Possible Mario Profile Split/Varies Rating

[Antvasima]

Well, the main characters are extremely uneven from game to game.

 

[Dust_Collector]

Ok so I was wrong about the light dodging stuff from Superstar Saga, Mario and Luigi never dodge the reflected sun beams they just stand to the side and let the light open the locked doors that they need to open

 

[Seol404]

Ok so I was wrong about the light dodging stuff from Superstar Saga, Mario and Luigi never dodge the reflected sun beams they just stand to the side and let the light open the locked doors that they need to open

I believe there are enemies which use lighting attacks, although one could argue aim dodging of course

 

[Armorchompy]

I think we need to organize a bit better, maybe start a new thread and focus on one thing to completion. Remember that P&A has to be handled too.

I'm a bit burned out on VSBW rn though so if someone else could try I'd appreciate it

 

[HammerStrikes219]

I think we need to organize a bit better, maybe start a new thread and focus on one thing to completion. Remember that P&A has to be handled too.

I'm a bit burned out on VSBW rn though so if someone else could try I'd appreciate it

I agree especially after 7 pages of discussion.

 

[Antvasima]

It may be best if somebody starts a properly organised new thread and then links to it here then. After that, we can close our current Mario thread.

 

[Kirbonic_Pikmin]

If we’re splitting Mario into different keys based on game then.
Can we scale Dream Team M&L to Dreamy Bowser?

To my knowledge, even outside of comparing it to other feats in the franchise, Dreamy Bowser scaling was very inconsistent within the game itself and was more of an anti-feat for the Dream Stone itself, hence why it's usually thrown out and considered an outlier.

 

[SuperStar]

To my knowledge, even outside of comparing it to other feats in the franchise, Dreamy Bowser scaling was very inconsistent within the game itself and was more of an anti-feat for the Dream Stone itself, hence why it's usually thrown out and considered an outlier.

Could you explain this more?

 

[Kirbonic_Pikmin]

Could you explain this more?

That fight is generally considered an outlier as it's Base Mario & Luigi fighting a Bowser amped to such absurd degrees that it's one of the strongest things in the verse (assuming the Dream Stone isn't downgraded soon, which is possible). Base Mario & Luigi being multiversal+ obviously creates massive confusion in the scaling chain when they are never able to reach that level in the series otherwise (with the exception of Pure Heart amping), and it would also imply that Base Form Bowser would be multiversal+ via competing with Base M&L, which would then create the confusion of why he'd even need Dreamy form in the first place.

Alongside the fact it's not internally consistent with the game & plot itself, when only about an 30 minutes prior to the fight Mario & Luigi couldn't even enter Bowser's Castle due to the Dream Stone creating a barrier, to the point that they needed the Zeekeeper, an incredibly powerful entity to break the barrier for them. But very shortly afterwards they can fight, match, and surpass the full might of the Dream Stone, when they were literally incapable of overpowering just one of it's barriers shortly before. It can't even be attributed to power-growth over the length of the game, as the events of the barrier breaking and fighting Dreamy Bowser are incredibly close to one another.

It's a massive moment of PIS and if taken at face value would only serve as an Anti-Feat for the Dream Stone itself. The scaling is just unusable.

I swear there was a post or rule about this somewhere on this Wiki but I can't seem to find it somewhere now.

 

[JJSliderman]

The Dream Stone isn’t really multi+ I think.

I don’t even think there’s a reason to scale it to Dream Depot.

Earlier in the game, they specifically had to collect dream energy for the stone to work, implying it had none or little power before the events of the game, which does line up with the interpretation of it being a collection of dream energy. A much better result is probably finding the amount of entities it could have absorbed dreams from on the island in one day, which I calced as anywhere between 2000-27000.

 

[Kirbonic_Pikmin]

The Dream Stone isn’t really multi+ I think.

I don’t even think there’s a reason to scale it to Dream Depot.

Earlier in the game, they specifically had to collect dream energy for the stone to work, implying it had none or little power before the events of the game, which does line up with the interpretation of it being a collection of dream energy. A much better result is probably finding the amount of entities it could have absorbed dreams from on the island in one day, which I calced as anywhere between 2000-27000.

Hence why I said unless it gets downgraded, which is very likely based on a current ongoing CRT. I think it might get bumped down to L2C or 2C?

 

[Armorchompy]

boys let's pick one "sub-franchise" we're all interested in starting with, i'll make a thread about specifically it

 

[Kirbonic_Pikmin]

boys let's pick one "sub-franchise" we're all interested in starting with, i'll make a thread about specifically it

I'd say the most pertinent ones to start with are:

2D Mario
Paper Mario
Mario & Luigi

 

[Seol404]

2D Mario
Paper Mario
Mario & Luigi

Agree with this, these are the most prominent for discussion it seems.

 

[Armorchompy]

So should I start with 2D Mario?

Also we needed to settle what exactly 2D means, there was a bit more contention there.

 

[DarkDragonMedeus]

I think you mean Super Mario; I thought it was agreed for there to be no reason for 2-D and 3-D to be separated. But it's basically the traditional platformers.

