RWBY: Light Speed Upgrade

[Cire]

At this point, we are literally looking for the word lightspeed for things, even when light is literally being named as light multiple times from multiple sources.

 

[WeeklyBattles]

Correct.

Being in line with wiki standards makes me right. If it's called something, especially as egregious as light, it needs to prove it.

Name is not evidence.

Lasers in RWBY being made of natural light (due to being derived from light dust, which is natural light) or being fully mechanical in nature (one of the main criteria for lightspeed), with light dust also being used in stuff like cameras (one of the main criteria for lightspeed), the lasers in the verse reflecting off of reflective surfaces (one of the main criteria for lightspeed), moving exclusively in straight lines, burning and cutting rather than generating force, and being described as particle beams (one of the main criteria for lightspeed)

"Hmm no, not enough evidence, disagree, you need statements of things being light, then it will be alright to use"

Gives multiple statements of light

"Hmm no, still not enough evidence, disagree"

Like my guy, at this point you are just ignoring literally every piece of evidence given to you and acting like this entire revision is based solely on naming conventions

 

[Cire]

Also, I will say that the lasers fire in Amity Arena are bright blue, the same color as other things powered by hard light dust.

 

[Kingofwolves999]

At this point, we are literally looking for the word lightspeed for things, even when light is literally being named as light multiple times from multiple sources.

Yes.

Because the name is irrelevant to the feats. Speed is the most important aspect about light speed scaling, and you all have not provided anything that suggests the speed is comparable.

Magic Light being called light is not enough evidence

"Hmm no, not enough evidence, disagree, you need statements of things being light, then it will be alright to use"



"Hmm no, not enough evidence, disagree"

Lasers being Light dust is unfounded. Again. Something you did not prove. At all.

Provide evidence for light dust, because the only scan was the velvet one for Hard Light Constructs. Hard light dust has not been shown to be involved with lasers.

Also, that is your own post, not evidence. I'm literally challenging that post with my own, that's not helping your argument.

 

[CurrySenpai]

Do you have scans to the light dust being actual light and meeting the criteria rather than just being some sort of magic or whatever?

 

[WeeklyBattles]

Do you have scans to the light dust being actual light and meeting the criteria rather than just being some sort of magic or whatever?

Yes. This exact point has been asked four times in this thread already. And the evidence to prove that it is has been posted. Four times. Dust is not magic. Magic exists in RWBY and Dust is explicitly not it. Dust is natural elements, named strictly after the elements they are. Hard Light Dust is named Hard Light Dust because it is the element of light.

 

[Cire]

Yes.

Because the name is irrelevant to the feats. Speed is the most important aspect about light speed scaling, and you all have not provided anything that suggests the speed is comparable.

Magic Light being called light is not enough evidence

Lasers being Light dust is unfounded. Again. Something you did not prove. At all.

Provide evidence for light dust, because the only scan was the velvet one for Hard Light Constructs. Hard light dust has not been shown to be involved with lasers.

Also, that is your own post, not evidence. I'm literally challenging that post with my own, that's not helping your argument.

Like I told you, the lasers in Amity Arena fire off lasers of blue light, which is the same color as most things that are powered by hard light dust.

 

[WeeklyBattles]

Yes.

Because the name is irrelevant to the feats. Speed is the most important aspect about light speed scaling, and you all have not provided anything that suggests the speed is comparable.

Magic Light being called light is not enough evidence

Its not the name. Its the description of the light itself. It being magic means absolutely nothing. Youre strawmanning so hard its unreal.

Lasers being Light dust is unfounded. Again. Something you did not prove. At all.

It has been proven but cool, even if theyre not light dust theyre still mechanical, which still qualifies for lightspeed. Dont like it? Take it up with the lightspeed standards.

Provide evidence for light dust, because the only scan was the velvet one for Hard Light Constructs. Hard light dust has not been shown to be involved with lasers.

Here is Velvet making lasers with her hard light dust.

