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One Piece Post-Timeskip Scaling and Calcs #4
- Thread starter Damage3245
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Nah Admirals don't scale fully to Yonko. From what I recall there's a method that the OBD uses where the Admirals are scaled by blocking Whitebeard's quakes all together. So they would only scale to a portion of it.
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Hey guys welcome to my new thread on Zunisha's new/real height thanks.
https://vsbattles.com/vsbattles/2624616
https://vsbattles.com/vsbattles/2624616
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Rin The Dragon EmpressDivide by 3? xd
That's the feat where Admirals only used CoA as a barrier.
But the important feat is when Akainu tie with WB in his clash with him. So whatever WB energy is, Akainu is the same and all Admirals are in the same tier. You don't need to divide anything. Cause the WB from MF is weakened to the point of be at Admiral lvl.
That's the feat where Admirals only used CoA as a barrier.
But the important feat is when Akainu tie with WB in his clash with him. So whatever WB energy is, Akainu is the same and all Admirals are in the same tier. You don't need to divide anything. Cause the WB from MF is weakened to the point of be at Admiral lvl.
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- Thread starter
- #206
Well, since he moved it to a new thread let us not continue that topic here.
Regarding the Yonkou Commanders, my list of ratings for them are currently:
Beast Pirates
Jack: At least High 7-A (Survived Zunisha's trunk swing but appeared to be instantly defeated), likely higher with Zoan forms
Quee: Unknow
King: Unknow
Whitebeard Pirates
Marco: 6-C (Clashed with Admirals multiple times and was stated to be one of the few people that could potentially stop Blackbeard)
Ace: At least High 7-A (Fought with Jinbe in the past to a draw, cancelled out one of Aokiji's attacks)
Jozu: At least High 7-A (Hurt Aokiji with a surprise attack), with 6-C durability (Blocked a powerful slash from Mihawk)
Vista: At least High 7-A, possibly 6-C (Clashed with Akainu and Mihawk during Marineford)
Big Mom Pirates
Charlotte Katakuri: 6-C (Overwhelmed Gear 4 Luffy multiple times during their fight forcing him to grow stronger)
Charlotte Smoothie: At least High 7-A (Should be at least comparable to Cracker)
Charlotte Cracker: At least High 7-A (Fought with Monkey D. Luffy in Gear 4 for several hours)
Red Hair Pirates
Benn Beckma: Unknown, possibly 6-C (Threatened Kizaru into stopping his attack)
Regarding the Yonkou Commanders, my list of ratings for them are currently:
Beast Pirates
Jack: At least High 7-A (Survived Zunisha's trunk swing but appeared to be instantly defeated), likely higher with Zoan forms
Quee: Unknow
King: Unknow
Whitebeard Pirates
Marco: 6-C (Clashed with Admirals multiple times and was stated to be one of the few people that could potentially stop Blackbeard)
Ace: At least High 7-A (Fought with Jinbe in the past to a draw, cancelled out one of Aokiji's attacks)
Jozu: At least High 7-A (Hurt Aokiji with a surprise attack), with 6-C durability (Blocked a powerful slash from Mihawk)
Vista: At least High 7-A, possibly 6-C (Clashed with Akainu and Mihawk during Marineford)
Big Mom Pirates
Charlotte Katakuri: 6-C (Overwhelmed Gear 4 Luffy multiple times during their fight forcing him to grow stronger)
Charlotte Smoothie: At least High 7-A (Should be at least comparable to Cracker)
Charlotte Cracker: At least High 7-A (Fought with Monkey D. Luffy in Gear 4 for several hours)
Red Hair Pirates
Benn Beckma: Unknown, possibly 6-C (Threatened Kizaru into stopping his attack)
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What's going on here? 2 days and i know nothing. Are you done with pre-time skip?
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Yes, we are pretty much done with Pre-Timeskip.Gianglebatruong said:
We are focusing on the last few profiles that need to be updated.
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The only remaining thing that I believe hasn't been discussed yet is if the Monster Trio should get a Low 7-B for their strongest forms in Thriller Bark or if we're going to put a higher.
