Salad Saiyan (Dragon Ball What If) Discussion Thread

[Spinoirr]

I will try writing and rewriting attacks on the weekend.
Do you want to mention all techniques he can possibly use, just the ones he used, or a mix of both (like, there's probably no need to mention every single ki technique he can use if they are all inferior to Kamehameha, for example.)
Love the updated images, shame we don't have Salad's renders.

Well for one is his Sealing technique he used on a whole continuity and compressed it down to the size of his hand

So yeah just the ones he's sown

 

[Spinoirr]

Episode 7 of cell prime just dropped

 

[Spinoirr]

I will try writing and rewriting attacks on the weekend.
Do you want to mention all techniques he can possibly use, just the ones he used, or a mix of both (like, there's probably no need to mention every single ki technique he can use if they are all inferior to Kamehameha, for example.)
Love the updated images, shame we don't have Salad's renders.

i asked Salad Saiyan about his powers so far and this is what he said

 

[Spinoirr]

so yeah, we have a lot to add based on this new info and new ep

 

[MrKerf]

Should've known that Dragon Ball What If'ers are VsBattlers too, lol.

I am just woke up now, so not sure, but why does Cell possesses Omnipresence? He didn't absorb Zamasu, nor his Continuity. And I don't think Kakamasu showed Omnipresence.

 

[MrKerf]

Although admittedly, I have not watched Goku Supreme Kai story.

 

[Spinoirr]

Should've known that Dragon Ball What If'ers are VsBattlers too, lol.

I am just woke up now, so not sure, but why does Cell possesses Omnipresence? He didn't absorb Zamasu, nor his Continuity. And I don't think Kakamasu showed Omnipresence.

He read his mind temporarily remember and Kakamasu is a unofficial Supreme Kai of Time aka he can view history and the present

Anyways he is shown to have it in ep 7 anyways

 

[MrKerf]

Episode 7 of cell prime just dropped

Absolutely Extraordinary Genius (at least), and Big Gete Star still is my favourite underutilized thing from Dragon Ball.

 

[MrKerf]

Also I wonder how long Cell Prime will stay Low 1-C. I want to put him up against Devil Artemis Cell.

 

[MrKerf]

He read his mind temporarily remember and Kakamasu is a unofficial Supreme Kai of Time aka he can view history and the present

Anyways he is shown to have it in ep 7 anyways

That's... a weird power mimicry...

 

[Spinoirr]

Absolutely Extraordinary Genius (at least), and Big Gete Star still is my favourite underutilized thing from Dragon Ball.

Either way Cell Prime will become Nigh Omnipresence for his weakened key onwards

 

[Spinoirr]

Anyways good cooler comes from this what if


Evil Goku aka Kakarot 2 comes from this what if (also the what if Kakarot 2 met Good cooler)


What if Piccolo comes from (Also Kakarot 2 met a Version of Lord Slug here)

 

[Spinoirr]

Anyways going to update the profile?

 

[MrKerf]

I must finish some stuff, afterwards I'll rewatch the series and write all relevant techniques.

 

[Spinoirr]

I must finish some stuff, afterwards I'll rewatch the series and write all relevant techniques.

Also note how his continuity ring is a part of his standard equipment for post Energy Absorption onwards

 

[Spinoirr]

Bump

 

[Spinoirr]

Bump

 

[Spinoirr]

"Type 1 - Continuity Ring has same effects as Time Ring
Type 2 - At this point in the story, doesn't "exist" in one timeline or continuity, he lives independent of those without a past or future
Type 3 - Continuity Ring lets him create "checkpoints" for himself to restore from. I forget if this was in the most recent vid or if this spoils the next one lol"

- Salad Saiyan

 

[MrKerf]

My internet was dead

 

[Spinoirr]

My internet was dead

New Cell prime episode

 

[MrKerf]

Well, I did the thing. Without normal descriptions still, but it is what it is.

Not sure what to do with:

Buu's Teleportation (What's that? Isn't it just Kai Kai?)

Paralysis (Probably an existing magic technique of Kai, but can't find it)

Turning Azeer into bomb (???)

Sealing (Magic? Ki?)

 

[Spinoirr]

Well, I did the thing. Without normal descriptions still, but it is what it is.

Not sure what to do with:

Buu's Teleportation (What's that? Isn't it just Kai Kai?)

Paralysis (Probably an existing magic technique of Kai, but can't find it)

Turning Azeer into bomb (???)

Sealing (Magic? Ki?)

1. It's probably just Kai Kai, it's the same teleporting Kid Buu did after blowing up Earth
2. List it under Kai abilities
3. List this under ki attacks given he did it by putting his ki into his body to make him a bomb
4. Definitely probably magic

 

[Spinoirr]

Also list he can use the Ultra Instinct technique alongside Ultra Ego (the form)

Oh yeah, list he has Ultra Ego

 

[MrKerf]

Is Ultra Ego really relevant, if it's just worse version of Beerus' power?

