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Riordanverse Tier 6 Revisions

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Jason was near the center, not in it, which means he will not benefit from the full range of the explosion. He won't even have half. It's a sphere if it's a normal explosion- the energy spreads in 360 degrees.

Also stop throwing 'casual' in front of everything. The Demigods themselves don't say that and neither does narration. Endless use of 'casual' is by far one of the most useless parts of Vsdebating because there's almost no objective use of the term.
 
Explosion Yield Calculations

This is how this wiki calculates explosions. Jason was holding the sword and it exploded, how is he not in the centre?

Anyway according to the above link, we first calculate the explosion yield via Inverse Square Law (but in this case Jason is in the centre), then multiply by Jason's cross-section area (the average for a human is 0.68). That will still be slightly less only I think.
 
And if you somehow have a problem with the world casual, would "unharmed" and "young and untrained" make you feel better? Since:

Percy was unharmed after smashing the glacier.

Hazel and Nico were both young and untrained when their High 7-C and Low 7-B feats happened.

While the explosion did hurt Jason, he was recover eventually.
 
It is stated that Percy spent two weeks on Ogygia after the incident:

  • ""LOST?" she yelled. "Two weeks, Percy? Where in the world—""
Percy only spent a few nights on Ogygia after he woke up, some of which spanned quite a considerable sleep time (so much Percy wasn't sure if he didn't sleep several days even after he began recovering), which means he at the very least spent many days out cold.

Even after he recovers considerably he can't do shit without toppling over. He also states many times that every single drop of energy was spent during the feat, and that he couldn't control what he did at all.

Ergo, the farthest thing from casual imaginable.
 
Never said this was casual, but anyway he spent two weeks on Ogygia, but he wasn't out of cold for a few days. It was said that he fell asleep after the first time he woke up, and probably slept a long time.
 
Jason was holding his javelin and the giant broke it. The epicenter of the explosion is not in Jason but several feet in front of him.

Said explosion then travels in 360 degrees, losing energy the entire time. Because this point was not in Jason and traveled outwards in a sphere- it is impossible for Jason to have absorbed even half (or a greater percentage) of the energy because of this.


Unharmed, young, and untrained all individually have practically nothing to do with the amount of effort expended in the feats. Unharmed does but that leaves a wide gap between, "Minimal effort" and "A great deal of effort but it didn't ultimately hurt me".

Just call the feat as it is. Percy smashed the glacier. No need to throw in 'casual' or 'when he was young' to try and make it better.
 
Spinosaurus75DinosaurFan said:
Never said this was casual, but anyway he spent two weeks on Ogygia, but he wasn't out of cold for a few days. It was said that he fell asleep after the first time he woke up, and probably slept a long time.
Click to expand...
You sure were pegging it as not an anti feat, even though it surefire is.
 
You did say "Percy casually smashed the glacier.".

If you're tired enough to need to sleep for weeks, it's not really a casual feat.
 
For starts he's using a polearm so presumably the explosion is at least an entire meter away from him since those tend to be 2 meters long.

For another given that Jason and the giant had identical distances forced between them despite the giant clearly being more durable and larger, there's no logical reason that their durability had anything to do with it. Jason is neither as durable as the giant nor as large yet was thrown backwards an identical distance. Jason likewise cannot have actually absorbed any decent amount of the energy because otherwise the crater wouldn't be perfect- given that the energy continued on perfectly fine in order to make the sphere- it clearly doesn't stop 2 or 3 feet away from the explosion.

For one more thing, the first calculator it says to use, this one , doesn't list craters. Nukemap gives you a 30 feet deep crater at 1 kiloto. Am I missing something?
 
Percy is the son of Poseidon, he is fine with high dives into water and manipulating large chunks of it, so him breaking a chunk off Hubbard Glacier is something that takes some effort and does not in any way scale to others. Especially when no one else can pull off something like it or tank it in the first place.

This is honestly the most egregious part of the discussion. People seem to be fine with scaling powers to physical stats of all demigods, which is crazy when most durability feats are far below the Big Three showings, and not everyone is as blessed as the Big Three. Even scaling in between the Big Three should be done with caveats as not everyone is as strong as each other.
 
Friendlysociopath said:
For starts he's using a polearm so presumably the explosion is at least an entire meter away from him since those tend to be 2 meters long.

For another given that Jason and the giant had identical distances forced between them despite the giant clearly being more durable and larger, there's no logical reason that their durability had anything to do with it. Jason is neither as durable as the giant nor as large yet was thrown backwards an identical distance. Jason likewise cannot have actually absorbed any decent amount of the energy because otherwise the crater wouldn't be perfect- given that the energy continued on perfectly fine in order to make the sphere- it clearly doesn't stop 2 or 3 feet away from the explosion.

