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My Hero Academia General Discussion Thread #18

Kingofwolves999 said:
Also Endeavor bullying AFO kinda forces people to scale to Weakened All Might
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That still has to be one of my favorite moments in series

Endeavor went into that fight knowing he shouldn't be able to win and was most likely going to fall, against an opponent that even in this weakened state forced someone leagues above him into retirement and made him look like a fool. He knew he should never make it out of that fight, he's done all he's can do atone and now seems like his final days

And through nothing more than that sheer ************* willpower, he trucks through getting parts of his lungs and his side ripped out, his arm is torn off and thrown into the dirt like nothing, and he charges through it all, destroying what was in his way and actually outright killing this force of nature which should have in every conceivable way murdered him, and he does it SOLO. AFO was mostly in perfect condition other than his mask being broken, and was throwing the heroes around like ragdolls, and here comes Endeavor fueled by his desire to burn the mistakes he and his generation made away, and he WINS (not counting rewind, which in all honesty I don't, AFO's still gonna die so best he does is have a draw with Enji). Honestly if that was the end of that fight, and it happened at the end of the war arc, with that being the final panel of the fight, I would have been incredibly satisfied
 
Kingofwolves999 said:
Also are we putting Prime AM peeps at baseline Sub-Rel+ for Faux 100% blitzing Nagant’s Sub-Rel bullets?
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Also are we using 313 or 433 gigaton for the Intercontinental Cruise Punch? Cuz there's a lot of upscaling fuckery that could be done if it's the latter
 
I think it should be noted that physically, there is still a decent difference between Weakened All Might and Endeavor. Like, Endeavor is still a tier weaker.

Endeavor's physical punches can hurt WAM and WAM-durability level characters, but he's not gonna be able to defeat them with that. He still relies on the Flashfire Heat to roast through them.
Meanwhile, Endeavor was already badly injured from like 2-3 direct attacks from 75% Shigaraki, who is a definitive WAM-level character. He takes like 3-4 direct attacks from Hood and basically was injured the same way. [Which acts as more proof for the High Ends scaling to WAM if anyone is interested in that.]

Simply put, without the durability-ignoring heat from Flashfire Fist, Endeavor can hurt Weakened All Might but won't really be able to defeat him, as we know that Weakened All Might took hundreds of hits from the USJ Nomu who was just as strong as himself. Whereas All Might would probably take 6 punches at most to completely obliterate Endeavor.

Endeavor (nearly)-killing All For One does show that their physicals aren't that far off but the point still stands, as AFO was primarily roasted by Flashfire during that fight anyways.
 
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If Nejire can overpower two characters that are 82.95 Tons with 30%, wouldn’t that mean that actual 30% power is 165.9 Tons? Since it’s an energy power quirk, and she’s splitting up her power on two targets

Maybe I’m tripping but I just noticed it
 
Mazdoesstuff said:
There is a coliseum and you throw all of these students in:

Phosphor Todoroki

Dark Shadow at Peak Darkness

Full Body Cluster Bakugou

Awakened Shoji

45% Dark Deku (No Gear Shift)

2nd War Arc Jirou

Mirio with Nejire’s Energy Boosts

2nd War Arc Froppy

2nd War Arc Uraraka

Unbreakable Kirishima

Who comes out on top?
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I wanted to also discuss this again:

Tokoyami might just blitz Todoroki and the others. He scales to Prime AFO in speed since he can keep pace with his flight speed, and Prime AM characters are capable of blitzing Weakened AM characters. So, Tokoyami could blitz Todoroki and smash him into the ground before he could get the chance to activate Phosphor

The only real challenge he has is Full Body Cluster Bakugou I’d say
 
Also Bakugou would need to literally douse Tokoyami in light attacks to weaken him enough to the point where he wouldn’t be able to harm him. Even a non-darkness Tokoyami’s Ragnarok could shatter AFO’s mask (which was already slightly weakened but still a feat for him)
 
Mazdoesstuff said:
Snip
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No. If you hurt two characters with a single attack, that doesn't make you 2X their stats. Why would that make her 2X higher?

