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Khârn the Betrayer vs Son Goku ~ Redux

Getting stomped by someone is not a feat.

Getting stomped by someone also doesn't mean you scale to them.

SSJB Goku isn't Low 2-C because he got stomped by Jiren but took the hits.
 
We SERIOUSLY need to get that damn justification removed, it's misunderstood literally all the damn time.

The way we word it makes it sound like he took hits when he didn't and leads to so much people overestimaing Kharn it hurts.
 
I voted for Kharn, add my vote in.

If the thing about his axe negating durability is true.. i fail to see how he would lose against someone like goku
 
As far as I'm aware, Gorechild only negates magic defenses and absorbs an opponent's soul upon killing them.

Neither of those will mean anything to Goku.
 
@Gargoyle One

Kharn is 2 kilofoe and Goku scales to 1Kilofoe SPC who is weaker than SSJ2 and SSJ3 is likely 2 times stronger than SSJ2(SSJ1=50base,SSJ2=100,SSJ3=200),am I right?Correct me please,I am not into these multipliers.
 
Firstly, we don't use Multipliers.

Secondly, SS 3 is 4X stronger then 2, assuming we used them.
 
So,if Goku is only about 4Kilofoe,there is no way he is going to put Kharn down while Kharn has limitless stamina and Goku's SSJ3 lasts only a few minutes.
 
Dzhindzholia said:
So,if Goku is only about 4Kilofoe,there is no way he is going to put Kharn down while Kharn has limitless stamina and Goku's SSJ3 lasts only a few minutes.
Click to expand...
To quote from Goku's page, "In addition, as of Battle of Gods, he has finally gotten past Super Saiyan 3's energy problem, allowing him to use it much more easily and for longer periods of time"
 
"Buu Saga Goku"

Goku in Battle of Gods is 3-A and such.
 
Dzhindzholia said:
@Gargoyle One
Kharn is 2 kilofoe and Goku scales to 1Kilofoe SPC who is weaker than SSJ2 and SSJ3 is likely 2 times stronger than SSJ2(SSJ1=50base,SSJ2=100,SSJ3=200),am I right?Correct me please,I am not into these multipliers.
Click to expand...
1 KiloFoe <= Injured one-handed Gohan < ssj2 Goku and Vegeta << Fat Buu << Kid Buu >= ssj3 Goku
 
Azathoth the Abyssal Idiot said:
>inb4 anyone actually remembers 4-B Kharn's durability would technically be in the very low GigaFoe to very high MegaFoe range despite his AP
Click to expand...
I've literally been trying to say that this whole time.
 
It amazes me that people will seriously overestimate what Kharn's blessing will null, yet equally underestimate him in actual combat. Anyway...

  • "Khorne negates shooting and running away"
1. The hell does this even mean?

2. No, he doesn't. Khorne has protected Kharn from attacks of people who tried to use them on Kharn while staying away from him, but he doesn't negate the attack itself or stop someone from running or anything.

  • "4-B Kharn's durability doesn't remotely scale to Angron's AP because Angron stomped him"
This misses the context of the entire scene, that being that Angron had beaten every other high-ranking War Hound to death when they were sent in to talk to him. Debating if this is a high-end or outlier or whatever is one thing, but it's sure as hell a feat. For those doubting Angron was going on a killing spree, this is what remains of those sent in before Kharn.

"He felt the urge to look around him for his brothers. Gheer, the Legion Master, who had come in here first when the Emperor had told the War Hounds they must take this duty upon themselves and then taken ship to meet the Thirty-seventh Fleet at Aldebaran. Kunnar, the First Company Champion, who had donned his formal cape, taken up his axe-staff and walked down the steps after the noises coming through the doors had convinced them that Gheer was long dead. Anchez, who had captained the assault echelon, had walked down next. He had joked with Kharn and Hyazn as the doors had been opened for him, despite the blood they could already smell on the air. The man had never known what fear was. Hyazn had been next, and two of the banner-bearers from his personal command coterie had insisted on marching down the steps into the dark with him. They had meant to block the primarch's fury for long enough that Hyazn could speak with him. It hadn't worked. Vanche, the master-at-arms to old Gheer, had insisted on being next, even though the next to inherit the Legion's command, and so the duty of taking up embassy to their lord, should have been Shinnargen of the Second Company. The point was moot now. Shinnargen had met his end in here an hour after Vanche."

  • "Kharn inflicted no damage to Abaddon, who completely ragdolled him"
This is what we in the business like to call "a lie". I will link the entire fight, with full context, for those interested, but I will also post some notable bits, below.


1. Abaddon genuinely wants to kill Kharn, despite holding himself back. He's well aware of the benefits Kharn could bring.

"'As am I, berzerker. You spat on my offering. I should take your head as payment and wear it as my trophy.'.

Kharn saw the rage behind Abaddon's eyes. Nothing would give the Warmaster more pleasure than to take his head, and nothing would satisfy Kharn more than to see him try. For several long seconds, the Despoiler stared at him, oblivious to the fires licking into the darkening sky and the scream of war machines overhead. The massed ranks of Black Legionnaires stood immobile around them. Kharn wondered if they could understand the power they beheld, at this moment. Two lords of darkness, chosen of the gods. Very soon, there would only be one."

2. Abaddon's initial attacks are only counters to Kharn coming at him, and he knocks him away with little effort. This seems to be where the misconception that he was hilariously casual the whole time comes from.

