My Hero Academia - Scaling Revisions [One for All AP Edition]

[RazumaHiroki]

Good thing my comment never addressed this and was talking specifically about the appeal to incredulity, I even go as far as to say that I don't agree with the 6-C upgrade.

I see. If you don't agree with the 6-C upgrade, then why even brought up other verses in this? (Considering you are already aware of how other verses works, because I found your reason a bit lacking tbh) the way you worded it sounded like you were complaining the "unfairness", because almost all verses were upgraded because of one or two feats and emphasized our points to be a "lame reason" or we are "enforcing rules", that was my initial impression of your 1st paragraph.

This is absolute nonsense, there is no multiplier at all in the series as proven by the fact if you wanted to be objectively measure every feat they don't scale to what they would be based on the % used, we are retroactively creating a multiplier to create a false problem. and this Issue is going to get inevitably worse when characters pull off more Impressive feats as the series goes on with less % than they are using now.

Most multiplers need to be accepted here, that's something I know too well (Keep in mind that most Mods doesn't like Multiplers, so you really have no other choice than to prove them wrong via a CTR). Bankai was accepted, Super Sayain was accepted, plenty of other multiplers were accepted precisely because we know how much stronger they make the user. Full Cowl 100% is not an exception, if you claims it to be a 50x multipler, then feel free to create a CTR and convince everyone with your limited evidence, considering that would've spared us all that.

 

[OneBleachHurricane]

Even if we use Earth's 31 megaton calc for 30/45%, I think we should put war arc 100% at 7B+, possibly borderline 7A.

https://vsbattles.fandom.com/wiki/Powerscaling

It is possible for a character who is depicted as vastly superior to another in a statistic to be placed in a tier above the other, given that the other character is close to the the next tier.

Since a 2-4X multiplier for a 55% increase isn't that farfetch considering we had bigger jump from much smaller percentage increase. This number could possibly be higher since even with his regen and deku's arm getting ever increasingly more broken, shigaraki was still getting his ass kicked

https://vsbattles.fandom.com/wiki/Multipliers

Multipliers come from direct statements instead of being reasoned from something else. That means, for example, that if a verse has powerlevels or statistics, the doubling of a statistic or power level should not be concluded to correspond to the power of the character doubling, unless it is clearly specified to work that way.

 

[Bruh]

given that the other character is close to the the next

The thing is we don't know how strong 100% is so at best we could use the term "possibly" due to how vague things are. All we now is 30% is at least 31 megaton, 45% along with shigaraki scale above that and 100% is an unknown degree stronger than that. Strong enough to severely injured shigaraki despite his high-mid regen and deku's declining bone density. Even if we low balled it and say 100% is only 2X stronger than 45% even though OFA increase its percentage exponentially not mathematically, deku would at the very least be 62 megaton or City lv+

 

[Gitagon]

Yeah MHA doesn't have multipliers. At most the only thing that would count is AFO stacking quirks where he was saying stuff like x4 or x3 but even then we don't exactly how strong those quirks were individually so it's all an assumption. OFA seems to have a way more linear progression at most exponential and unless stated otherwise, I don't see multipliers being a thing with OFA.

 

[KingTempest]

If yall want to upscale, do it right.

You don't just upscale from whatever value via one shotting, and we don't assume a 2x value for one shotting

 

[TheRustyOne]

I'm back, I have no idea what's going on since I left for one day. What multiplier and one shot are we talking about here?

However 30% Izuku does not scale to Shigaraki, as 30% was easily outpaced by Shigaraki when he attacked. Bakugo was shown to be slightly faster than 30% Izuku, as he was able to pass him while they were running beside each other. But when Izuku goes after Shigaraki, Bakugo is actually losing ground on him, the only explanation is that Izuku is using 45% not 30%.

The Izuku who survived that elbow from Shigaraki is 45%, not 30%.