Velvet Scarlatina

Velvet Scarlatina is a ?-aura unit in RWBY: Amity Arena. Unlocked at Mistral Village, Velvet Scarlatina is a unit that copies a previously deployed unit. A unit that copies a previously deployed unit. Miss Scarlatina, for the sake of gameplay, will copy abilities of other cards, even Semblances...

amityarena.fandom.com

Even in her Amity Arena bio she is stated to copy the weapons of everyone in the game, including, guess what, the particle cannon of the spider droid and Penny's lasers.

Also, that is your own post, not evidence. I'm literally challenging that post with my own, that's not helping your argument.

What is the point of reposting the evidence for the twelfth time if youre just demonstrating the unwillingness to listen and willingly ignoring everything shown or explained to you?

 

[Maitreya12]

Like I told you, the lasers in Amity Arena fire off lasers of blue light, which is the same color as most things that are powered by hard light dust.

I wouldn’t use this as a good argument.

As King Pointed out there is a noticeable difference between Hard Light just being natural light and its constructs velvet used which clearly carry things like mass and weight in them. That and the fact that multiple times lasers in RWBY proper have been shown to be a wide variety of colors ranging from red, blue, and green.

However I will say I totally agree and support the notion of Ruby’s silver eye blasts being light speed. They are simply a flash of light. It carries no weight or force behind them, is omnidirectional, and both acts and is described as “light” with nothing to the contrary. I know Damage pointed out how they were a little weird looking in Ruby’s very first use of them what with them appearing as “angel wings” and all but that was only shown one time the very first time they were used which can simply be attributed to the art of the scene at the time.

Every other instance of them is them being used literally like a flash of light. Ruby’s eyes are essentially a flashlight right lol. I don’t see any problem with this.

 

[WeeklyBattles]

I wouldn’t use this as a good argument.

As King Pointed out there is a noticeable difference between Hard Light just being natural light and its constructs velvet used which clearly carry things like mass and weight in them. That and the fact that multiple times lasers in RWBY proper have been shown to be a wide variety of colors ranging from red, blue, and green.

Lasers = Raw light dust, which is natural light

Constructs = Processed light dust, which is hard light

NGL im really getting tired of having to explain this every five minutes, from now on im just going to copy paste this every time it gets brought up.

 

[Cire]

I will also say that Ruby's silver eyes have none of the disqualifying criteria.

 

[Cyberblader90]

This isn't valid. Ruby's "light" is shaped into two large wing-like shapes pouring from her eyes instead of shooting in a straight light like a beam. Even if we accepted that they were composed of light, there is no reason to think that the shapes of light she is emitting is travelling at lightspeed.

isnt this only like in season 3/

 

[Spinoirr]

To be fair lasers come in different colors as well

 

[WeeklyBattles]

isnt this only like in season 3/

Yep, every other season its an omnidirectional sphere of light

 

[Cire]

isnt this only like in season 3/

It's only one time. Every other time her eyes go in all directions.

 

[Spinoirr]

isnt this only like in season 3/

Yeah it retconed aka changed to be a flash of light in a omnidirectional way

 

[Cire]

I should also say that @/Dalesean027 agreed with the Silver Eyes being light, and it was stated the calcers like him are very strict on LS stuff.

 

[Cyberblader90]

also regarding the particle cannon

"name fallacy".....

They make focus on the nature of it, the spider drone puts together into the shape of a particle accelerator yype constructs and then fires. Itts stated twice to be a partice cannon. Name fallacy is a very weak argument

Also

how did you get away with 2 pages

This type of response sets up a very bad mood regarding your whole counter, ngl.

 

[WeeklyBattles]

Light Magic needs evidence of being Light speed. You're ignoring context and just stating that because it's called Light it must be true Light speed because the source of the powers also created light. That's not how that works, evidence needs go be produced for her specific brand of completely different light to be the same speed as natural light.

Incorrect. Just by virtue of being stated to be light is what makes it lightspeed, literally 70% of this thread revolved around this issue and it has now been resolved. If you disagree then go downgrade Black Clover (Uses magic that is only light in name) or One Piece (Uses light that explodes on contact) or Naruto (where light is just condensed lightning).

Lasers are the explicit example of NOT using names to justify speed. Name is not enough at all, that's why the criteria even exist.

