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Is My Little Pony Low 1-C? Let's Find Out.

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Vietthai96 said:
Are you serious??, higher tier is automatically superior to lower tier, that basic thing. What i say is, you don't need to prove qualitative superiority to get to tier 1, that waht i replied to Firestorm. Now do you understand???
Click to expand...
Answering doesn't prove this is true. Qualitative superiority is required. Even if you are dimensionally superior to a 4-D structure, you still cannot be Tier 1 unless there is a qualitative superiority in power and existence.

You're the one talking nonsense here and you're the one who finds this weird?Lmao
 
Georredannea15 said:
Answering doesn't prove this is true. Qualitative superiority is required. Even if you are dimensionally superior to a 4-D structure, you still cannot be Tier 1 unless there is a qualitative superiority in power and existence.

You're the one talking nonsense here and you're the one who finds this weird?Lmao
Click to expand...
qualitative superiority is different in math bro
 
Vietthai96 said:
Are you serious??, higher tier is automatically superior to lower tier, that basic thing. What i said is, you don't need to prove qualitative superiority to get to tier 1, that what i replied to Firestorm. Now do you understand???
Click to expand...
No, you need to prove qualitative superiority to get Tier 1. There are just different methods of doing so.
 
Georredannea15 said:
This is more commonly referred to as a subset-superset or greater degree of infinity. In dimensionality, it means an universal sized extra axis
Click to expand...
Extra axis don't need to be proved to be qualitative superior if it is significantly large to be tiered, literally we have verse such as TTGL use Brane Cosmology and Honkai Impact which use M-Theory as the foundation of their cosmogy and they have tier 1. Literally Toaru Majutsu no Index is High 1-C (the same verse DT supported) because it have 11-dimensional realm. Same i don't need to prove Aleph-1 is qualitative superior to Aleph-0, because it is automatically that Aleph-1 is bigger in size compare to Aleph-0
 
@Firestorm808 yet you keep mentioning qualitative superior while OP isn't even argued for it, his argument based on Continuum Hypothesis, which is the basic on why timeline is 4D because timeline have uncountable infinite points on it axis, which each point in time contain a snapshot of 3d object. Continuum Hypothesis is uncountable infinite amount of 1D line create 2D plane, then uncountable infinite amount of 2D plane create 3D cube, uncountable infinite amount of 3D create 4D, continue on to higher. OP argued that, uncountable infinite amount of 4D world create 5D construct or Low 1-C, that simple
 
Vietthai96 said:
Extra axis don't need to be proved to be qualitative superior if it is significantly large to be tiered, literally we have verse such as TTGL use Brane Cosmology and Honkai Impact which use M-Theory as the foundation of their cosmogy and they have tier 1. Literally Toaru Majutsu no Index is High 1-C (the same verse DT supported) because it have 11-dimensional realm. Same i don't need to prove Aleph-1 is qualitative superior to Aleph-0, because it is automatically that Aleph-1 is bigger in size compare to Aleph-0
Click to expand...
"11 dimensional realm"
This 11-dimensional space already has 11 different axes, Lmao. It has a lot to do with the axis.

In short, extra universal size axes are found here.(For dimensionality)

"Aleph 1 have bigger size than Aleph 0"

And that's because Aleph 0 is a subset of Aleph 1, and Aleph 1 is a higher degree of infinity.

higher-set and higher degree of infinity always gives you a greater "size", but a larger "size" does not always give you a higher degree of infinity or higher-set
 
Vietthai96 said:
@Firestorm808 yet you keep mentioning qualitative superior while OP isn't even argued for it, his argument based on Continuum Hypothesis, which is the basic on why timeline is 4D because timeline have uncountable infinite points on it axis, which each point in time contain a snapshot of 3d object. Continuum Hypothesis is uncountable infinite amount of 1D point create 2D plane, then uncountable infinite amount of 2D plane create 3D cube, uncountable infinite amount of 3D create 4D, continue on to higher. OP argued that, uncountable infinite amount of 4D world create 5D construct or Low 1-C, that simple
Click to expand...
It would not be right to tagg a staff member in this way. Also, the reason why Firestorm tagged Qawsedf and the OP tagged Ultima is to find out if the situation here lends itself to uncountable infinity and qualitative superiority.
 
