One Piece Lifting Strength Revision

[Damage3245]

You know this can apply with literally anything regarding scaling right?

I know. It's one of the aspects of powerscaling that I am most uncomfortable with on the wiki. I feel like some instances have a lot more justification than others though.

Since the strength of Fujotora's gravity can vary, why assume he was at his shown maximum output when he was pushed by Zoro?

We even see with Fujitora Vs Law that Fuji is able to use his gravity on a small scale without destroying nearly anything yet still held law down from it.

We see that Fujitora's gravity on law there is destructive enough to shatter a boulder in his place, but besides that, what has Law shown himself to be capable of lifting with pure physical strength and not his devil fruit?

 

[joshpiece]

I think it's a fact that the majority of the feats of the verse are well below what you would rate them as, and the average portrayal of these characters is not as high as what you'd argue for.

With this logic Goku would be building level since he has hundreds of building level feats.

You argue this a lot and honestly what tf is your problem. Enel vaporized islands. Wb had enough power to destroy country’s and create earthquakes that can be felt across the large world of Op. Jack took a strike from an elephant the size of an island with a country on its back. Law sliced a mountain range in half. Maybe it’s not how the series is portrayed and more to how infatuated you are with lowballing. And screaming wanker when good evidence is provided.

So yes the tier 8 explosions you wanna calc and a ******* rock getting broken is idiotic and stupid. It is completely low balling and honestly it gets on alotta peoples nerves.

 

[Damage3245]

With this logic Goku would be building level since he has hundreds of building level feats.

Context is important, as well as consistency. A powerful character can be capable of less powerful feats, nobody is denying that.

You argue this a lot and honestly what tf is your problem. Enel vaporized islands. Wb had enough power to destroy country’s and create earthquakes that can be felt across the large world of Op. Jack took a strike from an elephant the size of an island with a country on its back. Law sliced a mountain range in half.

My problem is people highballing the verse to absurd degrees, and treating it as though it is the most normal and expected thing.

1) Nobody scales to Enel.
2) Whitebeard is practically the strongest character in the verse but it's also fairly easy to destroy country's when they're on islands a few kilometers across.
3) Jack took a fraction of the energy of the attack and it was enough to instantly defeat him.
4) Law used Spatial Cutting to achieve that.

Maybe it’s not how the series is portrayed and more to how infatuated you are with lowballing. And screaming wanker when good evidence is provided.

Nobody is screaming, unless you count Arslan's capslock up above.

So yes the tier 8 explosions you wanna calc and a ******* rock getting broken is idiotic and stupid. It is completely low balling and honestly it gets on alotta peoples nerves.

People highballing the hell out of the verse get on my nerves too.

So yes the tier 8 explosions you wanna calc and a ******* rock getting broken is idiotic and stupid. It is completely low balling and honestly it gets on alotta peoples nerves.

Why do you dislike Tier 8 explosions? Or do you dislike that characters are shown to be hurt by Tier 8 explosions? If characters are consistently getting damaged by explosions or feats that are well below the rated level on their profile, then have you considered that maybe what is on their profile is the inconsistency?

How is idiotic and stupid to be reserved in the estimation of the characters instead of constantly trying to scale them as high as feasibly possible?

 

[StrawHatArslan]

Context is important, as well as consistency. A powerful character can be capable of less powerful feats, nobody is denying that.



My problem is people highballing the verse to absurd degrees, and treating it as though it is the most normal and expected thing.

1) Nobody scales to Enel.
2) Whitebeard is practically the strongest character in the verse but it's also fairly easy to destroy country's when they're on islands a few kilometers across.
3) Jack took a fraction of the energy of the attack and it was enough to instantly defeat him.
4) Law used Spatial Cutting to achieve that.



Nobody is screaming, unless you count Arslan's capslock up above.



People highballing the hell out of the verse get on my nerves too.



Why do you dislike Tier 8 explosions? Or do you dislike that characters are shown to be hurt by Tier 8 explosions? If characters are consistently getting damaged by explosions or feats that are well below the rated level on their profile, then have you considered that maybe what is on their profile is the inconsistency?

How is idiotic and stupid to be reserved in the estimation of the characters instead of constantly trying to scale them as high as feasibly possible?

