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Nasuverse General Discussion Board 19

Actually, I don't think that Jesus' class would necessarily be Saver, even tho he is eligible, since Prototype Beast has Nega-Messiah, which is different from Nega-Saver. I could be wrong though.
 
Prototype Beast is supposed to be The Beast from the literal Bible, or something close and related, so the word Messiah is likely related to that. But I don't think Messiah by itself is a class at all.

And if it is, get ready for some Law Path SMT protagonists being summoned as Heroic Spirits.
 
No, to be considered Messiah you normally go for the Law Path. Neutral part is all about forging your own path and not leaning to any of the extremities, which necessitates killing said extremities since they'll be trying to carry out their plans for their side to win.
 
LSirLancelotDuLacl said:
No, to be considered Messiah you normally go for the Law Path. Neutral part is all about forging your own path and not leaning to any of the extremities, which necessitates killing said extremities since they'll be trying to carry out their plans for their side to win.
Click to expand...
Actually, in SMT Messiah is a term that applies to more or less any party, since it's more of a designation by The Axiom
 
Oh yeah, I forgot the use of Messiah as a general term from the Apocalypse game.

And I mean, you end up using a variety of weapons, mainly Swords and I think Spears? But their main thing would totally be summoning demons. So mainly Caster or a double summon.
 
Aleph and the early protagonists can't do any real magic outside of summons tho.

But yeah, as a SMT fan, I can say that that would be fairly cool.
 
And some of our Casters are non-magicians, writers and a few inventors. If Babbage can have a super mecha body powered by steam that creates weapons, magical items and mini copies of him that fight, you bet your ass the SMT protagonists can be Casters.

I mean, the Demon Summoning Program is pretty much summoning rites and magic turned into pure math and, by extension, a computer program.
 
Those are scientists though. If everyone who ever used tech was a Caster, I'm pretty sure every single person with tech could qualify for Caster.
 
Minor rant here, but generally the Demon Summoning system is more the internet and social media used as fuel through a computer that acts as a client, meaning rituals are done by computer and through rerouted emotion. It's the equivalent of saying that someone who fires a gun makes bullets, so I wouldn't consider people who can only summon things as Casters, especially when a lot of Non-Caster servants have summons.
 
Yeah, but that's different from being a Evil of Humanity iirc. It has to represent a issue or problem intrinsic to humanity.
 
Reminder that DF was once human, and had the potential of going down the Law or Neutral paths before deliberately deciding to side with Lucifer. He could represent the sin of "corruption" or "choosing evil" or something.
 
That's not something that is intrinsic though. You could argue that he represents "Discontent" and "a hatred of stagnation" though.

Assuming he does represent something, he probably would qualify and have the Nega-Saver skill, since he also had the path of someone who could save everyone and is simultaneously a evil being and a Messiah.

but that's too speculative for my taste
 
Anyway, there was a thread a while back about characters from other verses being servants and what classes they'd have. I'll see if I can dig it up.
 
Something I've been finding odd about Dantes' few VS matches is the assumption that, in-character, he'd just go for max speed right off the bat, or that the NP that gives him said speed is an instant boost to that level, or that he can use it casually and without cost. It's quite odd.

When have we ever seen Dantes actually use that speed to its fullest in the story, even under dire circumstances? He's never actually attacked while moving at immeasurable speeds, and the few times he even goes that fast are only for the sake of transport to places he normally wouldn't be able to reach. As far as I've seen, he's only ever gone fast enough to outspeed whoever he's currently fighting.
 
The main issue is that a big deal of the people summoned as Casters fall under the category Heroic Spirit of Man. So those that made great deeds from their own actions leaving their mark in history without divine intervantion... but not everybody is gonna be Li Shuwen with super physical abilities, so they gotta fit somewhere else. And if you didn't go nuts or have nifty mounts, there's hardly many options.
 
Solacis said:
Something I've been finding odd about Dantes' few VS matches is the assumption that, in-character, he'd just go for max speed right off the bat, or that the NP that gives him said speed is an instant boost to that level, or that he can use it casually and without cost. It's quite odd.
When have we ever seen Dantes actually use that speed to its fullest in the story, even under dire circumstances? He's never actually attacked while moving at immeasurable speeds, and the few times he even goes that fast are only for the sake of transport to places he normally wouldn't be able to reach. As far as I've seen, he's only ever gone fast enough to outspeed whoever he's currently fighting.
Click to expand...
If you remember Solomon Chapter, it happen there.
 
I don't play NA so can't really give scans, but it was when Dantes enter the time temple and he attack Andromalius.
 
His Immeasurable speed was used to get to and enter the Time Temple, not attack Andromalius.

The issue I have is that everyone seems to assume that Avenger just goes full blast with Chateau D'If whenever he decides to use it, when it's been shown time and again that he only ever goes as fast as he needs to. There isn't even anything that states Avenger can fight and react at Immeasurable speeds at all, just that he can effectively wormhole his way anywhere by breaking free from space-time.

Hell, if he could actually attack while moving that fast, why didn't he just hyperblitz every Demon Pillar in the Time Temple at once? Why didn't he just punch Moriarty in the face as soon as he got into Shinjuku? It's honestly baffling to see that he's currently a legitimate contender for strongest 7-A by virtue of just massively outspeeding everything in his tier.
 
He has the ability to move at immeasurable speeds while fighting because Chateau allows him to escape the prison of time. If he can escape the prison of time there is no reason to assume he is not able to do that while attacking. Also didn't he go immeasurable against Roa?

Here is his np description it supports the fact he goes immeasurable while fighting

Burning Bright (ÞÖÄÒéêÒÇüþàîÒÇàÒü¿þçâÒüêþøøÒéîÒéóÒâ│ÒâòÒéºÒâ½Òâ╗ÒéÀÒâúÒâêÒâ╝Òâ╗ÒâçÒéúÒâò, Tora yo, Kōkō to MoesakareAnferu Shatō Difu?) is the mental power of steel of Edmond Dant├¿s, cultivated while imprisoned within the Ch├óteau d'If, sublimated into a Noble Phantasm. Not even mentioning his body, Avenger is able to escape from even "abstract prisons such as time and space." Through performing super high-speed thinking, he is able to forcibly reflect that on his body and "subjectively realize a super high-speed action that makes something that seems like a 'time halt' is being employed."

The rate of such high-speed movement makes the attacks take the form of a "simultaneous multi-attack" from many different "afterimages" of Avenger. Afterwards, the flames of grudge materialized by mana are released from multiple afterimages, dealing damage to the target.
 
Going high speeds with Chateau isn't the problem. Reaching immeasurable speeds isn't the problem. It's fighting while moving at immeasurable speeds.

Escaping space-time isn't the default of Chateau D'If. It just allows him that capability. Every time we see Edmond moving at super speeds, we still see him moving, like when he fought a spriggan here. There, he's fast enough to be moving at imperceptible speeds despite other Servants moving at slow motion. That said, he's not blinking out of space-time, or it would be impossible to perceive him. He's never used his singularity-jumping speeds on any opponent, ever. We just know that at the very least he's as fast as, or faster, than Chronos Rose Kerry; because the same "as if time was stopped" analogy is used, and both characters were written by Nasu.
 
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