"In the blink of an eye, Abaddon turned towards the attack, bringing up his gauntlet and curling the talons into a fist. The lightning-streaked blow was so fast and powerful it pushed Gorechild away and spun Kharn to the left into a wall of black power armour. Kharn brought Gorechild up once again, ready to engage the warriors, but they stepped back at some unseen command, giving him space to turn. A flash of dull metal caught Kharn's eye and he ducked, but the flat of Abaddon's blade smashed into the side of his helmet and sent him reeling, crashing into a number of Black Legionnaires. Kharn's head sang with the impact, but his body knew what to do to regain his balance. He swung his chainaxe behind him as he recovered and was rewarded with the sensation of Gorechild chewing through weapons and armour. When he raised it to block the next blow from Abaddon, it was covered in the blood of his legionnaires."

3. Kharn cuts straight into Abaddon's left knee, and the reaction shows this clearly wasn't a pleasant experience. So yes, Gorechild both cut through Abaddon's armour and wounded him, in the process.

"Abaddon raised his sword and aimed it once again towards Kharn's head. Kharn brought Gorechild up, but instead of angling to the right, he flicked it around in his wrist, ducking to evade the sweeping blow from Abaddon's gauntlet and driving the chainaxe into the leg of the Despoiler. Kharn knew that trying to attack Abaddon's head in its deep cowl was pointless, no matter how exposed it seemed without a helmet, so he would instead cripple him limb by limb. Angling the next blow downwards, Gorechild's teeth bit into the thick ceramite of Abaddon's cuisse. The mica-dragon teeth gouged their way into the dense armour, sinking the axe head deep into Abaddon's left knee. The Despoiler bellowed in fury."

4. Abaddon is so pissed off by this, he tries to slice off Kharn's arm.

"Kharn saw the daemon sword flashing down towards his arm. Letting go of Gorechild's haft, Kharn rolled away, kicking out at Abaddon's right leg."

5. Abaddon trying to cut Kharn's head in half.

"Abaddon't towering form was forced backwards momentarily, but he swiftly regained his footing and struck at Kharn with his sword. This time, it was not with the flat of the blade. Kharn knew Drach'nyen would slice through the ceramite of his helmet, so he threw himself to the side, just avoiding the swing of the weapon as it cut through the tassels on his headpiece."

6. Confirmation that Kharn did indeed draw blood when he sliced open Abaddon's knee.

"Gorechild screamed for blood in his good hand, its teeth spitting dried blood and ceramite as they spun. Kharn could see the blood congealing around the wound he had made in Abaddon's leg."

7. Confirmation that Abaddon is 200% MAD and trying to slaughter Kharn for being such a dick. Kharn also blocks an explicit killing blow from Drach'nyen.

"The Warmaster was on him in an instant, and Kharn ducked just as the huge broadsword sliced above his head, splitting one of the vanes of his helmet. Kharn heard the mighty weapon thud into several Black Legion warriors, but Abaddon's rage had overtaken him. Kharn rammed himself into the Despoiler once again, but the Warmaster slammed the pommel of Drach'nyen into his stomach. Kharn was lifted from the ground with the servo-powered blow, and his fused ribcage fractured fully. He brought his boot down as hard as he could onto Abaddon's injured knee, and was rewarded with a grunt of pain. Dropping to the ground, Kharn saw Abaddon's right leg come towards him too late to avoid the blow. The impact sent him skidding along the ruined plaza's stones and claning into the Thunderhawk's cargo pod. Abaddon glowered at him and swung his daemon sword with a cry of rage. Kharn brought Gorechild up to meet the furious blow, and it took all of his strength to prevent the blade from cleaving his skull."

8. Abaddon, once again, tries to decapitate Kharn.

"Using the hull of the Thunderhawk, Kharn pushed himself away. He grappled with Abaddon, forcing him back out into the arena and distancing them both from the ship. Kharn could feel every muscle in his body scream at him, but he needed more room in which to move. As Gorechild's blade spun closer to Abaddon's arm, so did the Despoiler's sword creep towards Kharn's neck."

So while Abaddon would have won had they been forced to keep going, he was in no way "lol super casual", nor did he shrug off Kharn's attacks which actually landed. Drach'nyen being able to kill him makes sense, as Drach'nyen cuts through reality (and Gorechild, another daemon weapon, blocks it).

On top of all this, if I'm remembering correctly, it's confirmed in one of the Horus Heresy books that while Kharn couldn't beat Sigismund in a duel, he doubtlessly could have killed them had they been fighting to the death. Would have to find the quote, though.

Edit on the last bit: It's a little more complicated than that. Sigismund defeated Kharn in a duel, though everyone was well aware Kharn refused to go all out when his life wasn't on the line. Delvarus, a World Eater who was in charge of the Triarii and was partners with Sigismund, offered a rematch to the death. Him and Sigismund vs Kharn and Argel Tal. Sigismund refuses out of honor not allowing him to potentially take the life of any of his Legion cousins. However, Kharn dryly refuses simply because he was fully aware he would have slaughtered Delvarus, thus leaving the Triarii without a leader. Not entirely relevant to the rest of this post, but figured I'd clarify.

TL;DR VERSION:

  • Khorne doesn't null literally everything that isn't hand-to-hand combat.JFC. It just needs to be mixed in with brutal CQC fighting and not used when running or constantly trying to shrink away from a real fight. It does effect certain things in CQC, though.
  • Yes, Angron was bloodlusted when he beat the shit out of Kharn.
  • Yes, Abaddon was in fact trying to kill Kharn for the majority of their fight.
 
Goku cant get past Kharns durability.Goku is only 4 times stronger AP wise if i dont miss something+his ssj3 lasts only a couple of minutes.I think people ignored the stamina thing.Goku cant take this.
 
Dzhindzholia said:
Goku cant get past Kharns durability.Goku is only 4 times stronger AP wise if i dont miss something+his ssj3 lasts only a couple of minutes.I think people ignored the stamina thing.Goku cant take this.
Click to expand...
I think that was considered an outlier for Kharn, so he is inferior in durability too.
 
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