Kuroki Gensai vs Yoriichi Tsugikuni

[Deceived3596]

More Kenganverse vs Demon Slayer since these seem to be popular and people want me to keep making them so i'll happily oblige these request.

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SBA
Speed Equalized
AP of both characters.
Kuroki Gensai: 400 Tons, Higher with Devil Lance, Scaling Chain:
Yoriichi Tsugikuni: At least 217.96 Tons, Scaling Chain: Tanji > Akaza >>> Kaigaku ~ Zenitsu

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Vs

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Kuroki Gensai: LordGinSama

Yoriichi Tsugikuni:

Yhwach:

 

[LordGinSama]

Will reply later!

 

[Nehz_XZX]

It might help to add the scaling chain to the OP. Yoriichi pretty much stomped Muzan and is at the top of his verse's scaling which should probably be mentioned.

 

[Deceived3596]

It might help to add the scaling chain to the OP. Yoriichi pretty much stomped Muzan and is at the top of his verse's scaling which should probably be mentioned.

I have no idea the scaling chains of each verse since i'm very ignorant of both.

So i'll need a scaling chain from someone and then i'll place it in the OP.

This goes for Kenganverse supporters as well for Kuroki.

 

[LordGinSama]

I'll be posting an in depth analysis of each character soon, AP is essentially irrelevant as neither character really focuses on sheer strength but rather skill and intelligence.

 

[Nehz_XZX]

I have no idea the scaling chains of each verse since i'm very ignorant of both.

So i'll need a scaling chain from someone and then i'll place it in the OP.

This goes for Kenganverse supporters as well for Kuroki.

Well, there is the scaling chain provided by the match between Ohma and Tanjiro:

"Tanji > Akaza >>> Kaigaku ~ Zenitsu"

Above Akaza are Doma and Kokushibo with it being said that Akaza couldn't possibly hope to defeat them and Kokushibo was in possession of the Transparent World (also known as See-Through World) ability that allowed Tanjiro to decapitate Akaza which he had for around 500 years. It is also implied that Kokushibo as a human was the second best swordsman of his generation of the Demon Slayer Corps with the best swordsman being Yoriichi. His generation was compared favorably to the generations of the Demon Slayer Corps in the 500 years after it.

Muzan has in turn this as his Attack Potency justification:

"Incomparably stronger than the Upper Moons. Even while weakened and aged, he easily held back Gyomei, Sanemi, Giyuu, Obanai, Mitsuri, Zenitsu, Inosuke, and Kanao at the same time and later one-shot all of them after getting serious"

The context for him being weakened and aged is a drug that aged him by 9000 years in 3-4 hours with said drug also inflicting gradual cellular destruction at a later point in time. Gyomei and Sanemi previously fought against Kokushibo and Gyomei and Obanai were capable of using Transparent World. All of the participants with Demon Slayer Marks with the exception of Mitsuri were also capable of using the Crimson Red Nichirin Blade.

Yoriichi stomped Muzan so hard that even 500 years later Muzan becomes afraid if he is reminded of Yoriichi with this effect being also present in demons with high concentrations of his blood. It also made Muzan avoid the Demon Slayer Corps for 500 years out of fear despite no one who was even close to being comparable to Yoriichi showing up in that time with him making efforts to find and kill everyone with the potential of using Sun Breathing. Muzan viewed Yoriichi as a monster due to his strength and used him as a reason to say that he himself isn't one.

 

[LordGinSama]

Okay now I'm ready and I can review this match properly.

Attack Potency & durability

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Okay so for both combatants, we have a scaling chain but Yoriichi has a higher chain scaling list, however Gensai takes AP via sheer virtue of scaling to a casual feat of Wakatsuki's which clocks in at 400 Tons, which is almost 2x the feat that Yoriichi scales to. So at worst they're even in terms of AP, otherwise Gensai should have the advantage here.

His strikes hit harder than the likes of Wakatsuki and Gaolang due to how reformed they are, so he's above >>> a casual Wakatsuki.


Now to add onto Gensai's AP, he also has moves that allow for a one shot such as The Devil Lance which can effortlessly maul comparable opponents.


In terms of durability, Gensai definitely takes it. Characters who scale to 400 tons, including Ohma with his restricted Advance can't break his bones due to the Vigorous training Gensai has from his Kaiwan Style Karate giving him nigh unbreakable bones and joints.



Skill

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Now this one is an interesting debate, I don't think Gensai can automatically skill stomp Yoriichi but his skill feats are notably above Yoriichi's.



The average Master in a discipline have 2 forms of Analytical Prediction, one that's based upon breathing and shifting of the eye lines and the breathing of the opponent. And they also have one that's based upon viewing the muscles, tendons and the center of gravity of the opponent's body. And a 17 Year Old Ohma could also use Prediction that contained X-Ray vision.


Then we have the ability "Foresight." which takes all of the lower level forms of Prediction from above into an entirely new league. Not only do they scale above the form of Prediction from above but they can now read up to 100 steps ahead, and that's for the Incomplete form. Gensai's scales above everything I've said thus far, but has the benefit of having a layered variant based on bypassing Kanoh's Formless Analytical Prediction resistance, which not even the Fist Eye can't comprehend and is stated to be unpredictable, and also predicting Demonsbane (Albeit with great focus.) which is even higher than Kanoh's Formless. Motionless also scales above Ohma's Asura Predictions, which allows Ohma to have imaginary fights with his opponents to familiarize himself with his opponents move-sets, and he's fought over 40'000 matches in this fashion. His level of Motionless is enough to be able to Predict Rei's fastest Raishin flash which blitzed everyone in the arena, including other users of Foresight.