 

[Jackof_noTrades068]

Also, this calc is very relevant to the discussion. High Hypersonic+ 100%

This probably should be saved for another revision
This thread is dense enough

 

[Kingofwolves999]

This probably should be saved for another revision
This thread is dense enough

Yeah, I said that before this multiplier talk started up

 

[OneBleachHurricane]

I'm back, I have no idea what's going on since I left for one day. What multiplier and one shot are we talking about here?

Even if we use Earth's 31 megaton calc for 30/45%, I think we should put war arc 100% at 7B+, possibly borderline 7A. Since a 2-4X multiplier for a 55% increase isn't that farfetch considering we had bigger jump from much smaller percentage increase.

 

[Bruh]

However 30% Izuku does not scale to Shigaraki, as 30% was easily outpaced by Shigaraki when he attacked.

I was just repeating what the op said about how 30% is at least 31 megaton, I didn't scale him to shiggy

 

[TheRustyOne]

I wasn't talking about anyone in general, if you wanted to be accurate I was referring to the OP.

 

[Therefir]

The discussion is kinda pointless but yes, if 45% is 7-B+ then 100% would be 7-A at the very minimum.

 

[Bruh]

I wasn't talking about anyone in general, if you wanted to be accurate I was referring to the OP.

Oh, my bad

 

[Kingofwolves999]

So, besides the FC 100% stuff which I literally don’t care about, the bulk of the thread is done.

We use either Earthy’s 31 Megaton calc or Therefir’s 68 Megaton calc (whichever is more accurate) to upgrade those who scale and be on our way.

 

[Bruh]

Hey King, wasn't there a revision going on regarding shigaraki and his upgrade to High Hypersonic +

 

[Kingofwolves999]

Hey King, wasn't there a revision going on regarding shigaraki and his upgrade to High Hypersonic +

To Deku, yes. That’s probably it’s own thread.

 

[Bruh]

Cool

 

[Livinmeme]

If yall want to upscale, do it right.

You don't just upscale from whatever value via one shotting, and we don't assume a 2x value for one shotting

Reinhardt is 7-A via one shotting a 7-B+ so....

 

[KingTempest]

Reinhardt is 7-A via one shotting a 7-B+ so....

I just checked, that should be downgraded then. That 7-B+ is close to baseline 7-B+. No reason to upscale when it has 40+ megatons from the next tier

All because another verse gets away with it doesn't mean yall should too.

 

[Therefir]

In order to jump to the next tier a difference of 1.5x times is required, it was discussed here.

But as I said before it doesn't really matter as 100% is at the very minimum two times stronger than 45%.

 

[BlackeJan]

In order to jump to the next tier a difference of 1.5x times is required, it was discussed here.

But as I said before it doesn't really matter as 100% is at the very minimum two times stronger than 45%.

And how do u know it’s 2x unless I’m missing something here

 

[Kingofwolves999]

And how do u know it’s 2x unless I’m missing something here

Percentile wise/mathematically, 100% is 2.2 times higher than 45%. So Deku's 100% is bare minimum 2.2x his 45%.

As we know however, that is a low ball because the difference between the higher percentages is far more vast and that OFA doesn't abide by normal mathematics.

 

[Gitagon]

Just looking at the recent chapter, Faux 100% is ridiculously above 45% and 30% considering these 2 can be somewhat scaled to Bakugo, Gran Torino and Iida.

As for Faux 100%, it requires

Spoiler

multiple characters putting their all just to catch up speedwise. If the same goes for strength as with speed then the difference between 45% and 100% is downright exponential.

 

[Damage3245]

I wouldn't bring up anything from a chapter that hasn't come out yet.

 

[Therefir]

Just looking at the recent chapter, Faux 100% is ridiculously above 45% and 30% considering these 2 can be somewhat scaled to Bakugo, Gran Torino and Iida.

As for Faux 100%, it requires

Spoiler

multiple characters putting their all just to catch up speedwise. If the same goes for strength as with speed then the difference between 45% and 100% is downright exponential.