Vietthai96 said:
@Firestorm808 yet you keep mentioning qualitative superior while OP isn't even argued for it, his argument based on Continuum Hypothesis, which is the basic on why timeline is 4D because timeline have uncountable infinite points on it axis, which each point in time contain a snapshot of 3d object. Continuum Hypothesis is uncountable infinite amount of 1D point create 2D plane, then uncountable infinite amount of 2D plane create 3D cube, uncountable infinite amount of 3D create 4D, continue on to higher. OP argued that, uncountable infinite amount of 4D world create 5D construct or Low 1-C, that simple
Click to expand...
The axis size difference between 2-D to 3-D or 4-D to 5-D or etc in our tiering system is referred to as qualitative superiority.

The use of lines, planes, and cubes is one method of proving qualitative superiority.
 
Georredannea15 said:
11 dimensional realm"
This 11-dimensional space already has 11 different axes, Lmao. It has a lot to do with the axis.
Click to expand...
And, that my point, i don't need to prove qualitative superiority for each dimension/axis, because it automatically is that big
Georredannea15 said:
"Aleph 1 have bigger size than Aleph 0"

And that's because Aleph 0 is a subset of Aleph 1, and Aleph 1 is a higher degree of infinity.

higher-set and higher degree of infinity always gives you a greater "size", but a larger "size" does not always give you a higher degree of infinity or higher-set
Click to expand...
Again, like before, i don't need to prove qualitative superiority, because Aleph-1 automatically bigger than Aleph-0 because it is higher infinity

So you all can stop with: muh it need to be proved qualitative superior

Georredannea15 said:
It would not be right to tagg a staff member in this way. Also, the reason why Firestorm tagged Qawsedf and the OP tagged Ultima is to find out if the situation here lends itself to uncountable infinity and qualitative superiority.
Click to expand...
I don't tag him, and can't anyway because normal user account don't have tag function, as no one will receive the alert even if i use @
 
Vietthai96 said:
And, that my point, i don't need to prove qualitative superiority for each dimension/axis, because it automatically is that big
Click to expand...
Extra-dimensional axis=/= automatically Tier 1. You have to prove that these axes are also have universal size. And if you prove that these extra axes are universal sized, that's an automatically qualitative superiority.
Vietthai96 said:


Again, like before, i don't need to prove qualitative superiority, because Aleph-1 automatically bigger than Aleph-0 because it is higher infinity

So you all can stop with: muh it need to be proved qualitative superior
Click to expand...
And yes, this is also a qualitative superiority. Here Aleph 1 is qualitatively superior to Aleph 0(Also on the infinity level). This is what they all have in common.
 
Firestorm808 said:
Can you confirm if the reasoning used for the MCU's Realm of the Sacred Timeline(s) being Low 1-C can be applied to MLP's Dreamscape?
Click to expand...
There's two Low 1-Cs used:
  • A standard timeline: An infinite amount of alternate dimensions is in one universe, which can branch off infinitely and have those branch off infinitely. That however is still a 2-A feat going by the FAQ, but since they're still within "A timeline" it was considered debatable if that meant the timeline itself could be considered to qualify for a infinite set/Aleph-1 due to it being an infinite recursive thing, which is why certain profiles got a "Possibly Low 1-C" rating.
  • The Void: The reason the void the timelines was considered Low 1-C is that multiple separate 2-A multiverses existed within it at one point and when the multiverse began to branch out you could see it happening within that realm while away from it and the structure itself even when fully expanded was still only taking a finite amount of space. So it embedded a 4-D structure within it and other people in the realm could be in a separate axis.
The first one is important since as I said before the FAQ page notes that multiple infinite multiverses is still just 2-A

Q: Is destroying multiple infinite multiverses a better feat than destroying a single one?​

A: In spite of what our intuitions may tell us, destroying or fully affecting multiple infinite-sized multiverses is in fact not better than doing the same to a single infinite multiverse, and thus, not above the "baseline" for 2-A

The reason is that the total amount of universes contained in a collection of multiple infinitely-sized multiverses (even one consisting of infinitely many of them) is in fact equal to the amount of universes contained in a single one of the multiverses that form this ensemble: It is countably infinite, as the union of countably-many countable sets is itself countable, and thus does not differ in size from its components. The only general difference between multiple infinitely-sized multiverses and a single one is representation. What is considered to be multiple multiverses in one fiction could be considered a single multiverse in another, and vice versa, without the objective properties of those collections of universes changing. The only difference is where an author decided to draw the line between what belongs to the same multiverse and not. Thus, only an uncountably infinite number of universes actually makes any difference in terms of Attack Potency, at this scale.

