Medaka Kurokami vs. Funny Valentine (a.k.a. "Lapitus' unintentional surprise")

[TheJ-ManRequiem]

So angry. I was just trying to speak your language J-Man, I thought it might make it easier for you to understand ovo. You can't even take a joke apparently.

Admins are people too. And when people insult them in redneck speech, it wears on the nerves.

You're a real asshole monarch. I'm out.

 

[Monarch_Laciel]

I said I apologise. My words were unbecoming.

 

[DodoNova2]

Ok thank you,

• Medaka is Bloodlust? ok but I really do not think she uses AF directly she will do her usual tactics until she decides to AF
• Well About AF bringing back of the erasure, the explanation is correct, technically AF user can come back from the erasure but it seems BS since no one has been erased from MB and no feat
• Regarding Paradox, I honestly think that to kill an AF user, you need Bust the Timeline (bust Past, present and Future prevents the manipulation of causality from being activated because of massive paradox generated) but in our case it is not the case
• From what I read from MB she could possibly copied, she can copied Ajimu skill and ability she sees or hears about

 

[Monarch_Laciel]

Medaka isn't bloodlusted, which is why she won't af from the start.

Menger sponge paradoxes aren't past present future paradoxes, just so you know

 

[Monarch_Laciel]

Personally, I'm not arguing AF will bring her back from erasure seeing as that is questionable.

I'm arguing that upon seeing D4C use it's power, she will gain its powers herself - including the power to dimension hop back if he BFRs her, and the power to not be affected by Menger sponges. And there go his only win conditions .

 

[DodoNova2]

Menger sponge paradoxes aren't past present future paradoxes, just so you know

Oh okay so I will go with medaka but it seems that votes are a total mess in this thread so ....

 

[Firephoenixearl]

@DodoNova2 Medaka is not bloodlusted here. If she were she instantly opens with All Fiction (bloodlusted means the character will open with their best shot right off the bat, usual strategies are only in character)

Stands are stands, abilities are abilities. The world is a stand, all it does is freaking time stop, prove that time stop can't be copied.

Existence Erasure works since again don't forget that All Fiction isn't erased and Kumagawa was named "invincible" in verse.

Paradox doesn't require busting the timeline, just preventing an action: Cause (my mom was killed) Effect (i don't exist). Erase the cause and he's just golden, every action is being erased in the past (no matter how close it's still the past and treated as cause), if someone stops existing there IS a cause. You killed my mom therfore i never existed, wrong because u never did kill my mom.

And about copying yeah, The End is 1 of the strongest power mimicries in all of anime, learning something just by knowing about their existence is broken beyond sense.

 

[PaChi2]

Medaka via unrestricted The Hero

 

[Firephoenixearl]

Medaka via unrestricted The Hero

What was the point of the fight then?

 

[PaChi2]

What was the point of the fight then?

Showing that Medaka is the ultimate hero.

 

[Firephoenixearl]

Showing that Medaka is the ultimate hero.

Ok

 

[PaChi2]

 

[Mr._Common_Sense]

1. Medaka option of copying the abilities isn't out the questions.

2. I know there can only be one stand per user, but Medaka also manifesting her own stand isnt out the question either. So for those really knowledgeable about the series please correct me if I am wrong.


Stands are defined as personifications of "life energy" whose abilities are given visual form. A Stand can also represent the manifestation of an individual's innate "fighting spirit" and embodies, to an extent, the individual's psyche. However, Stands may also derive through the exploration of possibilities and expression of the mind, in which case, only a large amount of mental strength is required.

Beyond that definition, Stands present themselves in a large variety of forms and with different behaviors, if they are sentient at all. They follow a loose set of rules that are regularly broken, and there is no real standard by which one can fully classify Stands. As an embodiment of someone's psyche, Stands are therefore as varied as human minds can be. Also, Stands are not limited to humans. Please correct me but didnt Jotaro pet rat also get a Stand?

3. Medaka manifesting her own stand doesnt seem to far especially with The End. For those that argue against Medaka cant copy what she cant see. I like you to remember that Medaka was able to copy an ability called the Unknown Hero: An ability copied from Hinokage that prevents Medaka's foes from noticing her presence unless she wills it. Even then, if she wishes herself to remain hidden, no one, not even those as observant as her, will be able to acknowledge her presence. Medaka does have her own way of already becoming invisible.

 

[Mr._Common_Sense]

Also it should be know few people in MB are already aware of JoJo verse. So Medaka copying abilities or her manifesting her own stand especially is much closer.


Proof about Anshin'in used to reference to JoJo

 

[DMB_1]

So what are the votes?

 

[Kisaragi_Megumi]

Firstly it was 7-1 for FunFun and Medaka,but then Monarch said most of FunFun vote are not valid and yadda yadda.......and now i'm lost counting the current vote.....