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- Thread starter
- #210
I would put a higher for them. Unlike Zoro, Luffy's and Sanji's aren't straight multipliers and I don't think we can scale them exactly like that.
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Right.
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Alright, are there any more profile that still undecided?
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- #213
Well, there are the Yonkou Commanders which I posted above.
I also think that Blackbeard's feat of punching a wounded Whitebeard isn't from the manga. Does anyone know where that's from? If not then I think Blackbeard's Pre-Timeskip rating may be affected.
I also think that Blackbeard's feat of punching a wounded Whitebeard isn't from the manga. Does anyone know where that's from? If not then I think Blackbeard's Pre-Timeskip rating may be affected.
Stefano4444
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Yes, Blackbeard punching a wounded Whitebeard is only from the Anime.Damage3245 said:
Still, since he was able to beat and overpower Ace in their short fight and that he was able to scar Shanks in the past, it should still be fair to rank him at Island level.
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Alright. Blackbeard's rating should stay the same but I'll alter his justification slightly.
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Oh, yeah, Damage, did you reread that fight with Luffy and Katakuri to decided the rating for Whole Cake Luffy.
EDIT: Overall fine with the Yonkou Commanders ratings (still feel like Jack should have that 6-C durability but I digress)
EDIT: Overall fine with the Yonkou Commanders ratings (still feel like Jack should have that 6-C durability but I digress)
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I'm doing that now. I'll post what I have for them soon.KobsterHope07 said:
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- #218
This is an analysis of all the attacks Luffy lands on Katakuri or the clashes between them.
Later on Katakuri and Luffy are clashing and throughout the entire exchange these are the attacks Luffy lands on him.
Yeah, just a single attack. Then Luffy transforms into Snakeman and we know how that goes.
Gear 4 Luffy, both in Bounceman and Snakeman, is able to fight on equal grounds with Katakuri. Every other time Luffy is either dodging, being battered around, or having his attacks be blocked or overpowered.
Luffy only dealt significant damage to Katakuri while in Gear 4.
Luffy landed a couple of hits in while in lower forms such as fighting in base or with Gear 2, but the damage he dealt is negligible and is certainly not on the same level as Katakuri / Gear 4.
Luffy's Gear 3 clashed with Katakuri twice. The first time it was overpowered and the second time Katakuri hit Luffy directly after the clash so we couldn't see if Luffy would be overpowered or not.
My suggestion for Luffy's Post-Katakuri fight rating would be:
Attack Potency: Unknow, High 7-A with Gear 2 & Gear 3, 6-C with Gear 4
Durability: High 7-A, 6-C with Gear 4
We don't have enough info from this fight to determine Luffy's base rating currently.
- Luffy uses Red Hawk. He is countered by a Haki-enhanced Mochi punch from Katakuri.
- Luffy uses Hawk Gatling. Katakuri shapeshifts out of the way of his punches.
- Luffy uses Hawk Gatling. Katakuri shapeshifts out of the way of his punches.
- Luffy uses Hawking Gatling. Katakuri matches each of his punches.
- Katakuri and Luffy both use Elephant Gu. Katakuri's is clearly larger and Luffy is overpowered and sent crashing into the wall.
- Luffy and Katakuri exchange Haki-enhanced blows. Katakuri is clearly superior here as he possesses greater Armament Haki and his strikes can hurt Luffy despite his Haki defence.
- Luffy sees and opening and kicks Katakuri in the jaw with a Haki-enhanced kick. The result is a few drops of blood from Katakuri's mouth. It is worth noting that Katakuri didn't see the attack coming and didn't defend himself with Haki.
- Luffy transforms into Gear 4: Bounceman and punches Katakuri with a Kong Gu. This is the second attack Luffy has managed to successfully land on Katakuri and it pushes Katakuri back pretty far.
- Luffy's follow-up Kong Gun breaks through Katakuri's guard despite his superior Haki and sends him flying agai.
