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The imaginary spaces are like maths type of thingAgree with Speed and Neutral with Range with Beelzebuth using the feats of ignoring Space-Time. You should also added the one in V10 where it first said to ignore Space-Time.
I agree that Infinity Prison is infinity as stated to be an infinity sized Imaginary Space in V1, etc. But i will disagree to Predator being able to predate Infinity Prison as Infinity Range feats, etc. Bcs it used a barrier and it's not infinity, but the inside of the barrier is infinity sized Imaginary Space that prevent any interaction from inside and outside. Of course the barrier itself is very strong as Chronoa can used Infinity Prison on herself to tanked attacks from Veldora, said to not weaken overtime, etc.
Isn't this how anos got immeasurable speed anyways lolThis should work.
I agree.
Tbh, i'm very unfamiliar with Math Manip, especially determining if it actually Math Manip or not, considering Gojo don't have Math Manip despite Limitless being kinda related to Math too. So idk.The imaginary spaces are like maths type of thing
Velzard in volume 4 said "infinite number of imaginary number spaces"
Idk but owners of skills gets math manip of am i bugging sorry i ask stupid questions all the time or does this only give the creator of the skill math manip (math manip also work for spaces, physics etc)
I saw a thread that admins agreed gojo does have it infact they are "multiple hax" that isnt on his profileTbh, i'm very unfamiliar with Math Manip, especially determining if it actually Math Manip or not, considering Gojo don't have Math Manip despite Limitless being kinda related to Math too. So idk.
I seen a few cases where characters got it from ignoring space to reach its target.I won't give my opinion for the time being and will wait and see what the staff think. Also is ignoring the spacetime effect thereby achieving infinite speed accepted on this wiki?
Anos got immeasurable speed for literally dodging an attack that ignores space and timeI seen a few cases where characters got it from ignoring space to reach its target.
The contexts are completely different, stop talking about Anos. Anos attacks hit the opponent before he even perform them.Isn't this how anos got immeasurable speed anyways lol
A different verse. Forget it.Anos who?
No that duadehutum spear or smt said it ignored time and space, even tho conceptually still time and space lolThe contexts are completely different, stop talking about Anos. Anos attacks hit the opponent before he even perform them.
It's attack speed, no one in slime can move physically up to light speed...i agree if it is infinite attack speed, because it makes a clear contrast that beelzebub is not teleportation, but reaction speed or movement speed then i disagree
And this is false; this spear (WN) literally ignores concept of distance, speed, time, and space to reach its opponent. It has been stated that none can ignore it, but he truly dodges it multiple times, which is accepted as immeasurable reaction speed. In this contextual instance, it indicates that Anos used a pure reaction speed to dodge it, not an ability, distinctly from this thread's contextual framework.Anos got immeasurable speed for literally dodging an attack that ignores space and time
what is your opinion on the range?No, I don't believe this is solely about speed.
I disagree with the thread. In this scene, "ignore space and time" likely suggests that the protagonist can manipulate space and time around the bullet, allowing them to halt its motion and hold it in their hand. Essentially, they can freeze the bullet in space and time, preventing it from reaching its target.
In my view, this is more about space-time manipulation than sheer speed. Spatial Connection appears to involve spatial manipulation, and Gluttonous King Beelzebuth represents a higher degree of spatial-time manipulation.
- Elric employs a special skill called 'Spatial Connection,' which enables her to bypass obstacles and cover long distances instantly. Spatial Connection is a magical skill that manipulates space in a specific way, making it a valuable tool for rapid movement or achieving objectives involving physical barriers.
- “Spatial Connection” does not pertain to the user's sheer speed, but rather allows them to manipulate space, connecting two recognized points in space to create a shortcut or bypass obstacles. While the user may still move at their regular speed, this skill enables them to traverse space in a unique and unconventional manner.
Unfortunately, your supporting evidence doesn't seem to corroborate this idea.
Overall, I don't believe any of this indicates that the characters possess pure speed.
I don't notice any evidence of impressive range abilities here; if anything, it appears to be limited to bullet-range capabilities. They essentially manipulated space and time solely to immobilize a bullet, which could be considered within the range of bullet-speed feats, but overall, it's not particularly noteworthy.what is your opinion on the range?