 

[Thesolidsnakex]

Again, not too well informed about Medaka Box in general, by why can't a minus be erased? It's just a negative abnormality, I see no reason for All Fiction to stick around with Medaka after she's been obliterated from existance. If she's been stabbed, and she dies, All Fiction activates automatically because the minus still resides within her. Even if she's been vaporized, you could argue that she's technically just taken a change in form and All Fiction still exists. But if she is literally given the boot from existance, in what form can All Fiction activate? She has no spirit, no body, no nothing.

The only restriction on stands is to actually have a soul, as the narrator described Iggy when he was dying as having a soul because he had a stand, which is just a manifestation of your soul. We've seen birds, rats and cats with stands. It's possible she can copy D4C (as we've seen two of the same stands before, in the case of Ratt ) and use it against him, so not out of the question. Then again, how does that benefit her? She still can't beat Love Train, and the only person paradox doesn't apply to is Valentine, but we're never told why, so she should still be vulnerable to paradox.

I'll go ahead and re-vote Valentine because of paradox being able to kill her.

 

[Firephoenixearl]

"Why can't a minus be erased?" How am i even supposed to answer that? They tried twice to erase a minus it didn't work. They just won't be erased, that's fact, that is not a logical conclusion, it's just something they have.

1. Once Medaka copies D4C is gg no matter how u slice it, Medaka just becomes a much stronger character.

2. Medaka CAN bypass love train with causality erasure (erasing a cause in the past won't be redirected unless u have proof it redirects hax that erase past events)

3. Paradox is useless as i've explained many times, as well as the fact that once she copies D4C she'll do the dimenssional hopping herself.

Medaka just takes this man, she wins against HAD ffs.

 

[Rikimarox2]

Basically, Resistance To Existence Erasure.

 

[Thesolidsnakex]

1. No because now she has a stronger D4C... Okay? How is that supposed to get past Love Train? His strength at 120% isn't infinite so the fake D4C is still widely useless.

2.Anything that isn't beneficial to Valentine will get redirected into someone else's misfortune. So she can erase anything she wants, but the moment it involves Valentine and his barrier it will be negated. Even past scars and damage were removed from his body.

3. Explain how you think it is useless one more time, too many opinions atm.

Also can I get contextra and maybe more scans on them talking about erasing a minus? They just said it has always been wrong, not that they can't be erased.

 

[Firephoenixearl]

1. She becomes Funny Valentine (gets all his skills at 120%) and also has her own skills.

2. Again reality overwrite fuked him over, so no. And you need to show proof it can reflect reality overwrites. Also GER dude, GER (and everyone else that affected him). And let's not forget "it has been ******* on before by AP alone", Scar Dead passively 1 shots it.

3. She gets erased, she comes back. It's useless on many levels. 1 is that i just mentioned, 2 is that she copies D4C and just hops dimensions herself preventing the paradox from happening at all. 3. Puts Encounter in front of her to stop the 2 medaka's from clashing. There are too many ways to prevent the paradox from happening.

And about that they said "a minus that's been wrong since the begining is something u can't make never happened" (every minus is wrong since the beginning, and never happened is more than just simple existence erasure, it's erasure from every timeline).

 

[Tincan123]

You guys should stop debating this and start voting for the best President,

 

[Thesolidsnakex]

1. In character, when has she ever stolen someone's entire skills and identity? Why use it now if shes not bloodluted?

2. EoH is non canon, they are two different characters. This isn't composite Valentine, this is SBR Valentine. It hasn't been beaten by anything other than infinite rotation, and from the way we've been told it works, seems like the case.

3. She gets erased, donzo. Until I see more scans about a minus not being able to be erased i refuse to believe it. It could be true, but that single scan is too vague IMO.

Agree to disagree, I guess.

 

[Dienomite22]

@Firephoenixearl 1.No, at most she would get D4C she would not get Love Train.

2. Love Train has never been ******* on by AP, that is a lie. The attack that ******* on him was durability negating and could bypass Love Train's infinite dimensional barrier then spins a target infinitely. Why did you mention GER?Also, Stop referencing non-canon material aka Eyes of Heaven.

She is not getting past Love Train, she has no abilities to do so and she is not copying Love Train either. This match is inconclusive in my eyes.

 

[EdwardSuoh]

Are we not counting her plot manipulation? Cause she has that in droves.

 

[Dienomite22]

Plot manipulation won't do anything if she has nothing that can get past her opponent's defense

 

[EdwardSuoh]

Hasn't stopped her before. She beat Ihiko along with 98 other opponents at the end of the series even when Ihiko's power neutralizes all her abnormalities and minuses.

 

[Dienomite22]

Not an actual battle that we were supposed to take seriously considering he stomped her before, it was just a send-off for the series nearing it's end.

 

[EdwardSuoh]

I don't know, she was sweating and covered in bruises and cuts.

 

[EdwardSuoh]

Also she has a habit of stomping people way above her once the next arc comes around (see the members of Class Thirteen)

 

[Dienomite22]

This wasn't a new arc, it was a send-off to the series. Either way, there needs to be proof that she can bypass an infinite dimensional barrier that redirects misfortune leaving only the good fortune and nullify attacks.

