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Revisiting Toneri's Moon Split

AKM sama

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I know this has been brought up before, but I feel the need to address it because the arguments I've seen on previous threads are just bad.

Currently Toneri's feat of splitting the Moon is calculated like this. According to the calc, the distance between the two halves of the Moon is 61.6 km going off of a single inconsistent scene. However, the problem with this is explained below.

BmpQ7Y0.jpg
vTGovOt.jpg

8OfyUxa.png
ONYz7lo.jpg


The top two images are only a few seconds after the Moon was split, and the bottom two images are from a little bit later during the fight. We can see that throughout the fight, the distance between the two halves is depicted consistently to be much much lower than 61.6 km. So much so that the people standing on different pieces can casually talk to each other.




Moreover,

Screen_Shot_2021-05-30_at_11.28.16_AM.png
IDlIIaE.jpg


In this shot which is currently used for the calc, we can see that the width of the beam is comparable to the crack and the distance between the halves. If calculated using the same pixel scaling method, the width of the beam would be in tens of kilometers.

But,

Screen_Shot_2021-05-30_at_11.27.00_AM.png
Screenshot_35.png


In above shots, we see that the beam passes right behind the area where Kurama is fighting the Golem, and it is comparable to them in size. It is most certainly not kilometers wide, given that Kurama's size is portrayed between a several dozens to a couple hundred meters. This only goes to show further that the scene being used is inconsistent.




Screenshot_37.png
Screenshot_36.png
Screenshot_38.png


In these scenes we can see that the Golem is bigger in size than the crack, as he emerges from underneath destroying the edges due to its size.




Simply put, the reason we are using the one scene of moon that gives a distance of 61.6 km is because the feat happens in that scene. It doesn't matter if the feat happens in that scene. The feat simply tells us that the moon has been split. The distance between the halves is shown to us by many different scenes. And when there are about half a dozen scenes of the distance being some meters, than one scene with 61.6km distance is an outlier.

And given the other context, with the beam's width and Kurama's/Golem's size, it can be easily chalked up to be an art inconsistency because animators don't measure such stuff with a scale.

Another argument I've seen from people is that the pieces came together after being separated. That logic doesn't work because it implies that the two halves traveled 61.6 km in only a few seconds. With that kind of relative speed, they would have crashed instantly with a force that would have destroyed the majority of the Moon. Except we see that doesn't happen and the distance is constant throughout the fight.

In conclusion
There is literally no reason to use that one flashy show-y scene that is only meant to display the split that contradicts everything else and breaks the story, when there are about a half a dozen plot-relevant scenes where the distance is depicted to be some meters, people are talking about important stuff standing on opposite halves casually, the distance is depicted to be smaller than the Golem, the beam width from the currently used scene is inconsistent with other scenes, etc. At that point, it's simply an art inconsistency, and in cases like these, we always go with what's consistently shown to us and what's safer to use, ignoring the inconsistent showing.
 
While I agree with the OP that consistently it's far less than 61.6 KM, this has been discussed multiple times and the reason is apparently because it's better to use the split as it happens in the feat as oppose to later.

Everything in the OP has been brought up before, so I don't personally see why the result will be different, even if I agree it should be.
 
I don't think it really changes all that much to be honest, might only really affect Toneri.

Actually that isn't true, it would slightly affect Naruto/Sasuke as well.
It would affect all the God tiers because they all scale from Toneri.
 
It would affect all the God tiers because they all scale from Toneri.
Don't SPSM Naruto/Sasuke have a 5-C+ calc though?

Hagoromo is also 5-C+ through his own stuff and Kaguya scales above him

Jigen/Isshiki scales above SPSM Naruto/Sasuke

Momoshiki fought SPSM Naruto and Sasuke

Madara scales to SPSM Naruto/Sasuke

Juubito currently scales to Hagoromo somewhat.

Why would Toneri's feat affect them all that much?
 
So uh, is the feat going to have to be re-calculated or something? What exactly is this supposed to do to the verse?
 
This change would essentially make the Calc 6-A to High 6-A

GG Tier 5 Naruto 👀

I can already see the other Tier 5 Calcs being nuked and the God Tiers going to Tier 6
 
Don't SPSM Naruto/Sasuke have a 5-C+ calc though?

Hagoromo is also 5-C+ through his own stuff and Kaguya scales above him

Jigen/Isshiki scales above SPSM Naruto/Sasuke

Momoshiki fought SPSM Naruto and Sasuke

Madara scales to SPSM Naruto/Sasuke

Juubito currently scales to Hagoromo somewhat.

Why would Toneri's feat affect them all that much?
Lemme put it this way.....

Chibaku Tensei = Ass for scaling lol
 
I know this has been brought up before, but I feel the need to address it because the arguments I've seen on previous threads are just bad.

Currently Toneri's feat of splitting the Moon is calculated like this. According to the calc, the distance between the two halves of the Moon is 61.6 km going off of a single inconsistent scene. However, the problem with this is explained below.

BmpQ7Y0.jpg
vTGovOt.jpg

8OfyUxa.png
ONYz7lo.jpg


The top two images are only a few seconds after the Moon was split, and the bottom two images are from a little bit later during the fight. We can see that throughout the fight, the distance between the two halves is depicted consistently to be much much lower than 61.6 km. So much so that the people standing on different pieces can casually talk to each other.