He's also defeated people with mid difficulty who can perceive things in slow motion and predict attacks such as Kiryu Setsuna with his Fallen Demon. Matter of fact he literally limited himself to a ******* small circle and best the life out of Fallen Demon Kiryu.


He also scales above all the strikers in the series, such as Gaolang who stands at the pinnacle of striking and Gaolang himself also has feats of overpowering / countering people with Formless such as Kaneda (an incomplete user of Foresight which can predict 100 moves in advance.) and later Carlos Medel who's Foresight is on the level of Asura Gensai's. Gaolang being the same guy who can tango with Kanoh, who's the same guy who can copy your attacks, evolve mid battle and can create styles on the fly to counter anything his opponent has.



Speaking of Kanoh, he also beat Kanoh with upper mid difficulty, and this Kanoh was even more impressive given that Kanoh at this point fused his Formless and Martial Arts personas together.



Also due to how precise Gensai's blows are, they all ignore durability and cause rapid functional decline and a great decrease in blood flow. His strikes are so clean and refined that he can strike the likes of Kanoh who doesn't have a blind spot.


Much lesser skilled opponents such as the likes of Raian can skill stomp the likes of Alan Wu who had the Memories and personality of Wu Hei, who's been getting revived for the last 5000 years and killed demons and gods alike.



Endurance & stamina

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In terms of endurance and stamina, Gensai is comparable to Kanoh, a survivor of the Gu Ritual, a massive fight to the death of upwards to 1000 men which lasts for months. Kanoh killed everyone in the Gu Ritual before the 4 months, and was found by Metsudo weeks into the Ritual. So he scales to someone who can fight in massive battles to the death for weeks on end with no sleep.



Conclusion

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With everything being said, I believe Gensai should take this with similar difficulty to his bout with Kanoh, upper mid to high difficulty. He has an appropriate counter to all of Yoriichi's moveset, for breathing he can directly attacks organs, such as the lungs, and can decrease blood flow and cause functional decline, and that's with every blow. For See-Through-World, he'd likely have some issues at first with it especially given Yoriichi's usage of the ability, but alas Gensai has countered almost the same exact ability before. Yoriichi's resistance to Analytical Prediction and Information Analysis would be bypassed by Gensai's Motionless which has feats of bypassing much more potent forms of Analytical Prediction.


Voting Castle Kuroki the Impregnable Fortress.

 

[Nehz_XZX]

Okay now I'm ready and I can review this match properly.

Attack Potency & durability

---

Okay so for both combatants, we have a scaling chain but Yoriichi has a higher chain scaling list, however Gensai takes AP via sheer virtue of scaling to a casual feat of Wakatsuki's which clocks in at 400 Tons, which is almost 2x the feat that Yoriichi scales to. So at worst they're even in terms of AP, otherwise Gensai should have the advantage here.

His strikes hit harder than the likes of Wakatsuki and Gaolang due to how reformed they are, so he's above >>> a casual Wakatsuki.

Now to add onto Gensai's AP, he also has moves that allow for a one shot such as The Devil Lance which can effortlessly maul comparable opponents.

In terms of durability, Gensai definitely takes it. Characters who scale to 400 tons, including Ohma with his restricted Advance can't break his bones due to the Vigorous training Gensai has from his Kaiwan Style Karate giving him nigh unbreakable bones and joints.

Skill

---

Now this one is an interesting debate, I don't think Gensai can automatically skill stomp Yoriichi but his skill feats are notably above Yoriichi's.

The average Master in a discipline have 2 forms of Analytical Prediction, one that's based upon breathing and shifting of the eye lines and the breathing of the opponent. And they also have one that's based upon viewing the muscles, tendons and the center of gravity of the opponent's body. And a 17 Year Old Ohma could also use Prediction that contained X-Ray vision.

Then we have the ability "Foresight." which takes all of the lower level forms of Prediction from above into an entirely new league. Not only do they scale above the form of Prediction from above but they can now read up to 100 steps ahead, and that's for the Incomplete form. Gensai's scales above everything I've said thus far, but has the benefit of having a layered variant based on bypassing Kanoh's Formless Analytical Prediction resistance, which not even the Fist Eye can't comprehend and is stated to be unpredictable, and also predicting Demonsbane (Albeit with great focus.) which is even higher than Kanoh's Formless. Motionless also scales above Ohma's Asura Predictions, which allows Ohma to have imaginary fights with his opponents to familiarize himself with his opponents move-sets, and he's fought over 40'000 matches in this fashion. His level of Motionless is enough to be able to Predict Rei's fastest Raishin flash which blitzed everyone in the arena, including other users of Foresight.

He's also defeated people with mid difficulty who can perceive things in slow motion and predict attacks such as Kiryu Setsuna with his Fallen Demon. Matter of fact he literally limited himself to a ******* small circle and best the life out of Fallen Demon Kiryu.

He also scales above all the strikers in the series, such as Gaolang who stands at the pinnacle of striking and Gaolang himself also has feats of overpowering / countering people with Formless such as Kaneda (an incomplete user of Foresight which can predict 100 moves in advance.) and later Carlos Medel who's Foresight is on the level of Asura Gensai's. Gaolang being the same guy who can tango with Kanoh, who's the same guy who can copy your attacks, evolve mid battle and can create styles on the fly to counter anything his opponent has.

