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Jack gets a surprising amount of wank for some reason. I once had to debate people on which was more likely to win a fight in general and people were saying Jack just because Herc threw their fight and gave away the win to Jack.
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Record of Ragnarok: Whatever the hell happened to this verse
- Thread starter OppaiSenpai5
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Jack still has 5-B, but to a much lesser extent than Herc and the other humans.
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So now his blood is 5-B? Because we know that the "building" are able ti affect him inly because jake have put some blood in them, i seriously think him as 5-B is weird, he like not even a fighter ...
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He uses Volunds, which can damage gods. He isn't 5-B without them.
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His gloves make those things 5-B, not that they are inherently that level.
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Yes. That is why he is 5-B like you said. He can turn anything he uses into a Volund, but physically he isn't (except in durability, but he far, far downscales.)
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I don't even see why Heracles is 5-B lmao.
Only people who scale to 5-B are like 4 people and in my mind it should be possibly.
Only people who scale to 5-B are like 4 people and in my mind it should be possibly.
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Shiva is 5-B, and Herc scales to or above Shiva.
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Literally why.
Shiva is only 5-B in his super form that he:
1. Never used in battle before.
2. Is stated to be far stronger than his normal self (Vishnu comments on how Shiva's power is nothing like before)
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And Herc is stated to be comparable to Zeus in physical power. Base Shiva is also stated to be able to create and destroys worlds on a whim.
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He's not. That's like a Heimdall statement. Zeus in his weakest form casually blocks both Ares and Alcides' punches.
Heimdall statements are 100% invalid.
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And Ares and Alcide were casually punching. Zeus is stronger of course but comparable doesn't mean equal. Also creating and destroying worlds on a whim with base Shiva.
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Isn't that statement also directly from Heimdall?
Jack should, bare minimum, have 5-B durability for casually tanking direct hits from Heracles. I don't see why this is so disagreed upon when it's literally exactly what happens in the manga. He takes hits and shrugs them off, the only one that seemed to take real affect was the direct one he took from Heracles near the end of the fight, after him being stated to be weakened from blood loss.
Jack should, bare minimum, have 5-B durability for casually tanking direct hits from Heracles. I don't see why this is so disagreed upon when it's literally exactly what happens in the manga. He takes hits and shrugs them off, the only one that seemed to take real affect was the direct one he took from Heracles near the end of the fight, after him being stated to be weakened from blood loss.
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Also, i've already pointed out how Zeus caught their attacks when they both already fought themselves to exhaustion
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1. They weren't casual they were going all out meanwhile Zeus was at his weakest and he easily blocked both jokingly. How can you misremember events so badly?
2. Base Shiva has no real feats on that level and we know from actual reliable narration that he can only supposedly do it in his final form.
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You guys haven't provided any evidence for 5-B.
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Ares, who knows Zeus' strength, compares base Heracles to Zeus,
The "anti-feat" for this is Zeus catching their punches near the end of the fight, but literally nobody has given a counter to my counterargument of: They had already fought themselves to exhaustion. They were weakened because of this, making Zeus able to catch their hits.
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Very good point, Matt I had actually forgotten about Zeus stopping the punches.
Also for clarification, by raw strength I was referring to physical strength and durability, not counting weapons or speed
Also for clarification, by raw strength I was referring to physical strength and durability, not counting weapons or speed
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I suppose Herc having Zeus's strength may just be him reminding Ares of Zeus, or Ares sensing Zeus's power. Especially since it's contradicted so immediately
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Or it's because they were weakened after exhausting each other...
Does nobody remember the scene were Zeus delivers a massive punch to the side of Ares' face in the Heracles vs Jack fight and Ares doesn't even have a visual bruise? He makes his arm buff and throws a massive right hook into the side of Ares' face and it does nothing other than send him flying. That's a decent bit of supporting evidence.
Does nobody remember the scene were Zeus delivers a massive punch to the side of Ares' face in the Heracles vs Jack fight and Ares doesn't even have a visual bruise? He makes his arm buff and throws a massive right hook into the side of Ares' face and it does nothing other than send him flying. That's a decent bit of supporting evidence.
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I don't buy the assumption that Hercules > Shiva or Raiden because a straightforward reading of the text renders that absolutely ridiculous. Shiva tanked and overpowered Raiden who should be absolutely Godly in comparison to Jack (in terms of physical strength) and Hercules lost badly to Jack
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Hercules if he was trying could easily one-shot Jack. He literally gave the win to Jack. Jack like I said doesn't have any physical strength, and gets his AP from his Volunds.
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But he was trying. He even went into his most powerful form at great risk to his life. And he still wasn't fast or strong enough to OHK Jack ... In fact, the metal spike that Jack fell onto seemed to have caused the most damage to him
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Infinite, are you seriously telling me that he went into the form that has a 100% chance to kill him, and brute forced his way through multiple of Jack's defenses and went for straight hits, he wasn't trying? He was trying to win the fight, as he stated, but he just didn't kill Jack at the end. That doesn't mean he wasn't trying for the rest of it.
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Also, Heracles should probably get some form of Natural Weaponry, actually. When he swings his fists, there's MASSIVE claw marks and such on the area around him. So, the claws definitely do mean something there. Maybe not Natural Weaponry, but it should definitely warrant something.
