Pokémon Intelligence: Gotta stupefy 'em all

[Shmooply]

The absolute state of the intelligence section on Pokemon profiles makes me hurt myself in confusion.

For starters, almost all of the profiles use a non-existent term for intelligence, which is High, which doesn't explain anything. Speaking of explanations, there are no reasons provided for why they have it in the first place, and those who do have an explanation listed on their profile tend to not make any sense. Pidgeotto has high intelligence for... being territorial? And this is for Pidgeotto, there's nothing for Pidgey and its other forms, which is an issue a lot of the other profiles have. Both Paras and Parasect have high intelligence for being controlled by a fungal parasite? They should be mindless, and the mushrooms should have the high intelligence stuff.

Because of this ridiculous issue that plagues a majority of the profiles, this thread's purpose is to collect and gather any intelligence feats that these pokemon either pulled off, or scale to, so that the problem can be solved.

 

[FinePoint]

The sheer amount of active Pokémon CRTs lol

 

[StekFence]

Pokémon understand human language pretty well. it’s just a matter of your Pokémon choosing to listen or not

 

[StekFence]

Some Pokémon, namely psychic types, are incredibly smart like alakazam, or mewtwo, definitely above average people.

 

[Shmooply]

Pokémon understand human language pretty well. it’s just a matter of your Pokémon choosing to listen or not

This would just give them average human intelligence.

 

[Armorchompy]

Understanding human language and being good fighters but still being relatively close to animals would be Below Average I think

 

[Arceus0x]

I think it all depends on individual pokemon.
For example, every single pokemon know how to speak properly and constantly communicates with each other, its just that they don't know human language.
Basically someone like the non-evolved pokemon would be average or below average unless proven otherwise like in the case with psychic pokemon who are super intelligent.
In the case of fully evolved ones most should just be average with potential intelligence being genius in combat (such as machamp who literally knows all martial arts) and more.
Some should be extraordinary genius such as Alakazam and Metagross both of which work faster than a supercomputer and Metagross is like 4 supercomputers, metang being two and beldum 1.

Overall: we need case by case basis.

 

[Arceus0x]

and i think it would be fair to have the lower end ones at average as even a random meowth managed to fully learn the human language and master walking on hind legs by himself just because he was horny

 

[SamanPatou]

Remind me if we still consider stuff like Mystery Dungeon and Pokepark as usable for general profiles, because in that case we would have a clash between those games where Pokemon are basically like humans in terms of cognitivity, and others where they are closer to smart animals.

For everything else, yes, we must evaluate each of them on a case by case basis.
This thread is good to address the issue, but it's impossible to narrow down a standard beyond basic stuff like understanding human language and being good in combat.
Also, keep in mind that out profiles theoretically aim to reflect a fully experienced wild Pokémon, so it should be somewhat be taken in account, as the Dex entries usually describe the average member of the species.

It might be too complicated, but people could use this very thread to rework Pokemon one-by-one. (At least those in need).

 

[Shmooply]

It might be too complicated, but people could use this very thread to rework Pokemon one-by-one. (At least those in need).

Yes, this is one of the reasons I made the CRT.

Remind me if we still consider stuff like Mystery Dungeon and Pokepark as usable for general profiles,

We used to, but apparently they aren't considered canon to the mainline games. I could be misremembering.

 

[SamanPatou]

Iirc the official take of the wiki over the Pokemon canon is blurry at best, as it kept making an endless back-and-forth until people got tired and everything ended in nothing, and it is still reflected on profiles features stuff from here and there, while others don't and so on.

 

[GyroNutz]

We used to, but apparently they aren't considered canon to the mainline games. I could be misremembering.

They've since been reconsidered as canon.

 

[Armorchompy]

and i think it would be fair to have the lower end ones at average as even a random meowth managed to fully learn the human language and master walking on hind legs by himself just because he was horny

Team Rocket Meowth is definitely not a random Meowth. Also, that's an Above Average/Gifted feat probably, IIRC he did so in a couple weeks at most.

 

[StekFence]

and i think it would be fair to have the lower end ones at average as even a random meowth managed to fully learn the human language and master walking on hind legs by himself just because he was horny

the things men do

 

[Armorchompy]

I think it all depends on individual pokemon. - Overall: we need case by case basis.

but yeah i definitely agree, a lotta pokemon are gonna be Average or far above that, and some are even gonna get Animalistic I would assume.