Man, this man has never heard of PIS, outliers, AOE fallacies. Instead you believe every single attack hits for a different amount of AP. I seriously think you would believe that if goku’s punches can destroy the universe, but if they destroy a wall, that moment he only has wall level AP, lmao. Not to mention whitebeards country level feat is from creating the tsunami, not destroying things with it, you just love to lowball, and EVERY single person in this thread can vouch for that. NOBODY HERE agrees with your ideology, with all due respect, NOBODY AGREES with it, if anything were infuriated by how much you downplay and how you scale things.

 

[joshpiece]

Why do you dislike Tier 8 explosions? Or do you dislike that characters are shown to be hurt by Tier 8 explosions? If characters are consistently getting damaged by explosions or feats that are well below the rated level on their profile, then have you considered that maybe what is on their profile is the inconsistency?

Context is important, as well as consistency. A powerful character can be capable of less powerful feats, nobody is denying that.

U answered your own question

My problem is people highballing the verse to absurd degrees, and treating it as though it is the most normal and expected thing.

People highballing the hell out of the verse get on my nerves too.

Who tf is highballing…. Honestly you are so trapped in your downplaying world it’s almost giving me an aneurysm trying to debate you. Nothing will change your mind you think Law is rock level so cool.

 

[StrawHatArslan]

U answered your own question


Who tf is highballing…. Honestly you are so trapped in your downplaying world it’s almost giving me an aneurysm trying to debate you. Nothing will change your mind you think Law is rock level so cool.

Preach.

 

[Eminiteable]

We see that Fujitora's gravity on law there is destructive enough to shatter a boulder in his place, but besides that, what has Law shown himself to be capable of lifting with pure physical strength and not his devil fruit?

Yeah we see Doffy is unable to overpower Law's grip, i.e lifting strength and it has nothing to do with Law's devil fruit. So either Doffy & Law have dirt level Lifting Strength or Fuji can control the AOE & DC of his gravity.

 

[Damage3245]

Who tf is highballing…. Honestly you are so trapped in your downplaying world it’s almost giving me an aneurysm trying to debate you. Nothing will change your mind you think Law is rock level so cool.

We all have our own opinions.

I'm just giving mine that default scaling Zoro to Fujitora's strongest shown Lifting Strength feat is not the best approach. If it is possible to calc the strength that Fujitora used on Zoro for that particular feat, then why is that a terrible idea?

How is that not more reliable than just randomly scaling to a completely different feat from Fujitora?

 

[StrawHatArslan]

Yeah we see Doffy is unable to overpower Law's grip, i.e lifting strength and it has nothing to do with Law's devil fruit. So either Doffy & Law have dirt level Lifting Strength or Fuji can control the AOE & DC of his gravity.

Relating to Katakuri hitting people with jelly beans, based off his ideology and logic, they’re only jelly bean level lmfao

 

[Damage3245]

Relating to Katakuri hitting people with jelly beans, based off his ideology and logic, they’re only jelly bean level lmfao

There's no such thing as "jelly bean level". That's a moronic argument.

 

[StrawHatArslan]

We all have our own opinions.

I'm just giving mine that default scaling Zoro to Fujitora's strongest shown Lifting Strength feat is not the best approach. If it is possible to calc the strength that Fujitora used on Zoro for that particular feat, then why is that a terrible idea?

How is that not more reliable than just randomly scaling to a completely different feat from Fujitora?

Your opinions are something EVERYTHING and EVERYONE here disagree with. Of course we respect it, we know you’re a hardworking individual and you’ve been scaling for a while, BUT NOBODY HERE agrees with your points.

 

[StrawHatArslan]

There's no such thing as "jelly bean level". That's a moronic argument.

I’m using your ideology and logic btw.

 

[Damage3245]

Your opinions are something EVERYTHING and EVERYONE here disagree with. Of course we respect it, we know you’re a hardworking individual and you’ve been scaling for a while, BUT NOBODY HERE agrees with your points.

Then call in more staff members to evaluate the feat.

 

[Damage3245]

I’m using your ideology and logic btw.

Don't put words in my mouth. It's not respectful, and I personally doubt you actually understand most of my arguments.

 

[StrawHatArslan]

Don't put words in my mouth. It's not respectful, and I personally doubt you actually understand most of my arguments.

Nope, I’ve been seeing your arguments, from other threads. My apologies if I you believe that, but I’m trying to use your ideology here.