- Luffy's Rhino Schhneider sends Katakuri flying but still fails to cause significant damage.
- Katakuri goes back to being calm and uses his shapeshifting to avoid Luffy's Kong Gu.
Later on Katakuri and Luffy are clashing and throughout the entire exchange these are the attacks Luffy lands on him.
Yeah, just a single attack. Then Luffy transforms into Snakeman and we know how that goes.
- Snakeman Luffy's Jet Culverin smacks Katakuri in the face, forces him to block and sends him flying.
- Luffy's attacks are repeatedly matched by Katakuri. Even Katakuri's Armament Haki is still superior to Luffy's.
- Again, Katakuri repeatedly blocks Luffy's attacks.
- Luffy hits Katakuri directly with the King Cobra. Katakuri remains standing for a moment then falls forward while Luffy passes out.
Gear 4 Luffy, both in Bounceman and Snakeman, is able to fight on equal grounds with Katakuri. Every other time Luffy is either dodging, being battered around, or having his attacks be blocked or overpowered.
Luffy only dealt significant damage to Katakuri while in Gear 4.
Luffy landed a couple of hits in while in lower forms such as fighting in base or with Gear 2, but the damage he dealt is negligible and is certainly not on the same level as Katakuri / Gear 4.
Luffy's Gear 3 clashed with Katakuri twice. The first time it was overpowered and the second time Katakuri hit Luffy directly after the clash so we couldn't see if Luffy would be overpowered or not.
My suggestion for Luffy's Post-Katakuri fight rating would be:
Attack Potency: Unknow, High 7-A with Gear 2 & Gear 3, 6-C with Gear 4
Durability: High 7-A, 6-C with Gear 4
We don't have enough info from this fight to determine Luffy's base rating currently.
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The fact that even in base he can make Kata bleed (and with G2 as well) would grant a certain tier. He shouldn't be far below G2 in base.
And his Dura should be 6-C in all his forms. He's sustaining damage from a 6-C the whole fight.
And his Dura should be 6-C in all his forms. He's sustaining damage from a 6-C the whole fight.
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For Third Gear, I still think it should be 6C, since Luffy can match a big punch. Yeah, Kata kicked Luffy on his face but we can not deny that our Luffy show comparable power with an Awaken punch.
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Kata could kick because he was much faster at that moment and more active.in the situation, not because of strength.
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He's sustaining damage yes, but it is hard to argue that he is tanking it.
He's coughing up blood from even basic attacks from Katakuri and the reason he is able to keep fighting isn't because he has insanely high durability but because he has insanely high endurance and stamina.
When Katakuri got a glancing hit on Luffy with his spear he practically blasted a hole straight through Luffy.
He's coughing up blood from even basic attacks from Katakuri and the reason he is able to keep fighting isn't because he has insanely high durability but because he has insanely high endurance and stamina.
When Katakuri got a glancing hit on Luffy with his spear he practically blasted a hole straight through Luffy.
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Tanking an attack isn't the only way to scale. He isn't getting knocked out and he's able to fight back despitehis serious injures. The fact that you can stand Up and fight back after getting attacked and injuredis enough to scale.
If his Durability is that below then Kata'd defeat him with a couple of strikes.
That attack works on a different way and we know that w/o Armament the piercing/cutting damage is always effective.
If his Durability is that below then Kata'd defeat him with a couple of strikes.
That attack works on a different way and we know that w/o Armament the piercing/cutting damage is always effective.
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Being somewhere in High 7-A while Katakuri is vaguely above baseline 6-C doesn't mean Katakuri would defeat him in a couple strikes.
Especially since we see that even when they clash fist to fist, Luffy is the only one of the two feeling pain due to Katakuri's superior Haki.
But if people think that Luffy should have 6-C durability in base then we'll roll with that and see how it goes.
Especially since we see that even when they clash fist to fist, Luffy is the only one of the two feeling pain due to Katakuri's superior Haki.
But if people think that Luffy should have 6-C durability in base then we'll roll with that and see how it goes.
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Agree with Calaca, punches and spear share the same power. The different outputs come from different shape.