As for the technique, I think it should be put separately, that Prime and Ultra Prime forms utilise other forms and their combinations.

 

[Spinoirr]

Is Ultra Ego really relevant, if it's just worse version of Beerus' power?

As for the technique, I think it should be put separately, that Prime and Ultra Prime forms utilise other forms and their combinations.

Ultra Ego is kinda relevant given it is a form that's also a technique https://dragonball.fandom.com/wiki/Ultra_Ego_(ability)

 

[MrKerf]

I can't redact for some reason.

 

[Spinoirr]

New Cell prime episode, honestly I don't think he gets anything new this episode

 

[MrKerf]

Superior EE, one that was compared to Zeno's. Timeline Splitting, no longer on accident.

Also Moro? Hell yeah.

 

[Spinoirr]

Superior EE, one that was compared to Zeno's. Timeline Splitting, no longer on accident.

Also Moro? Hell yeah.

Yeah true

 

[Ghengiroo115]

Felt like making some sandboxes for “Kakarot 2”, Raditz and Turles from the evil Goku series. I’ll be updating the keys as I rewatch the series.

When it comes to the Stellar Fruits Turles and Raditz eat, does it work to where they get the full power of the star in their base form and then Infernal Saiyan is an additional boost on top of that (kinda like how Orange Piccolo works)? Now that I think about it I think Evil Saiyan works this way as well.

 

[Spinoirr]

Felt like making some sandboxes for “Kakarot 2”, Raditz and Turles from the evil Goku series. I’ll be updating the keys as I rewatch the series.

When it comes to the Stellar Fruits Turles and Raditz eat, does it work to where they get the full power of the star in their base form and then Infernal Saiyan is an additional boost on top of that (kinda like how Orange Piccolo works)? Now that I think about it I think Evil Saiyan works this way as well.

Spoiler

Start of series (dragon ball tournament arc): kakarots power level in the 100 range and strong as Tien

22nd tournament arc: kakarot beats everyone there and strong as tien

Evacuation Arc: kakarot has a power level of 1200

Crusher corps arc: kakarot is stronger then raditz and close in power to nappa (in this arc Turles after eating a fruit form the tree of Might killed all the Ginyu force)

Crusher Duo arc: kakarot easily Dodoria, nappa and vegeta (Turles easily killed Transformed Zarbon and is stronger via eating from the tree of Might meny more times)

Freiza arc: freizas 3rd form some what matches kakarot and Turles working together with turles being the stronger of the two. After eating fruit from the tree of Might they are now stronger then 50% freiza and both of then kill 100% Freiza. After eating more fruits kakarot alone easily kills king cold

Bojack arc: kakarot and turles kill bojacks henchmen. Evil saiyan kakarot easily kills Bojack

Evil Saiyan fall out arc: they both have gotten stronger, with turles also getting his evil saiyan form and kakarot is stronger then turles by a slight amount.

Lord Slug arc: Months pass with both kakarot and turles getting stronger and kakarot is stronger then him and beats him, forcing him to run away but both are hurt by the fight and it was a close one. Raditz is weaker then prime Lord Slug in base, but belives with ssj he can kill Lord Slug. Granolah's attacks harm prime Lord Slug. With one shot he killed all four the heaters after his wish and now he overpowers Granolah in base. Super Saiyan raditz can counter Granolah's attacks (proving him saying in ssj he can kill prime Lord Slug to be true with Slug knowing raditz had ssj, making him wish for his potential to be unlocked out of fear). Kakarot and super saiyan raditz, Granolah are matching him in power (mostly kakarot) with Granolah targeting his weak points to show kakarot and raditz where to hit Slug, ssj raditz and evil saiyan kakarot kill orange Lord Slug with a head shot combo attack

Cooler arc: Turles eats fruits from stars now and gains a new form. Kakarot gets super saiyan and it's weaker then evil saiyan (meaning however strong a evil saiyan is, it's more then 50 times boost), Base raditz kills coolers squad easily. Both kakarot and raditz in base casually knock away coolers lasers, ssj raditz overpowers base Cooler, but cooler goes into his 5th form and stomps ssj raditz and can hold back two super saiyans (with kakarot being stronger then raditz), evil saiyan kakarot and 5th form cooler are on par with one another with kakarot bringing him to his knees. Cooler has great potential but not like freiza's potential and has been training for a few years, cooler then goes Black Cooler and one punch of air knocks raditz out of ssj, stomps Evil Saiyan Kakarot casually. With one finger he stomps both ssj raditz and evil saiyan kakarot, Kakarot mixes Super Saiyan with Evil Saiyan making "Supreme Saiyan" (50 times Multiplier mixed with a over 50 times Multiplier) and he is now even with black cooler, Cooler makes a black hole and launches it at kakarot and he moves away from it then punches a hole through black cooler with all his energy and then launches cooler into the black hole with all his energy.