 

[Damage3245]

Nope, I’ve been seeing your arguments, from other threads. My apologies if I you believe that, but I’m trying to use your ideology here.

What you're doing is literally a Strawman Argument.

If that's what you're going to resort to, then just stop responding to me.

 

[StrawHatArslan]

Then call in more staff members to evaluate the feat.

You act like we can @ staff members, you can @ them.

 

[StrawHatArslan]

What you're doing is literally a Strawman Argument.

I’m using your ideology, this isn’t me saying you straight up believe that, I’m using your ideology as if I were you, of course I know you don’t believe in “jelly bean level” lmao. I’m not strawmanning you, if I was I would say you directly believe in a jelly bean tier.

 

[joshpiece]

There's no such thing as "jelly bean level". That's a moronic argument.

Let’s calc the jelly beans KE then.

The point still stands that you can’t tell Ap and Dc apart and it’s hilarious seeing you argue for cracking a wall and tier 8 explosions to accurately portray their tier. When they have been constantly proven to be way stronger than that.

It’s just Ironic downplay and shit arguments that nobody else agrees with but you.

Maybe look at the common denominator for all these shit arguments and you’d be looking in a mirror.

 

[joshpiece]

Honestly how tf do you not know what Ap and Dc is and how they aren’t =\= it’s almost like you are doing this on purpose. Shocker

 

[Damage3245]

We all have our own opinions.

I'm just giving mine that default scaling Zoro to Fujitora's strongest shown Lifting Strength feat is not the best approach. If it is possible to calc the strength that Fujitora used on Zoro for that particular feat, then why is that a terrible idea?

How is that not more reliable than just randomly scaling to a completely different feat from Fujitora?

@joshpiece; I know that they're not necessarily the same thing. I notice that you didn't respond to this argument though.

 

[joshpiece]

If it is possible to calc the strength that Fujitora used on Zoro for that particular feat, then why is that a terrible idea?

Because how far did it go down? A lot of bs factors that you could use to misrepresent the feat. I don’t trust you and I think I’m justified to think that way especially with your behavior and comments in previous threads.

Not to mention your self admitted Low balling ideology.

I know that they're not necessarily the same thing.

Then ******* act like it and stop suggesting bs feats to calc cus you know it’ll fit your idiotic ideology. Your not slick everybody understands what you are tryna do.

 

[Eminiteable]

Quoting his profile "Performed a feat of this level very casually" that feat wasn't him going all out, and no else in the arc surprised him when attacking him or via bypassing his gravity like Sabo (Who bypassed his Ferocious Tiger which is actually an attack that takes effort from him)

Because we visually see him put effort into his other attacks besides this one, for example after using his ferocious tiger he's out of breathe and we even see a visual indicator of him being out of breathe.

Just because it's a devil fruit power doesn't mean it doesn't require physical strength/effort. For example iirc Pica gets out of breathe from using his devil fruit powers.

Dunno about that, it's more so where he aims his sword is the direction gravity will go; his side ways gravity he pushes his sword forward, the country lifting he lifted it upwards, against Sabo he isn't shown striking forward ultimately it's just his gravity powers.

Regardless though Sabo who could power through Fujitora's Ferocious tiger with his Logia propulsion couldn't push back Fujitora or make him react the way he did against Zoro.

We even see with Fujitora Vs Law that Fuji is able to use his gravity on a small scale without destroying nearly anything yet still held law down from it.

"How is that not more reliable than just randomly scaling to a completely different feat from Fujitora?"

Wouldn't really call it randomly scaling him there for the sake of it myself Damage.

 

[Damage3245]

Because how far did it go down? A lot of bs factors that you could use to misrepresent the feat. I don’t trust you and I think I’m justified to think that way especially with your behavior and comments in previous threads.
Not to mention your self admitted Low balling ideology.

How the hell is that an issue? My "low ball ideology" is just my opinion, just like how your opinion is seemingly a "high balling ideology".

Also, suggesting that specific feats get calced is now "low ball ideology"? That really says a lot.

Then ******* act like it and stop suggesting bs feats to calc cus you know it’ll fit your idiotic ideology. Your not slick everybody understands what you are tryna do.

No idea what the hell you're trying to say here.

If we didn't adopt my "lowballing ideology" at times, then we'd already have Country level Pre-Timeskip Luffy by now.

