Real Life Big Animals CRT

[DarlingAurora]

I just finished the Capybara sandbox, is 10-A fine for them?

Here the sandbox of red fox & capybara, just to be sure

 

[Antvasima]

You mixed up the intelligence and stamina sections. Except for that it seemed fine to me, but I didn't have the time and patience to look indepth.

 

[DarlingAurora]

You mixed up the intelligence and stamina sections. Except for that it seemed fine to me, but I didn't have the time and patience to look indepth.

Fine :3
I'm going to fix it

 

[DarlingAurora]

Okay, I just created both profiles

 

[Apex_Predator_GX]

Conclusion

• Epicyon: At least Street level to Street level+
• Jaguar: Street level to "Street level to Street level+"
• Sloth Bear: Street level+ to "Street level to Street level+"

That's all.

This was applied?

 

[DarlingAurora]

This was applied?

I'm waiting for opinions from Spino or others

 

[Apex_Predator_GX]

I'm waiting for opinions from Spino or others

I see.

 

[DarlingAurora]

Okay, there are some animals that need a little downgrade of tier (10-A to 10-B):

• Cheetah: They aren't that impressive.. I mean, even smol wolfs can dominate them.. and yeah, you can say that this is due since they are shy.. but a cheetah was easily overpower by a man that was defending his son.. and Cheetah have hard encounters with wild dogs.. Cheetah claws aren't sharp too, so they need a better justification than just preying on big animals, because those that can defend themselves can easily overpower them. (I think that they are so large for be just 10-B, but we need to put this on their weakness).
• Capybara: Just because they aren't impressive like wolves to be 10-A. Through, still due to their size and robustness the 10-B+ due to this calc are fine, not sure since some pitbulls can overpower them but they are so heavy. Brazilian Capybaras average 56 Kg, so open for discussion.
• Female Wolves: Females are more than 20 lbs less heavy than males. Just change it to "10-B for females to 10-A for males". Female Northwestern Wolves are stronger so they are fine in just 10-A. (Since we can put the 10-B+ on their, then the 10-A is more fine, females are still to large enough to qualify).
• Common Chimpanzee: What suggests that they are 10-A? I mean, chimps are only 1.5x times stronger than humans, so I think that 10-B fits better. (Apparently Chimps weighs almost as humans, so I think that we can keep this).

 

[Antvasima]

Please remember that the + signs (Such as 10-B+) always need calculations as a basis, not guesswork.

 

[DarlingAurora]

Please remember that the + signs (Such as 10-B+) always need calculations as a basis, not guesswork.

But don't we agree that the RL is more complex with that?

 

[Antvasima]

The + signs should always refer to specific calculated values according to our standards/rules.

 

[DarlingAurora]

Okay, there are some animals that need a little downgrade of tier (10-A to 10-B)

• Cheetah: They aren't that impressive.. I mean, even smol wolfs can dominate them.. and yeah, you can say that this is due since they are shy.. but a cheetah was easily overpower by a man that was defending his son.. and Cheetah have hard encounters with wild dogs.. Cheetah claws aren't sharp too, so they need a better justification than just preying on big animals, because those that can defend themselves can easily overpower them.
• Capybara: Just because they aren't impressive like wolves to be 10-A. Through, still due to their size and robustness the 10-B are fine, not sure since some pitbulls can overpower them but they are so heavy. Brazilian Capybaras average 56 Kg, so open for discussion.
• Female Wolves: Females are more than 20 lbs less heavy than males. Just change it to "10-B for females to 10-A for males".
• Common Chimpanzee: What suggests that they are 10-A? I mean, chimps are only 1.5x times stronger than humans, so I think that 10-B fits better.

Okay, modified

 

[Antvasima]

It seems fine to me, except for that 10-A seems better for adult chimpanzees.

 

[DarlingAurora]

• It seems fine to me, except for that 10-A seems better for adult chimpanzees.

Well why?, even if we multiply x1.5 with the strength of a human, that just reach 10-B+ and not the 10-A.. unless there exists another justification.

 

[Antvasima]

Well, I do not think that what is compared to is a very weak regular human, but I would appreciate if somebody can investigate further exactly how strong chimpanzees are.

 

[DarlingAurora]

Well, I do not think that what is compared to is a very weak regular human, but I would appreciate if somebody can investigate further exactly how strong chimpanzees are.