For one more thing, the first calculator it says to use, this one , doesn't list craters. Nukemap gives you a 30 feet deep crater at 1 kiloto. Am I missing something?
Click to expand...
I will link to the calc when I go home
 
The average man's javelin is apparently 2.6m long. Let's assume 40% of the height, sine that's usually the point where one grips it to swing it around or throw it, and we get 1.04 meters.

4*pi*1,04^2/2 = 6.79m^2

  • 61729344000000 / 6,79 = 9,09e12 joules per square meter
  • 9,09e12 * 0,68 = 6,812e12 joules, or 1.5 kilotons of TNT.
 
Percy surviving the Saint Helens eruption, though...I'm not sure if it's 9-B due to lava shenanigans, or tier 7 something due to it being specified to be an explosion that hit him.
 
Percy surviving St Helens

Chapter 11

"He scooped some lava out of the nearest furnace. It set his fingers ablaze, but this didn't seem to bother him at all. The other elder telekhines did the same. The first one threw a glop of molten rock at me and set my pants on fire. Two more splattered across my chest. I dropped my sword in sheer terror and swatted at my clothes. Fire was engulfing me.

Strangely, it felt only warm at first, but it was getting hotter by the instant.

"Your father's nature protects you," one said. "Makes you hard to burn. But not impossible, youngling. Not impossible." They threw more lava at me, and I remember screaming. My whole body was on fire. The pain was worse than anything I'd ever felt. I was being consumed. I crumpled to the metal floor and heard the sea demon children howling in delight.

Then I remembered the voice of the river naiad at the ranch: The water is within me.

I needed the sea. I felt a tugging sensation in my gut, but I had nothing around to help me. Not a faucet or a river. Not even a petrified seashell this time. And besides, the last time I'd unleashed my power at the stables, there'd been that scary moment when it had almost gotten away from me.

I had no choice. I called to the sea. I reached inside myself and remembered the waves and the currents, the endless power of the ocean.

And I let it loose in one horrible scream.

Afterward, I could never describe what happened. An explosion, a tidal wave, a whirlwind of power simultaneously catching me up and blasting me downward into the lava. Fire and water collided, superheated steam, and I shot upward from the heart of the volcano in a huge explosion, just one piece of flotsam thrown free by a million pounds of pressure. The last thing I remember before losing conscious was flying, flying so high Zeus would never have forgiven me, and then beginning to fall, smoke and fire and water streaming from me. I was a comet hurtling toward the earth."

Chapter 12

""Time," Calypso mused. "Time is always difficult here. I honestly don't know, Percy."

"You know my name?"

"You talk in your sleep."

I blushed. "Yeah. I've been…uh, told that before."

"Yes. Who is Annabeth?"

"Oh, uh. A friend. We were together when—wait, how did I get here? Where am I?"

Calypso reached up and ran her fingers through my mangled hair. I stepped back nervously.

"I'm sorry," she said. "I've just grown used to caring for you. as to how you got here, you fell from the sky. You landed in the water, just there." She pointed across the beach. "I do not know how you survived. The water seemed to cushion your fall. As to where you are, you are in Ogygia." "
 
Wait, so Percy would have died were it not for his father's domain making his fall soft? That means he was a literal smidge from death.
 
A reminder that Piper's 100% human father was only a few feet away from this as well as an unconscious Coach Hedge.

Also the book says nothing about headfirst into the pit or anything of the sort. All it says is the giant toppled over and fell into the pit.

"A large black metal wedge slammed into Enceladus with a massive thunk! The giant toppled over and slid into the pit."

We already know the pit is 30 feet deep. That is enough for this to be possible- without any mention of radius whatsoever needed.
 
Spinosaurus75DinosaurFan said:
Are you sure it was the tip of the javelin that exploded though
Click to expand...
It was done while Jason was thrusting towards Enceladus' back, when Ency spun around like a Beyblade to break the javelin. While not specified, it would still be closer to the tip than Jason.

Chapter 43

Enceladus let him approach, grinning with anticipation. At the last second, Jason faked a strike and rolled between the giant's legs. He came up quickly, thrusting with all his might, ready to stab the giant in the small of his back, but Enceladus anticipated the trick. He stepped aside with too much speed and agility for a giant, as if the earth were helping him move.

He swept his spear sideways, met Jason's javelin—and with a snap like a shotgun blast, the golden weapon shattered.

The explosion was hotter than the giant's breath, blinding Jason with golden light. The force knocked him off his feet and squeezed the breath out of him.
 
It was done while Jason was thrusting towards Enceladus' back, when Ency spun around like a Beyblade to break the javelin. While not specified, it would still be closer to the tip than Jason.

Chapter 43

Enceladus let him approach, grinning with anticipation. At the last second, Jason faked a strike and rolled between the giant's legs. He came up quickly, thrusting with all his might, ready to stab the giant in the small of his back, but Enceladus anticipated the trick. He stepped aside with too much speed and agility for a giant, as if the earth were helping him move.