Speaking of Kanoh, he also beat Kanoh with upper mid difficulty, and this Kanoh was even more impressive given that Kanoh at this point fused his Formless and Martial Arts personas together.

Also due to how precise Gensai's blows are, they all ignore durability and cause rapid functional decline and a great decrease in blood flow. His strikes are so clean and refined that he can strike the likes of Kanoh who doesn't have a blind spot.

Much lesser skilled opponents such as the likes of Raian can skill stomp the likes of Alan Wu who had the Memories and personality of Wu Hei, who's been getting revived for the last 5000 years and killed demons and gods alike.

Endurance & stamina

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In terms of endurance and stamina, Gensai is comparable to Kanoh, a survivor of the Gu Ritual, a massive fight to the death of upwards to 1000 men which lasts for months. Kanoh killed everyone in the Gu Ritual before the 4 months, and was found by Metsudo weeks into the Ritual. So he scales to someone who can fight in massive battles to the death for weeks on end with no sleep.

Conclusion

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With everything being said, I believe Gensai should take this with similar difficulty to his bout with Kanoh, upper mid to high difficulty. He has an appropriate counter to all of Yoriichi's moveset, for breathing he can directly attacks organs, such as the lungs, and can decrease blood flow and cause functional decline, and that's with every blow. For See-Through-World, he'd likely have some issues at first with it especially given Yoriichi's usage of the ability, but alas Gensai has countered almost the same exact ability before. Yoriichi's resistance to Analytical Prediction and Information Analysis would be bypassed by Gensai's Motionless which has feats of bypassing much more potent forms of Analytical Prediction.

Voting Castle Kuroki the Impregnable Fortress.

Well, I guess I can give some details on Yoriichi since all I've explained is Yoriichi's scaling chain and LordGinSama only provided details for Gensai for the most part.

Attack Potency & durability

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Given that Yoriichi's scaling chain includes one-shots and stomps as well as a drug with pretty devastating effects that severely weakened Muzan I'm not inclined to view Yoriichi as being at a disadvantage in terms of Attack Potency here. There is a reason why his rating has an "At least" and a "likely higher". He does admittedly lack durability feats, so the only thing he has going for him there is the justification that it should be comparable to his Attack Potency and that he upscales from the feats of the marked Pillars which fought Muzan.

Skill

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Yoriichi cutting 1500 of the 1800 pieces of flesh into which Muzan scattered to escape from Yoriichi could be considered as a fairly impressive skill feat. While speed certainly played a role here Muzan's pieces weren't moving at a slow pace if Yoriichi saying that Muzan's body burst open with incredible force is any indication. Not only would he need to have the precision to cut the 1500 pieces he cut and that were presumably fleeing into every direction around him but he would also have needed the mental capacity to keep track and count all of them considering the fact that he was able to give numbers for them.

He also has an impressive ability to adapt and improvise which can be seen by how he teached others by modifying his Sun Breathing to suit the individual strengths of those he was teaching and how he quickly created a new technique against Muzan after understanding what his weaknesses were shortly after meeting him. Among the Breathing Styles Water, Moon, Flame, Thunder, Stone and Wind were directly derived from Yoriichi's Sun Breathing and with the exception of Moon continued to be passed down to the following generations for 500 years.

The fact that Yoriichi talked to Michikatsu (Kokushibo's name as a human) when they were seven about taking a really deep breath before you go to strike, the fact that he was born with his Demon Slayer Mark with a Demon Slayer Mark's appearance relating to the Breathing Style of the user and the fact that he taught the other demon slayers breaths because he noticed that nobody could use them unlike him which seems to have happened not long after he joined them make me inclined to think that Sun Breathing is just his natural way of breathing and that he wouldn't stop with it until he is completely incapable of breathing. He had little to no interest in swordsmanship after he tried it out for the first time, so he had no reason to develop Sun Breathing before he became a demon slayer.

Kiryu Setsuna's profile doesn't list Analytical Prediction for him and the scan LordGinSama provided for him predicting attacks seems to imply that he can simply dodge attacks due to being able to mentally process them faster due to Fallen Demon, so unless I'm missing something Transparent World which has Information Analysis, Analytical Prediction and the ability to directly view the opponent's muscles and blood flow on top of accelerating perception to the point where everything appears to move in slow motion should be superior to that especially since it comes so natural to Yoriichi that he needed to be told by someone else that other people can't do the same thing and it has no negative side effects for him.

Relevant here would be the fact Gensai doesn't have Resistance against Analytical Prediction listed and while he apparently knows the Adamantine Kata to some extent that only helps him against Yoriichi using his muscles to predict his movements and the fact that he only knows it to some extent according to his profile would imply that he would have more difficulty with effectively using it against Yoriichi than Ohma would have against Tanjiro though the fact that he has much better Analytical Prediction himself should help him. Either way the only aspect of Yoriichi's Analytical Prediction that he has a conceivable counter against that he could come up with during the fight after understanding how Yoriichi's Transparent World works would be the predictions based on his muscles which means that his movements and blood flow would still allow Yoriichi to predict him.

Aside from these things there is also the fact that Kokushibo was unable to reach Yoriichi's level of swordsmanship despite having vigorously trained his swordsmanship since he was a child and having become a demon in order to have enough time to catch up to Yoriichi. A battle doll designed for training demon slayers that was modelled after Yoriichi was given six arms and six katanas since two arms weren't even nearly enough to imitate Yoriichi's movements and said battle doll was vastly inferior to Yoriichi even with its 108 techniques. It's safe to assume that Yoriichi upscales in terms of skill from everyone else in the entirety of the Kimetsu no Yaiba verse.