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Durability shouldn't scale tbh. Luffy's durability in gear 4 increases, and is equal to Katakuri, which is baseline 6-C.
Luffy's base durability should be lower. The fact that Luffy "survived for long" doesn't mean much, since it's a common anime trope that happens in almost every series. Characters from different tiers can fight each other and last a while, despte them being leagues apart.
Luffy's base durability should be lower. The fact that Luffy "survived for long" doesn't mean much, since it's a common anime trope that happens in almost every series. Characters from different tiers can fight each other and last a while, despte them being leagues apart.
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In this one Katakuri's Strength Mochi's momentum is not at his peak. I mean, the punch didnt have time to gather the maximum power because it did not come out completely.
And the scan itself is explaining this indirectly. That was a scene when Luffy saw the future with his CoO and he hit before Katakuri could launch his technique completely.
It would not make any sense if Luffy G3 have that power with an Elephant Gun because Strength Mochi can do this to G4 Luffy Boundman. Luffy G4 is above all commanders (except Marco, Jozu) in durability cause his rubber body with CoA. And his durability is above his strongest moves (KKG, Tankman Cannonball, King Cobra).
And the scan itself is explaining this indirectly. That was a scene when Luffy saw the future with his CoO and he hit before Katakuri could launch his technique completely.
It would not make any sense if Luffy G3 have that power with an Elephant Gun because Strength Mochi can do this to G4 Luffy Boundman. Luffy G4 is above all commanders (except Marco, Jozu) in durability cause his rubber body with CoA. And his durability is above his strongest moves (KKG, Tankman Cannonball, King Cobra).
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Agree that the punch was not at its peak power, but it should be comparable. Moreover, you can see that the punch was much larger than before so it is safe to assume it contained much more power.Ronnijuro said:
And as for Third Gear could match something that had harmed G4 before. I think that how manga works, character evole through battle, like some kind of ability, adapting power? I dont know... but it had happened before.
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Again with the anime trope argument... Okay so we're gonna dismiss every rating coming from an asspull because that's an anime trope as well.
Really that argument doesn't hold a bit.
Those cases of unbalanced fights are 1) considered outliers here or 2) proof for upgrades/downgrades depending on context.
@Ronnijuro Luffy didn't covered his body with Haki once Katakuri punched him in G4 so he doesn't fully scale to G4 Durability either.
Boundman's AP > Katakuri >= Snakeman (Luffy still suffers the effect of clashing with a stronger Haki)
The only thing Luffy doesn't fully scale are Katakuri's big punches because he's always dodging or blocking them.
Really that argument doesn't hold a bit.
Those cases of unbalanced fights are 1) considered outliers here or 2) proof for upgrades/downgrades depending on context.
@Ronnijuro Luffy didn't covered his body with Haki once Katakuri punched him in G4 so he doesn't fully scale to G4 Durability either.
Boundman's AP > Katakuri >= Snakeman (Luffy still suffers the effect of clashing with a stronger Haki)
The only thing Luffy doesn't fully scale are Katakuri's big punches because he's always dodging or blocking them.
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" And as for Third Gear could match something that had harmed G4 before. I think that how manga works, character evole through battle, like some kind of ability, adapting power? I dont know... but it had happened before. "
Luffy had his powerups during the fights in Whole Cake Arc, but not to that degree where an EG can match tecnhiques at the lvl of KKG/Strength Mochi.
Grizzly Magnum is already = 2 x Elephant Gun, and at the same time GM is below any punch from G4.
A powerup like this: Elephant Gun "3┬║ round vs Katakuri" = Grizzly Magnum "2┬║ round vs Katakuri" is already a great improvement. The one that you suggest is too exaggerated.
Luffy had his powerups during the fights in Whole Cake Arc, but not to that degree where an EG can match tecnhiques at the lvl of KKG/Strength Mochi.
Grizzly Magnum is already = 2 x Elephant Gun, and at the same time GM is below any punch from G4.