 

[Chariot190]

Meowth is on crack, tbh he's probably extraordinary genius, a lot of the plans (as in like, all of them) are him, and a lot of the mecha and shit, also him, and while Pokemon is definitely advanced, it's not so advanced that ya can just make ******* mechazords and gundams in like a day or two unless ya smart as ****.

90% of other pokemon though? Would vary from below average to just average, with some highs here and there with a few animalistic Pokemon as well, like Rhyhorn. (Obviously excluding shit like Alakazam and Slowking and so on who are Genius to Extraordinary Genius).

Basically case by case most, but mostly hovering below to normal intellect, notable exceptions of species like Meowth excluded and notable species like Metagross on the smart end or Rhydon on the stupid end.

 

[SamanPatou]

The main problem is that, as of now, we consider canon too many different things.
Like, if we use MD as a basis, all Pokémon are at the very least average in terms of intelligence, same for spin offs where they live in societies etc..

It's also true, I think/iirc we consider them as different universes, which opens to the possibility of differences existing in different worlds.
But as of now, our general pkmn files are a hodgepodge of everything, which naturally creates inconsistencies with things like intelligence.

 

[FinePoint]

The main problem is that, as of now, we consider canon too many different things.
Like, if we use MD as a basis, all Pokémon are at the very least average in terms of intelligence, same for spin offs where they live in societies etc..

It's also true, I think/iirc we consider them as different universes, which opens to the possibility of differences existing in different worlds.
But as of now, our general pkmn files are a hodgepodge of everything, which naturally creates inconsistencies with things like intelligence.

Honestly Mystery Dungeon creates more inconsistencies than that.
For example the IQ skills which you don't see literally anywhere else, yet we accept as normal for entire species.

 

[XXKINGXX69]

All pokemon should be genius for having 999 IQ in mystery dungeon

 

[Armorchompy]

it's almost like compositing the entirety of one of if not the biggest media franchise ever that is generally aimed at kids and uninterested in overarching lore leads to inconsistencies

 

[FinePoint]

it's almost like compositing the entirety of one of if not the biggest media franchise ever that is generally aimed at kids and uninterested in overarching lore leads to inconsistencies

The biggest multimedia franchise*
I feel we went a little hard on the compositing under the excuse we're classifying a species rather than a character.

 

[XXKINGXX69]

and i think it would be fair to have the lower end ones at average as even a random meowth managed to fully learn the human language and master walking on hind legs by himself just because he was horny

Why do you think trained Pokemon are "random"

 

[Arceus0x]

Why do you think trained Pokemon are "random"

He was never trained he was a wild pokemon and even now he wasn't caught and has no trainer. Yes he's way stronger now but before he was just a wild meowth

 

[Arceus0x]

Anyways i feel like below average is an understatement.
I've seen kong get below average to average intelligence based on understanding blind speech and being able to communicate and think properly.

Meanwhile we wanna give pokemon below average despite them constantly being shown to have human level communication skills?
I mean we had a few anime episodes where it was only about the pokemon and we basically had every pokemon talking freely in between each other. So it's canon to anime and MD. Another piece of evidence would be the fact that meowth constantly translates pokemon speech to human speech.

Overall i think pokemon are a very intelligent species and should be rated as such. The reason behind their animalistic behavior is their instincts and nature most likely. Of course some of the more brutish ones should be rated lower and some are truly dumb but most other pokemon are quite clever and in mystery dungeon they manage to develop their own culture.

 

[Armorchompy]

Anyways i feel like below average is an understatement.
I've seen kong get below average to average intelligence based on understanding blind speech and being able to communicate and think properly.

Wtf, chimpanzees can do that, should definitely be downgraded to Below Average at best.

Meanwhile we wanna give pokemon below average despite them constantly being shown to have human level communication skills?
I mean we had a few anime episodes where it was only about the pokemon and we basically had every pokemon talking freely in between each other. So it's canon to anime and MD. Another piece of evidence would be the fact that meowth constantly translates pokemon speech to human speech.

Eh, fair point

Overall i think pokemon are a very intelligent species and should be rated as such. The reason behind their animalistic behavior is their instincts and nature most likely. Of course some of the more brutish ones should be rated lower and some are truly dumb but most other pokemon are quite clever and in mystery dungeon they manage to develop their own culture.