Plot manipulation only helps if the character has methods to beat the opponent or the opponent has exploitable PIS which isn't the case here.

 

[Mr._Common_Sense]

@Dienomite22

What?? Plot manipulation does not work like that at all. Plot Manipulation is the ability to control the plot itself. Examples include altering the plot, creating/destroying stories, changing speech bubbles, changing the setting, etc.

The fact that Funny Valentine died in the plot of the process for the JoJo story shows he doesn't have resistance nor is immune to plot manipulation. Unless, you have definte proof of Funny have resistance or immunity make a CRT.

Other than that Medaka's plot will effect him. Either way majoirty of Medaka's plot come from The Hero, which is restricted because it will make it a stomp in her favor.

 

[Dienomite22]

@Mr.Common Sense, I was referring to Medaka Box's plot manipulation, of course there is more stuff to plot manipulation than what I said. The point was you can't come up with a scenario where Medaka could bypass Love Train even with The Hero because she doesn't have abilities to bypass it. Sure The Hero makes the story work in her favor but it wouldn't give her some sort of hax to bypass Love Train. Whether or not Funny has resistance to plot manipulation isn't even a point I was trying to make.

 

[Firephoenixearl]

"Won't make her bypass love train" Really lol? Base Medaka without hax but with The Hero stomps Ajimu, now guess what Medaka full power stomps with The Hero. There is a reason it is usually restricted.

About Love Train "YOU HAVE TO HAVE PROOF", u guys need to have proof that it can redirect past events. Encounter is = to Love Train by that logic, it can redirect bad fortune aswell so yeah Encounter beats All Fiction cus Encounter pushes the death of his mom to someone else, so he trades moms with someone else so his mom becomes their mom and then since the cause is still not erased it will keep erasing moms passively......... GG. Srsly show proof that it can redirect 1.hax that bypass durability such as All Fiction and Bookmaker 2. Hax that affect cause and effect 3. Hax that overwrite reality 4. Hax that affect past events (unless u give me proof that LT can redirect ALL of those 4 then Medaka stomps hard, and this time i don't need ur sweet talk but show me scans or scenes where he does do that). Srsly this Jojo wank is OP af, someone resists time stop they give him infinite speed, someone redirects some bfr or some bullshit they give him 2-C+ redirection of literally EVERYTHING.

 

[Iapitus_The_Impaler]

(unless u give me proof that LT can redirect ALL of those 4 then Medaka stomps hard, and this time i don't need ur sweet talk but show me scans or scenes where he does do that). Srsly this Jojo wank is OP af, someone resists time stop they give him infinite speed, someone redirects some bfr or some bullshit they give him 2-C+ redirection of literally EVERYTHING.

Dude calm the crap down. Talk like this is how you get warned or banned

 

[Monarch_Laciel]

the only person paradox doesn't apply to is Valentine, but we're never told why, so she should still be vulnerable to paradox.

It's pretty obvious why the paradox doesn't affect him. He's the one with D4C

And once Medaka has its powers, she won't be affected either

 

[Kisaragi_Megumi]

I agree with Ia here,just calm your attitude Fire.

 

[Firephoenixearl]

Dude calm the crap down. Talk like this is how you get warned or banned

I didn't insult anyone or did anything, i just showed why i dislike this wank. No proof but LT can bypass All Fiction....really now?

Though yeah i did get pretty heated up (they brought up the same things with no facts too many times), im sorry.

 

[Firephoenixearl]

1. She does it passively, bloodlusted or "wanting to make friends" she copies skills passively. And why would she copy D4C but not Love Train @Dienomite?

2.GER is said to be the strongest stand in Canon from what i remember so if GER trumps Love Train then All Fiction stomps too.

3. I already gave u a scan with "2" proofs in it. Recheck it "i was told by Emuake long ago that a minus is something u can't make never happened" when he bypassed a girl that turns any attack into nothing (erases an attack from existence cus confront and nothing have similar kanji). And there is a flashback scene right next to that where Kumagawa failed to erase Emuake's minus Raff Raffesia. Those are the 2 scenes ppl tried to erase a minus and it failed both times.

And again why can't Medaka copy Love Train? There are too many ways for Medaka to take this, Medaka wins. The End is not something Jojo can deal with.

 

[Dienomite22]

@Firephoenixearl

Ajimu a being unknown in power and who may or may not have taken Ihiko or Medaka seriously.Ajimu is a fat question mark in what she is truly capable of and shouldn't be used to compare to other characters in the verse.Also Ajimu doesn't have Love Train.

1.All Fiction is physical, the thing that it does after being in contact with something bypasses durability and so it could very well get destroyed by trying to bypass Love Train's barrier and even if it could touch the barrier it would need to be able to erase (or whatever) infinite barriers along and resist Love Train negating it.

2.3.Depends if the hax is physical.

4.Don't get what this even means, don't remember All Fiction affecting past events, unless your talking about All Fiction erasing everyone's memories of Shiranui which isn't affecting past events, fill me in on what your talking about.