He swept his spear sideways, met Jason's javelin—and with a snap like a shotgun blast, the golden weapon shattered.

The explosion was hotter than the giant's breath, blinding Jason with golden light. The force knocked him off his feet and squeezed the breath out of him.

Yeah, but the whole javelin exploded, right?
 
Kepekley23 said:
Wait, so Percy would have died were it not for his father's domain making his fall soft? That means he was a literal smidge from death.
Click to expand...
This was a thing since he fell off the Gateway Arch into the Mississippi, although possibly with some godly help pushing him there as the river isn't directly below the arch.

It is physically impossible to fall from the Gateway Arch in St. Louis into the Mississippi River, as the Gateway Arch does not span the river. It is in fact almost five hundred feet from the edge of the Mississippi River normally. Falling straight down would land him in the middle of the grassy park of the Jefferson National Expansion Memorial. Though Poseidon and/or Zeus may have been helping him, knowing he would be vital to future prophecies.
 
Friendlysociopath said:
A reminder that Piper's 100% human father was only a few feet away from this as well as an unconscious Coach Hedge.

Also the book says nothing about headfirst into the pit or anything of the sort. All it says is the giant toppled over and fell into the pit.

"A large black metal wedge slammed into Enceladus with a massive thunk! The giant toppled over and slid into the pit."

We already know the pit is 30 feet deep. That is enough for this to be possible- without any mention of radius whatsoever needed.
Click to expand...
If the pit is less than 30 pit wide then Encelandus wouldn't have been able to fall into it from a topple. He would have smashed into the ground and covered the hole. And if 30 feet is not the rough radius then he would smash his head right into the pit's bottom, not slid in.
 
An interesting thing about the volcano feat: Calypso noted that Percy should have died crashing in the water. In Percy's narrative, he witnesses the explosion, and only lost conscious when he crashed.

Which means he tanked a volcano blast but could not tank a fall. That makes no sense whatsoever.
 
Percy was still conscious when he blasted out, flying in the sky. He only fainted and "should have died" after crashing in the water.

So basically this makes no sense. If you want to use this as an anti-feat then we may as well as downgrade Percy Jackson to 9-C or 9-B.
 
Spinosaurus75DinosaurFan said:
An interesting thing about the volcano feat: Calypso noted that Percy should have died crashing in the water. In Percy's narrative, he witnesses the explosion, and only lost conscious when he crashed.

Which means he tanked a volcano blast but could not tank a fall. That makes no sense whatsoever.
Click to expand...
He didn't tank a full blast and was blown away by the initial eruption thanks to the steam and forces released. It's not like he took an energy blast to the face. And yes, most demigods would have died there if not from the steam slamming them up, then the eventual crash landing. Even Percy wasn't safe if he had hit the ground instead of the water.
 
If this is what everyone is agreeing on, then 9-B Percy. While I disagree the 6-C feat is invalid, if that is what everyone thinks, then tier 9.

Either 9-B or 6-C
 
I would think that a calc member is capable of more indepth analysis than Either 9-B or 6-C. My reasonable idea is to correctly analyse his feats, try not to scale everyhting he does with his powers to his physical stats and most likely end up with something like Tier 8/9 with Riptide, Tier 7 with powers for his AP, while his durability has added notes such as protection from falling into water and such. Same goes for other Big 3 demigods, while the rest like Annabeth, Clarisse, Frank, Leo, Piper etc., get their own ratings not based off scaling to Percy or the invalid sky feat.
 
We all know you think demigods are as strong as a normal human and Blofis is as strong as a monster.

I was asking others if they want 9-B physical strength for demigods, as most of the others are saying bullshit like "7-C physical strength/durability". That is what I meant by "either 9-B or 6-C".

If what the majority wants is 9-B, then fine, even though I disagree. But if what they want is Tier 7 and the supposed anti-feat for 6-C is a feat that implies Percy is 9-B (also the True Form thing which makes no sense), then you are making no ******* sense at all.
 
Way to misinterpret and mislead people. My point has always been that most demigods excluding Percy and a few have zero scaling or feats that would leave them at 7-C, let alone 6-C outliers that you like to push for some reason.

Given that this is a CRT, it would be best to rescale the pages with proper feats and scaling, avoiding dumb stuff like Percy scaling to Annabeth or Clarisse being far weaker than Annabeth. Ridiculous scaling is a big problem in a lot of the profiles, so why should it not be fixed?

Also, arbitrarily deciding ratings without you know, any actual analysis seems premature, especially from a calc member.
 
Spinosaurus75DinosaurFan said:
We all know you think demigods are as strong as a normal human
Click to expand...
How many interpretations can you really take of this?

Honestly you're overreacting. There's a 6-C outlier and a 9-B anti feat, what of it? There are plenty of Tier 7 feats that make plenty of sense.
 
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