A powerup like this: Elephant Gun "3┬║ round vs Katakuri" = Grizzly Magnum "2┬║ round vs Katakuri" is already a great improvement. The one that you suggest is too exaggerated.
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Sorry but no. No Armament covering his chest means that Katakuri punched him out of surprise and he had no time to block it unlike with Doffy.
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Best argument ever.
So what's next?
So what's next?
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Well, if we're fine with all of the Yonkou Commanders ratings, and Luffy's Dressrosa & Whole Cake Island keys, then we should update those profiles and prepare to split Luffy's profile into two parts.
I assume you've still got the draft of Luffy's profiles ready?
I assume you've still got the draft of Luffy's profiles ready?
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Everything is on my sandbox.
I'd wait to see what people think about Luffy. There's people who might have something to say.
I'd wait to see what people think about Luffy. There's people who might have something to say.
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So for the Joker of One Piece himself; his stats will be something like this
Attack Potency: At least Small City level, likely higher via Black Knight (Overpowered base Luffy), Large Mountain level via himself (Far stronger than his Black Knight and Gear 2nd Luffy. Should be far weaker than G4 Luffy as he couldn't harm him), higher with Awakening, Large Mountain level+ via Birdcage
Durability: At least Large Mountain level, Large Mountain level+ via Birdcage
For the Birdcage thing, is it gonna change with that Fujitora's metoer being recalculated to account for all the meteors.
EDIT: As for Luffy, I'm pretty much fine with it, I still think Dressrosa Luffy should be "At least City level" with G2 (Comparable to Zoro and Sanji). We also had Thread explaining why G3 Luffy is 6-C and Base Luffy Durability is 6-C as well in WCI
EDIT 2: @Damage's comment below me
Really, but that how we have Doflamingo's profile, with Birdcage in his Attack Potency section
Attack Potency: At least Small City level, likely higher via Black Knight (Overpowered base Luffy), Large Mountain level via himself (Far stronger than his Black Knight and Gear 2nd Luffy. Should be far weaker than G4 Luffy as he couldn't harm him), higher with Awakening, Large Mountain level+ via Birdcage
Durability: At least Large Mountain level, Large Mountain level+ via Birdcage
For the Birdcage thing, is it gonna change with that Fujitora's metoer being recalculated to account for all the meteors.
EDIT: As for Luffy, I'm pretty much fine with it, I still think Dressrosa Luffy should be "At least City level" with G2 (Comparable to Zoro and Sanji). We also had Thread explaining why G3 Luffy is 6-C and Base Luffy Durability is 6-C as well in WCI
EDIT 2: @Damage's comment below me
Really, but that how we have Doflamingo's profile, with Birdcage in his Attack Potency section
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- #238
No, the Birdcage was struck by each meteor individually and each individual meteor was less powerful than the biggest one which was calced.
That calc shouldn't affect the Birdcage's rating.
Also, the durability of the Birdcage is Large Mountain level+ but Attack Potency doesn't automatically scale to Durability.
That calc shouldn't affect the Birdcage's rating.
Also, the durability of the Birdcage is Large Mountain level+ but Attack Potency doesn't automatically scale to Durability.
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wait wait so your gonna ignore the fact that zou is 33km+ who should be high-6B as what this site said but your not going to use it for one piece? ya this is unfair ,also your ignoring that jack got heavily damaged in base from while getting attacked by zou (33KM+ tall non normal animal aka new world animal) and wasn't that serious damaged after that he was conscious.
ya if your still ignoring all these facts then this site specially that person who want to downplay this because he want to be right all the time. this is stupid and unfair tbh.
ya if your still ignoring all these facts then this site specially that person who want to downplay this because he want to be right all the time. this is stupid and unfair tbh.
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Yes, I am going to ignore you Aerozz because you're not helpful on this thread.
High 6-B would be too high of an outlier to scale to anyone because there are no supporting feats for anyone in the verse that even comes remotely close to it.
High 6-B would be too high of an outlier to scale to anyone because there are no supporting feats for anyone in the verse that even comes remotely close to it.
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