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One Piece Post-Timeskip Scaling and Calcs #4

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I mean old Whitebeard and Shanks were even with each other and iirc it's said all the Yonko used to have territory battles with the former
 
Js250476 said:
I mean old Whitebeard and Shanks were even with each other and iirc it's said all the Yonko used to have territory battles with the former
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Which make sense, considering that Yonkou are in constant competion between each other over the New World and the Road Poneglyph, and it more than likely that they have fought in the past multiples times over territories and etc.

Hell, Shanks was fighting with Kaido when Whitebeard was going to save Ace (and it doesn't matter if this wasn't show), if that don't show that they are comparable, then nothing else would.
 
Ask yourself a question. Do you see 200,000,000 bounty Squard driving a blade throughGear four Luffy? Through Big Mom? Kaido? What about burgees shooting them up with bullets? Marine officers swords and canon balls with no Haki doign anything?
 
Luffy has Haki to destroy the sword on contact. He doesn't rely on the hardness of his body because he hasn't an adamantious body to begin with.

Big Mom can only be injured if she's somehow weakened. That's why a plan to make her scream was essential to assassinate her instead of just launching the poisonous rockets.

Kaido was shown immune to execution methods which includes a guillotine.

Swords and fire arms are lethal if you have no Armament, a bulletproof cape or your name is Linlin/Kaido.
 
I agree with your basis but not your result Calaca.

Most characters in the new world have Haki amplifying them. Even wihtout haki, characters in One peice have super human feats. There's no point in singling out Kaido and BM other than for their very high stats. WB probably had comparable stats back in the day, at least to BM. But he's old and sick now and as was pointed out many times at Marine ford isn't as strong as the Legend.
 
Damage3245 said:
This is assuming that Old Whitebeard is still 6-C which might not be the case.
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Old Whitebeard should still be 6-C, after all he was still able to hold the title of the strongest pirate until his dead and he wouldn't had be able to do that if old age had cripple his strength to the point to be insignificant next to the other Yonko.

Even an ill and wounded WB at Marineford, he was still able to fight admirals and nearly oneshot one of them when he got mad.
 
Dr.Fix

1. Bounties are not equal to strength.

2. We don't know how strong Squardo is but he does live in the New World so it is reasonable to assume he's at least decently strong.

3. Are you saying that bullets and cannonballs hurting Whitebeard isn't plot-induced stupidity? Because it obviously is unless you think WB is less durable than East Blue Luffy who can tank both. Which is absolutely ridiculous.
 
Keep in mind Whitebeard at Marineford was past his prime due to old age had a deadly sickness and iirc was holding back to not harm his crew or sink the whole island

The only time he was fully bloodlusted was when Akainu killed Ace ( and at Teach to)
 
Bounties have consistantly indicated strength. They're just a guidleine as opposed to iron clad. Some bounties are disperportionate for one reason or another but a general theme of OP is higher bounty=Stronger character.
 
Yes in general bounty increases with strength but that is not a rule. If it was then Zoro and Sanji would have higher bounties than Pre-timeskip Luffy and Ace's bounty would be higher than Perospero's.

So using bounties at all as an argument is invalid.
 
Whitebeard still got hit by hundreds of sword slashes and bullets and tens of cannonballs. It's not Plot Induced Stupidity when the entire verse has the same thing. Swords and fire arms "ignore durability" because being stronger doesn't make your skin harder. In any case it makes you able to continue fighting with those wounds.
 
Even if Old Whitebeard was just baseline island level, Akainu and Kizaru would also be Island level for harming him and surviving his direct attacks (for Akainu).

So the original Admirals should be 6-C.

And probably Sengoku and Garp even though neither of them directly scale to the Admirals aside from rank. Old Garp might be better off as At least High 7-A, likely 6-C tbh.
 
Honestly I'm not against admirals scaling 6-C but Fuhgi's meteors and Duffy Vs Luffy seem a whole lot more credible than A<=B<=C<=D etc.
 
Dr. Fix; Fuji's meteors is even worse than any other scaling because nothing connects those meteors to the other Admirals. But let's drop this bit and focus on developing the current scaling.

@Cmue0312; it's impossible to know for certain what 'highest offensive power' means. It could mean that Akainu's attacks > Fujitora's ordinary gravity attacks, but that doesn't necessarily mean anything about the meteors since the meteors aren't Fujitora's actual ability. They're more like a combat-applicable side-effect.
 
Well I see your point about the meteors not being a direct power from Fujitora's fruit. I would argue that he still had to exert the gravity necessary to make the meteor 6-C. I don't see why he wouldn't be capable of exerting that much force on things other than meteors.