Endurance & stamina

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Yoriichi has a feat of running for an entire day (this includes the night) as a seven years old child without feeling any fatigue or any prior training. He also upscales from every other character with finite stamina in his verse which includes training non-stop for a week without food or sleep and only a small amount of water from rain, hunting for 3 days, months of training that puts you on the verge of death and 5 hours of fighting in enemy territory against a large number of fairly powerful opponents. A stamina feat from when Yoriichi was 17 and that happened directly before he became a demon slayer is him absentmindedly embracing the corpses of his wife and unborn child for ten days with the implication that he did nothing else and therefore did that without food, water or sleep. Kokushibo met Yoriichi in his 80s and described him as not being any slower or weaker than he was in his prime with the only reason that Kokushibo survived the encounter being that Yoriichi died standing up from old age shortly before he could unleash a second blow.

Other things to consider

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It's probably worth mentioning that Yoriichi's extended meelee range with his sword is larger than Gensai's standard meelee range and Yoriichi's Breath Styles increase that range to several meters through shockwaves. Yoriichi also fights by default with a Crimson Red Nichirin Blade which emits heat that burns on a cellular level with the wounds that he inflicted on Muzan having continued to do so for 500 years despite Muzan's potent Regeneration. While Gensai has Resistance against Fire Manipulation I doubt that any ordinary flame has heat that can be considered comparable to what Yoriichi's blade emits.

 

[LordGinSama]

Well, I guess I can give some details on Yoriichi since all I've explained is Yoriichi's scaling chain and LordGinSama only provided details for Gensai for the most part.

That was done intentionally, if I were to also cover Yoriichi's stuff I'd be posting a massive wall of text. Plus I think it's more entertaining for you to cover Yoriichi's stuff.

Anyway I'll reply to this soon! Also great analysis.

 

[Nehz_XZX]

That was done intentionally, if I were to also cover Yoriichi's stuff I'd be posting a massive wall of text. Plus I think it's more entertaining for you to cover Yoriichi's stuff.

Anyway I'll reply to this soon! Also great analysis.

Is that so? Whatever.

Okay, it's good to know that I wrote something good.

 

[LordGinSama]

Attack Potency

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Like the aforementioned statement, Yoriichi upscales massively from 217+ tons with an impressive chain scaling, however as big as it may be, it isn't enough to quite match Gensai's AP, given Devil Lance's ability to one shot characters who scale to 400 tons.



In terms of durability, Ohma who has class M lifting strength using the Possessing Spirit is incapable of breaking Kuroki's bones, because of how much body training he went through his limbs have gotten strong enough to effortlessly gouge other 8-A characters (Kanoh, Ohma, etc.) his durability is enough to where Ohma broke fingers by hitting his forehead, and this durability also extends to his durability being high enough that him blocking results in damage being done to his attacker.


Skill

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As I pointed out, any master of Martial Arts in Kengan has the ability to view the activity of muscle movement, albeit they don't have the ability to view blood flow. However the Muscle viewing stuff applies everyone in the verse, as that's a verse rule for any master, and Kiryu is adept enough to skill stomp other Masters.



Also Kuroki has the Pinnacle of Foresight and is the Embodiment of Martial Arts, he scales above every Martial Artist in Asura.

However, the likes of BoS Ohma has enhanced senses good enough to hear the blood flow, breathing, and movement of joints while being poisoned and robbed of his Kinetic Vision. (His Kinetic Vision is stated to be extraordinary, being able to see the Flow of Power, and his hearing is just as good as his kinetic vision is. Matter of fact, his hearing is so good that he can somehow view the battlefield without the use of his sight, and his hearing is capable of working despite the opponent specifically forming counter measures to his sight and hearing.)


The Kure Clan have been performing selective breeding for the last 1300 years, there is no move that they cannot counter, can copy Techniques just by viewing them once.



Then we have the Wu Clan, the Chinese branch of the Kure Clan who's history dates back even further than the Kure Clan, dating back to 5000 years ago. The important part comes from an ability known as HuiSheng, a form of Memory / Soul based Resurrection. Using this, Wu Hei has managed to pass on his memories for the last 5000 years. Kure Raian is able to skill stomp the likes of Alan Wu while using HuiSheng, giving him direct access to Wu Hei's 5000 years of experience. Later on Raian goes onto fight 3 more users of HuiSheng, that being Eddie Wu, Fabio Wu and Solomon Wu, and Raian still managed to somewhat hold his own against all for a short amount of time.


His precision scales above the likes of Rei Mikazuchi, Hanafusa Hajime, Misasa and Nicolas Le Banner. Rei is accurate enough to strike dozens of pressure points instantly, Hajime is capable of targeting pressure points that can cause instant death or Paralysis, Misasa can do shit like this, and Nicolas can strike nerves so perfectly he can cause a poison like Paralysis inducement.


Speaking of the aforementioned characters, Rei is a master of the Raishin Style which has a history of 1200 years, out of these 1200 years of history only two people were able to reach "Oneness." that being Rei and his father. In the process of the Vigorous training, the user is placed under a strong hypnosis, which they must meditate through.


Misasa is an expert of unarmed combat, namely in the form of Silat, and out of Metsudo's body guards, Misasa is the best hand to hand combatant and excels in facing off against armed opponents, and fighting in tight spaces.