Mystery Dungeon is pretty ****** different from most other depictions, I don't think it should take precedence

 

[Shmooply]

Wtf, chimpanzees can do that, should definitely be downgraded to Below Average at best.

hey orangutans can do that too but better because theyre the cooler great ape

Mystery Dungeon is a weird case. Aren't all of our pokemon profiles supposed to be about the wild versions of the creatures? From what I remember, the ones in MD wear clothes and stuff.

 

[Arceus0x]

hey orangutans can do that too but better because theyre the cooler great ape

Mystery Dungeon is a weird case. Aren't all of our pokemon profiles supposed to be about the wild versions of the creatures? From what I remember, the ones in MD wear clothes and stuff.

Not really, there's no specific difference there. The pokemon in MD at best wear some scarfs that are basically items that wild pokemon hold every once in a while

 

[XXKINGXX69]

This man thinks wearing clothes = not wild

 

[Arceus0x]

This man thinks wearing clothes = not wild

Like yeah, why wouldn't a smart creature wear a protective piece of clothing they found?

 

[Shmooply]

bump

 

[DaReaperMan]

Meowth is on crack, tbh he's probably extraordinary genius, a lot of the plans (as in like, all of them) are him, and a lot of the mecha and shit, also him, and while Pokemon is definitely advanced, it's not so advanced that ya can just make ******* mechazords and gundams in like a day or two unless ya smart as ****.

90% of other pokemon though? Would vary from below average to just average, with some highs here and there with a few animalistic Pokemon as well, like Rhyhorn. (Obviously excluding shit like Alakazam and Slowking and so on who are Genius to Extraordinary Genius).

Basically case by case most, but mostly hovering below to normal intellect, notable exceptions of species like Meowth excluded and notable species like Metagross on the smart end or Rhydon on the stupid end.

So what strain of crack is Meowth on? Since you watch and read a lot of jojo I'd assume you know!

 

[Armorchompy]

???

 

[DaReaperMan]

???

That's a joke on how insane jojo can be mate

 

[Armorchompy]

...

Anyway, let's avoid derailing.

 

[DaReaperMan]

Lol

Regardless most Pokémon should be below average to above average, generally case-by-case, I think Mewtwo would probably be just Genius though, not extoirdinary genius unless it's got some feats of outsmrting say Metagross that I don't know

 

[FinePoint]

I believe they can be below average intelligence and still wear clothes, and have some degree of coherent speech between each other.

If I haven't already implied it, it makes more sense to me for Mystery Dungeon to be a separate thing.
Alternate universe versions of characters (still technically "canon") is something we're familiar with, especially with other expansive franchises like Marvel and DC.
I don't believe we composite those.

 

[Arceus0x]

Lol

Regardless most Pokémon should be below average to above average, generally case-by-case, I think Mewtwo would probably be just Genius though, not extoirdinary genius unless it's got some feats of outsmrting say Metagross that I don't know

I mean Mewtwo did build a perfectly working cloning machine and a lab within a week or less from scraps left of the same lab he utterly nuked. Scientists couldn't perfect the cloning machine, only succeeding with mewtwo and even that was luck and took them ages to develop him, meanwhile mewtwo, besides making a fully functional mechanical palace he also made cloning machines that instantly clone pokemon and make the clones superior all from a strand of hair.
I think he deserves extraordinary

 

[Arceus0x]

I believe they can be below average intelligence and still wear clothes, and have some degree of coherent speech between each other.

If I haven't already implied it, it makes more sense to me for Mystery Dungeon to be a separate thing.
Alternate universe versions of characters (still technically "canon") is something we're familiar with, especially with other expansive franchises like Marvel and DC.
I don't believe we composite those.

Bruh they also talk in the anime. Like full on speech that meowth can directly translate to human

 

[FinePoint]

Bruh they also talk in the anime. Like full on speech that meowth can directly translate to human

Yes. The upper limit for Animalistic is the smartest animals.
That means Below Average includes (in real life) entirely humans.

An "average" person includes people who have graduated high school.

 

[SamanPatou]

I wouldn't say MD is consistent with the rest of the franchise.
There the Pokémon could create their own civilization, culture, society etc... unlike most other media that portray them as smart animals, but still somewhat instinctive.