If she had stopped an combined attack from them with one attack, I can see the logic there. But that isn't what happened. Probably wouldn't be accepted either.

Also she unleashed two attacks, one from each hand, that brought down the 8-B+ villains. She didn't even one shot them or massively injured them.

You must be on a Dark Shadow phase it seems. I'm going to ignore that discussion.
 
Mapl3Sy4up said:
AFO was mostly in perfect condition other than his mask being broken
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That the mask was broken IS treated as a big issue for AFO post kamino, that was the "big" plan of the heroes against him in Gunga mountain, and afo himself says that he can barely move without his mask

Probably AFO would have been able to get rid of enji if he still had his mask
(((That's ignoring all the time it took endeavor to get back up while the others broke AFO's mask, in a real 1v1 Endeavor wouldn't have had all that time))
 
Ultimate_Invader_Pendulum said:



That the mask was broken IS treated as a big issue for AFO post kamino, that was the "big" plan of the heroes against him in Gunga mountain, and afo himself says that he can barely move without his mask

Probably AFO would have been able to get rid of enji if he still had his mask
(((That's ignoring all the time it took endeavor to get back up while the others broke AFO's mask, in a real 1v1 Endeavor wouldn't have had all that time))
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AFO was nerfed twice just for Endeavor to win.

1. The mask broken impaired his motor functions. He couldn't even move his hands properly and was basically in a semi-paralyzed state.

2. His quirks started rebelling so he couldn't even use them properly.
 
Mazdoesstuff said:
Regardless tho Prime AM characters cannot oneshot Weakened AM level characters

Bakugou simply cannot oneshot Todoroki
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What feat put phosphor shoto durability above cluster bakugo? I still think shoto will null bakugo in a fight since speed are most likely always equalised here.

Bakugo oneshotting shoto just ain't happening as of now.
 
Mazdoesstuff said:
I wanted to also discuss this again:

Tokoyami might just blitz Todoroki and the others. He scales to Prime AFO in speed since he can keep pace with his flight speed, and Prime AM characters are capable of blitzing Weakened AM characters. So, Tokoyami could blitz Todoroki and smash him into the ground before he could get the chance to activate Phosphor

The only real challenge he has is Full Body Cluster Bakugou I’d say
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Shoto doesn't need to activate phosphor beat tokoyami. Infact a casual fire blast from shoto would be more than enough incapacitate tokoyami. Also, phosphor is a bright light. So unless tokoyami now has resistance to light he most definitely isn't beating todoroki and neither is he blitzing him.

Tokoyami weakness is a general knowledge since lots of people watch the sf and shoto and bakugo has already countered him once.
 
For real: we don't really know what Prime AFO's flight speed is, so we can't just scale off from that.

In fact there is a lot we don't know about Prime AFO, even until now. So we can at most barely scale characters fighting him in speed and power, and even then it's obvious that Prime AFO is still a fair bit stronger than any of them.
 
Metalballrun said:
For real: we don't really know what Prime AFO's flight speed is, so we can't just scale off from that.

In fact there is a lot we don't know about Prime AFO, even until now. So we can at most barely scale characters fighting him in speed and power, and even then it's obvious that Prime AFO is still a fair bit stronger than any of them.
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People are just making assumptions. Unlike Shigaraki, there is no way to know AFO's speed unless:
1. He uses recognizeable quirks whose speed is known
2. His speed is compared to someone else
etc
AFO's stats depend on whatever quirks he has active at any given moment. We won't suddenly say his physical durability is sword level/below his mask just cause he didn't use a defensive quirk to tank Hawk's sword that one time.

Right now we don't even know what quirks he is using to fly of particularly how fast those quirks were. It is also possible he can stack even more quirks for higher speed than he is currently using like for example adding Air Canon as propulsion while flying or something like Hood's jet thruster quirk.
 