Star-Eater Turles arc: Raditz can use Evil Saiyan now after some time. Supreme Saiyan Kakarot and Evil Saiyan Raditz fight Infernal Turles and Infernal Turles and Evil Saiyan Raditz can't do anything to help as Supreme Saiyan Kakarot gets beat down by Infernal Turles, Raditz eats the fruit from the tree of Might from a star they are fighting on and gains Infernal Raditz but raditz isn't on turles' level but Turles' takes some damage from his attack as Raditz's form is unstable unlike Turles' and he is letting the power all out so he isn't killed by this form. It takes raditz days to expel the insane amount of power from the tree of Might from that star and he didn't need to sleep in those days due to having so much energy in his body and the power Raditz has let's him "travel galaxies in a few days" and both kakarot and raditz in evil saiyan fly to earth (this takes place in age 771)

Black Ribbon arc: kakarot and raditz easily destroy the army of clone gammas in ssj and are a little bit weaker then cell max (note the last time they got data on kakarot and raditz was when raditz picked up kakarot at the start of Z. But cell max has to at least be stronger then Anroid 13, 16, 17, 18 as each Android he made got more and more powerful) and they easily destroy cell max with Evil Saiyan.

Hope my scaling I made long ago helps, also use Toei scaling

 

[Ghengiroo115]

Spoiler

Start of series (dragon ball tournament arc): kakarots power level in the 100 range and strong as Tien

22nd tournament arc: kakarot beats everyone there and strong as tien

Evacuation Arc: kakarot has a power level of 1200

Crusher corps arc: kakarot is stronger then raditz and close in power to nappa (in this arc Turles after eating a fruit form the tree of Might killed all the Ginyu force)

Crusher Duo arc: kakarot easily Dodoria, nappa and vegeta (Turles easily killed Transformed Zarbon and is stronger via eating from the tree of Might meny more times)

Freiza arc: freizas 3rd form some what matches kakarot and Turles working together with turles being the stronger of the two. After eating fruit from the tree of Might they are now stronger then 50% freiza and both of then kill 100% Freiza. After eating more fruits kakarot alone easily kills king cold

Bojack arc: kakarot and turles kill bojacks henchmen. Evil saiyan kakarot easily kills Bojack

Evil Saiyan fall out arc: they both have gotten stronger, with turles also getting his evil saiyan form and kakarot is stronger then turles by a slight amount.

Lord Slug arc: Months pass with both kakarot and turles getting stronger and kakarot is stronger then him and beats him, forcing him to run away but both are hurt by the fight and it was a close one. Raditz is weaker then prime Lord Slug in base, but belives with ssj he can kill Lord Slug. Granolah's attacks harm prime Lord Slug. With one shot he killed all four the heaters after his wish and now he overpowers Granolah in base. Super Saiyan raditz can counter Granolah's attacks (proving him saying in ssj he can kill prime Lord Slug to be true with Slug knowing raditz had ssj, making him wish for his potential to be unlocked out of fear). Kakarot and super saiyan raditz, Granolah are matching him in power (mostly kakarot) with Granolah targeting his weak points to show kakarot and raditz where to hit Slug, ssj raditz and evil saiyan kakarot kill orange Lord Slug with a head shot combo attack

Cooler arc: Turles eats fruits from stars now and gains a new form. Kakarot gets super saiyan and it's weaker then evil saiyan (meaning however strong a evil saiyan is, it's more then 50 times boost), Base raditz kills coolers squad easily. Both kakarot and raditz in base casually knock away coolers lasers, ssj raditz overpowers base Cooler, but cooler goes into his 5th form and stomps ssj raditz and can hold back two super saiyans (with kakarot being stronger then raditz), evil saiyan kakarot and 5th form cooler are on par with one another with kakarot bringing him to his knees. Cooler has great potential but not like freiza's potential and has been training for a few years, cooler then goes Black Cooler and one punch of air knocks raditz out of ssj, stomps Evil Saiyan Kakarot casually. With one finger he stomps both ssj raditz and evil saiyan kakarot, Kakarot mixes Super Saiyan with Evil Saiyan making "Supreme Saiyan" (50 times Multiplier mixed with a over 50 times Multiplier) and he is now even with black cooler, Cooler makes a black hole and launches it at kakarot and he moves away from it then punches a hole through black cooler with all his energy and then launches cooler into the black hole with all his energy.