He's skilled enough to effortlessly stomping Yumi, who's an expert in copying techniques from different schools, all while the ring around them was being reduced in size smaller and smaller, with one of the rules being however even grazes outside the ring will be eliminated.



Jean (Nicolas.) was apart of the French Special Forces, who was serving with his friend Nicolas. During this time Nicolas ended up effortlessly killing everyone in his special forces unit, barring Jean with his bare hands. Jean then proceeded to kill Nicolas in hand to hand combat.


Oh also there's people like Muteba, who's capable of using the foot work of boxing Master's such as Gaolang who stated that Muteba has mastered it upon Muteba first trying it out. Muteba being the same man who can effortlessly solo entire groups of armed forces, all while being blind. His base senses are good enough to the point where he can predict attacks using all of his other senses, each of which grant the ability to predict and analyze the opponent. Later on in the tournament, Muteba gains "cybernetic eyes." which granted him 2 more forms of sensing in the form of Infrared Vision and Vibration sensing. (This is important as the surgery is meant to replicate the effects of Kinetic Vision, which Motionless scales above.)


While Gensai lacks the resistance to Analytical Prediction, he's fought opponents with comparable levels of Foresight, and while See-Through World is impressive I feel like that doesn't quite stack up to Ohma's Mental Prediction that we fought well over 40'000 of.


Endurance & stamina

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Not quite much to really add here, I've already posted all of Gensai's stuff, namely scaling above Ohma's Endurance where he can fight for 11 days on end with little to no rest or food, scales above Kanoh who can fight for weeks on end with no rest, little to no food or water and against a large sum of opponents.



Other things to consider

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Shockwaves and AoE aren't anything really new to Gensai, he's reacted to blows that cause shaking and shockwaves before, such as reflecting Kanoh's Dragon Shot which can do shit like this indirectly.


and scales above Hatsumi Sen who can dodge Bando's Arm Whips which can cause explosions. Crimson Red Nichirin Blades burning at a cellular level really isn't impressive given that normal fire already does that, hence why cauterization is possible. Kuroki was able to stand dead center in the middle of flames for 3 days and 3 nights all without obtaining any burns. I'd say Gensai definitely has enough resistance to make it so that Yoriichi's fire wouldn't be as effective as it usually is.

 

[LordGinSama]

Bump.

 

[Deceived3596]

Bump

 

[azontr]

I honestly think that Kuroki takes this pretty solidly.

There is not much that I can say that hasn't already been said by @LordGinSama, but, with how things are looking, a single hit from Kuroki is going to be doing major damage due to Kuroki's insane upscaling along with the very nature of the Devil Lance making it practically ignore durability.

I'd also like to note that See-Through World isn't going to really do much for Yoriichi since even if he outspeeds and predicts Kuroki, Kuroki can do the exact same, except it's layered, and Kuroki is no stranger to hitting faster opponents as shown here.

So yeah, throw my vote out there for Kuroki.

 

[azontr]

I'd also like to note, that if Yoriichi can even cut into Kuroki, he's most likely going to have his sword broken once he cuts down to the bone layer since not even Ohma could break his bones, and broke his fingers when trying to hit the man in the head.

Even when combining the Advance with Demonsbane, a technique that works to use the opponents' own force against them, he could only break Kuroki's arm, and that was when he was still injured from his fight with Kanoh.

 

[LordGinSama]

Bump

 

[Mapl3Sy4up]

Yoriichi Tsugikuni: At least 217.96 Tons, Scaling Chain: Tanji > Akaza >>> Kaigaku ~ Zenitsu

small correction, it’s Zenitsu~Kaigaku<<<Akaza<Tanjiro<<Doma<<<Kokushibo<<<Muzan<<<<<<<Yoriichi. He scales so far above that he’d casually one tap anyone in KnY without Muzan’s Regen. Add onto that he’s burning people on a cellular level.

It’s the same with skill, Yoriichi is so far above quite literally everyone in KnY that even after 480 years, while doing nothing except training, Kokushibo is still so many leagues below him that it still isn’t fathomable that they could fight fairly. That 13th form of sun breathing was made in less then a second specifically to perfectly kill one opponent and it would have worked if not for Muzan causing himself to go boom. His see through world is casually above those of the most powerful characters who have it in KnY. It’s this good while casual as a 7 year old child. Before he even trained for a minute.

Essentially yoriichi can probably easily clap the entire verse while having 100% focus reading a 3000 page novel, and eating dinner, while not having slept for a few Months.

 

[LordGinSama]

480 years

laughs in Wu

 

[Nehz_XZX]

small correction, it’s Zenitsu~Kaigaku<<<Akaza<Tanjiro<<Doma<<<Kokushibo<<<Muzan<<<<<<<Yoriichi. He scales so far above that he’d casually one tap anyone in KnY without Muzan’s Regen. Add onto that he’s burning people on a cellular level.

It’s the same with skill, Yoriichi is so far above quite literally everyone in KnY that even after 480 years, while doing nothing except training, Kokushibo is still so many leagues below him that it still isn’t fathomable that they could fight fairly.

That scaling chain in the OP links to my post which explains Yoriichi's scaling, so I assumed that Deceived merely copied Tanjiro's scaling chain from this thread and used my post for further clarification.

One thing that comes to my mind here is that Kokushibo wouldn't need to rest or sleep as a demon and would therefore be able to spend more time training in 480 years than a human who has immortality but is otherwise normal could which arguably makes this even more impressive.