This Prime AFO is > Weakened AFO. (Can't say what his flight speed is though)

This speed is his "top" speed unless stated otherwise. (That he's moving slower than his top speed for whatever reason while he dying due to his time limit)

We aren't saying AFO can go higher because you believe he's faster. We need the series to reveal he can go faster.

I can't say what his flight speed is, but he should be going as fast as he reasonably can. Also I don't believe we have any reason to assume his flight speed is comparable to All Might's travel speed. His combat and reaction speed would scale, but his flight speed is something different.
 
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TheRustyOne said:
This Prime AFO is > Weakened AFO. (Can't say what his flight speed is though)

This speed is his "top" speed unless stated otherwise. (That he's moving slower than his top speed for whatever reason while he dying due to his time limit)

We aren't saying AFO can go higher because you believe he's faster. We need the series to reveal he can go faster.

I can't say what his flight speed is, but he should be going as fast as he reasonably can. Also I don't believe we have any reason to assume his flight speed is comparable to All Might's travel speed. His combat and reaction speed would scale, but his flight speed is something different.
Click to expand...
We can probably add his flight speed is the same as Shigarakis at the end of the star and stripes battle

I actually calculated that somewhere in this thread
 
Spinoirr said:
We can probably add his flight speed is the same as Shigarakis at the end of the star and stripes battle

I actually calculated that somewhere in this thread
Click to expand...
This is the type of scaling I don't agree with. Shigaraki and AFO are using completely different abilities. Shigaraki used the winged Nomu's quirk to fly so he should only be as a fast as that winged Nomu.

I believe the individual powers themselves should be used to scale rather than assuming 2 characters have the same speed just because they are top tiers when they are using completely different abilities.
 
Gitagon said:
Right now we don't even know what quirks he is using to fly of particularly how fast those quirks were. It is also possible he can stack even more quirks for higher speed than he is currently using like for example adding Air Canon as propulsion while flying or something like Hood's jet thruster quirk.
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It’s Occam’s Razor: safest to assume AFO is moving at his top speed unless stated otherwise
 
This is also why I despise the argument that we can’t assume AFO has any feats in base form and that we need to consistently assume that he is using quirks

If we don’t physically see any quirks active or AFO doesn’t name drop his quirks, it’s safest to assume that is his natural power

Also AFO stacks so many quirks on top of one another that it’s safe to assume that he is moving at flight speeds comparable to his combat speed
 
Which characters do you guys wanna see die in the war?

I’d be interested in seeing Kirishima, Iida or Aoyama die. Moreso the first two
 
Mazdoesstuff said:
Which characters do you guys wanna see die in the war?

I’d be interested in seeing Kirishima, Iida or Aoyama die. Moreso the first two
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Gran torino, he has lived out his purpose and shouldn't still be alive to begin with. Just shows a random panel where he flatlines or falls down a flight of stair and ill be happy.
 
Mazdoesstuff said:
Which characters do you guys wanna see die in the war?
Click to expand...
Personally? An alive character can tell more stories than a dead character (Even if you do nothing with them). I don't hate character death, I just find little reason in going down that path. I'm talking in a meta sense, not saying Hawks shouldn't have killed Twice or Shiggy shouldn't have killed Star.

In universe it's fine. And I think MHA current way of killing off characters is fine for the most part, sans Nighteye. Who I feel like could've had a much bigger impact than he initially got, without changing much. Twice is death honestly the "best" death so far, it's not just for pointless shock value or meaningless drama. Neji

Twice was a game changer, and the series wouldn't be where it is now if he was still alive. While I would've preferred Star living, there was no in universe way that Shiggy wasn't killing her. Similar to Twice, she was too big of a game changer. However her biggest issue was not having the same story presence as Twice.

Which is a completely different issue.

