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- #41
And what say that even if teleportation is blocked it would still affect the opponent?
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Rematch Shia Haulia vs Fiamma of the Right (6-9-0)
- Thread starter Expectro2000xxx
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To further solidify my point that teleportation is just a word thrown out by someone else ;
The translations do not use the word teleport to define the Holy Right attack once in the volume it appears in.
The translations do not use the word teleport to define the Holy Right attack once in the volume it appears in.
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Yes, because it's not teleportation?
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- #44
The literal description of the narrator itself say that the teleportation of Yue is instantaneous, it ignore speed and distance, the same as the hand, so why it's that if she can counter that she can't counter the hand?
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Because the attack is delivered immediately and she wouldn't be able to react to it just because her teleportation is instantaneous.
Being able to move instantly /=/ being able to react instantly, unless you have proof of that then by all means show her instantaneous infinite reaction speed.
But from what I'm seeing on her profile, she doesn't have that. Just impressive speed.
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- #46
The quote itself say that she reacted by sheer instinct... the opponent were even under a time magic that shorten everything while she wasn't even using amp... and the future sight automatically tell her what's gonna happen if she is in danger...
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Cool, instinct doesn't defend against something that ignores speed and distance. It's an infinite-speed level attack as it moves beyond the constraints of speed. There is nothing to instinctually react too as it's already there.
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- #48
... ok.
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So anyways, you missed a count. That's 4 for Fiamma against Shea.
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Just to clarify something, Fiamma's power IS literally descried as auto win button.
It may sound NLF but this is how his power is described in the novel. His attack doesn't have a speed, doesn't have a direction, and use the exact power needed to always end the target and will hit you no matter your place. It's an auto-win button through and through.
It may sound NLF but this is how his power is described in the novel. His attack doesn't have a speed, doesn't have a direction, and use the exact power needed to always end the target and will hit you no matter your place. It's an auto-win button through and through.
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Pretty much. It's likened and described in the novel as an RPG. Instead of having commands like 'Attack, Defend', he has 'Win'.
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- #52
Cool, don't seem to resist things like info manipulation, time manipulation, space manipulation, biological manipulation, or concept manipulation, and don't even know how potent is his soul and mind resistance, but I'm honestly tired and this don't seems to go nowhere so whatever.
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Literally none of this matters when she can't react to the first attack. Unless they're all passive, it's not a factor.
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- #54
Literally matter if for example she info manipulation the hand and so, but again, to tired and this don't seem to go nowhere.
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How is she doing that when the hand has already erased her? It's Fiamma's opening move.
Please don't be stubborn about this and just accept defeat if you're too tired to actually debate. The only reason this goes nowhere is because of your misconceptions.
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- #57
Because if for example she develop a way to info manipulation, time manipulation, etc the hand in the moment the hand touch her would affect her? And she literally revive at top condition like nothing in the moment she die?
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Again, she can't react that fast so that's not possible. I don't think you understand but this is how Fiamma matches work.
And yes, it's dumb. Even if she revives she'll just keep getting slapped. I dunno her character but I think endlessly dying wouldn't be what she wants.
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- #59
Again, she react from before anything happen because future sight, that's how her future sight work.
And yes, it's dumb.
(I know I said that I not gonna respond like this more, but when you begin the comments like this I can only react the same way)
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On any other site, sure. But this is VSB, here HR is restricted to SoL and at best planetary feats. And Fiamma's profile is pretty generous in power level by local Toaru community standards anyway.
Information manipulation is relevant, because that's one thing Right Hand of NLF failed to overcome in its interactions with lol!righthand.png - as in, it had the output to bruteforce through IB (otherwise absorption thing later on would've been impossible) and yet, it never did so, because it could read only the rest of Touma (just like Index in OT1), not the right palm.
Automatic ressurection. Fiamma haven't ever gone Yog, and Headcrab hasn't shown a spell that goes around, so he is not overcoming this.
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You can respond that way because I also think Fiamma's abilities are dumb. I don't see what future sight is gonna do. She'll see it's coming, try to time manip or info manip but Holy Right will brush both up and just end it.
Reaction wise on auto-detect, not The Strike. you're wrong. Also did you just say IB is information manipulation? Really? The only reason it has trouble locking on to IB is not because of info but because of IB's inherent properties of being an exorcising tool that resets the world. It's a fundamentally nullifying force with little power physically.
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Anyways, as for auto-ressurect ; How is she resisting being sealed into hell by the Right Hand?