Well.. that's why I suggested the 10-B+, because they are strong, yeah.. but don't thaaat much.. they are x1.5 stronger than humans, but they don't are strong enough to reach 100 joules.. unless we can put an "at least"?

 

[DarlingAurora]

 

[Antvasima]

The issue is 1.5x stronger than which types of humans exactly? Regular athletes or physically infirm people, for example?

That is why I would appreciate if somebody is able to investigate further regarding the exact strength and energy output of chimpanzees.

 

[DarlingAurora]

The issue is 1.5x stronger than which types of humans exactly? Regular athletes or physically infirm people, for example?

That is why I would appreciate if somebody is able to investigate further regarding the exact strength and energy output of chimpanzees.

Pretty sure that is just from average humans

• So why, on a pound-for-pound basis, are chimps slightly stronger than humans? The team went on to look at the muscle of chimps that had died of natural causes, which revealed that two-thirds of their muscle consists of fast-twitch fibres, whereas more than half of human fibres are slow-twitch. Fast-twitch fibres are more powerful, but use more energy and become fatigued faster. Another factor, O’Neill found, is that chimps have longer fibres on average, which also enhances their strength. This adds to the evidence that walking is considerably more energy-costly for chimps than for people. The results fit neatly with the idea that early humans evolved to walk or run long distances. It seems that we sacrificed some strength for greater endurance.
• Since at least the 1920s, it has been reported that common chimpanzees (Pan troglodytes) differ from humans in being capable of exceptional feats of “super strength,” both in the wild and in captive environments. A mix of anecdotal and more controlled studies provides some support for this view; however, a critical review of available data suggests that chimpanzee mass-specific muscular performance is a more modest 1.5 times greater than humans on average.

 

[DarlingAurora]

I suggested 10-B+ but is that is only from calcs then 10-B is fine, but 10-A is too high

 

[Antvasima]

Okay. Given that chimpanzees are also smaller than humans, I suppose that 10-B is fine then.

 

[DarlingAurora]

And for adding, I'm thinking that we can upgrade Sun Bear, Athletic level is fine only for females.
Sun Bears are still bears, they still weight almost 70 Kg which is almost the double than giant anteaters.
Sun Bears easily kills humans and mauls

Spoiler: NSFW

their face.

Sun Bears have a strong bite force, higher than the one of leopards.
Sun Bears have sharp-claws like others bears.

There another count of Sun Bears almost killing a man and child but I think that is so NSFW to put it here, if I have permission to do it I can put the source.

For reference, here a Sun Bear fight.

Also, Mandrill needs to be downgraded since their justification is that are stronger than Baboons, but Baboons are only 10-B.

 

[DarlingAurora]

Conclusion

• Epicyon: At least Street level to Street level+
• Jaguar: Street level to "Street level to Street level+"
• Sloth Bear: Street level+ to "Street level to Street level+"
• Aardvark: Average Human level to Athletic level
• Domestic Pig: Athlete level to Athlete level+
• Moa: Wall level to Street level
• Gigantopitecus: Wall level to Street level+
• Haast's eagle: Street level to Average Human level
• Wild Boar: Street level+ to "Street level for smaller & medium-sized" and Wall level to "Street level+ for biggest-sized boars"
• Otters: Average Human level to "Below Average Human to Average Human level"
• Capybara: Athletic level to Average Human level+ (Just without + if the calc isn't accepted)
• Sun Bear: Athletic level to "Athletic level to Street level"

 

[DarlingAurora]

Problem
Since apparently we can't use the + without a calc or something to support that, then many animals that have "+" in their profile due to size needs to have that removed.
Also, I suggest that we can also scale their tier due to robustness.

 

[DarlingAurora]

Just did a Capy calc

 

[Apex_Predator_GX]

Problem
Since apparently we can't use the + without a calc or something to support that, then many animals that have "+" in their profile due to size needs to have that removed.
Also, I suggest that we can also scale their tier due to robustness.

Like which animals?

 

[DarlingAurora]

Like which animals?

Lions, Tigers, Wolfs, Hyenas, Sloth Bears, Boars and almost every animal has a + in their profiles without a calc..

 

[Apex_Predator_GX]

Lions, Tigers, Wolfs, Hyenas, Sloth Bears, Boars and almost every animal has a + in their profiles without a calc..

I see...