Moreover,

Screen_Shot_2021-05-30_at_11.28.16_AM.png
IDlIIaE.jpg


In this shot which is currently used for the calc, we can see that the width of the beam is comparable to the crack and the distance between the halves. If calculated using the same pixel scaling method, the width of the beam would be in tens of kilometers.

But,

Screen_Shot_2021-05-30_at_11.27.00_AM.png
Screenshot_35.png


In above shots, we see that the beam passes right behind the area where Kurama is fighting the Golem, and it is comparable to them in size. It is most certainly not kilometers wide, given that Kurama's size is portrayed between a several dozens to a couple hundred meters. This only goes to show further that the scene being used is inconsistent.




Screenshot_37.png
Screenshot_36.png
Screenshot_38.png


In these scenes we can see that the Golem is bigger in size than the crack, as he emerges from underneath destroying the edges due to its size.




Simply put, the reason we are using the one scene of moon that gives a distance of 61.6 km is because the feat happens in that scene. It doesn't matter if the feat happens in that scene. The feat simply tells us that the moon has been split. The distance between the halves is shown to us by many different scenes. And when there are about half a dozen scenes of the distance being some meters, than one scene with 61.6km distance is an outlier.

And given the other context, with the beam's width and Kurama's/Golem's size, it can be easily chalked up to be an art inconsistency because animators don't measure such stuff with a scale.

Another argument I've seen from people is that the pieces came together after being separated. That logic doesn't work because it implies that the two halves traveled 61.6 km in only a few seconds. With that kind of relative speed, they would have crashed instantly with a force that would have destroyed the majority of the Moon. Except we see that doesn't happen and the distance is constant throughout the fight.

In conclusion
There is literally no reason to use that one flashy show-y scene that is only meant to display the split that contradicts everything else and breaks the story, when there are about a half a dozen plot-relevant scenes where the distance is depicted to be some meters, people are talking about important stuff standing on opposite halves casually, the distance is depicted to be smaller than the Golem, the beam width from the currently used scene is inconsistent with other scenes, etc. At that point, it's simply an art inconsistency, and in cases like these, we always go with what's consistently shown to us and what's safer to use, ignoring the inconsistent showing.
Aye, i understood, so you are telling that the moon hasn't split completely, cuz the split crack size is smaller than the golem.
Makes sense to me.
 
Because AKM asked me to, I'm going to briefly break my rule about speaking on HST threads. This ain't happening again.

I agree with the OP. I don't care that it was shut down previously. If the split is constantly shown to be far smaller than 61 km (such as being small enough for individuals to carry on a conversation across it), then it shouldn't be considered 61 km based on some massive outward view. We can get a much more exact measurement in the micro than the macro, that's always the case.

Downgrade away.
 
Because AKM asked me to, I'm going to briefly break my rule about speaking on HST threads. This ain't happening again.

I agree with the OP. I don't care that it was shut down previously. If the split is constantly shown to be far smaller than 61 km (such as being small enough for individuals to carry on a conversation across it), then it shouldn't be considered 61 km based on some massive outward view. We can get a much more exact measurement in the micro than the macro, that's always the case.

Downgrade away.
Is the golem's size important for measuring distance of the crack, just asking?
 
Yeah I'm not sure why it would be shut down previously if the instances of the crack being portrayed as not 60km are the more consistent ones than what seems to be a sole shot.
 
I don't see why you can't use the moon being chopped in half in general. The issue is just the 60km fissure claim being contradicted by what seems to be every other shot it appears in. You would just need a more consistent size for that.
 
Whatever tier the math comes out to lol I don't think anyone has something specific in mind.

I'd eyeball it at somewhere in High 6-A since iirc 5-C is kinda small and 60km to <1km is a decent change
 
Is this gonna be another Bleach thing if people keep poking at the sleeping bear?
 
We still has Toneri's feat moving the moon. But that massacres and buries the upscaling thread to Low 5-B...

F
 
It doesn't make sense to use Kurama's size as an example, as in the movie he is portrayed in the same size as Naruto's first costume transformation. That is, small. The megazord is pure chakra, and the user determines whether it will be small or not. (obviously it has limits)

The point here is that it doesn't make sense to use Kurama's size as a 100% parameter, as he is bigger than what was shown in the movie, and Naruto could make him bigger.

Using the argument that they were talking as if distance were a differential is wrong. Soon on Naruto?! The work loves to ignore distance in conversations. And this has been demonstrated countless times.

Anyway, I recommend calculating the size of the golem and recalculating the slit size.
 
I agree fully with the OP. I've always thought that the consistency of the later shots was more important for evaluating the feat than the single shot where the distance appears to be much greater.
 
Please don't. If naruto gets upgraded to any tier beyond 5-C I'll have a heart attack.
We still has Toneri's feat moving the moon. But that massacres and buries the upscaling thread to Low 5-B...

F
 
Lemme put it this way.....

Chibaku Tensei = Ass for scaling lol
Didn't the new scaling chains that were applied were to scale Naruto God Tiers to the Hagoromo feat and the New Era to Toneri feat through Movie Naruto? So that change would only affect New Era characters If I get it right...?
 
well not like it changes anything much but i agree, the distance is not 60 km, and besides the split still happened, he split the CT/GBE of the moon either way
another view from mine, (My physicist gf)
the moon is kind of a large mass the two split bodies would get closer overtime due to their gravitational energy pulling each other in.
 
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