Star-Eater Turles arc: Raditz can use Evil Saiyan now after some time. Supreme Saiyan Kakarot and Evil Saiyan Raditz fight Infernal Turles and Infernal Turles and Evil Saiyan Raditz can't do anything to help as Supreme Saiyan Kakarot gets beat down by Infernal Turles, Raditz eats the fruit from the tree of Might from a star they are fighting on and gains Infernal Raditz but raditz isn't on turles' level but Turles' takes some damage from his attack as Raditz's form is unstable unlike Turles' and he is letting the power all out so he isn't killed by this form. It takes raditz days to expel the insane amount of power from the tree of Might from that star and he didn't need to sleep in those days due to having so much energy in his body and the power Raditz has let's him "travel galaxies in a few days" and both kakarot and raditz in evil saiyan fly to earth (this takes place in age 771)

Black Ribbon arc: kakarot and raditz easily destroy the army of clone gammas in ssj and are a little bit weaker then cell max (note the last time they got data on kakarot and raditz was when raditz picked up kakarot at the start of Z. But cell max has to at least be stronger then Anroid 13, 16, 17, 18 as each Android he made got more and more powerful) and they easily destroy cell max with Evil Saiyan.

Hope my scaling I made long ago helps, also use Toei scaling

This should help, thanks.

Wouldn’t it be canon scaling though, since all the non-canon additions aren’t direct adaptations and don’t scale the same as their Toeiverse counterparts (e.g Cooler > Bojack, Slug = Granolah and Kogu ≈ Frieza)? Also makes Turles’ whole consuming stars thing way less impressive-feeling but I digress.

 

[Spinoirr]

This should help, thanks.

Wouldn’t it be canon scaling though, since all the non-canon additions aren’t direct adaptations and don’t scale the same as their Toeiverse counterparts (e.g Cooler > Bojack, Slug = Granolah and Kogu ≈ Frieza)? Also makes Turles’ whole consuming stars thing way less impressive-feeling but I digress.

If scale them to their Toei versions and the animie of dbs mixed with the manga too (given this is what salad does in what ifs that includes movie villain's or all his what ifs where they have anime dbs stuff but always having a Moro or Granolah arcs)

 

[Ghengiroo115]

Oh yeah one thing about Evil Saiyan, if we consider Fifth Form Cooler’s power increase in Cooler’s Revenge (goes from matching base Goku to overpowering 20x Kaioken Goku) we can say Evil Saiyan is ~20x Super Saiyan and therefore 1,000x base.

 

[Spinoirr]

Oh yeah one thing about Evil Saiyan, if we consider Fifth Form Cooler’s power increase in Cooler’s Revenge (goes from matching base Goku to overpowering 20x Kaioken Goku) we can say Evil Saiyan is ~20x Super Saiyan and therefore 1,000x base.

Then they stack ssj on top of evil saiyan

 

[Ghengiroo115]

If scale them to their Toei versions and the animie of dbs mixed with the manga too (given this is what salad does in what ifs that includes movie villain's or all his what ifs where they have anime dbs stuff but always having a Moro or Granolah arcs)

I’m still not sure on that, but I’ll just have both for now at the very least just to compare them.

Then they stack ssj on top of evil saiyan

Yup, which makes 50,000x.

 

[Spinoirr]

Felt like making some sandboxes for “Kakarot 2”, Raditz and Turles from the evil Goku series. I’ll be updating the keys as I rewatch the series.

When it comes to the Stellar Fruits Turles and Raditz eat, does it work to where they get the full power of the star in their base form and then Infernal Saiyan is an additional boost on top of that (kinda like how Orange Piccolo works)? Now that I think about it I think Evil Saiyan works this way as well.

You should note the Moro in salads videos are basically like a hypothetical anime and manga continuity hybrid

 

[Spinoirr]

Also Majin Turles battled this version of cooler


So he should scale to coolers EoS self

 

[Spinoirr]

Also shouldn't black cooler (Evil Gokus universe) have a Multiplier above golden as its above golden and golden grants the same boost as ssj blue (if not more)

 

[Ghengiroo115]

You should note the Moro in salads videos are basically like a hypothetical anime and manga continuity hybrid

Yeah I’ll do that, and also note that he should still scale to post-Broly Super Saiyan Vegeta regardless.

Also shouldn't black cooler (Evil Gokus universe) have a Multiplier above golden as its above golden and golden grants the same boost as ssj blue (if not more)

The big issue is that using the Golden Frieza multiplier would make Cooler way higher than he actually is. If you applied the Golden Frieza multiplier to Final Form Frieza (who Fourth Form Cooler alone is way stronger than) you would end up with a character thousands of times stronger than Buu, which doesn’t really work when you consider Infernal Saiyan Turles was having a bit of trouble with him (granted it was mainly because of the regen, but “having a bit of trouble” implies that Buu was still a threat to Turles at the very least). Black Cooler would also only be 50x based on the Supreme Saiyan multiplier. I think since Cooler isn’t a mutant, doesn’t have the Golden form, has a different colour palette to Black Frieza and has different powers I think it’s safe to say that his version of the form just works differently.