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Probably either natural weaponry if they were done through physical contact, or air manip if it was shockwaves.
Since we still don't have a page for shockwave manipulation
Since we still don't have a page for shockwave manipulation
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I'm not sure. If it was shockwaves, it wouldn't be in the exact shape of giant claw marks.
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Hercules & Ares were exhausted after an extended battle, also stopping a punch doesn't mean anything, it doesn't make an anti feat at all.
Secondly, we see that Zeus later punches Ares with his buff arm and Ares is totally unharmed, that's other supporting evidence.
Lastly, Hercules failing to one shot Jack, is a great durability feat for Jack who has no anti feats at this point in the story.
Secondly, we see that Zeus later punches Ares with his buff arm and Ares is totally unharmed, that's other supporting evidence.
Lastly, Hercules failing to one shot Jack, is a great durability feat for Jack who has no anti feats at this point in the story.
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5B Jack ... the meme is real
Also
Also this is exactly the kind of nonsense all this context and story-blind scaling leads to ... with Jack (whose main schtick was trickery and deception) being scaled to higher physical strength than Lu Bu, Thor, Raiden and Shiva - who have been shown to be some of the greatest physical powerhouses
Also
This was most likely done for comedic purposes
Also this is exactly the kind of nonsense all this context and story-blind scaling leads to ... with Jack (whose main schtick was trickery and deception) being scaled to higher physical strength than Lu Bu, Thor, Raiden and Shiva - who have been shown to be some of the greatest physical powerhouses
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For what it's worth I'll put my thoughts on the matter - Shiva is the only character with a somewhat legit 5-B statement as I see it. The only ones who undeniably scale to him are Zeus, Raiden and Adam. That's it. Everyone else goes down to Lu Bu's sky splitter feat or whatever can be an accepted calc for Thor killing the World Serpent
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You can't just attribute something you disagree with as "comedy". It's a feat. There's not even a comedic tone about the scene.
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Zeus going buff isn't indicative of anything. He was not seriously attacking his own son. Ares isn't even in the Gods' list of fighters - which is highly unusual given your claims that he is comparable to Zeus ... but then you are basically trying to scale everyone to Zeus - which is nuts
PS : I reread the chapter in question. Zeus smacked Ares to encourage him and to fire him up because he was despairing after Herc lost an arm ... To actually use that "feat" for scaling, stripped of any and all context is beyond ridiculous
PS : I reread the chapter in question. Zeus smacked Ares to encourage him and to fire him up because he was despairing after Herc lost an arm ... To actually use that "feat" for scaling, stripped of any and all context is beyond ridiculous
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Zeus going buff is literally indicative of him using strength. That’s the whole point of the buff form. I’m not trying to “scale everyone to Zeus”, i’m scaling people’s raw physicals to Zeus when it makes sense for the characters to scale to Zeus.
“Zeus smacked Ares to encourage him” he through a giant right hook into the side of his face after making his arm buff. Do I need to show a scan for this? He literally sends him flying into a pillar. I don’t see why him using his buff arm, which is indicative of him using strength, in THIS SPECIFIC SCENARIO isn’t apparently him using his strength. There’s no good reason for it other than “I don’t want the other gods to be this powerful”.
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Also, Zeus consistently in character shows himself getting emotional and destroying things by making himself buff. I don’t see why him watching his own son get his arm chopped off by a human wouldn’t be a more than valid reason to assume that’s what happened here, especially since he’s angry with Ares. Zeus literally killed his pet dragon simply out of anger that the clause of Ragnarok was brought up.
Saying that he “wouldn’t seriously punch his own son” is a complete non-argument if you actually know what Zeus does in the story. If anything, saying he ISN’T seriously punching completely ignores context and is pure headcanon.
Saying that he “wouldn’t seriously punch his own son” is a complete non-argument if you actually know what Zeus does in the story. If anything, saying he ISN’T seriously punching completely ignores context and is pure headcanon.
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Zeus is also completely banged up when he "punched" Ares. It's a parental smack of encouragement, not an attack with any intention of causing hurt. Like I said, this is extremely taken out of context and has no business being considered seriously
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With all due respect, this is a very bad idea.
The fact of Jack surviving a serious attack from from 1st labor Hercules is a easy 5-B durability feat.
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Completely banged up? Him just having bandages on him doesn’t mean he can’t exhibit his strength, especially with the time he’s had to recover. It’s not just a “parental smack of encouragement”, he’s visibly upset about what happens to Heracles, gets upset, and punches Ares for crying in front of him. If there WASN’T any effort behind it, he WOULDN’T GO INTO HIS BUFF FORM.
This isn’t “extremely taken out of context”, you’re misinterpreting the context then using that as a basis for your argument. You’re dismissing basic logic and nitpicking this specific scene using reasoning like “he isn’t trying” when him going into his buff form is a direct indicative of effort. He’s also literally had plenty of recovery time, so arguing that he’s still physically messed up is pure headcanon.
What stops me from saying that he knows Ares is comparable to him, and uses a serious punch because that’s the only hit that would really mean anything against someone that’s physically comparable to himself?
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