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Rule Violation Reports (New forum)

Agnaa is correct. Eficiente has not done anything bad enough to warrant an actual punishment, and many non-staff members have done worse with considerably less backlash. If we start to punish our staff members for comparatively silly things like this, we will very soon have almost nobody to help me out to manage things anymore. In fact, I would have to quit as well, since I have had bad days several times in the past as well.
 
My point is, nothing ever comes of this. A comment he made fets brought up at the RVR, we have this exact same discussion, and zilch happens. That's the vibe I'm getting.

This wouldn't happen if he was confronted on this. That's literally the bare minimum we ask for.
 
I do agree with Wright, However. Take this to Eficiente’s Message Wall. I can agree he can go overboard on occasion, but he’ll never change unless someone actually tries something. We enforce rules and ban/warn/demote people because of them, Eficiente got warned, but we can’t do much else, as we’re not the Respect Police.
 
Antvasima said:
Agnaa is correct. Eficiente has not done anything bad enough to warrant an actual punishment, and many non-staff members have done worse with considerably less backlash. If we start to punish our staff members for comparatively silly things like this, we will very soon have almost nobody to help me out to manage things anymore. In fact, I would have to quit as well, since I have had bad days several times in the past as well.
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It's hard to dismiss it as silly when this keeps happening, Ant.
 
Schnee_One said:
I’m going to be frank, this is not the first time Eficiente has been blatantly disrespectful for literally no reason, there are multiple Jojo threads in the past where he does this and many others where he pulls the bias card on people, me included.

Quite frankly, I’m sick of a dude who blatantly acts disrespectful and gives a wall of text as to why he’s justified in doing it only getting a wrist slap, we made him staff, he must follow rules.
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I can vouch for the JoJo bit. The dude does kinda have a track record of disrespectiful behavior.

However, it's not up to me to decide on what should be done with him.
 
Tell you what, Milly, I'm starting to see your point. So, go talk to him about it. If he doesn't shape up, then we can have a serious discussion about removing him from staff. (A guy with a knack for snide insults like that shouldn't be a discussion mod).
 
00potato said:
The fact that he acted this way before kinda disproves this being “you being dragged in for every little comment.”
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Kind of irrelevant though. if anyone wants to make a case against him, gather evidence, and don't look at isolated incidents. It took a motherload of evidence to get Xcano banned, and efficient is actually a good member who isn't intent on destroying the wiki from the inside. Just a dude with some attitude problems
 
I'm not familiar with his other comments, but there is a balance to make between how often they have incidents like this, how far apart they are, how severe they are, etc.

e.g. if he'd simply been making comments like this once every 6 months since he'd joined the site, I wouldn't see that as severe enough to demote. But if they were happening monthly or more commonly than that, I think some sort of punishment could be justified.

tl;dr just this instance isn't enough, and I'm not familiar with his past instances to judge on them.
 
I mean, I did look the other way when he randomly did something similar in another thread but I did not know it was a repeated offense.

image0.png

image0.png
 
The_Wright_Way said:
If you want Efficient to shap up, then go talk to him about it.

The only reason I ever shaped up is because people talked to me about it. I wasn't dragged to the RVR for every little comment. There's no reason this can't be a discussion on his wall.
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Strongly agreed.

You could use the PM function as well. This is just destructive drama due to extreme oversensitivity.

We should try to be polite and respectful, yes, but this is also not a kindergarten. Remember that we used to have trolls bombard the staff with death and rape threats, gore and ****, hundreds of disgusting videos uploaded in our names just so they would show up in Google searches, and have had YouTube attack videos targeting me and other staff members shown to tens of thousands of people, and the staff still have generally tried to remain professional and dedicated to helping out throughout all of the ordeals. We cannot start punishing them every time they say something the slightest bit offensive.

Meaning, some degree of thicker skin is necessary to be able to endure virtually anything whatsoever.
 
Antvasima said:
Agnaa is correct. Eficiente has not done anything bad enough to warrant an actual punishment, and many non-staff members have done worse with considerably less backlash. If we start to punish our staff members for comparatively silly things like this, we will very soon have almost nobody to help me out to manage things anymore. In fact, I would have to quit as well, since I have had bad days several times in the past as well.
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If you give a person a job, and the power it comes with, they need to do said job.

Eficiente is a discussion MODERATOR, if he does not moderate discussions but instead provokes them, he shouldn’t have s job

It doesn’t mean shit if what someone does is minor when they do it constantly.

Im taking this to Eficiente’s wall. A warning is enough
 
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I don't think calling an argument "cringy" should count as anything bad. I view insults at arguments as far less bad than insults at people, and more soft/memey insults like "cringy" as far less bad than slurs and accusations.

I do agree with Schnee and others that staff should be held to a somewhat higher standard, but I'm not familiar enough with Eficiencte's past to know if he should be demoted.
 