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Looks like you didn't read the profile right,
Light speed is given to it reactions when it block an attack meant to him, ignoring speed and distant attack is it main gimmick and it's not the only verse to use this BS, LLT also has this "hit and end everything" so saying stuff like "we are on VSwiki" doesn't mean anything.
info hax doesn't mean anything she's not given the chance to use it.
Resurrection also doesn't mean anything when he can just seal her.
He can counter every gimmick she has.
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- #64
Why the hand would brush info and time manipulation? There aren't anything like that in his profile, the info can even conceptually erase, thing that also don't resist in his profile, and she literally just use one of them (or even various) before anything happen.
Edit: Also, you know that info manipulation can just negate the damage, right? Same with time manipulation. There don't are any mention in the profile about why that type of things wouldn't affect him.
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And Fiamma can swing before anything happens.
So. Here is why info won't work in the long run ; she erases the Holy Right, but then what? Telesma always returns back to its source phase so she's only erasing the HR currently in the world, but thanks to the Grimoire remote he can immediately remanifest it.
She also cannot resist sealing so he can just use Michael's little sealing miracle and send her to hell after killing her.
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- #66
If she is info manipulation, for say one of the hax, everything that touch her, what matter even if the hand come again?
The sealing is honestly the main win condition that Fiamma have that don't sound NLF, and in that case the sealing have to work against the haxs she already have and have to prevent that she develop anything after be sealed.
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She's sealed in hell... she's not doing anything there given how the Seven Seals on hell works in the Bible.
If the hand comes again then she immediately gets sealed if he can't swing, which he still should be able too but I'll play devils advocate.
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Then HR is peak human, as this is the only other speed value specified.
Or at best FTL+, as Touma can react to it. Which is also why future sight matters.
Also, why is spoiler button not working?
By Fiamma being in character and not using it as a first move. Otherwise, at best by spatial manip, which would probably fail.
Or by evolution, but in this case I think this would still be a loss even if it works.
I literally just gave an example of Holy Right not working correctly when it gets the wrong (lacking) info.
That's literally the first time I see something like this not being called "incomplete profile".
Rez
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He merely swung his right arm lightly. “I do not need destructive force.” [...] “If I touch my enemy, it’s over, so I don’t need to put any effort into destroying them.” [...] “I do not need speed.” A cold voice cut her off. Forcefully. Exceedingly overwhelming. “If I swing, I hit my enemy, so I don’t need to put any effort into hitting them.” Kamijou did not know what happened.
-Index volume 20
-Index volume 20
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Literally you just ruined your entire credit by saying Touma has FTL+ reactions.
This entire thread is very ironic. One side is spewing how Fiamma is an NLF but then we have the other saying Shea can develop random powers whenever she wants when it's both clear both characters have crazy NLF in canon potency.
There's a clear line of appeal to authority fallacies being done here by relying on the profiles and not the actual canon, as a lot of material on profiles are interpretative to begin with and supplied by proof. But they aren't fool proof, as democracy plays a part in getting things added too and democracy is not perfect.
My advice is ; Let's stop talking about this since it's clear one side doesn't understand how Toaru works and the other (us) only knows what we know about Fiamma.
Let's let the audience decide.
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This sound like how the conceptual erasure of the info manipulation work, don't use any destructive power, just make everything it touchs not exist, though in the description of the hand say that it use the exact amount needed to destroy, so I would say that the hand been able to destroy everything sounds NLF.
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In... what way, exactly?
The whole point of reactive evolution is developing powers when you want (or rather need).
That's appeal to popularity fallacy. Which is actually listed in the rules, unlike that one you threw at me.
Besides, how is using the given format of this site a fallacy? Isn't the whole point of VSB containing all fictional combat-ready characters in one system?
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fiamma fra
Heavens_Feel
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And now we have people saying touma has ftl reactions and HR is peak human speed.
Where are these people coming from? Did you read the novels upside down or something?? It boggles the mind.
Where are these people coming from? Did you read the novels upside down or something?? It boggles the mind.
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If HR's strike isnt teleportation (or spawning on the target), then Fiamma needs Infinite speed via HR
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Shea FRA
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- #79
It's also need to change the part about weakness, need to add to his profile resistance to info, time and conceptual manipulation, because he don't have anything like that in the profile.
Edit: DontTalkDT confirmed that he can't resist info, time or conceptual manipulation, so you better give a good argument as to why that don't work on Fiamma for any futher votes to him, I also don't see in the profile spatial resistance listed so that's other thing that need to be explained. He also confirmed that Fiamma can't use the hand forever.
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Rez
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Because Fiamma swings his hand casually and the fight ends she won't get a chance to use those
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