I trust your judgement on the speed. for range, it does say that Unlimited Prison holds infinite space, and that is was consumed. I feel like infinite range can be given thereI don't notice any evidence of impressive range abilities here; if anything, it appears to be limited to bullet-range capabilities. They essentially manipulated space and time solely to immobilize a bullet, which could be considered within the range of bullet-speed feats, but overall, it's not particularly noteworthy.
Calm down i wasn't trying to say rimuru gets itAnd this is false; this spear (WN) literally ignores concept of distance, speed, time, and space to reach its opponent. It has been stated that none can ignore it, but he truly dodges it multiple times, which is accepted as immeasurable reaction speed. In this contextual instance, it indicates that Anos used a pure reaction speed to dodge it, not an ability, distinctly from this thread's contextual framework.
Using a whataboutism argument to justify this ability is uproarious. Especially when you don't even know the context of the spear in question.
Uh, Beelzebuth don't have Spatial or even Space-Time Skill that's Uriel. Why Spatial Connection even important to shown Beelzebuth a higher Spatial/Space-Time Manip when the Bullet is not the one affected directly by the Spatial Connection but it's the "portal" or "gate" that connected space 1 and 2 so that the bullet can actually travel and hit the target from large distance. In V6 it also stated that Beelzebuth predate even the space.No, I don't believe this is solely about speed.
I disagree with the thread. In this scene, "ignore space and time" likely suggests that the protagonist can manipulate space and time around the bullet, allowing them to halt its motion and hold it in their hand. Essentially, they can freeze the bullet in space and time, preventing it from reaching its target.
In my view, this is more about space-time manipulation than sheer speed. Spatial Connection appears to involve spatial manipulation, and Gluttonous King Beelzebuth represents a higher degree of spatial-time manipulation.
- Elric employs a special skill called 'Spatial Connection,' which enables her to bypass obstacles and cover long distances instantly. Spatial Connection is a magical skill that manipulates space in a specific way, making it a valuable tool for rapid movement or achieving objectives involving physical barriers.
- “Spatial Connection” does not pertain to the user's sheer speed, but rather allows them to manipulate space, connecting two recognized points in space to create a shortcut or bypass obstacles. While the user may still move at their regular speed, this skill enables them to traverse space in a unique and unconventional manner.
Unfortunately, your supporting evidence doesn't seem to corroborate this idea.
Overall, I don't believe any of this indicates that the characters possess pure speed.
クレイマンの極大魔力弾は、『暴食之王(ベルゼビュート)』で空間ごと『捕食』した。
Something here is a definitely misunderstood, specially that the said context has been used multiple times for other purposes like cosmology which is also inconsistent, but here is my evaluation.I trust your judgement on the speed. for range, it does say that Unlimited Prison holds infinite space, and that is was consumed. I feel like infinite range can be given there
I have no clue what you are trying to address, but the fact it is an ability, and not pure speed, already negates any attempt for infinite speed.Uh, Beelzebuth don't have Spatial or even Space-Time Skill that's Uriel. Why Spatial Connection even important to shown Beelzebuth a higher Spatial/Space-Time Manip when the Bullet is not the one affected directly by the Spatial Connection but it's the "portal" or "gate" that connected space 1 and 2 so that the bullet can actually travel and hit the target from large distance. In V6 it also stated that Beelzebuth predate even the space.クレイマンの極大魔力弾は、『暴食之王(ベルゼビュート)』で空間ごと『捕食』した。
Also, what do you mean it manipulate the space and time around the bullet when Beelzebuth shown to be just like Gluttony? It even said in V10 scan that Rimuru used it to directly to take Chaos Dragon's Heart Core just before Milim's Magic hit the Core after destroying Chaos Dragon's Spiritual and Astral Body. That's why the timing is still important in that whole scene.
(虚数空間) it's called Imaginary Space but the literal translation is Imaginary Number Space, just like in Nasuverse. I don't know why just bcs it used the word "Imaginary" making it like something that's not existed. Is Rimuru's attack also not existed bcs it literally called Imaginary Blade?Something here is a definitely misunderstood, specially that the said context has been used multiple times for other purposes like cosmology which is also inconsistent, but here is my evaluation.
This “Unlimited Imprisonment” allows the hero to trap a target in an endless number of imaginary spaces indefinitely. This means that the target remains imprisoned, unable to escape or interact with the real world.
It is described as a formidable ability that prevents casual interference with the real world. In other words, the hero's power is so strong that it makes it nearly impossible for the captive to escape or affect the world outside their imprisonment.
