Questions about GER

[The_pen_or_the_sword]

So it's an ill defined ability used by an ill defined stand...Why would we assume its willpower manip is a result of it's "Causality manip" When it can clearly do a bunch of other things that in no way connect to it's causality manip? It just seems bizarre to me we would take the most potent interpretation of an ability that AFAIK we never even see used.

 

[Eficiente]

Some may say that willpower manip is just a part of its Causality Manipulation, but there is no evidence of it.

 

[The_pen_or_the_sword]

So the answer to my question is we don't assume it can pierce mental resistances and the people that insisted otherwise were overplaying the ill defined ability? Sorry just trying to be clear overall.

 

[Zel97]

If thats the case Im leaning more on no then, simply because theres no evidence to really support it being a result of causality manip and the stand clearly doing other things that don't make much sense in the grand scheme. It just feels odd to wank off and ability so ill defined...

Saying ger's willpower manip is linked to his causality manip isnt a wank at least for me since we have no clue on how it works. In some cases it benefits ger to have his willpower manip linked with C&E manip while in some cases it'd be better if its linked with empathic manip. Really depends on his enemy . This issue should be handle by someone more knowledgeable in jojo tbh . Im fine with either

 

[The_pen_or_the_sword]

Which is the problem, it can be wanked either direction to suit his needs in a vs scenario, if it's one or the other it's concrete and can't be taken advatage of. Im just trying to figure out how we treat it in general. (Though I argue it being linked to causality manip would be more wankish as it makes any other immunities/resistances worthless)

 

[Zel97]

Ger is a messy stand dude. This why i hate most ger matches. The stand is just too vague . I sincerely hope this is cleared up by people who are knowledgeable in jojo

 

[Eficiente]

Saying ger's willpower manip is linked to his causality manip isnt a wank at least for me since we have no clue on how it works. In some cases it benefits ger to have his willpower manip linked with C&E manip while in some cases it'd be better if its linked with empathic manip.

Well, some things point out to it being its own thing rather than a part of its causality manip.

• We saw the causality manip doing stuff but the willpower manip is different.
• When the causality manip happens the willpower manip doesn't happen, Diavolo still wants to kill Giorno, he just doesn't know what's happening.

 

[Zel97]

Fair point . At this point i can agree with anything

Since ger's main ability is to reset things to 0 (meaning his main ability isnt JUST causality manipulation) then i can see his willpower manip being a part of empathic manipulation.

 

[The_pen_or_the_sword]

Maybe we should have a new thread for this, call it clarifying ger, cause honestly feels like the profile needs a note explaning some of this confusing nonsense so we can have a concise stance on how we treat gers willpower manip.

 

[Zel97]

Giorno's profile needs A LOT more explanation. Not to mention its missing a few things like bfr,maybe a fate or death manip since diavolo experiences a new death everytime he dies and not just 1 death repeating over and over again . If im not mistaken giorno should have resistance to precog as well since diavolo wasnt able to see ger activating rtz,even after rtz activated he kept seeing a false future even though it was shown multiple times that epitath is always correct

 

[The_pen_or_the_sword]

True, another question gers death loop only works when he can actually harm/kill his opponent right? Thats how I understood the ability atleast.

 

[Zel97]

True, another question gers death loop only works when he can actually harm/kill his opponent right? Thats what I heard atleast.

Yeah thats what i heard too. Ger needs a death to rtz it

 

[Eficiente]

GER may or may not have bfr, but it doesn't have death manip and it likely also doesn't have fate manip.

 

[Eficiente]

True, another question gers death loop only works when he can actually harm/kill his opponent right? Thats how I understood the ability atleast.

Yes, the wording of its Stand description makes it clear. If the death loop was its own thing then who knows what it can kill, but as it is, it's a repetition of the death made by GER, somehow done in other way, so it would be a stretch for it to kill something beyond GER's power.

 

[The_pen_or_the_sword]

K just trying to be clear, anyone willing to make a thread to clarify how we treat rtz willpower manip? Or should I do so? I feel it's important we explain how we treat the ability on his profile.

 

[BoomerKuwanger1]

Anyways, the anime seems to imply GER lost the ability to make animals that can retturn damage.

 

[Ionliosite]

Giorno literally used that ability once, Araki forgot.

 

[BoomerKuwanger1]

Is it fair to consider it for Giorno?

Since that IS a method to beat even low 2-C, just trricking them into hitting the frog.

 

[Wardokman69]

Diavolo actually died by killing the scorpion.

 

[Zel97]

K just trying to be clear, anyone willing to make a thread to clarify how we treat rtz willpower manip? Or should I do so? I feel it's important we explain how we treat the ability on his profile.

If you can do it that'd be nice

 

[Quibster]

Wow, this suddenly turned into a CRT thread

So you guys want Giorno to have Death Manip and Empathetic Manip?

Edit: Resistance to Precog is just his RtZ. He doesn't resist it, he resets the user's will to 0, resulting in said outcome not happening.

 

[Quibster]

Also, is RtZ automatic, or passive?

Giorno clearly has no control over it. Only GER does― which is stated in the Manga. Plus, there are no scans that say that RtZ is thought-based.

 

[Oblivion_Of_The_Endless]

Do you have scans that states that its passive?

 

[Quibster]

Proof that RtZ isn't thought-based, and is only controlled by GER.


"... Not even my stand master, Giorno Giovanna knows of this."

 

[Oblivion_Of_The_Endless]

Ok? But GER needs to think to use RtZ

 

[Quibster]

On what basis is RtZ thought-based? Provide the scans.

 

[Oblivion_Of_The_Endless]

Because you still havent proved why GER is passive, so the burden of proof is on you

Nothing on that scan proves that its passive

And if its not passive, we assume its thought based

 

[The_King_of_Prudence]

Although, technically a robot can't be killed due not being alive to begin with, so I doubt it can be "death-looped" (it could "destroy-loop" it, but that wouldn't have any sense against a robot), in whose case transmutate it into a living being should be enough. And as I said, Causality Manipulation still works.

But that would give them damage reflection.

 

[Zel97]

Wow, this suddenly turned into a CRT thread

So you guys want Giorno to have Death Manip and Empathetic Manip?

Edit: Resistance to Precog is just his RtZ. He doesn't resist it, he resets the user's will to 0, resulting in said outcome not happening.

I believe he should have resistance to precog because diavolo wasnt able to see ger activating rtz even though it was shown numerous times it can precog stand abilities just fine. Not to mention after rtz activated,epitath was still showing a false future even though it was shown in doppio vs rissoto fight that epitath's forecast is 100% correct.yes causality manip changes fate but epitath's vision did not changed even though it should


And no he did not reset diavolo's will to 0,this was clearly shown even in the anime that diavolo still wants to kill giorno even after rtz activated. People are wondering if ger actually has willpower manip because it never used that ability but it was said so by araki in the stand profile

 

[Wardokman69]

GER willpower manip actually worked after he BFR'd Diavolo.

 

[Zel97]

Yh but that was during the death loop. He can def do so outside of death loop but he never did in cannon.willpower manip is also used when he bfr'd pucci in the jorge joestar albeit non cannon

 

[The_King_of_Prudence]

Diavolo also saw Giorno with Gold Experience, so he clearly does something to Epitaph.