 

[Mapl3Sy4up]

That scaling chain in the OP links to my post which explains Yoriichi's scaling, so I assumed that Deceived merely copied Tanjiro's scaling chain from this thread and used my post for further clarification.

One thing that comes to my mind here is that Kokushibo wouldn't need to rest or sleep as a demon and would therefore be able to spend more time training in 480 years than a human who has immortality but is otherwise normal could which arguably makes this even more impressive.

Pft, Man’s is the strongest upper Moon and yoriichi clapped him on a Sunday afternoon and didn’t kill him because he didn’t feel like it.

 

[azontr]

Laughs in Kure Clan's 1300 years of selective breeding and martial arts training

 

[LordGinSama]

Bump

 

[LordGinSama]

Bump.

 

[LordGinSama]

Bump

 

[Nehz_XZX]

Attack Potency

---

Like the aforementioned statement, Yoriichi upscales massively from 217+ tons with an impressive chain scaling, however as big as it may be, it isn't enough to quite match Gensai's AP, given Devil Lance's ability to one shot characters who scale to 400 tons.

In terms of durability, Ohma who has class M lifting strength using the Possessing Spirit is incapable of breaking Kuroki's bones, because of how much body training he went through his limbs have gotten strong enough to effortlessly gouge other 8-A characters (Kanoh, Ohma, etc.) his durability is enough to where Ohma broke fingers by hitting his forehead, and this durability also extends to his durability being high enough that him blocking results in damage being done to his attacker.

Skill

---

As I pointed out, any master of Martial Arts in Kengan has the ability to view the activity of muscle movement, albeit they don't have the ability to view blood flow. However the Muscle viewing stuff applies everyone in the verse, as that's a verse rule for any master, and Kiryu is adept enough to skill stomp other Masters.

Also Kuroki has the Pinnacle of Foresight and is the Embodiment of Martial Arts, he scales above every Martial Artist in Asura.

However, the likes of BoS Ohma has enhanced senses good enough to hear the blood flow, breathing, and movement of joints while being poisoned and robbed of his Kinetic Vision. (His Kinetic Vision is stated to be extraordinary, being able to see the Flow of Power, and his hearing is just as good as his kinetic vision is. Matter of fact, his hearing is so good that he can somehow view the battlefield without the use of his sight, and his hearing is capable of working despite the opponent specifically forming counter measures to his sight and hearing.)

The Kure Clan have been performing selective breeding for the last 1300 years, there is no move that they cannot counter, can copy Techniques just by viewing them once.

Then we have the Wu Clan, the Chinese branch of the Kure Clan who's history dates back even further than the Kure Clan, dating back to 5000 years ago. The important part comes from an ability known as HuiSheng, a form of Memory / Soul based Resurrection. Using this, Wu Hei has managed to pass on his memories for the last 5000 years. Kure Raian is able to skill stomp the likes of Alan Wu while using HuiSheng, giving him direct access to Wu Hei's 5000 years of experience. Later on Raian goes onto fight 3 more users of HuiSheng, that being Eddie Wu, Fabio Wu and Solomon Wu, and Raian still managed to somewhat hold his own against all for a short amount of time.

His precision scales above the likes of Rei Mikazuchi, Hanafusa Hajime, Misasa and Nicolas Le Banner. Rei is accurate enough to strike dozens of pressure points instantly, Hajime is capable of targeting pressure points that can cause instant death or Paralysis, Misasa can do shit like this, and Nicolas can strike nerves so perfectly he can cause a poison like Paralysis inducement.

Speaking of the aforementioned characters, Rei is a master of the Raishin Style which has a history of 1200 years, out of these 1200 years of history only two people were able to reach "Oneness." that being Rei and his father. In the process of the Vigorous training, the user is placed under a strong hypnosis, which they must meditate through.

Misasa is an expert of unarmed combat, namely in the form of Silat, and out of Metsudo's body guards, Misasa is the best hand to hand combatant and excels in facing off against armed opponents, and fighting in tight spaces.

He's skilled enough to effortlessly stomping Yumi, who's an expert in copying techniques from different schools, all while the ring around them was being reduced in size smaller and smaller, with one of the rules being however even grazes outside the ring will be eliminated.

Jean (Nicolas.) was apart of the French Special Forces, who was serving with his friend Nicolas. During this time Nicolas ended up effortlessly killing everyone in his special forces unit, barring Jean with his bare hands. Jean then proceeded to kill Nicolas in hand to hand combat.

Oh also there's people like Muteba, who's capable of using the foot work of boxing Master's such as Gaolang who stated that Muteba has mastered it upon Muteba first trying it out. Muteba being the same man who can effortlessly solo entire groups of armed forces, all while being blind. His base senses are good enough to the point where he can predict attacks using all of his other senses, each of which grant the ability to predict and analyze the opponent. Later on in the tournament, Muteba gains "cybernetic eyes." which granted him 2 more forms of sensing in the form of Infrared Vision and Vibration sensing. (This is important as the surgery is meant to replicate the effects of Kinetic Vision, which Motionless scales above.)

While Gensai lacks the resistance to Analytical Prediction, he's fought opponents with comparable levels of Foresight, and while See-Through World is impressive I feel like that doesn't quite stack up to Ohma's Mental Prediction that we fought well over 40'000 of.

Endurance & stamina

---

Not quite much to really add here, I've already posted all of Gensai's stuff, namely scaling above Ohma's Endurance where he can fight for 11 days on end with little to no rest or food, scales above Kanoh who can fight for weeks on end with no rest, little to no food or water and against a large sum of opponents.