But a weakness is given for the ability – telepathy.
In simpler terms, the hero's Unlimited Imprisonment allows them to create an unlimited number of imaginary realms or environments where they can trap someone, and this imprisonment is eternal, lasting for all time.
So two things are essential for this context:
If anything, I suggest possibly rating for it. But I simply forget the further context, and as you see, the screenshot is being taken out of context.
- The eternality – no one can escape
- It is a prison – you can't escape from it
- These spaces are not real in the sense that they exist in the physical world, but are rather a product of the hero's power.
But if you need my take? It is imaginary, not physical, the whole point of this is to prison someone and disallow them to interact with the real world. So to even count it as a physical infinite range is a bit outside the intended context being presented here.
And i'm saying that i disagree with the Space-Time Manip you said.I have no clue what you are trying to address, but the fact it is an ability, and not pure speed, already negates any attempt for infinite speed.
Beelzebuth is not a Spatial/Space-Time skill as Nxdia explains.No, I don't believe this is solely about speed.
I disagree with the thread. In this scene, "ignore space and time" likely suggests that the protagonist can manipulate space and time around the bullet, allowing them to halt its motion and hold it in their hand. Essentially, they can freeze the bullet in space and time, preventing it from reaching its target.
In my view, this is more about space-time manipulation than sheer speed. Spatial Connection appears to involve spatial manipulation, and Gluttonous King Beelzebuth represents a higher degree of spatial-time manipulation.
- Elric employs a special skill called 'Spatial Connection,' which enables her to bypass obstacles and cover long distances instantly. Spatial Connection is a magical skill that manipulates space in a specific way, making it a valuable tool for rapid movement or achieving objectives involving physical barriers.
- “Spatial Connection” does not pertain to the user's sheer speed, but rather allows them to manipulate space, connecting two recognized points in space to create a shortcut or bypass obstacles. While the user may still move at their regular speed, this skill enables them to traverse space in a unique and unconventional manner.
Unfortunately, your supporting evidence doesn't seem to corroborate this idea.
Overall, I don't believe any of this indicates that the characters possess pure speed.
I think that would be a fine compromiseIf anything, I suggest possibly rating for it.
I guess that's a fair take. I disagree slightly, but I'm not too pressed about it.I don't think “infinite” here refers to the size; I think it refers to eternity.
it's called the Imaginary Number Space (in nasu) because it's a space that represents all possible imaginary numbers (Void element). it was explicitly stated to be such, and was also stated to have infinite volume.(虚数空間) it's called Imaginary Space but the literal translation is Imaginary Number Space, just like in Nasuverse. I don't know why just bcs it used the word "Imaginary" making it like something that's not existed.
I obviously can, because those two have nothing in common in a contextual sense. One is sealing, and the other is manipulating spatially to not let the bullet reach its target.This is text book definition infinite speed. You don't ignore this feat and evaluate other feat on their own.
And one need to think about its practicalities if you want to upgrade it to possibly infinite rangeI guess that's a fair take. I disagree slightly, but I'm not too pressed about it.
Ik. In slime it also called that bcs it literally a Chaos World and an insolated space that can be manifested in almost anywhere. Infinity Prison manifested it as a prison, Infinity Prison in V11 also can be manifested inside Chloe's personal Spiritual World that traps negative emotions, energy, even Hinata's ego. Beelzebuth and Azathoth's Imaginary Space Skill manifested inside Rimuru's and acts as his personal Spiritual World that can even manifest to isolate the battlefield in V19 similiar to Infinity Prison.it's called the Imaginary Number Space (in nasu) is because it's a space that represents all possible imaginary numbers (Void element).