Particle cannon. Laser. None of it matters if the criteria are not being met for every single instance especially.

Why are you acting like these lasers dont fit every criteria for lightspeed? You act like they are only these things in name when they have every property necessary to qualify for being the speed of light.

No, it's on you to prove that it's light speed. That's why criteria exist. Silver eyes having a trace back to the guy who made light doesn't make them light speed, as natural light and light magic are totally different things. The light of the silver eyed warriors is specifically used to counter Grimm, a counterbalance to "darkness." Prove Magic Light from the silver eyes is the same as natural light, that is your stance.

It being magic means absolutely nothing, otherwise you could easily downgrade the vast majority of lightspeed verses on the wiki (Black Clover's lightspeed is magic, One Piece's lightspeed is a devil fruit, Naruto's lightspeed is condensed lightning chakra, etc.)

 

[WeeklyBattles]

Seriously i feel like we could get a straight up statement of RWBY characters moving at the speed of light and there would be people on this thread who would ask for proof that its referring to actual light

 

[Spinoirr]

1. The beam refracts in a new material, such as a liquid (lasers in rwby bounce off of a flat sheet of ice. Check ✔)
2. The beam diffuses in a reasonably realistic way or reflects off a material that it can be expected to, such as a mirror.
3. It is stated to be composed/consisting of photons or light itself by a reliable source. (Atlas has a mech with a photon cannon made of photons and was a prototype. Penny's lasers are called lasers)
4. It has its origin at a realistic source of light, such as a camera. (It comes from technology and is powered by electricity like a real laser/photon cannon)

Idk that's 3 out for 4

 

[Spinoirr]

Before you bring up the stupid argument of "the lasers are different colors"

Lasers are different colors irl too.

 

[WeeklyBattles]

So, my issues are as many as the opposition has arguments. Allow me to go through the points currently and previously made.

1. The supporters believe Penny’s lasers should be considered light speed due to meeting criteria for light speed lasers. This was countered, as the amount of criteria she met was challenged, mainly her source, the statement itself being questionable and the lack of a true light speed statement. As it stands, current arguments about Penny specifically are on hold due to the challenge being brought forth of the Atlas Military’s usage of light speed lasers in the first place.

Penny’s lasers should be the last point made in this thread. This then leads us to the next points.

2. Atlesian Air Ship Laser

This laser was brought up in response to the Atlas Military’s knowledge of light speed weaponry. The claim is that due to the straight line nature of these beams, and their origin from hard light dust, they should be considered the speed of light.

In opposition to this, it was brought up that there is no source whatsoever claiming these lasers are created from hard light dust. The fact that they also produce force, which is a valid anti-feat for realism, places further doubt on these weapons being light speed. This leaves the air ship laser cannons with only two criteria met: moving in a straight line and a technological source. This is not sufficient evidence for the Atlas Military’s usage of light speed weaponry and should be disregarded.

Arguments that might be brought up against those seem to depend on Hard Light Dust being used in things such as a camera flash.

This is irrelevant. Because the claim that the cannons use Hard Light Dust is unfounded. I encourage the supporters produce actual, true evidence that these lasers are produced from hard light dust first before further discussion is had for them.

Put simply, the fact that there is not a blatant lightspeed statement for the lasers is wholly irrelevant due to the lasers meeting the other criteria of lightspeed (source is from technology, stated to be a particle beam by the best scientists in the world, burns and cuts rather than generating force, travels only in straight lines, reflects off of reflective surfaces), as well as the now currently accepted feats of near light feats which further support the lasers being lightspeed.

3. Velvet’s constructs

This seems to be the popular hard light dust usage, so it requires quite a bit of discussion.

To begin, the opposition claims that “raw hard light dust is light speed, as camera flashes are produced by hard light dust.” This belief is unfounded.

This is the one and only piece of evidence brought forth for Hard Light Dust being light speed. Through Velvet’s camera.

I would like everyone to actually look at the wording for this piece of evidence.

Nothing about “Raw Light Dust” is mentioned.

“Raw Light Dust,” as far as I’m concerned, doesn’t even exist.

