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Mewtwo, Mew, and Legendary Bird Trio Upgrade

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^ Its very possible they may be getting yet another upgrade, since Gothitelle has a 4-A feat in her dex and Mewtwo should scale to her.
 
Likely because the Pokedex stated that Gothitelle could condense space across thousands of lightyears, as "Starry skies from thousands of lightyears away are visible because of the space it condenses", and another dex entry stated that it's Psychic power is so great that it allows Gothi to condense space and distort reality.

And the fact that Mewtwo should be vastly superior to Gothitelle.
 
The key point here is that he should be, which makes this seem like a massive outlier for either Mewtwo or both of them.
 
It wouldn't be Mewtwo's outlier regardless, since it's not his feat, but it is very likely to be an outler, or just plain hax, on Gothitelle's part.
 
That was what I thought, too. As specific and straightforward the feat was.

I think 7-C Magikarp and 6-B Diglett are weird enough. We don't need 4-A gothitelle.
 
How is Gothitelle's feat an outlier? The anime showcases her dex entry's feat literally and she's never struggled with anything lower than 4-A. I dont get how it can be outlierish.
 
Why should we assume that? Heck the Gothitelle that did the feat didnt show any struggling of any kind.

Actually to be quite honest she didnt even struggle doing the feat period. at 4:25 here Gothitelle created her world of memories just by her psybeam coming in contact with Ash's snivy- https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nUwsXu18JGA

And despite only keeping them away from the bridge Gothitelle was quite handily owning Ash and co. without any problems whatsoever

I just dont understand how it can be an outlier unless someone can give me a really good explaination.
 
Roshi's moon busting is an outlier because stronger characters like King Piccolo showcased feats that were no where near moon busting level.

When has a stronger psychic type than Gothitelle come up in the verse and struggled with something lower than 4-A?
 
... Constantly? The fact that Gothitelle did it casually doesn't mean anything when, even when you merge continuities, Mewtwo (who is vastly superior to Gothitelle)'s best feat is only Dwarf Star level, which is ridiculously below 4-A.

The fact that Gothitelle's feat is casual only makes it more of a ridiculously obvious outlier.
 
Because it exists. It's vastly, VASTLY above any Pokemon who doesn't end or start with a, despite the fact that there are not only other legendaries, but other normal Pokemon that are above it in the Pokemon hierarchy.
 
Promestein said:
even when you merge continuities
The fact that Gothitelle's feat is casual only makes it more of a ridiculously obvious outlier.
Click to expand...
MD is non canon to the anime so I dont see why any lower showings in un official material makes this feat invalid. We are talking about Anime Gothitelle where this feat from the dex is the only part of the franchise that even shows up. Why should we compare it to non canon continuities?
 
The real cal howard said:
despite the fact that there are not only other legendaries, but other normal Pokemon that are above it in the Pokemon hierarchy.
Click to expand...
Anime, manga or game wise? Anime wise, Gothitelle has never lost to or has become inferior to any other "normal" pokemon at all. In fact it was beating back Ash and co.s pokemon very handily.
 
Anime4Life2020 said:
Roshi's moon busting is an outlier because stronger characters like King Piccolo showcased feats that were no where near moon busting level.
Click to expand...
(Cell Saga is High 4-C, the planet is fine)
 
It's definitely a legitimate feat. But it's still a HUGE outlier.

Like I said earlier, Large Country Diglett is weird enough. If we accept 4-A Gothi, then nobody is going to take us seriously. Yes, some of the new feats we've come across in the Pokefeats thread are pretty ludicrous, (Crossing my fingers that Porygon gets to Tier 7) but we need to show some restraint and draw the line somewhere. We didn't accept Large Star Level Gardevoir, so we shouldn't accept MSS Gothi, either.
 
(Cell Saga is High 4-C, the planet is fine)
Cell has KI control unlike King Piccolo who only has basic ki control at best. KP has even shown to struggle letting out energy levels vastly under moon level in the manga. Not the same thing as cell.
 
ArbitraryNumbers said:
It's definitely a legitimate feat. But it's still a HUGE outlier.
Click to expand...
I have no problems with it being listed as an outlier at all, my only issue is the reasoning

we cant just list any feat in general to be an outlier for no concrete reason, that will just make us look like not accepting feats or tiers for characters for "just because". No one has given me a concrete reason as to why Gothitelle's feat (which she didnt even struggle with) is outlierish when she has never done anything to make it outlierish.
 
Because of the fact that it would've killed everything by accident by now, especially considering how there's a whole species of them.

By the way. Gothitelle, and an elite four Gothitelle at that, struggled against Cynthia's Garchomp.
 
"MD is non canon to the anime so I dont see why any lower showings in un official material makes this feat invalid. We are talking about Anime Gothitelle where this feat from the dex is the only part of the franchise that even shows up. Why should we compare it to non canon continuities?" You do know that Mewtwo, outside of MD, is even LOWER than Dwarf Star Level, right?
 
And we're assuming that a verse filled with monsters with super natural abilities would get "killed by accident" because? It's not like our world.