 

[KingTempest]

Can we not bash ideologies anymore and get to the topic at hand?

 

[StrawHatArslan]

Overall, I think emin has a good point, samething with joshpiece, damage's point is severely lowballed, and there's no need for it's own calc.

 

[KingTempest]

I sent something regarding Zunesha swinging the mass of his trunk.
Recently we’ve gotten a volume statement about Kaido truly being the strongest creature. Volume 95.

Kaido is already the strongest creature in the world—and he’s about to form an alliance that would make his Animal Kingdom pirates even more powerful!! Meanwhile, Luffy and the Straw Hats continue to recruit members to their side. But unbeknownst to them, the balance of power in the world is beginning to change...

Can we scale Kaido's lifting strength to the mass of Zunesha's trunk now because of this?

 

[Eminiteable]

Can we scale Kaido's lifting strength to the mass of Zunesha's trunk now because of this?

Makes sense to me

 

[StrawHatArslan]

I sent something regarding Zunesha swinging the mass of his trunk.
Recently we’ve gotten a volume statement about Kaido truly being the strongest creature. Volume 95.

Can we scale Kaido's lifting strength to the mass of Zunesha's trunk now because of this?

I think it makes sense.

 

[KingTempest]

Check the top of the sandbox

 

[Eminiteable]

Check the top of the sandbox

Looks good

 

[DarkDragonMedeus]

I kinda forgot about this thread, but what are the new proposed replacements?

 

[KingTempest]

I kinda forgot about this thread, but what are the new proposed replacements?

Not your fault, I closed the thread and reopened it since there was nothing to be discussed.
The sandbox in the OP has most of them, but here's the main ones.

The message here.

I sent something regarding Zunesha swinging the mass of his trunk.
Recently we’ve gotten a volume statement about Kaido truly being the strongest creature. Volume 95.

Can we scale Kaido's lifting strength to the mass of Zunesha's trunk now because of this?

And this

Zoro scales to Fuji for overpowering his gravity and shocking him by doing so. (I'll post the image later, although it is present on the Zoro CRT)

Which is an issue to some people, but it was already technically accepted here

https://vsbattles.com/threads/post-timeskip-zoro-crt.114148/

• 1st Encounter: Fujitora intercepted Ittoryu Zoro who was about to attack Doflamingo and applied gravity which sent him far into the earth. Zoro then overpowered that same gravity with an ittoryu air slashed (produced with his weakest sword), which Fujitora sensed and what he sensed made him shiver in fear. Fujitora was pushed back from the attack. What's notable is that Fujitora didn't react in this manner when he was attacked by Luffy, Doflamingo or Sabo.
  (Source)

 

[KingTempest]

We have an issue with Doffy, as always.

Doffy scaling to Jozu's lifting is an outlier feat. Doffy scaling to his birdcage is incorrect as well.

Doffy's strings' lifting scale to the likes of Trafalgar Law, Smoker, etc.

Same Law who got held down by Issho's gravity.

Law and everyone who scales to him and Smoker have no reason to scale to Jozu (who scales to the god tiers) and 2 Isshos worth of people (via the birdcage).

Doffy will get Class G for restraining Luffy

 

[Damage3245]

Alright. Seems fine to me.

(Though personally I would just scale Jozu to his actual lifting feat of the iceburg and leave it at that)

 

[joshpiece]

Seems good honestly scaling Doffy to anybody who is 6-B is either incorrect or an outlier. He should be as far away as possible from the god tiers.

 

[KingTempest]

Alright. Seems fine to me.

(Though personally I would just scale Jozu to his actual lifting feat of the iceburg and leave it at that)

Class M is OP's top class

 

[Eminiteable]

We have an issue with Doffy, as always.

Doffy scaling to Jozu's lifting is an outlier feat. Doffy scaling to his birdcage is incorrect as well.

Doffy's strings' lifting scale to the likes of Trafalgar Law, Smoker, etc.

Same Law who got held down by Issho's gravity.

Law and everyone who scales to him and Smoker have no reason to scale to Jozu (who scales to the god tiers) and 2 Isshos worth of people (via the birdcage).

Doffy will get Class G for restraining Luffy

Yeah I agree with this

 

[Eminiteable]

Bump

 

[KingTempest]

We giving BB Infinite lifting w/ Yami Yami?

I just had to ask