Sorry to be blunt but making this claim is just wholly ignorant of Dust as a material in RWBY. Raw dust does in fact exist in-verse, it is what releases the natural elemental properties of Dust. Raw fire dust creates fire, raw lightning dust creates lightning, raw ice dust creates ice. Raw hard light dust creates light.

The only time we see hard light dust is through Velvet’s hard light constructs (as so far produced). The fact that this light has mass substantially lowers its speed, and places doubt on any hard light dust being a usable source for light speed.

Already explained this multiple times but i guess i have to again because people dont listen; Velvet's constructs are the PROCESSED version of Hard Light Dust, while her camera flash and lasers are the RAW version of hard light dust.

To further this: does a raw form of Hard-Light dust even occur naturally?

The opposition has brought forth the statement that new dust types are created by mixing them together. So Hard Light Dust could very easily be a non-naturally occurring type of dust. I’m which case, why is a raw form being questioned at all? What would raw hard light dust even look like? We never see this in series, nor is it ever explained what hard light dust is.

It does yes, all Dust is naturally occurring, artificial Dust does not exist in RWBY.

Hard Light Dust is used for making tangible objects, similar to energy weapons, via an unknown process. Claiming that the raw form of Hard Light Dust, which has not been produced, should be light speed, and therefore anything powered by Hard Light Dust should also be light speed, is completely unfounded.

So what does this mean for Velvet?

The argument for Velvet is that her camera uses “raw light dust” to create flashes. This is unfounded, as her camera is not stated to use any dust.

Wrong

Velvet Scarlatina

Velvet Scarlatina is a ?-aura unit in RWBY: Amity Arena. Unlocked at Mistral Village, Velvet Scarlatina is a unit that copies a previously deployed unit. A unit that copies a previously deployed unit. Miss Scarlatina, for the sake of gameplay, will copy abilities of other cards, even Semblances...

amityarena.fandom.com

"Being a small rabbit Faunus in one of Beacon's most illustrious teams of all time, Velvet feels like all eyes are on her. Incessant whispers about her inadequacy and veiled Faunus discrimination continuously scar her heart. To make matters worse, the combination of having an intelligence type Semblance, dependence on hard light Dust (the rarest Dust) for her camera, and losing precious photos of friends with each attack forces Velvet to take the backseat in most combat situations."

Just...very, very wrong. And that scan has been on this thread since page 1.

4) Particle Cannon

This I feel is the most egregious current offender of wiki rules.

Naming fallacy.

The claim is that because it’s labeled as two things (“particle cannon” and “laser”), then it does not need to show any criteria for it to be considered light speed. The opposition is claiming that name and scientific properties alone are enough for light speed.

This is a clear violation of the rules brought forth for light speed attacks in the first place.

“Particle Cannon” has the exact same amount of backing behind it as “Laser,” there should be no difference whatsoever between one name and another. In fact, the statement of “Particle Cannon” should be even MORE scrutinized, and further evidence for the exact mechanics for this weapon should be produced.

But beyond anything else: it still needs to meet our criteria. A name is just that: a name. Until put to the proof, I absolutely disagree with using the particle cannon as if it were light speed. Particle Cannon’s come in all different shapes and types and sizes, not to mention ones as advanced as this one are a fictional construct totally.

This is a purely imaginary weapon, and therefore should be put under our suspicion regardless of what it is called. A force produced, speed of light attack is already doubtful, but the lack of any other criteria is doubly so.

Again: name alone should not qualify something for light speed, regardless of the name. Statements of light speed, showings of the qualities of light, things such as THAT are how we accept light speed. So naturally, that brings us to the final point.

Same response as the first one, it has every property of lightspeed, not even going to bother repeating myself.

5. Silver Eyes

Honestly, I was in agreement with the Silver Eyes until a certain point was made.

This is likely the most ridiculous statement yet, so allow me to break down exactly what Maria is implying.

“Legends of warriors whose eyes shone like mirrors, reflecting the light of the world unto darkness.”

Let’s get this out of the way first: she is not talking about natural light nor is she claiming that their eyes are literal mirrors.

Her entire speech to Ruby is in no way framing their eyes to be producing light in a similar vein as “sunlight” or any other type of “light” that would imply their speed would be the same, or their properties.