This illustrates some of the more unintuitive properties of sets with infinite elements: Namely, given a set X, it being a subset of another set Y does not imply that Y > X in terms of size. An example of this is how the set of all natural numbers contains both the odd numbers and even numbers, yet all of these sets in fact have the same number of elements.

Similar to Attack Potency, affecting multiple multiverses by default can not be considered a feat of superior Range to affecting a single one. As mentioned before there is no real difference between the size or properties of one or multiple multiverses. Hence there can be no objective difference in range either. This is made even worse by the fact that what we considered multiversal range, as the distance between universes or the distances between things in or between multiverses, is usually not directly stated or quantifiable in fiction, but instead is approximated by the number of universes. That idea becomes meaningless if we try to quantify different ranges within sets of universes of equal numbers. As a consequence, even if one verse gave an indirect indicator of different ranges in its multiverse it would be impossible to compare to a different fiction where such a quantification doesn't exist.
For example, if travelling to another multiverse is said to take longer than travelling within the same one, that would seem to be an indication of different ranges, but at the same time one can not compare those informations to another fiction, as there is no way to tell how travelling within the same multiverse in another fiction compares range wise to either of those distances.

However, feats regarding affecting multiple multiverses may indeed qualify as higher range if the verse itself treats it as such. Those feats need to be relatively explicit and objective. For example, one multiverse being outside of the range of an effect or of the power of a character that can affect one infinite multiverse doesn't necessarily mean the multiverse is further away. Other factors such as differences in nature and domain of the multiverses or characters could, amongst other many other factors, also be the reason.
Click to expand...
I have no knowledge of MLP and don't know its cosmology. But having a hallway of infinite hallways is just 2-A. The Dreamscape would be the only theoretical Low 1-C realm if you can prove every single bubble either contains a multiverse or exists as second dimensional flat objects.
 
Phoenks said:
However, here I will just explain the names.

Countable Infinity (Aleph-0. *All whole numbers) is countable because you can start at 1 and keep going. 1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6... etc. Thus, theoretically, if given an infinite amount of time (and knowledge of all numbers or something), you could reach infinite by counting.

Uncountable Infinity (Aleph-1. *All real numbers) is uncountable because you can't even begin to count it.

Because, what real number would come after 0? Would it be 0.001? 0.000000000000001? 0.000.......001? No. It can go on forever. You can always add another 0 to the value that could come next. So there wouldn't even be a place to begin counting.

That's one of the differences between the two values. Though, watching that video will explain it better than I ever could.
Click to expand...
Thank you, anime girl
 
Qawsedf234 said:
I have no knowledge of MLP and don't know its cosmology. But having a hallway of infinite hallways is just 2-A. The Dreamscape would be the only theoretical Low 1-C realm if you can prove every single bubble either contains a multiverse or exists as second dimensional flat objects.
Click to expand...
there are infinite doors and every single door in the hallway leads to another infinite doors and so on. dreamscape contains all that

does this count as Low 1-C??
 
As the one who brought up the possibility of Low 1-C in the thread Phoenks linked, I agree with Low 1-C being a likelihood. However, I'm perfectly fine with it being either:
2-A, possibly Low 1-C
or
2-A, likely Low 1-C

I''m leaning towards the first option though because it's the most likely to be accepted, also because of it's similarities to MCU's Uncountable Infinite reasoning
 
The_2nd_Existential_Seed said:
As the one who brought up the possibility of Low 1-C in the thread Phoenks linked, I agree with Low 1-C being a likelihood. However, I'm perfectly fine with it being either:
2-A, possibly Low 1-C
or
2-A, likely Low 1-C

I''m leaning towards the first option though because it's the most likely to be accepted, also because of it's similarities to MCU's Uncountable Infinite reasoning
Click to expand...
why is it a possibly /likely instead of concrete? a 4d space cannot hold an uncountable infinite amount.
 
