Naruto Moon Conundrum (Potential Upgrades)

[BlackeJan]

They retain their tiers. This moon downgrade would not affect the God Tiers, really only Toneri is affected right now, but he's not a God Tier.

So Toneri donwgraded? i mean makes sense since Naruto used his chakra in his arm (without SM) and one shotted Toneri in base which basically implied that the man wasnt even trying

 

[TheFinalOrder]

The moon isn't hollow. Only a section is. I grow tired of having to explain the most basic things about this verse over and over again, and ontop of that, it irritates me when "supporters" act like they are unknowledgeable about the verse.

• The moon was created 1000 years before the last

• The moon is a Six Paths Chibaku Tensei (Which we all know how they are formed).

• Hamura took the Otsutsuki's who were o. Earth to the moon to watch over the Gedou Mazou (Stated in Databooks and Movie)

Now this is where people drop the ball. You all believe that the moon was completely hollowed out, but you ignore the facts of the verse:

• For starters, it makes no sense for Hamura to hollow out the moon, in effect breaking the seal he and Hagoromo just created to seal the Gedou Mazou when the entire point of going to the moon was to protect it.

• Second, it is stated in the manga/movie that the seal was broken when Madara summoned the Gedou Mazou some 800+ years AFTER Hamura went to the moon.

So, the moon isn't hollow according to the facts, not your misguided opinions....you all sound foolish claiming such things when canon states the seal was broken centuries after Hamura went to the moon, which wouldn't be the case if the moon was hollowed out completely because that means whoever hollowed it out, broke the seal not long after the moon was created, which contextually makes no sense and goes against canon. Meaning as I said, only a unquantifiable section less than half the diameter of the moon can canotically be hollow, not the entire thing.

So please stop the nonsense...

 

[TheFinalOrder]

Btw, don't come with some more nonsense claiming the moon is hollow. That claim is noncanon.

• Seal being intact until Madara's time = moon isn't hollow = Canon

• Moon being completely hollow in Naruto's time = Seal was broken before Madara's time = Noncanon.

There is no debating this.

 

[BMWFanboy]

So, what exactly is the issue here?

 

[Sigurd_Snake_in_The_Eye]

I agree that the moon is mostly hollow.

 

[IMadeThisOn8-1-2017]

The moon could have been hollowed out any time after the sealing. The Gedo Mazo was inert after the chakra was separated from it. There was nothing to seal after Hagoromo split the Chakra from it and made the Bijuu.

We don't need headcanon when we can work on scenes and scans from the movie that explicitly show us this. Those scenes and scans are greater than any amount of theory crafting as they show us the facts.

 

[TheFinalOrder]

So, what exactly is the issue here?

The gravity of the moon was being questioned. Portayal was being question based on 2 consistent showings and now the "Hollowness" of the moon was being contested falsely...

 

[TheFinalOrder]

I agree that the moon is mostly hollow.

The moon isn't mostly hollow. Please read my post again.

 

[Sigurd_Snake_in_The_Eye]

I did read it,but evidence shows otherwise.

 

[TheFinalOrder]

I did read it,but evidence shows otherwise.

There is no evidence showing otherwise my dude. Only facts which you guys are disregarding.

 

[Qawsedf234]

But like Imadethis said, it could have been hollowed out at any time and the movie shows us how thin the crust is multiple times.

 

[IMadeThisOn8-1-2017]

There is evidence, you just seem to be ignoring it for events that happened in the past when we're discussing the present that we have explicit scenes that we can go over.

 

[TheFinalOrder]

@Imade

1.)The only section hollowed out is where the Otsutsuki were. No shit that was done "After" the moon was created.

2.)The moon was created to seal the GM.

3.)You're right, we don't need headcanon...so kindly drop it, sir.

 

[IMadeThisOn8-1-2017]

1) As Qaws and Kep's scans show, nearly the entire moon was hollow as we can see in their scans. Meaning the moon had been hollowed out after the Gedo Mazo was sealed, which isn't much of an issue since the Gedo didn't need to be restrained when it was an inert statue.

2) It was, but the Gedo is inert and we see the moon is hollow through scans.

3) I'm not using headcanon, I'm using scans from the movie and just describing them. You on the other hand are just laying out your words about past events in the story.

 

[TheFinalOrder]

But like Imadethis said, it could have been hollowed out at any time and the movie shows us how thin the crust is multiple times.

When it was hollowed is irrelevant, not to mention that's a theory crafted assumption. Facts are:

• The seal was broken some 800+ years after the Otsutsuki went to the moon by madara.

Anything else not supported by canon.

 

[Sigurd_Snake_in_The_Eye]

What does this seal have to do with the moon being visibily incredibly hollow?

I'm quite sure this is a red herring.

 

[TheFinalOrder]

There is evidence, you just seem to be ignoring it for events that happened in the past when we're discussing the present that we have explicit scenes that we can go over.

The evidence only shows a potion of the moon is hollow my dude. Your headcanon is irrelevant.

Facts:

• Otsutsuki went to the moon after GM was sealed

• Madara broke the seal 800+ years later

Everything else you type is noncanon and irrelevant thus should be dismissed.