Also "highest offensive power" seems pretty straightforward. It sounds like the Magu Magu no Mi is either the strongest or one of the strongest Devil Fruits. I'm not really sure how else you could interpret that line.
 
I'm currently adding a higher for Arabasta Luffy's key going by the GGNS calc which would apply to his Rapid-Fire Techniques. Should I apply the same for the Golden Peony for the Skypiea key and the rest of the keys?
 
@Damage

Nothing connects Vista to Jozu either. Nor does anything connect Fugi to high 7-A. Without a little lee-way both he and Sabo would scale to city lv+

Realistically WB would scale to mountain level or small city level+, but I think that would be a sig low-ball :-(
 
I mean, all of those characters are far above Oven for obvious reasons.

@Kobs Personally I wouldn't put the higher for every key. It'd mess the ratings even more considering Luffy has many amps. But for those with different tiers I'd have no problem.
 
Whitebeard Commanders have the best feats amongst the Yonko Commanders. Each one has feats of tangling with Admirals level opponents, while they weren't able to beat them they've made it clear that they're able to at least defend themselves. Ace slightly burnt Whitebeard, Ace fought against Yami Blackbeard and melted 6-C Ice from Kuzan, Jozu drew blood from Kuzan and deflected an attack aimed at Whitebeard from Mihawk, Vista held off Mihawk and Marco broke Kuzan's ice, kicked and launched Kizaru and forced him out of his Logia state, took an attack from Garp without any serious injuries and held Akainu off. There's nothing to suggest that Whitebeard's Commanders are weaker than other Yonko Commander's. They have the best feats with facing off against stronger opponents and holding their own. Also really? Small City to Mountain Level Whitebeard whenever he's shown rag dolling Akainu once he got angry? And must I remind everyone that Whitebeard had to hold back in Marineford as to not hurt his sons and allies?
 
Dr.Fix said:
@Damage


Realistically WB would scale to mountain level or small city level+, but I think that would be a sig low-ball :-(
Click to expand...
@Rin: I feel like you didn't read this before you typed all that :S
 
Anyway none of that relates to them being the best commanders. Need to see them actually scale to someone that scales to the others for that.
 
We should really think about separating the Yonko from the Admirals (power-scaling wise). It's been made clear in Marineford that in straight up power, even the withered Whitebeard was more powerful than each of the Admirals.

I'm sure Fujitora isn't as strong as Akainu or Aokiji, but even he was challenged by both Doflamingo and Luffy, who we all know would never be able to defeat a Yonko and aren't stupid enough to fight an opponent who is clearly much stronger than them (unless bloodlusted like Luffy was with Kaido, and Doflamingo admitted Kaido would kill him if war came to Dressrosa, but still put Fujitora in the cage with everyone else and attacked the marines)

(Also, I feel the need to say that I'm pretty certain Kizaru's beams ignore durability via vaporization. No one except for a haki user [Rayleigh, cough] has come out without a hole through their chest. J-just a thought >_>... Akainu's red-dog vaped Whitebeard's head as well, so ... yeah <_>)
 
Imo, here's how the scaling should work out:

Top Tiers (6-C, from what I gather here): Zunisha, Yonko, and Garp + Mihawk gets a likely

High Tiers (At least High 7-A, likely 6-C): Admirals, Sengoku and those who directly scale.

Upper-Mid Tiers (At least High 7-A): Commanders, Gear 4th Luffy, Doflamingo (I already explained why. STAHP THE DOWNPLAY!), and others who directly scale.

BTW: I think Blackbeard and his crew should NOT scale to the other Yonko. They have had the status for 2 years, but I think they are being overhyped atm. Blackbeard should only scale above Ace w/ Yami-Yami, and to Sengoku with Goru-Goru.
 
I more or less agree with Cin, but I feel like WB should maybe a high tier with his health issues. Physically anyway, His AP via DF should still be at the top. Obviously this applies to BB as well.

And no more Downplay!!!
 
I still believe that Doflamingo should be just High 7-A, not At least High 7-A.

Putting the Admirals to At least High 7-A, likely 6-C could work.

Cin; do you think we should make the distinction that Garp in his prime was 6-C but the current Garp is At least High 7-A, likely 6-C?

EDIT: Btw, I'll create a continuation of this thread later today.
 
I still beleive the MF characters are being overhyped/characters after MF are being downplayed. Feats should take presecence here but this is a compromise to avoid back and fourth argumnets between "this feats shows" and "I don't want to use that feat".

Hopefully we'll get this settled in the next thread.
 
I disagree. It's just because they have feats against the Top Tiers. Sweet Commanders and Calamities don't.
 
That all depends on:

who you consider a top tier

what those feats were

whether or not you ignore/downplay feats on a case by case basis.

EDIT: But I really just want to move on from the back n fourth of it all.
 
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