There are some characters who have to die, even if them being alive tells more stories. Someone like AFO is going to die and in fact has to die, and I won't mind it whatsoever. Dabi is similar but for a different reason, he's going to die, but I'd like to see the conclusion of the Todoroki family as a whole.

It'd be annoying if he died the same as he "lived" as Dabi. I'd also dislike Endeavor dying either, personally and for meta reasons. Dabi can't kill Endeavor and I don't see Dabi dying with nothing changing about him. Shoto still needs to come back as well, his role isn't done yet. I hope Horikoshi hasn't benched him.

I can see Endeavor think about many sacrificing himself, only for Shoto to snap him out of it. But Dabi is likely going to find some kind of peace before he passes.
MHA needs to keep the same "spirit" it always have, even when it gets dark. It can't break from those roots, so character death should follow the series main theme.

Tropes are not bad or good. Death isn't a good thing or a bad thing, it depends on how it's executed. And the characters you mention have no good way of dying beyond cheap shock value and meaning drama to make things look bad. There's a reason why fake out deaths are common in Shonen, even if you dislike them.
 
TheRustyOne said:
Personally? An alive character can tell more stories than a dead character (Even if you do nothing with them). I don't hate character death, I just find little reason in going down that path. I'm talking in a meta sense, not saying Hawks shouldn't have killed Twice or Shiggy shouldn't have killed Star.
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I see wym but I think a conclusion can tie a character together, they don’t need to keep on going

Like Bakugou’s conclusion was perfect imo. No need for him to be revived, it was executed really well
 
Kingofwolves999 said:
I am once again asking for you to volunteer if we are putting Faux 100% at Sub-Rel+ or not if we’re having Nagant’s bullets at 2.8% SoL
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IDK. Have to wait for the CRT. We can't even say if they're being upgraded to High 6-C or Sub-Rel, it's only a possibility. I'll mention the speed, but can't say if it'll happen.

There will be some upgrades, unless something goes horribly wrong, but where they'll end up is anyone's guess.
 
Mazdoesstuff said:
This is also why I despise the argument that we can’t assume AFO has any feats in base form and that we need to consistently assume that he is using quirks

If we don’t physically see any quirks active or AFO doesn’t name drop his quirks, it’s safest to assume that is his natural power

Also AFO stacks so many quirks on top of one another that it’s safe to assume that he is moving at flight speeds comparable to his combat speed
Click to expand...
No one is denying that AFO can be a tank on his own, but feat-wise and statements support the fact that AFO is as strong as he is because of his stockpiled Quirks. Hawks made it a point that AFO doesn't have the same natural durability Shigaraki has IIRC.

It's simply the fact that there isn't much point trying to determine his base stats, so his stats is just always compounded with his Quirks. That's how a lot of other MHA profiles are treated.

A lot of strength-enhancing Quirks don't manifest visually, and we see AFO name multiple quirks enhanhing pretty much everything in his arsenal during his fight with All Might. He had 4x Kinetic Boosters which directly boosts his AP and 3x Strength Enhancers which directly enhances his physical strength.

Also, it's not that that isn't possible, but AFO's flight speed being equal to his combat speed is still debatable. Even 45% Deku doesn't appear to be able to travel as fast as he could in short bursts during combat, AFAIK.
 
Kingofwolves999 said:
I am once again asking for you to volunteer if we are putting Faux 100% at Sub-Rel+ or not if we’re having Nagant’s bullets at 2.8% SoL
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We should just ignore calc-stacking standards so that Faux 100% is 50% SoL

But yeaahhh there is gonna be some serious discussions about Lady Nagant's bullet and the scaling of that lol. There is a lot to unpack with how it scales especially since she was sniping Deku from 3km vs sniping Shigaraki from 200km away. The differentials between these two instances have to be disected.
 
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Bruh said:
And if we are using this version of the Intercontinental Cruise Punch, who can we upscale to High 6-C+?
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I'm confident in saying the single missile scaling isn't happening. So that isn't something you need to worry about.
 
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