Spoiler

Since when does Bakugo scale from 45%? I have to remind you that it's precisely 45% that generates enough kinetic energy to replicate a 100% super move.

This chapter showed that 45% Deku by moving his legs a bit and accumulating that kinetic energy, is able to achieve such speeds. The difference shouldn't be that substantial.

 

[CloverDragon03]

It’s about full cowl being a 200x boost to justify it not being an outlier. No way can you honestly believe full cowl has been portrayed as that big of a boost.

so you honestly want me to believe full cowl boosts Deku so much he can go from performing 7-B feats to 6-C feats bc it’s portrayed as superior to regular 100% yeah I just don’t agree with that logic the boost is not portrayed as being sooooo significantly stronger than regular 100%

It would be a different story if we had more supporting feats or a better justification for the jump in power.

So it's just an argument from incredulity without much else reasoning behind it. Got it.

If it actually caused scaling issues, I'd agree, but it doesn't. The affected characters would be FC 100% Deku, FC 100% Bakugo, Full Power Nine, Prime AFO, and Prime All Might. That doesn't cause any problems with scaling, and what you're saying makes it clear that your only argument is "the jump is too high for my liking."

 

[joshpiece]

So it's just an argument from incredulity without much else reasoning behind it. Got it.

So you just don’t read my argument sure wtv u think

If it actually caused scaling issues

Who is making that claim you keep misconstruing my argument and strawmanning me holy shit


Show me evidence that shows full cowl is that big of a jump. Where has Deku 1-shot a person who was tanking normal 100% punches? That would be enough for me to say ok the full cowl boost is shown to insanely more powerful than deku’s regular 100%

I could give 2 ***** if it was 6-C or 6-A the reasoning of the boost is wrong point blank.

Stop hiding behind the bs argument of incredulity.

 

[RazumaHiroki]

So you just don’t read my argument sure wtv u think



Who is making that claim you keep misconstruing my argument and strawmanning me holy shit


Show me evidence that shows full cowl is that big of a jump. Where has Deku 1-shot a person who was tanking normal 100% punches? That would be enough for me to say ok the full cowl boost is shown to insanely more powerful than deku’s regular 100%

I could give 2 ***** if it was 6-C or 6-A the reasoning of the boost is wrong point blank.

Stop hiding behind the bs argument of incredulity.

Funny how He/She accused us of strawmaning. Anyways, unwatching this thread, because She/He isn't going to read our arguments properly and deliberately misinterpret it the way she/he wants it aka out of context.

Apparently, patience is a myth?

 

[CloverDragon03]

Show me evidence that shows full cowl is that big of a jump. Where has Deku 1-shot a person who was tanking normal 100% punches? That would be enough for me to say ok the full cowl boost is shown to insanely more powerful than deku’s regular 100%

There's not an instance of that specific scenario, but there is something similar in the Nine fight. Deku used 100% in one arm to try and stop Nine's first attack after going full power. It does absolutely nothing. Later, he destroys Nine's barriers with a single kick (the barriers are even higher defense, and I'm pretty sure there was multiple of them).

I believe that shows that FC 100% is far superior to regular 100%.

 

[Gitagon]

Spoiler

Since when does Bakugo scale from 45%? I have to remind you that it's precisely 45% that generates enough kinetic energy to replicate a 100% super move.

This chapter showed that 45% Deku by moving his legs a bit and accumulating that kinetic energy, is able to achieve such speeds. The difference shouldn't be that substantial.

I don't know why people ignore Black Whip in all of this. It's isn't just 45%. It's 45% + Black Whip + Fa Jin and each time Black Whip has played a huge role so the difference is indeed significant.

And I never said Bakugo scales to 45% we know he's slower than 45% since he's at 30% before his power-up. However unless 45% Deku is significantly faster than High-ends, Endeavor, Mirko, Hawks and other similar tier characters, the new Bakugo after power-up and Iida who was taking on 2 High-ends solo while taking zero damage should at least scale to 45% or slightly below it.