 

[TheFinalOrder]

What does this seal have to do with the moon being visibily incredibly hollow?
I'm quite sure this is a red herring.

Do you understand what a Six Paths Chibaku Tensei is?

 

[Sigurd_Snake_in_The_Eye]

a big rock

 

[BMWFanboy]

People still saying it's more than 15%? Sigh. First off, just being 15% hollow means there's literally hundreds of km of free area there, almost half the size of Pluto. Toneri's swords was shown cutting through a portion, the camera ofc won't follow the whole slice n dice. Nothing except pure Ad Hoc can enforce >15% hollowness

 

[IMadeThisOn8-1-2017]

Let's lay out facts based on the manga, databooks and the movie.

1) The Gedo was sealed in the moon with a Six Paths Chibaku Tensei.

2) Hamura and the Otsutsuki went to live on the moon to guard the Gedo.

3) The Gedo is an inert statue that can't move.

4) As shown in the movie, the moon was hollowed out by an unquantifiable amount for oceans, castles, nations, an artificial sun, lands and etc.

5) As the movie goes on, we have several scans and scenes depicting that nearly the entire moon was hollowed out.

With that, we can easily conclude the moon was nearly entirely hollowed out after Hamura moved in thanks to scans and scenes. No theory crafting needed, just the scans from the movie.

 

[TheFinalOrder]

a big rock

Seriously dude, do you know what SPCT is? More specifically what it does?

 

[BMWFanboy]

Sigh, the headcanon here....

 

[Sigurd_Snake_in_The_Eye]

The technique used by the sage to seal his mother Kaguya via draining her of her chakra and turning her into the core.In other words a big rock prison.

 

[TheFinalOrder]

Let's lay out facts based on the manga, databooks and the movie.

1) The Gedo was sealed in the moon with a Six Paths Chibaku Tensei.

2) Hamura and the Otsutsuki went to live on the moon to guard the Gedo.

3) The Gedo is an inert statue that can't move.

4) As shown in the movie, the moon was hollowed out by an unquantifiable amount for oceans, castles, nations, an artificial sun, lands and etc.

5) As the movie goes on, we have several scans and scenes depicting that nearly the entire moon was hollowed out.

With that, we can easily conclude the moon was nearly entirely hollowed out after Hamura moved in thanks to scans and scenes. No theory crafting needed, just the scans from the movie.

5 is a misguided opinion. All that is shown is that a portion is hollow. Nothing suggests it's completely hollow, thus the assumption on your part.

 

[BMWFanboy]

First, Naruto and gang only explore a portion of the moon, that was hollowed out. Second, with our current assumption of 15% hollowness, all the stuff shown in the movie casually fits inside of the moon, given the fact that said hollowness would create an area the size of a dwarf planet inside. Nothing has to be changed

 

[BMWFanboy]

Second, if we're supposed to see the sword cut, Kurama and Toneri's summon fell thru the hole in the surface inside, and in a few seconds had already reached the ground, thus implying an even smaller hollowed out area

 

[IMadeThisOn8-1-2017]

5 is completely valid as we see through Qaws scans linked here and Kep's scan linked here that display it all.

It's quite hollow by a large degree as we can see through the scans.

 

[BMWFanboy]

Lastly, the artificial sun showering light showed that every area explored on the moon was part of the common hollowed area, said area where Kurama and Toneri's summon fought, was also darkened

 

[TheFinalOrder]

The technique used by the sage to seal his mother Kaguya via draining her of her chakra and turning her into the core.In other words a big rock prison.

So do you understand what it means for Madara to have broken the seal, centuries after the Otsutsuki were established on the moon?

 

[TheFinalOrder]

5 is completely valid as we see through Qaws scans linked here and Kep's scan linked here that display it all.

It's quite hollow by a large degree as we can see through the scans.

LMAO! Those scans prove nothing bro...all they prove is that a portion of the moon is hollow. Canon only supports less than half the moon being hollow in a sphere shape. It's that simple.

 

[BMWFanboy]

Hold up, you think Kurama and the summon FLEW to the other end of the moon? Lmfaoo, they weren't flying, they were freefalling, which disproves this absurd moon is fully hollow theory even more

 

[BMWFanboy]

they fell for a total of 30s, even applying the Earth's gravity, all we get is a measly 294 metres of falling lmfao

 

[BMWFanboy]

Lastly, it makes absolutely no sense for the moon to be fully hollowed out in the 30-ish years before the movie, where the clan had nearly already died out

 

[BMWFanboy]

Madara broke the seal around the time he found 12 yr old Obito, Kakashi by the end of P2 is like 30ish I guess, that gives you a 30 something year time period from the time the seal was broken to the movie, there's absolutely no sense for a dead clan to hollow out the moon so rapidly in 30 years

 

[IMadeThisOn8-1-2017]

Lastly, the artificial sun showering light showed that every area explored on the moon was part of the common hollowed area, said area where Kurama and Toneri's summon fought, was also darkened

Okay and? We don't know the size of the hollowed area, we can determine it with the scans and views we are given though. Also, Kurama and the Hamura statue fought in a dark area because the artificial sun disappeared after Naruto and Hinata destroyed the Tenseigan.