 

[Armorchompy]

Someone else brought up that given that this split is happening for the sake of consistency, grouping up this many games together kind of doesn't achieve that.

 

[Lou_change]

We could make a galaxy key and argue luma empowerment galaxy is the only one with feats above town level I think.

 

[Kirbonic_Pikmin]

So should I start with 2D Mario?

Also we needed to settle what exactly 2D means, there was a bit more contention there.

was there contention with Mario 1-World & NSMB series being one tier together? I don't think there was much contention there...

Consistently I think the above mentioned 2D Mario games & at least 64, Sunshine, and Odyssey could be one key? To my knowledge there's nothing in terms of major contradictions there.

The Galaxy games will likely need their own key due to the massive statistical difference there, and the universal reset stuff that allows Galaxy 2's plot to be possible, I presume.

 

[Foxthefox1000]

If it's a universal reset then Galaxy would need to be upgraded again. Just saying. Because the Grand Star is what basically caused that to happen, so whether it's Galaxy or Universal needs to be probably discussed yet again, although I think common sense dictates the universe was reset because why TF would we assume only the galaxy was? It was clearly meant to be another big bang. But I suppose we can wait on the thread for that.

 

[Kirbonic_Pikmin]

If it's a universal reset then Galaxy would need to be upgraded again. Just saying. Because the Grand Star is what basically caused that to happen, so whether it's Galaxy or Universal needs to be probably discussed yet again, although I think common sense dictates the universe was reset because why TF would we assume only the galaxy was? It was clearly meant to be another big bang. But I suppose we can wait on the thread for that.

How was the Grand Star what caused that? It was a massive collective of Luma's pooling together cancelling out the black hole. The only thing the Grand Star could have possibly caused was the destabilization of the Galaxy Generator via leaving it, and then the Galaxy Generator kind of just imploded in on itself.

The events of the finale of Galaxy always seemed unclear/dubious regardless, its not quite easy to fully tell what's going on, especially once Rosa talks to Mario in that white void.

 

[Armorchompy]

"Massive statistical differences" aren't a reason to split, we're still trying to avoid outliers so one would have to prove they aren't.

 

[MicDaniel]

How was the Grand Star what caused that? It was a massive collective of Luma's pooling together cancelling out the black hole. The only thing the Grand Star could have possibly caused was the destabilization of the Galaxy Generator via leaving it, and then the Galaxy Generator kind of just imploded in on itself.

The events of the finale of Galaxy always seemed unclear/dubious regardless, its not quite easy to fully tell what's going on, especially once Rosa talks to Mario in that white void.

Well the Grand Star was powering the generator to begin with and that Energy to collapse on itself had to come from Somewhere. If the Universe Reset after these events, then the threat presented by the black hole is way more dangerous then assumed. If it was just going to destroy the Galaxy, then all those Lumas wouldn't be needed, nor a Reset of the universe.

 

[The_Impress]

What are y'all even doing :v

 

[Antvasima]

So does anybody here have a plan of approach regarding what we should do here exactly?

 

[SuperStar]

I say just do the easy series first and build your way up, maybe with Mario Kart or Mario Party it doesn't make sense to go straight to M&L and Galaxy when those are the most difficult and controversial

 

[CuteAnimeNekoGirl99]

Would it be fine if I were to make a discussion thread for Mario Kart?

 

[Antvasima]

I say just do the easy series first and build your way up, maybe with Mario Kart or Mario Party it doesn't make sense to go straight to M&L and Galaxy when those are the most difficult and controversial

That is probably a good idea.

 

[Antvasima]

Would it be fine if I were to make a discussion thread for Mario Kart?

If you know how to properly organise it, probably yes, but let's wait for input from other staff.

 

[Armorchompy]

Yeah sure

 

[Antvasima]

Okay. In lack of further feedback, that is probanly fine then.

 

[Seol404]

I am okay with the creation of a Mario Kart CRT, with this one being closed.

 

[Antvasima]

Okay. Should we create some overall organisation thread, in which links to all of these upcoming Mario projects can be posted, first?

 

[Seol404]

Yes, that sounds good to me.

 

[Antvasima]

Okay. Is somebody here who knows what they are doing willing to do so please?

 

[Armorchompy]

bump

 

[Antvasima]

Okay. Should we create some overall organisation thread, in which links to all of these upcoming Mario projects can be posted, first?

I think that this is what currently needs to be done here.

Is somebody willing to write a list of all the staff and regular members who have helped out in this thread, so I or somebody else can call for them, please?

 

[Seol404]

I would make the thread myself, but I'm not terribly great at writing up CRTs

 

[Pikaman]

Phoenks called my Genshin Revision

…the single worst CRT I've seen in terms of formatting.

So nah I’m not making it lol

(tbf the formatting was shit and it was more a pre-cursor to a proper CRT that should’ve been labelled as such and possibly put somewhere like fun and games)

 

[CuteAnimeNekoGirl99]

I think more we should explain the deal and reasoning to the creation of that thread, link back to here if people want to read up on it, and then go over general canon of what's being covered notably just listing the games as well as any other resources that could be helpful such as respect threads n such uvu