 

[joshpiece]

There's not an instance of that specific scenario, but there is something similar in the Nine fight. Deku used 100% in one arm to try and stop Nine's first attack after going full power. It does absolutely nothing. Later, he destroys Nine's barriers with a single kick (the barriers are even higher defense, and I'm pretty sure there was multiple of them).

I believe that shows that FC 100% is far superior to regular 100%.

Time stamps?

 

[AtomicSekiro]

There's not an instance of that specific scenario, but there is something similar in the Nine fight. Deku used 100% in one arm to try and stop Nine's first attack after going full power. It does absolutely nothing. Later, he destroys Nine's barriers with a single kick (the barriers are even higher defense, and I'm pretty sure there was multiple of them).

I believe that shows that FC 100% is far superior to regular 100%.

Yeah, but you’re comparing one punch to Deku running at 100% speeds and gaining momentum down a mountainside and then spinning so fast he becomes a literal tornado of light before slamming into the shield at that speed. He didn’t just normally punch it.

 

[CloverDragon03]

Time stamps?

1:03 in this video for 100% Deku not doing anything to Full Power Nine's first attack. 2:41 in this video for FC 100% Deku destroying that Nine's barriers (he destroyed all six).

Yeah, but you’re comparing one punch to Deku running at 100% speeds and gaining momentum down a mountainside and then spinning so fast he becomes a literal tornado of light before slamming into the shield at that speed. He didn’t just normally punch it.

Well yeah, using 100% throughout the whole body will in fact be superior to 100% in one arm. I don't get why you're using all these hyperbolic adjectives to describe what happened when the "gaining momentum" thing is such a weird excuse given that it won't make so much of a difference as to invalidate the big picture.

 

[TheStoryReader]

Question. So I'm new here so just obviously got to this thread...but why not just say that the regular 100% upscales so the 7-B feats can have added stuff like "at least" and "possibly/likely higher"? Wouldn't this basically fix having the 200x multiplier that everything keeps talking about? Sure it wouldn't 100% fix the problem but at the same time at least it wouldn't completely ignore the storm feat or something like that.

 

[AtomicSekiro]

The point is you were comparing two vastly different in scale moves. You weren’t comparing a 100% punch to a 100% full cowling punch.

 

[CloverDragon03]

The point is you were comparing two vastly different in scale moves. You weren’t comparing a 100% punch to a 100% full cowling punch.

They're not as vastly different in scale as you make it seem, though. And in the same way, you could say Deku was building up momentum as he rushed to the tornado to do his 100% punch.

 

[ÆONS]

To explain why I'm unwatching this thread, Earthyboy—the one who started the thread in the first place and is most able to speak on some things in the OP—has gone radio silent and who knows when he's coming back. The discussion has also slowed to a crawl as a result of his absence with people just making circular arguments against each other. If either Earthyboy comes back or a breakthrough happens just say so in the general thread.

Please don't DM me or send a message on my wall thanks.

 

[BlackeJan]

Hold on. Full Cowl is suppose to have Deku just control the power through the body just like how All Might use his muscle form for OFA

Full Cowl is pretty much gonna work for Deku body to get accustom to the power hence why he doesn’t break his arms anymore because his base can handle more of the power

100% in just 1 limb is pretty much the same power of him using it for his entire body

 

[CloverDragon03]

Hold on. Full Cowl is suppose to have Deku just control the power through the body just like how All Might use his muscle form for OFA

Full Cowl is pretty much gonna work for Deku body to get accustom to the power hence why he doesn’t break his arms anymore because his base can handle more of the power

100% in just 1 limb is pretty much the same power of him using it for his entire body

Not at all. Using a punch or a kick requires much more than just the arm or leg, so putting One For All only in there isn't actually the highest it can go. Even in Heroes Rising we see (from what I've mentioned a few messages up) that Full Cowl 100% is clearly superior to 100% in one limb.

 

[KobsterHope07]

We should try to get the two calculations evaluated and accepted before discussing more on them