Agnaa said:
I literally never said I wanted either of those, so why is everyone assuming I want him gone??

You keep vaguely saying "He should be punished! Punish him more!" without ever telling us what these punishments are. I ask you again, what else are we supposed to take from that?

Is there no strike system

There sort of is. They're called warnings. The thing that he got from three different people in the thread. If he'd keep continuing this sort of behaviour despite these warnings, he'd get demoted/banned.

or an actual apology for comments that were done unprovoked and hostile?

We can't magically compel apologies.

Why is that allowed to slide regardless of mod or member?

It wasn't allowed to slide. Three people warned him over it, and other staff members supported the warnings.
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I would appreciate you stop lying about me. My whole reason for coming here is asking why is behavior like that only worth a slap on the wrist? Because he’s a good mod? Because he’d feel “alienated”?? Like what does that even mean, I asked how is that a punishment, anyone can say chill out, it’s not a warning.

Why are you, Wright, and Ant so dismissive of this earlier? This isn’t me even being over sensitive or wanting to start drama like what’s being portrayed, I just want to know why exactly can he say I shouldn’t speak because he disagrees, and proceeds to say I’m spreading misinformation and lying??
 
I don’t think calling people cringe is bad either. It’s just weird he randomly came into the thread just to say that. I thought he‘s just having a bad day.
 
Schnee:

It is much better if you take it to private PMs instead of several members attacking him publicly at the same time. He is much more likely to respond well to that kind of approach.
 
My response to Milly ended up being pretty long so I've spoilered it.

I would appreciate you stop lying about me.

My bad, I did **** up a bit there.

My whole reason for coming here is asking why is behavior like that only worth a slap on the wrist?

Because it's minor.

Because he’s a good mod?

Technically kinda, if someone did this stuff constantly it'd be bad. But I'd moreso phrase it as "because this is a rare occurrence from them" rather than the way you did.

Because he’d feel “alienated”??

Nope.

I asked how is that a punishment

It's the lightest one, more akin to a warning/strike.

anyone can say chill out, it’s not a warning.

Coming from staff members it is, and it is treated as such. Stuff like that has been brought up in the past to demonstrate that a user has been warned before without shaping up.

Why are you, Wright, and Ant so dismissive of this earlier?

For me, because that one incident seems so small that it has already been sufficiently addressed.

This isn’t me even being over sensitive or wanting to start drama like what’s being portrayed

From my perspective it really seems like that.

I just want to know why exactly can he say I shouldn’t speak because he disagrees, and proceeds to say I’m spreading misinformation and lying??

Because one comment phrased pretty civilly (not in all caps, no slurs, no personal insults) is pretty damn tame, and able to be resolved with just an instruction to stop.
 
Eficiente is occasionally easily annoyed, but is generally rational, productive, and helpful, and has not done anything bad enough for a demotion.

It is much better if staff members here talk with him via PMs. I do not want us to incite some kind of gang-up behaviour.
 
Antvasima said:
Eficiente is occasionally easily annoyed, but is generally rational, productive, and helpful, and has not done anything bad enough for a demotion.

It is much better if staff members here talk with him via PMs. I do not want us to incite some kind of gang-up behaviour.
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I mean, I'm easily annoyed too, but I at least apologize when called out.

That said, I'd advise people to avoid lighting torches.
 
Several people ganging up on him via his message wall is the entirely wrong way to cause any positive change whatsoever. I strongly urge everybody who have attacked him there to delete their messages and move to separate PMs instead.
 
Also, Eficiente gave thumbs up to staff comments that reprimanded him.
 
It's not just that one comment he made in the blazblue thread, ant. It's that he has been apparently doing this for quite a while now. A discussion moderator is supposed to keep things civilized, not the opposite.
 
XSOULOFCINDERX said:
So far it's just Wright and Schnee.
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More will likely come due to being publicly encouraged here. Again, take it to PMs, or you will likely provoke a destructive lashout reaction that benefits nobody in this community.
 
Antvasima said:
Several people ganging up on him via his message wall is the entirely wrong way to cause any positive change whatsoever. I strongly urge everybody who have attacked him there to delete their messages and move to separate PMs instead.
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I have made one with literally no insults or ill will that is significantly less then the majority of posts he has made, I have made my point clear.

BTW Kudosing posts doesn't mean much when all it takes is literally one apology and him trying to shape up and this whole situation is solved, the fact that he is aware of this and doesn't even bother is even less trust worthy.
 
Potato:

As Agnaa originally said, given just how much he was reprimanded in sum total, if anything the way he was treated was an overreaction for this somewhat semi-offensive comment.
 
@Ant I believe Wright/Schnee's comments come from more of a knowledge of Eficiente's history, rather than just this one comment.

I also don't share your worry about attacks, especially with how civil but stern Wright/Schnee's comments there have been. But I do see why you'd rather this happen over PMs.
 
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