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One Piece - Pica Feats Downgrade

Would anyone other than pica scale to 377 Tons, because out of this list of really does seem like only Pica would scale to that feat.
 
Personally I think only Pica would scale to that as his maximum potential.
 
Are we seriously going over this again?

The thread is for the numbers, not the scaling. And again, Pica's fruit isn't like Issho's. Differencing between one stat and the other is blatanly wrong.
 
Yeah see this is why I was a bit confused cause i thought the pica fruit mechanic's had been gone over countless times before with the same conclusion.
 
Damage3245 said:
So while Pica's maximum limit might be about 377 Megatons for example, that doesn't mean all of the characters scale to that same value.
Click to expand...
Considering how much Roronoa Zoro was dominating Pica during their fight at Dressrosa, its more than certain that Zoro scale to Pica at his full power.

And the "stronger with the more stone he has access to" argument doesn't fully work here, if that was just a matter of having not enough stone, then Pica could have just absorb more stone for match if not overpowered Zoro.

Damage3245 said:
Plus I think we'd only be forced to use that to scale Pica's attacks if we had no other calcs to rely o
Click to expand...
There are plenty of verses where a tiers of multiple characters are solely depend by scaling by a single feat.

Just look at Final Fantasy 7, Akame ga Kill!, Black Clover, Dragon Ball Super and many others, if such scaling is accepted in other verses then One Piece deserve the same treatment.
 
@Calaca; this thread is for both the numbers and the scaling. The majority of Pica's calcs are a lot less than the 377 Megaton calc.

We don't need to assume the attacks that Pica used against Zoro scale to his feat of lifting the Flower Hill, not when it is clearly shown that his stone manipulation has different levels of potency.

If there is such a large variation in Pica's feats, we shouldn't automatically assume everything he does is as strong as his biggest calc.
 
When did pica ever trade blows with Zoro? He got one shot when they were both base to base. If anything they "traded" blows when Pica was a stone golem and it's not really trading if due to Pica's fruit he won't take damage.

Yeah calaca makes sense on this.
 
@Eminiteable; when Pica emerged from his stone golem and duelled with Zoro briefly using his humongous sword.
 
When Luffy was going to the palace he destroyed the statue's head and Pica went out in the arm to stop them. Then Zoro clashed with him during an unknown timeframe until Pica went back into the stone.

Both were shown unscathed.
 
Ah completely forgot about this. Still in agreement for the Cal reasons on how stone assimilation functions.
 
Schnee One said:
No, it was deemed inconsistent and a false way of scaling people to a blast that killed them but didn't quite obliterate them
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I know, I was guessing what the feat in question was.

Am I right ?
 
Wait, if I am reading this right, we want to scale Zoro to Pica's highest showing when assimilating as much stone as he possibly can, because he overcame Pica's.....Haki?

So we want to scale full-body Haki usage to Devil Fruit Power usage? What sense does this make?
 
Because assimilating stone = usage of Pica's own strength; so Zoro one shot Pica who scales to his stone assimilation + full body armament.
 
@Eminiteable; that very topic is up for debate at this moment.

I think trying to scale Pica's durability to his stone manipulation is not a good idea.
 
Haki is willpower, and not always tied to physical strength.

It's two separate abilities, you can't cross-scale them. It's also iffy since Pica used full-body Haki and Zoro focused all of his into smaller surface areas to overcome Pica's
 
Xulrev said:
It's two separate abilities, you can't cross-scale them. It's also iffy since Pica used full-body Haki and Zoro focused all of his into smaller surface areas to overcome Pica's
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Armament haki is a stat amp, thus Zoro overcame Pica's natural Durability + with a stat amp. I would also wait for others who know more about this like Cal and such since they seem more knowledgeable.

I'm sure Oda put that much thought into it; the actual dialogue suggests the complete opposite and that it was simply Zoro's haki was stronger than Pica's.
 
Xulrev said:
Wait, if I am reading this right, we want to scale Zoro to Pica's highest showing when assimilating as much stone as he possibly can, because he overcame Pica's.....Haki?
Click to expand...
Zoro was dominating Pica even with the Stone Golems, it is clearly show that he was the strongest between the two and the only reason Pica lasted that long was because Zoro could harm his physical body and was only cutting the stone.

I don't see how Zoro wouldn't scale to Pica's highest showing.
 
@Eminitable

That is my point, Oda distinctly shows only that Zoro's Haki > Pica's Haki, considering Zoro outright states that Pica only can win is Pica's Haki is superior.

@Stefano

Zoro was able to slice up a bunch of stone, yeah. He never once blocked an attack from Pica or overwhelmed the full force of Pica's stone being moved. It isn't scaleable
 
@Stefano; so then wouldn't he only scale to being superior to the Stone Golems that he fought?
 