BasedNecoScaler69 said:
space cannot hold an uncountable infinite amount.
Click to expand...
It can, since an uncountable infinite is just an Aleph-0 value. It can't hold a higher set like Aleph-1 or Aleph-2.

An Aleph-1 amount of hamburgers for example can be contained in a 4D or 5D space as long as the hamburgers are baseline 3D.. An Aleph-2 amount of hamburgers would require and Aleph-2 space to hold it.

We're calling them out because everyone is avoiding these Tier 1 threads like the plague and they're not very experienced.
Click to expand...

Most of the time it's because Tier 1 threads are cancer and people get unreasonably salty if you disagree with their upgrade attempt.
 
@Qawsedf234

I see. In this verse, each person has their own 2-A branching timeline structure (made up of doors and hallways) in the dreamscape. In turn, a finite number of people are connected to the dreamscape.

Since there is only a finite number of 2-A structures in the dreamscape, the Dreamscape would only be possibly Low 1-C?
 
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Qawsedf234 said:
It can, since an uncountable infinite is just an Aleph-0 value. It can't hold a higher set like Aleph-1 or Aleph-2.

An Aleph-1 amount of hamburgers for example can be contained in a 4D or 5D space as long as the hamburgers are baseline 3D.. An Aleph-2 amount of hamburgers would require and Aleph-2 space to hold it.
Click to expand...
Ahhh... actually it starts from at least Aleph 1 but generally aleph 2 yes.
 
Admittedly, the MCU does have a lot more focus on it's cosmology and thus a bit more evidence for the uncountable branches.

However, I think the implications here are enough to say that it would probably just go on forever...

So I'll go ahead with the safe option of "possibly Low 1-C" once the 48 hours are up.

Firestorm808 said:
@Qawsedf234

I see. In this verse's case, each person has their own 2-A door and hallways timeline branching structure in the dreamscape. In turn, there is a finite number of people connected to the dreamscape.

Since there is only a finite number of 2-A structures in the dreamscape, the Dreamscape would only be possibly Low 1-C?
Click to expand...
There is not a finite number of 2-A structures in any way shape or form.

There is infinite dreams since they are all throughout time, which is infinite. There are hallways that lead to infinite futures in each dream. Each of those futures leads to another hallway of infinite futures.

The debatable part is if that trend continues infinitely (Results in Low 1-C). The evidence we have is Luna saying "There is always a hallway." Which can be interpreted that way.
 
Qawsedf234 said:
It can, since an uncountable infinite is just an Aleph-0 value. It can't hold a higher set like Aleph-1 or Aleph-2.

An Aleph-1 amount of hamburgers for example can be contained in a 4D or 5D space as long as the hamburgers are baseline 3D.. An Aleph-2 amount of hamburgers would require and Aleph-2 space to hold it.
Click to expand...
I keep getting mixed answers when I try to research the topic further, so ill take your word for it for now. Though uncountably infinite low 2-c spaces is still 5-d based on the wiki's standards.
Qawsedf234 said:
Most of the time it's because Tier 1 threads are cancer and people get unreasonably salty if you disagree with their upgrade attempt.
Click to expand...
💀
 
Firestorm808 said:
Are you referring to the individuals connected to the dreamscape or the doors that each individual has?
Click to expand...
The doors (hallways) exist within the dreams.

I'm saying there's an infinite number of dreams in the Dream Realm, since it contains dreams throughout the past, present, and future.
 
Qawsedf234 said:
It can, since an uncountable infinite is just an Aleph-0 value. It can't hold a higher set like Aleph-1 or Aleph-2.

An Aleph-1 amount of hamburgers for example can be contained in a 4D or 5D space as long as the hamburgers are baseline 3D.. An Aleph-2 amount of hamburgers would require and Aleph-2 space to hold it.

Most of the time it's because Tier 1 threads are cancer and people get unreasonably salty if you disagree with their upgrade attempt.
Click to expand...
Aleph 0 is not uncountable. Uncountables begin at Aleph 1.
 
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