This quote, of “mirrors reflecting the light of the world” is not scientific. It is not made with the intention of speed, properties or anything that would imply it being a natural phenomenon that involves photons. This is all language used to describe the LEGEND of the silver eyes.

Her statement? Is not from herself. It’s not even from her father. Her father’s research resulted in this statement, and it is from a time shrouded in mystery/not explored. Nearly 100 years give or take from Ruby’s own time is when Maria would have heard her father say this. That is not evidence for light speed at all.

To put this in perspective: the legend is about silver eyes reflecting the light of the world onto darkness. The wording for this is flowery, it is not indicative of speed. The “light of the world” is not sunlight, nor is it ever implied that the silver eyes function as mirrors from this point onward.

In fact, the silver eyes are specifically fueled by magic to PRODUCE light, not reflect it. So this initial statement from her iincorrect, on top of not even being a statement from her.

Context needs to be heavily ignored to believe this statement is true.

“It is the desire to preserve life which fuels the light inside you.”

Before we get to the “important” claim, let’s briefly stare at this statement that precedes it.

Ruby’s silver eyes are magical in nature. They are fueled by her desire to preserve life, and act according to that desire. Ruling out “reliable source” on that one, but the main issue I have comes later on.

Keep in mind “preserve life”

“and make no mistake, it is light”

So, this is the big statement. Seems cut and dry no? She’s calling it light, therefore it is light, therefore it is light speed.

However, let’s see what’s she says next, because through context, we can tell that her definition of “light” is not the same as the opposition would have you believe.

“Preservation is an extension of creation, or at the very least an enemy of destruction. The creatures of Grimm were made by the God of Darkness, but your light comes from his brother.”

In the context of this scene, what is Light?

Preservation. Creation. Life.

These are the words used by Maria to describe the magical powers of the silver eyes.

None of these words imply the “light” Maria is referring to is natural, fast or otherwise related to any criteria we have that implies light speed.

The light they create is used to defeat the creatures of Grimm, a counterbalance if you would. It is a direct opposition to the God of Darkness. They shine in order to vaporize, blind or turn to stone their enemies.

That is not enough reasoning to assume they are the same as natural light.

That these magical eye powers are called “light” is not enough, given the context in which they are called so. They are called “light” because they are the opposition of the “dark,” that being the creature of Grimm. They are not called light because they share properties with natural light. They are called as such because of what they represent: a fraction of the God of Lights power, magically fueled by emotion to preserve life by harming Grimm.

None of that is an implication for their speed being anywhere near relative to light itself. The magical source and lack of light speed criteria or statements is a similar issue.

Being called “light,” especially in this context, is not enough. Similar to how “laser” and “particle cannon” do not immediately give light speed, this should not either. Especially when context is actually looked at.

Maria is not talking about the speed of their eyes, nor is she talking about natural sunlight or other examples that would point to light speed. She speaks of the light solely as a counterbalance to the darkness.

Magic Light vs Magic Darkness

Therefore the silver eyes need evidence of light speed to be accepted. Being a gift from the God of Light does not immediately make them immune to any scrutiny.

And speaking of the God of Light, let’s jump into the next point.

Its stated to be light, therefore it is light, magical or nonmagical, it is light. If you dont like this then feel free to try to downgrade verses like Black Clover for also having 'magical light'.

7. Summation

In closing:

Penny’s lasers are the closest technology in Atlas to PROVING light speed. They are the only lasers that meet more than one to two criteria, yet some of their criteria is dependent on factors that simply have not been proven.

False. Her lasers meet four of the five criteria.

Other examples of lasers, such as the “Particle Cannon” and other beam turrets, have little to no reasoning beyond their names. The names alone are the implication of light speed, but the wiki demands that evidence meeting our criteria be produced.

It doesn’t matter how many times something is called light. Or how many things exist that are lasers. Or even if a fancy name like Particle Cannon is used. Meeting the criteria is the requirement, not an option.

The partcle cannon is not named 'particle cannon', it is STATED TO BE ONE, by Atlas Scientists.