Xulrev said:
@Eminitable

That is my point, Oda distinctly shows only that Zoro's Haki > Pica's Haki, considering Zoro outright states that Pica only can win is Pica's Haki is superior.
Click to expand...
Yeah so hitting a smaller surface isn't relevant since it's not Ida's intention for the scene. And yes so that means Zoro > Pica + stat amp.
 
Xulrev said:
Zoro was able to slice up a bunch of stone, yeah. He never once blocked an attack from Pica or overwhelmed the full force of Pica's stone being moved. It isn't scaleable
Click to expand...
Ok, if you think Zoro never once match Pica's full strength, then why the f**k Pica didn't just take all the stone available and just overwhelming him with his superior strength?

There is nothing that suggest Pica couldn't get access to his full strength during the fight and if it was an option then Pica would have done it during the fight.
 
Eminiteable said:
Yeah so hitting a smaller surface isn't relevant since it's not Ida's intention for the scene. And yes so that means Zoro > Pica + stat amp.
Click to expand...
I will say: Haki being focused into a single area would definitely make it more powerful.

Pica lost because he didn't utilize his Haki well enough, and it didn't hold up.

Zoro's stat amp > Pica's stat amp, sure.

But at that point we are comparing esoteric to esoteric, and in no way can reliably scale to base abilities since there's an unknown in the equation here.
 
@Stefano; Pica tried that multiple times, but Pica doesn't increase the durability of the stone he manipulates. Zoro just kept cutting through it.

It was essentially a battle of attrition for both of them with neither of them being able to land a proper hit until Pica decided to lure Zoro away and then kill the king.
 
Damage3245 said:
@Stefano; so then wouldn't he only scale to being superior to the Stone Golems that he fought?
Click to expand...
Again, if Zoro < Pica's full strength, then why Pica didn't just overwhelming him with his superior strength?

At this point i really start to think both you and Xulrev are just nitpicking for the sake of having everyone downgraded at baseline 7-A, or worse at 7-B at best.
 
Stefano4444 said:
Again, if Zoro < Pica's full strength, then why Pica didn't just overwhelming him with his superior strength?

At this point i really start to think both you and Xulrev are just nitpicking for the sake of having everyone downgraded at baseline 7-A.
Click to expand...
Because stone has volume, and it turns out that it moves slowly when massed together so Zoro could slice it up. I would ask you to re-read their fight; Pica tried to do what you claim, and found out that "Big hulking mass that doesn't move fast" loses to "Small strong slicey that bifurcates big hulking mass".

And nitpicking? Sure. That's what the entire wiki is about, is being pedantic to ensure accuracy. Don't try and use "You're attempting to be TOO ACCURATE" as an insult on-site, please
 
Xulrev said:
Because stone has volume, and it turns out that it moves slowly when massed together so Zoro could slice it up. I would ask you to re-read their fight; Pica tried to do what you claim, and found out that "Big hulking mass that doesn't move fast" loses to "Small strong slicey that bifurcates big hulking mass".
Click to expand...
Yeah, you talking about the guy who can move billions of tons of stone for many km of distance in a matter of seconds...

Slow my ass, also while he may have be slower, the lack is speed is compensate by his greater size which give him far more range.
 
He can move the stone at what, a few hundred meters per second?

And is fighting a guy who moves at what, several hundred times that speed?

Slow your ass, is indeed correct
 
Stefano4444 said:
Yeah, you talking about the guy who can move billions of tons of stone in a matter of seconds...

Slow my ass, also while he may have be small, it is compensate by his greater size which give him more range.
Click to expand...
"Slow" is a relative term here. Clearly he was still slower than Zoro since every time he tried to hit him, Zoro cut his stone attacks to pieces.

Whether he tried a huge golem, or multiple smaller tendrils, or tried biting him with a stone face, he just couldn't land successful hits on him.
 
I personally do not mind scaling Zoro to Pica. He was clearly intended to be shown as having an at least comparable amount of raw power.

Anyway, I have to unsubscribe from this thread due to time constraints. You can notify me later via my message wall if you need my help after you have reached a conclusion.
 
Antvasima said:
I personally do not mind scaling Zoro to Pica. He was clearly intended to be shown as having an at least comparable amount of raw power.
Click to expand...
I do agree on that point, however the issue is what, exactly, is base Pica's level of raw power. It's unfortunately absurdly vague, if not unknown
 
Tetsucabrah said:
What is Damage arguing?
Click to expand...
That Zoro cannot scale to Pica's full strength, because his Stone Golems shouldn't scale to his Flower Hill's feat, and Pica never had the chance to use its full power during his fight.
 
And I must say, I agree with Damage on that. If Zoro had one-shot the entire golem at any point? Sure, he overwhelmed Pica.

As-is, he had to utilize cuts across small surface areas to bifurcate it, thereby bypassing the majority of the AP involved in the feats
 
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