Other things to consider

---

Shockwaves and AoE aren't anything really new to Gensai, he's reacted to blows that cause shaking and shockwaves before, such as reflecting Kanoh's Dragon Shot which can do shit like this indirectly.

and scales above Hatsumi Sen who can dodge Bando's Arm Whips which can cause explosions. Crimson Red Nichirin Blades burning at a cellular level really isn't impressive given that normal fire already does that, hence why cauterization is possible. Kuroki was able to stand dead center in the middle of flames for 3 days and 3 nights all without obtaining any burns. I'd say Gensai definitely has enough resistance to make it so that Yoriichi's fire wouldn't be as effective as it usually is.

Sorry for the late reply but I was surprisingly busy and I also got a larger amount of alerts than usual lately. I was admittedly also not in the mood of making the reply given the length it will need to properly reply to everything that needs to be addressed.

Attack Potency

---

I'd say that Yoriichi should be able to keep up with those that scale to 400 tons, so Yoriichi could keep up with all attacks that aren't Devil Lance though it does seem like as if that is what he is mostly using which makes this a fairly major problem for Yoriichi to deal with.

These are indeed impressive Durability feats which should make Gensai sturdy even from Yoriichi's perspective though since Yoriichi will be using a sword he won't try to break Gensai's bones or try to fight him with his bare hands under regular circumstances. He should also be skilled enough to avoid damage to his blade if his sword strikes get blocked since the series put some emphasis on that.

Skill

---

I'm pretty sure that these martial arts masters do this by observing the muscles from an outside perspective which isn't quite the same as being able to directly see the muscle fibers underneath the skin and Yoriichi has always been able to do that since for him the bodies of people are transparent. Yoriichi's usage of Transparent World is innate to his perception and intuitive for him since he was able to make use of it the first time he used a sword and defeated Michikatsu's (Kokushibo) sword instructor as a 7 years old child without training.

If we are talking about the history, skill and senses of other individuals due to upscaling from the entire verse, then I can present quite a few things too.

Muzan has lived for a 1000 years and the Demon Slayer Corps was founded by members of the family Muzan came from due to a curse they've received because of Muzan which gives the Demon Slayer Corps a history of a 1000 years. Yoriichi single-handedly created what is described as the golden era of demon slaying through teaching others his breathing techniques and his generation of Pillars is still used to express how good the generation of Pillars during the events of the series is which is the best one since the first generation that used breathing techniques and Yoriichi was still the strongest swordsman of that generation. This makes Yoriichi the by far best swordsman in a history of 1000 years with master swordsmen not only being unable to reach his level of swordsmanship but also unable to so much as even learn his style which was superior to all other ones.

Tanjiro has a sense of smell so good that he can recognize the scent of Muzan years after he murdered Tanjiro's family, can smell what kind of person someone is, their feelings and to an extent how strong they are and can predict movements based on smell. Zenitsu can hear breathing, heartbeat, the sound of blood circulating and the thoughts of people to the point where he can hear everything around him even while he is sleeping. He also used it to filter through various sounds for information gathering and perfectly replicated the sounds played on a Shamisen and Koto after only hearing it once without prior musical experience. Inosuke can use his sense of touch to identify the positions of enemies hundreds of meters away, identify the location of the weakness of a demon and sense when someone is looking at him. Kanao has exceptional eyesight that she can use to predict the movements of enemies and which she can enhance to view the world in slow motion via her Final Form.

The Pillars have good perception feats as well. Gyomei can fight using his sense of hearing to compensate for the fact that he is blind which he can use to judge Regeneration speed, detect if someone is lying and can use to gain situational awareness from the echoes of swinging his weapon. Tengen was able to hear a fight that was a significant distance below the ground while on a roof aboveground. He was also able to use his hearing to tell that all the people inside a house had left. Yoriichi scales above the Pillars which demonstrated Instinctive Reaction with Mitsuri having been able to dodge a multitude of attacks that were too fast for her to see using her instincts and Sanemi being able to continue attacking even after he had lost consciousness.

Gyomei and Muichiro were able to become Pillars 2 months after they first picked up a sword and Muichiro was 11 when that happened. Kokushibo said that he expected this level of capability from one of his descendents but that might partially be his own pride speaking though his achievements as a human demon slayer and the fact that Muichiro's capabilities don't seem to surprise him at all support what he is saying. Muichiro and Giyu created their own forms and Mitsuri and Shinobu have created their own Breath Styles. Rengoku was able to protect the people in 5 cars of a train that was fused with Enmu without there being a single casualty despite the comparatively narrow space he had available.

The Upper Moons have some impressive skill feats as well. Gyutaro was able to defeat a samurai as a heavily injured human with an impoverished background. Akaza as a human was able to tear apart 67 people from a kendo dojo with his bare hands which attracted Muzan not long afterwards. Kokushibo's Moon Breathing was on a level that other people couldn't imitate for the same reason they couldn't imitate Sun Breathing despite him still not being capable of learning Sun Breathing or matching it. Mitsuri stated that the experience of fighting Upper Moon 6 (Gyutaro) is worth 5 to 10 years of training.