Don't touch the wolves XD

 

[DarlingAurora]

Conclusion

• Epicyon: At least Street level to Street level+
• Jaguar: Street level to "Street level to Street level+"
• Sloth Bear: Street level+ to "Street level to Street level+"
• Aardvark: Average Human level to Athletic level
• Domestic Pig: Athlete level to Athlete level+
• Moa: Wall level to Street level
• Gigantopitecus: Wall level to Street level+
• Haast's eagle: Street level to Average Human level
• Wild Boar: Street level+ to "Street level for smaller & medium-sized" and Wall level to "Street level+ for biggest-sized boars"
• Otters: Average Human level to "Below Average Human to Average Human level"
• Capybara: Athletic level to Average Human level+
• Sun Bear: Athletic level to "Athletic level to Street level"

What about this?

 

[H3110l12345I20]

Pretty sure that is just from average humans

• So why, on a pound-for-pound basis, are chimps slightly stronger than humans? The team went on to look at the muscle of chimps that had died of natural causes, which revealed that two-thirds of their muscle consists of fast-twitch fibres, whereas more than half of human fibres are slow-twitch. Fast-twitch fibres are more powerful, but use more energy and become fatigued faster. Another factor, O’Neill found, is that chimps have longer fibres on average, which also enhances their strength. This adds to the evidence that walking is considerably more energy-costly for chimps than for people. The results fit neatly with the idea that early humans evolved to walk or run long distances. It seems that we sacrificed some strength for greater endurance.
• Since at least the 1920s, it has been reported that common chimpanzees (Pan troglodytes) differ from humans in being capable of exceptional feats of “super strength,” both in the wild and in captive environments. A mix of anecdotal and more controlled studies provides some support for this view; however, a critical review of available data suggests that chimpanzee mass-specific muscular performance is a more modest 1.5 times greater than humans on average.

Okay. Given that chimpanzees are also smaller than humans, I suppose that 10-B is fine then.

I did a couple of calcs back then for my personal tiering system & updated the human punches for this, 74 J & 49 J seems to be more consistent so...

74(1.5) = 111 J, 49(1.5) = 73.5 J. I mean I did calc stack so I'm not sure if the results are valid even if it's IRL.

Spoiler: Dog & Wolf LS

"Depending on the conditions, a healthy, fit dog can likely pull about 3 time their own body weight." (Ar) " The Nest, a collaborative DNA study called CanMap was conducted by UCLA, the National Institutes of Health, and Cornell University on 85 different dog breeds, using 1,000 individual dogs...the most amusing discovery was that the canine which had the most in common with its ol' gray wolf grandpa, bizarrely enough, was a Shiba Inu...Other breeds...as very genetically similar to their wolf ancestors were the ever-fluffy chow chow, the Akita, and the Alaskan malamute...As far as looks and behavior go, K9 of Mine points out that some of the more wolf-like dogs are Kugshas, Utonagans, Siberian huskies, and the aforementioned Alaskan malamutes, all of which could easily be mistaken for a wolf if you saw one running through the snow... (Ar)"

Some of the dogs that are wolf like & genetically close to the Gray Wolf are fit, athletic dogs. If the Gray Wolf is accepted to be comparable to wolf-like & most wolf genetically dogs, then the wolf's calculated LS is this:

((79+99)/2)3 = 267 lb or 1187.675274 N (Athletic Human) (lb*4.448222=N (pg 65))

Trivia! Dogs can carry 25% of their weight in a backpack, though other breeds can carry 10% while older dogs & puppies need under 10% of their weight (Ar)

This spoiler is for the Grey Wolf, fit dogs & other weaker dogs' lifting strength.
Edit: I edited this link in to make everyone here not think that the link is dead.

I'm still following this thread btw.

 

[DarlingAurora]

I did a couple of calcs back then for my personal tiering system & updated the human punches for this, 74 J & 49 J seems to be more consistent so...

74(1.5) = 111 J, 49(1.5) = 73.5 J. I mean I did calc stack so I'm not sure if the results are valid even if it's IRL.