LMAO! Those scans prove nothing bro...all they prove is that a portion of the moon is hollow. Canon only supports less than half the moon being hollow in a sphere shape. It's that simple.

You just seem in denial and purposefully ignoring evidence at this point when you've provided nothing to counter the scans except going "LMAO!" or "lol" to brush off the facts. You keep using canon as if it disproves anything when we're literally giving canon scans from the canon movie from the present while you're just saying events from the past.

 

[BMWFanboy]

Lastly, the artificial sun showering light showed that every area explored on the moon was part of the common hollowed area, said area where Kurama and Toneri's summon fought, was also darkened

Okay and? We don't know the size of the hollowed area, we can determine it with the scans and views we are given though. Also, Kurama and the Hamura statue fought in a dark area because the artificial sun disappeared after Naruto and Hinata destroyed the Tenseigan.

The scans and views only determine said area to be a common one lit by the artificial sun, like I already said in my first point if you read carefully. The entire "99% of it is hollow!!" theory gets debunked by the simple fact that Kurama and the statue in freefall were already on the ground in less than 30s after jumping into the hole, which would give the hollowed area a very small radius

 

[TheFinalOrder]

@Imade Those scans only prove the section the Otsutsuki live in is hollow. I've already said more than enough to disprove the nonsense you guys are pushing, so it's quite the opposite as to who is in denial.

And those "events from the past" shoot your entire argument out of the sky. I'm about to start dismissing everything said otherwise because it's just you guys blowing smoke up your own asses at this point.

Again, the only facts are:

• The Otsutsuki went to the moon to guard the GM after it was sealed.
• Madara broke that seal some 800+ years after the Otsutsuki already settled on the moon.

Those scans you keep harping on only serve to prove a portion is hollow. You have nothing to suggest it's entirely hollow and you need to stop acting like what's shown is proof of it, because it's not unfortunately.

 

[IMadeThisOn8-1-2017]

The scans and views only determine said area to be a common one lit by the artificial sun, like I already said in my first point if you read carefully. The entire "99% of it is hollow!!" theory gets debunked by the simple fact that Kurama and the statue in freefall were already on the ground in less than 30s after jumping into the hole, which would give the hollowed area a very small radius

Your mistake here is thinking Kurama and the statue fell into the hole. Kurama and the statue were on Toneri's floating castle and fell for an unknown amount of time and landed on the interior side of the crust. Nothing about that disproves the inside is mostly hollow.

Those scans only prove the section the Otsutsuki live in is hollow. I've already said more than enough to disprove the nonsense you guys are pushing, so it's quite the opposite as to who is in denial.

You actually haven't disproven anything, not once did you link a scan.

And those "events from the past" shoot your entire argument out of the sky. I'm about to start dismissing everything said otherwise because it's just you guys blowing smoke up your own asses at this point.

You should probably calm down, you're already getting upset clearly with multiple people agreeing it's hollow. Nothing about the events from the past shoot down the argument as said above:

The moon could have been hollowed out any time after the sealing. The Gedo Mazo was inert after the chakra was separated from it. There was nothing to seal after Hagoromo split the Chakra from it and made the Bijuu.

Events from the past don't hold the same weight as events from the present that are also canon and tell a new story to us.

Again, the only facts are:

• The Otsutsuki went to the moon to guard the GM after it was sealed.
• Madara broke that seal some 800+ years after the Otsutsuki already settled on the moon.

Actually there are more:

• The Gedo was sealed in the moon with a Six Paths Chibaku Tensei.

• Hamura and the Otsutsuki went to live on the moon to guard the Gedo.

• The Gedo is an inert statue that can't move.

• As shown in the movie, the moon was hollowed out by an unquantifiable amount for oceans, castles, nations, an artificial sun, lands and etc.

• As the movie goes on, we have several scans and scenes depicting that nearly the entire moon was hollowed out.

 

[BMWFanboy]

The scans and views only determine said area to be a common one lit by the artificial sun, like I already said in my first point if you read carefully. The entire "99% of it is hollow!!" theory gets debunked by the simple fact that Kurama and the statue in freefall were already on the ground in less than 30s after jumping into the hole, which would give the hollowed area a very small radius

Your mistake here is thinking Kurama and the statue fell into the hole. Kurama and the statue were on Toneri's floating castle and fell for an unknown amount of time and landed on the interior side of the crust. Nothing about that disproves the inside is mostly hollow.

.....did you read what you typed? Or more likely, did you watch the movie? Kurama and Toneri's statue were fightning on the surface of the moon, that's when Konoha noticed and said "the ninetails has been spotted on the moon!", in between Naruto and Toneri's fight, Kurama bullrushed the statue and both of them fell inside the moon, less than 30s later, Toneri's sword passed by them as it split the moon. It wasn't an unkown amount of time in any case unless you blatantly ignore timestamps. That still disproves this absurd "mOsTLy HoLlOw" idea.