Extra Note: No statement of light speed has been produced. The claims by the opposition that light speed statements have been produced is false. Never is anything in RWBY claimed to be light speed. All “light speed statements” are just names placed on objects such as laser. Anything that is given a name but lacks the qualities should not be accepted per wiki standards.

The wiki standards allow this to be considered lightspeed my guy, we even had a whole discussion in this thread about how lasers are able to be considered lightspeed if other lightspeed feats exist in the verse independent of the lasers

 

[Spinoirr]

Hazel has actually used raw hard light dust in vol 8, so it is real

The dust crystals are dust in its raw form and raw fire dust was used by civilizations in mantel to make a fire bigger in vol 8

 

[WeeklyBattles]

At this point in the argument it really feels like the arguments against it are just repeating the same things over and over again without actually paying attention to any of the evidence being provided to them, are strawmanning the absolute hell out of everything, and are trying to create false arguments to be in their favor (downplaying stuff like the particle cannon by arguing its 'only a particle cannon in name' despite never actually being named a particle cannon, only described as one, and by the most intelligent analytical scientists on the planet at that).

And people are wondering why this thread is currently six pages long lol

 

[Cyberblader90]

i think the particle beam and post season 3 silver eyes are fine, at the least

 

[Spinoirr]

At this point in the argument it really feels like the arguments against it are just repeating the same things over and over again without actually paying attention to any of the evidence being provided to them, are strawmanning the absolute hell out of everything, and are trying to create false arguments to be in their favor (downplaying stuff like the particle cannon by arguing its 'only a particle cannon in name' despite never actually being named a particle cannon, only described as one, and by the most intelligent analytical scientists on the planet at that).

And people are wondering why this thread is currently six pages long lol

Might as well post the proof of the photon cannon and the game being made by Atlas scientists in universe and being approved by the writers as cannon (its basically like our guide book saying this thing is light speed basically)

 

[WeeklyBattles]

Might as well post the proof of the photon cannon and the game being made by Atlas scientists in universe and being approved by the writers as cannon (its basically like our guide book saying this thing is light speed basically)

Thats already been posted lol

Spider Droid

Spider Droid is a 6-aura unit in RWBY: Amity Arena. Unlocked at Beacon Academy Tower, Spider Droid is a ranged unit that has a particle cannon and an attack that causes massive damage. [1] A ranged unit that has a particle cannon and an attack that causes massive damage. Nobody knows how many of...

amityarena.fandom.com

"A ranged unit that has a particle cannon and an attack that causes massive damage. Nobody knows how many of these prototypes were created, but they have been seen in service as security and Atlesian military ranks. Any who dare to go up against it must be careful around its powerful particle cannons."

Note how it is not NAMED a particle cannon, its weapon is DESCRIBED as a particle cannon

Amity Arena's lore stuff is canon

"The game took place in-universe. Many card bios were written by an Atlesian scientist, and the game itself was developed in Atlas by the in-universe company Human Nextwork."

Human Nextwork

Human Nextwork was an in-universe game-development company which produced the Scroll version of RWBY: Amity Arena for Remnant. They were located in the former Kingdom of Atlas. The company was later destroyed alongside the Kingdom in "The Final Word". Partnering with the Atlesian Military, the...

rwby.fandom.com

 

[DarkDragonMedeus]

So far, Rusty is the only one who at least gave some decent reasons for a disagreement. And even then, he still later considered changing his mind, but I think he just read slightly recent posts and noticed the main argument was regressed to square one but forget some other/better reasonings were used back in page 1. And most of the opposition just disagreed based on Rusty's old comments that overlooked some other points.

We agreed that "Bouncing off cloudly blocks of ice" wasn't a good argument and that stuff such as "Hardlight" or simply being called "Lasers" or being described as "Particle Beams/cannons" while steps in the right direction are still one the weak side. But there is lore statements for what light dust is, and even typical cameras use it to have light generation; so light dust being a reason to produce real light is possible. Light dust appears to be what photons are called in the RWBY universe. And yeah, light can have up to 9 different main colors and a multitude of invisible colors (Inferred, Ultra Violet, ect) based on what type of radiation is used to generate light. Most of us already agreed that Silver Eyes seems to have consistency on what real light is considered too.