Spoiler: Dog & Wolf LS

"Depending on the conditions, a healthy, fit dog can likely pull about 3 time their own body weight." (Ar) " The Nest, a collaborative DNA study called CanMap was conducted by UCLA, the National Institutes of Health, and Cornell University on 85 different dog breeds, using 1,000 individual dogs...the most amusing discovery was that the canine which had the most in common with its ol' gray wolf grandpa, bizarrely enough, was a Shiba Inu...Other breeds...as very genetically similar to their wolf ancestors were the ever-fluffy chow chow, the Akita, and the Alaskan malamute...As far as looks and behavior go, K9 of Mine points out that some of the more wolf-like dogs are Kugshas, Utonagans, Siberian huskies, and the aforementioned Alaskan malamutes, all of which could easily be mistaken for a wolf if you saw one running through the snow... (Ar)"

Some of the dogs that are wolf like & genetically close to the Gray Wolf are fit, athletic dogs. If the Gray Wolf is accepted to be comparable to wolf-like & most wolf genetically dogs, then the wolf's calculated LS is this:

((79+99)/2)3 = 267 lb or 1187.675274 N (Athletic Human) (lb*4.448222=N (pg 65))

Trivia! Dogs can carry 25% of their weight in a backpack, though other breeds can carry 10% while older dogs & puppies need under 10% of their weight (Ar)

This spoiler is for the Grey Wolf, fit dogs & other weaker dogs' lifting strength.

I'm still following this thread btw.

So Chimps are still 10-A or 10-B+ right? They still weighs as much as humans
And what is your opinion about the capys?

 

[H3110l12345I20]

So Chimps are still 10-A or 10-B+ right? They still weighs as much as humans
And what is your opinion about the capys?

Chimps are 10-B+ to 10-A if my calc is requested to be on a blog, they're still stronger than humans.

Capys are usually chill & smaller than humans in size but can cause severe bite injuries. 10-B+ is fine as long as your calc is accepted.

 

[DarlingAurora]

Chimps are 10-B+ to 10-A if my calc is requested to be on a blog, they're still stronger than humans.

Capys are usually chill & smaller than humans in size but can cause severe bite injuries. 10-B+ is fine as long as your calc is accepted.

okay

 

[DarlingAurora]

Conclusion

• Epicyon: At least Street level to Street level+
• Jaguar: Street level to "Street level to Street level+"
• Sloth Bear: Street level+ to "Street level to Street level+"
• Aardvark: Average Human level to Athletic level
• Domestic Pig: Athlete level to Athlete level+
• Moa: Wall level to Street level
• Gigantopitecus: Wall level to Street level+
• Haast's eagle: Street level to Average Human level
• Wild Boar: Street level+ to "Street level for smaller & medium-sized" and Wall level to "Street level+ for biggest-sized boars"
• Otters: Average Human level to "Below Average Human to Average Human level"
• Capybara: Athletic level to Average Human level+ (Just without + if the calc isn't accepted)
• Sun Bear: Athletic level to "Athletic level to Street level"

any opinion?

 

[Propellus]

And also I forgot to bring this up, but as I remember, most of the animals stamina's are listed as "High" which is invalid to our stamina standards. But what do you all propose for the replacements for the stamina for each of the animals?

 

[Antvasima]

What are the current agreements regarding what needs to be applied here?

And also I forgot to bring this up, but as I remember, most of the animals stamina's are listed as "High" which is invalid to our stamina standards. But what do you all propose for the replacements for the stamina for each of the animals?

Agreed.

It likely needs to be investigated for how long periods of time that each type of animal can usually exert themselves at high capacity on an individual basis.

 

[DarlingAurora]

What are the current agreements regarding what needs to be applied here?

Agreed.

It likely needs to be investigated for how long periods of time that each type of animal can usually exert themselves at high capacity on an individual basis.

I need some opinions about this:

Conclusion

• Epicyon: At least Street level to Street level+
• Jaguar: Street level to "Street level to Street level+"
• Sloth Bear: Street level+ to "Street level to Street level+"
• Aardvark: Average Human level to Athletic level
• Domestic Pig: Athlete level to Athlete level+
• Moa: Wall level to Street level
• Gigantopitecus: Wall level to Street level+
• Haast's eagle: Street level to Average Human level
• Wild Boar: Street level+ to "Street level for smaller & medium-sized" and Wall level to "Street level+ for biggest-sized boars"
• Otters: Average Human level to "Below Average Human to Average Human level"
• Capybara: Athletic level to Average Human level
• Sun Bear: Athletic level to "Athletic level to Street level"

I think that just that need to be revised but first I need opinions

 

[Apex_Predator_GX]

I need some opinions about this:

I think that just that need to be revised but first I need opinions

I thought sign "+" is only given via calc.

 

[DarlingAurora]

I thought sign "+" is only given via calc.

Lions & Tigers have it without a calc too

 

[Propellus]

Lions & Tigers have it without a calc too

They're based off higher end bone breaking though