In addition, it revealed in the Giratina movie that Giratina's reverse world keeps the main universe stable by taking in whatever nonsense happens in the humans world and then corrects it to maintain Time and Space. Whats stopping us from saying the effects that the world could get from Gothitelle's feat are just simply nullified by Giratina's reverse world?
 
ArbitraryNumbers said:


You do know that Mewtwo, outside of MD, is even LOWER than Dwarf Star Level, right?
Click to expand...
Arent the feats Mewtwo did outside MD casual ones? Not saying its anywhere near 4-A remotely but feat wise they werent anything close to Mewtwo's limit.
 
By the way. Gothitelle, and an elite four Gothitelle at that, struggled against Cynthia's Garchomp.

Oh right, i forgot about that.......

Tho didnt Cynthia's garchomp stop a Roar of Time from Dialga in the Sinnoh Saga? and also freed them from the Red Chain? Might be just PIS however.

But this is assuming that all Pokemon in trainer battles use their Dex abilities when fighting. And frankly it wouldnt make any sense for Gothitelle to show those kind of abilities it has from the dex in just a excibition match, which isnt even real just for show.
 
Ash also stopped a Gothitelle in the White (or Black) Victini movie. Also, the same movie implies that Reinculus is its equal by them being mirrored.
 
tbh Anime I'd have to agree that Gothitelle should either be downgraded or utterly deleted. The feat is a massive inconsistency and it really makes no sense that gothitelle is beyond Zygarde or any legendary... We just have to be careful with dex entries like this. Or it may end up with us not being able to make non-legendary pokemon files again.
 
For the Victini movie Gothitelle's only instruction by Damian was to keep Ash and Pikachu from coming near Victini while moving the Sword of the Vale. Not actually defeat them in battle. The only thing it did in the entire movie was use its psychic hax, not real AP. And Reinculus was refered to rival it?
 
The fact that Reinculus was its opposite in the movie seemed to imply that Reinculus was it's opposite. As for an rebuttal for your other response...

A verse filled with monsters which apparently even the revered ones and the ones who created Earth, control life and death, and make 40 day storms are trillions of times weaker than a tall grasser. If it were this powerful, why wouldn't Lysandre or AZ use the power of this? Why wouldn't Ghetsis use it to rule the world with an iron fist?

Because Giratina didn't nullify any of the other widescale events, like Mewtwo's planetary storm, Unown's reality warp, the capture of the birds. Heck. He didn't even nullify Palkia's and Dialga's fight and had to punish Dialga next movie.

@Dragon. Deleted is a little harsh. It still has hax that could be used to pit it against Sans or someone.
 
Dragonmasterxyz said:
snip
Click to expand...
I think in another thread they are suggesting to scale this towards stronger pokemon such as the legendaries or at least just psychic types like Mewtwo and what not. Zygarde would be an exception because it fought evenly with Mega Mewtwo Y and X in the manga (apparently).
 
. Heck. He didn't even nullify Palkia's and Dialga's fight and had to punish Dialga next movie.
Correction: Giratina isnt the one to nullifty it. The Reverse World itself nullifies it, Newton even admits this in the movie. Giratina doesnt need to do anything, the reverse world does it automatically as its whole purpose is to do that.

And yes the reverse world nullified them, thats why it got full of pollution clouds. You can even see them appear when Dialga and Palkia at least are fighting- 24:59 and foward https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dAUws6Hl5dA

Any disturbance in the real world creates them as he says. And its evident by the whole reverse world being filled with them. Hell thats the reason Giratina got mad at them in the first place...its home got filthy by supporting the real world, Dialga and Palkia's clash sped it up and from all the Pollution Giratina got pissed at them.
 
then it should've been chock full of holes after A Gothitelle being in simple battles. Let alone a whole species of them. A ton of holes got formed from Zero iirc. A supposedly 4-A species would make the Distortion World poison cloud utopia.
 
Well considering Gothitelle wasnt even a thought until Gen 5 and that we're talking about a whole universe such as Giratina's, its either highly possible or doubtful. And we're assuming a Pokemon uses its dex entry powers in every single battle it goes in, including excibition matches which makes no sense at all. A pokemon can freely choose to use its dex abilities in a battle or not, especially if they have no reason to use something that strong in the first place.
 
You're not aware how big the 4-B gap is, and combine that with all of tier 5 and the high 6-A gap. Gothitelle can't even turn off its Future Sight to keep itself from learning it's trainer's lifespan.
 
Good points. But we also have to remember that Giratina = The reverse world as one and the same and Giratina is vastly superior to any Pokemon outside its own tier by beyond light years. Even Dialga and Palkia (also vastly superior pokemon by infinite margins) only produced like a dozen pollution clouds at best in the Reverse World, which didnt show any sign of being disperseable or destroyed by the clashing of Time and Space as a whole. All they really did to piss Giratina off was increase the rate of pollution clouds being made. So If it can survive a full on battle by Universe+ to Multi Universe level pokemon of its own tier without any issues (except having a dirty home xD) im pretty sure the entire Gothitelle population combined and more wouldnt be able to do anything close to threatening.
 
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