Endurance & stamina

---

I guess it would be worth to mention that Yoriichi upscales from the entire Kamado family which had a 500 years old tradition of annually performing the Dance of the Fire God, which is basically Sun Breathing's Thirteenth Form but constantly repeated from sunset to sunrise without a break, to celebrate the new year. Tanjiro's father Tanjuro was frail and gaunt for years due to an illness that was slowly killing him but he still considered the annual tradition to be not tough due to his Sun Breathing despite the version that was passed down in his family being an imperfect version of what Yoriichi does. This means that Yoriichi can effortlessly keep spamming his Sun Breathing forms for a whole day even when he is physically heavily impaired without getting tired.

Other things to consider

---

Indirect shockwaves that are created as a result of an impact are arguably much less impressive or useful than what Yoriichi does. What pretty much any Breath Style does is to create shockwaves along a sword strike's trajectory that allow a swordsman to strike from a longer distance and almost all of Yoriichi's attacks will do this, so Gensai will have to deal with that constantly since Yoriichi has no problems with outright spamming his various forms. This combined with Yoriichi's high mobility will make it difficult for Gensai to get in the right range for an attack especially since Yoriichi has the mental capacity to keep up with 1800 small moving pieces and should therefore have no problem with detecting and reacting to whatever Gensai does which combined with his higher range will mean that Yoriichi will always get the opportunity to strike first whenever Gensai comes close to him.

The matter of the cauterization makes sense though Crimson Red Nichirin Blades don't emit fire. Yoriichi's Sun Breathing creates the visual perception of fire and the feeling of being burned when slashed but he doesn't actually manipulate fire and the cellular burning occurs through nothing but sheer heat. I mentioned Gensai's Fire Resistance since fire also emits heat. Even if Gensai's Resistance is enough to reduce the burns from the heat he'll receive, they'll still accumulate every time he comes into contact with Yoriichi's blade and be a problem for the rest of the entire fight since Muzan wasn't able to get rid of them after 500 years with the heat still burning the cells in the area of these wounds. This means that Gensai won't just receive burns but the heat will remain in those burns and keep burning until the end of his natural lifespan since he will obviously not live as long as Muzan.

I'd also like to note, that if Yoriichi can even cut into Kuroki, he's most likely going to have his sword broken once he cuts down to the bone layer since not even Ohma could break his bones, and broke his fingers when trying to hit the man in the head.

Even when combining the Advance with Demonsbane, a technique that works to use the opponents' own force against them, he could only break Kuroki's arm, and that was when he was still injured from his fight with Kanoh.

The series actually makes a point of avoiding damage to the blade through skill and Nichirin swords are made by swordsmiths from a village that generally makes an effort to create swords that never break, to the point where they blame the swordsmith if a sword from them does in fact break. Tanjiro was able to avoid having his blade broken even though he spent 6 months trying to cut a boulder that he couldn't even nick during his training. Given that Yoriichi's skill upscales from every other swordsman in the series he should be able to avoid getting his blade broken even if he does hit something much harder than what he can cut through.

Another thing that would be worth mentioning is that Yoriichi was able to recognize that his mother was suffering from an illness when no one else noticed and Kokushibo was able to see how refined Gyomei's body was with Transparent World. Yoriichi would presumably immediately see that Gensai's bones have been trained to be much stronger than regular ones and act accordingly.

 

[LordGinSama]

Your links are broken

 

[azontr]

Your links are broken

They are? They all work for me.

 

[Nehz_XZX]

Your links are broken

Is that a joke or do you have some sort of problem?

 

[LordGinSama]

Is that a joke or do you have some sort of problem?

The latter, like whenever I click your links it just sends me to the wiki page.

 

[Nehz_XZX]

The latter, like whenever I click your links it just sends me to the wiki page.

That's on purpose. I've made the experience that if I link directly to the image and only the image, it tends to have weird results.

 

[LordGinSama]

That's on purpose. I've made the experience that if I link directly to the image and only the image, it tends to have weird results.

Yeah I still can't see any of the images you posted, but I know a site that's pretty good for linking images without much issues.

 

[Nehz_XZX]

Yeah I still can't see any of the images you posted, but I know a site that's pretty good for linking images without much issues.

You can't see them? I don't have that issue and other people in this thread don't seem to have that issue either. I'm also pretty sure that this wasn't an issue in previous threads where I did that, so it seems to be an issue that only you have.

 

[LordGinSama]

You can't seem them? I don't have that issue and other people in this thread don't seem to have that issue either. I'm also pretty sure that this wasn't issue in previous threads where I did that, so it seems to be an issue that only you have.

Yeah not really sure what's going on here, guess I'll wait for a bit and see if the issue takes care of itself.

 

[Nehz_XZX]

Yeah not really sure what's going on here, guess I'll wait for a bit and see if the issue takes care of itself.

Okay, it would be good if you could see the images yourself

 

[Deceived3596]

Yeah not really sure what's going on here, guess I'll wait for a bit and see if the issue takes care of itself.

From my end the links work fine for me so i have no idea what's messing up on your end.

Possibly refreshing your tab and re checking the scans again could work.

If that doesn't work then I'll think of something to remedy this issue.

 

[LordGinSama]

Still the same issue for me and I even looked on my lady's phone to see if it was my phone, it isn't.


Nonetheless I still know the scans he's talking about.

 

[Nehz_XZX]

Nonetheless I still know the scans he's talking about.

How exactly do you know them?

 

[LordGinSama]

How exactly do you know them?

Advent Demon Slayer fan, I've read the manga because my love of D-Gray Man turned me onto it.

 

[Nehz_XZX]

Advent Demon Slayer fan, I've read the manga because my love of D-Gray Man turned me onto it.

Okay.

 

[LordGinSama]

Bump