 

[Dalesean027]

I mean I personally don't think there's really anything to contend with regarding the silver eyes like its flat out stated numerous times to be light and literally originates from the God of Light who is actually FTL so like....I'd like to hear why it wouldn't be light

This was my thoughts on silver eyes like even the legends aside its flat out stated to be light

 

[Cyberblader90]

its main contradiction was retconned out of existence

 

[Cire]

So far, Rusty is the only one who at least gave some decent reasons for a disagreement. And even then, he still later considered changing his mind, but I think he just read slightly recent posts and noticed the main argument was regressed to square one but forget some other/better reasonings were used back in page 1. And most of the opposition just disagreed based on Rusty's old comments that overlooked some other points.

We agreed that "Bouncing off cloudly blocks of ice" wasn't a good argument and that stuff such as "Hardlight" or simply being called "Lasers" or being described as "Particle Beams/cannons" while steps in the right direction are still one the weak side. But there is lore statements for what light dust is, and even typical cameras use it to have light generation; so light dust being a reason to produce real light is possible. Light dust appears to be what photons are called in the RWBY universe. And yeah, light can have up to 9 different main colors and a multitude of invisible colors (Inferred, Ultra Violet, ect) based on what type of radiation is used to generate light. Most of us already agreed that Silver Eyes seems to have consistency on what real light is considered too.

Thanks man for summarizing what we have so far.

 

[Dalesean027]

its main contradiction was retconned out of existence

Literally after volume 3 the silver eyes have never looked or acted the way they did when shown again its just omnidirectionally light and has been for every volume since then

 

[TheRustyOne]

What did I miss?

Can someone summarize what's happened? Links to relevant comments would be helpful as well.

 

[Spinoirr]

What did I miss?

Can someone summarize what's happened? Links to relevant comments would be helpful as well.

1. The beam refracts in a new material, such as a liquid (lasers in rwby bounce off of a flat sheet of ice. Check ✔)
2. The beam diffuses in a reasonably realistic way or reflects off a material that it can be expected to, such as a mirror.
3. It is stated to be composed/consisting of photons or light itself by a reliable source. (Atlas has a mech with a photon cannon made of photons and was a prototype. Penny's lasers are called lasers)
4. It has its origin at a realistic source of light, such as a camera. (It comes from technology and is powered by electricity like a real laser/photon cannon)

Idk that's 3 out for 4

Before you bring up the stupid argument of "the lasers are different colors"

Lasers are different colors irl too.

Hazel has actually used raw hard light dust in vol 8, so it is real

The dust crystals are dust in its raw form and raw fire dust was used by civilizations in mantel to make a fire bigger in vol 8

Thats already been posted lol

Spider Droid

Spider Droid is a 6-aura unit in RWBY: Amity Arena. Unlocked at Beacon Academy Tower, Spider Droid is a ranged unit that has a particle cannon and an attack that causes massive damage. [1] A ranged unit that has a particle cannon and an attack that causes massive damage. Nobody knows how many of...

amityarena.fandom.com

"A ranged unit that has a particle cannon and an attack that causes massive damage. Nobody knows how many of these prototypes were created, but they have been seen in service as security and Atlesian military ranks. Any who dare to go up against it must be careful around its powerful particle cannons."

Note how it is not NAMED a particle cannon, its weapon is DESCRIBED as a particle cannon

Amity Arena's lore stuff is canon

"The game took place in-universe. Many card bios were written by an Atlesian scientist, and the game itself was developed in Atlas by the in-universe company Human Nextwork."

Human Nextwork

Human Nextwork was an in-universe game-development company which produced the Scroll version of RWBY: Amity Arena for Remnant. They were located in the former Kingdom of Atlas. The company was later destroyed alongside the Kingdom in "The Final Word". Partnering with the Atlesian Military, the...

rwby.fandom.com

So far, Rusty is the only one who at least gave some decent reasons for a disagreement. And even then, he still later considered changing his mind, but I think he just read slightly recent posts and noticed the main argument was regressed to square one but forget some other/better reasonings were used back in page 1. And most of the opposition just disagreed based on Rusty's old comments that overlooked some other points.

We agreed that "Bouncing off cloudly blocks of ice" wasn't a good argument and that stuff such as "Hardlight" or simply being called "Lasers" or being described as "Particle Beams/cannons" while steps in the right direction are still one the weak side. But there is lore statements for what light dust is, and even typical cameras use it to have light generation; so light dust being a reason to produce real light is possible. Light dust appears to be what photons are called in the RWBY universe. And yeah, light can have up to 9 different main colors and a multitude of invisible colors (Inferred, Ultra Violet, ect) based on what type of radiation is used to generate light. Most of us already agreed that Silver Eyes seems to have consistency on what real light is considered too.

 

[Spinoirr]

RWBY: Silver Eyes Argument​

Guess I'm doing another CRT inside of my own CRT. CRTception.

Anyway, my argument is that Ruby's silver eyes are natural light and that RWBYverse as a whole can get upgraded due to characters reacting to said light.

The first thing I have to point out is that the God of Light is a primordial being made out of one half of a space dragon that was born at the beginning of time, the other half being his brother, the God of Darkness.

The Gods

The Gods are two immensely powerful beings that created Remnant. While there have been many various stories concerning the existence of dozens of deities, the only ones confirmed to actually exist are a pair of brothers: the God of Light and God of Darkness. The God of Light created the forces...

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The Two Brothers​

"The Two Brothers is a fairy tale detailing more information on the Brother Gods. As detailed in the story, in the beginning of time, a lone Dragon traveled the universe in search of other beings like himself. Overcome with loneliness, the Dragon decided to create one himself. Despite being all powerful, even the Dragon had to split its magic in half – into two symmetrical forms, one of light and the other of shadow. Each side thought one was the original and the other was the copy. Despite different personalities, they were ever only complete when they were together."

As it is strongly implied by Oz that every fairy tale has a measure of truth in them, we can assume that it was the God of Light's creation that brought forth all the natural light in the world.

Fairy Tales

For the real world book, see RWBY: Fairy Tales of Remnant. For the animated series, see RWBY: Fairy Tales. Fairy Tales are stories passed down through the history of Remnant. Although generally regarded as mere myths and legends, even the most unlikely of stories are said to have some basis in...

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"Ozpin notes that the Two Brothers appear in almost every creation story in various forms, but one thing is consistent: they arrived from a realm outside mankind's, and created the universe together out of nothing, leaving mankind on its own."

Here is further evidence backing up the point. The God of Light made all of the light in the universe. Also, we should really bump these guys up to uni lol.

"Nevertheless, the God of Darkness continued to secretly create more and more forms of Grimm whilst the God of Light planted a hidden gift in mankind to defend themselves from the monsters."

Here we see a statement that very strongly implies that the God of Light gifted humanity with a portion of its power, the silver eyes.



Here we see the God of Light performing a very similar flash to what Ruby uses for her silver eyes.



As seen here.



And here.

Thus, it can be said that Ruby's eyes are natural light. And thus, anyone reacting to such light would be moving at SoL.

 

[Dalesean027]

I'll give an explanation, a shit one but an explanation nonetheless

Silver eyes are accepted as being real light aside from one counter point that used a retconned visual of silver eyes to say flowerly language lol, so we have calcs involving those now, there was contentions revolving around the particle beam adam blocked, and idk

 

[WeeklyBattles]

What did I miss?

Can someone summarize what's happened? Links to relevant comments would be helpful as well.

A lot lol

Summed up, we've moved away from penny's lasers being based on hard light dust and are just going with the argument that they are mechanical lasers with the properties of lightspeed, velvet's lasers are still considered lightspeed, the Spider Droid is confirmed to have a particle cannon, and we got a bunch of lightspeed statements in regards to the silver eyes

 

[Cyberblader90]

Also visually when it fires it's particle Cannon the Droid reassembles itself into something like a particle accelerator and fires it as a pure beam rather than like an explosive then it's normal mode would

 

[Spinoirr]

Need someone to post the new calcs for rusty to check out because no one wants to go back and read the past pages