「あーあ、愚かなヤツ等よ。リムルを怒らせるとはな……」 困った事をしてくれたな。これでは我の出番がなくなるではないか――と、〝無限回廊エンドレスループ〟の中に囚われていたヴェルドラが嘆いた。 上も下もない空間。 合わせ鏡のように、ずっと書棚が並んでいるだけ。 ヴェルドラはそんな場所に居るのに、実に平然と構えていた。そして、どうにかしてここから脱出しようと、究極能力アルティメットスキル『究明之王ファウスト』で『解析鑑定』を行っていたのである。 危機感はなかった。 何故ならば、もっと難解な『無限牢獄』に囚われていた経験があるからだ。 それに、力技なら脱出出来ると、既に見当がついていたのである。 |
Can someone explain to Dread that WN and LN are different stories?Nothing has changed from the 2019 upgrade discussions, where many people here argued for immeasurable speed for WN Rimuru with a similar perspective.
it would likely be only with the certain ability and a specific aspect of the abilityAnd one need to think about its practicalities if you want to upgrade it to possibly infinite range
Does it mean you can seal the entire infinite space? Because this is never happened and never referred as.
we're allowed to give tiers for stuff done in/to mental landscapes, so I'm not sure why this would be differentIt is not even referred to physical space but to mental spaces.
Rimuru literally does this and analyzes the infinite prison.Does it mean you can seal the entire infinite space? Because this is never happened and never referred as
I don't know what this means. The infinite Prison or Endless Prison or Unlimited Imprisonment is only an unique ability to seal someone for eternity, which the feat itself supports this notion. Other than that, nothing. The claim of "it can seal the entire infinite space too" is too extraordinary.we're allowed to give tiers for stuff done in/to mental landscapes, so I'm not sure why this would be different
Just to add a little more, don't say anything that Spiritual World is something not real or anything, as it like saying that Daemon Realm, Spirit Realm, etc. Aren't real and Spiritual Lifeform is not a thing. Central World (the main world series take place) is also a Demi-Spiritual World.Ik. In slime it also called that bcs it literally a Chaos World and an insolated space that can be manifested in almost anywhere. Infinity Prison manifested it as a prison, Infinity Prison in V11 also can be manifested inside Chloe's personal Spiritual World that traps negative emotions, energy, even Hinata's ego. Beelzebuth and Azathoth's Imaginary Space Skill manifested inside Rimuru's and acts as his personal Spiritual World that can even manifested to isolate the battlefield in V19 similiar to Infinity Prison.
It literally said to traps target inside for eternal time in infinity sized Imaginary Number Space and the reason why the inside can't interact to outside world in the first place.I don't know what this means. The infinite Prison or Endless Prison or Unlimited Imprisonment is only an unique ability to seal someone for eternity, which the feat itself supports this notion. Other than that, nothing. The claim of "it can seal the entire infinite space too" is too extraordinary.
本来、勇者のユニークスキル『無限牢獄』は、対象を永遠の時間、無限の虚数空間に封じ込めるスキルであり、現実世界への干渉を許す程甘い能力ではないのだそうだ。
この場合、『念話』だけしか出来ないという考え方の方がおかしい。
時間とともに封印が弱まる事などないのだから、現実世界を認識した上、『念話』だけでも干渉可能なヴェルドラの方が異常なのだと言える。
無論、俺もヴェルドラもその事には気付かない。
the claim was that it is already infinite in size, I believe. which is why I said that I was fine with it being a range feat.I don't know what this means. The infinite Prison or Endless Prison or Unlimited Imprisonment is only an unique ability to seal someone for eternity, which the feat itself supports this notion. Other than that, nothing. The claim of "it can seal the entire infinite space too" is too extraordinary.
predator/beezelbuth moves physically, so no this does not debunk infinite speed.Once again, for the second time, I am still not sure what you are trying to counter-address. However, if you believe you can upgrade the range to infinity solely based on the ability name, then it definitely won't work – Name fallacy.
Regarding space-time, I'm not really trying to argue for it. I've presented my points. This type of discussion is always frustrating because it's tiring that every time there's a Slime discussion, you guys ignore the notion of ability and simply upgrade it for pure or sheer speed.
Nothing has changed from the 2019 upgrade discussions, where many people here argued for immeasurable speed for WN Rimuru with a similar perspective.
Additionally, why do you use the whataboutism argument/instances to bolster your argument? It is counterproductive, and I am not really here to entertain it.
@CodeCCLL I don't think anything you remotely have stated brought any new information in this table. Again, the fact it is an ability, and not physical sheer speed, already negates your points. You can ignore the fact, but I won't.
But it never refers as such. The fact it is stated as in quantity proves my point. If it was referring to size, it would straightforwardly state that.the claim was that it is already infinite in size, I believe. which is why I said that I was fine with it being a range feat.
The hero’s Unlimited Imprisonment could hold its target captive in an infinite number of imaginary spaces for all of time. It wasn’t some weak harrier that would allow casual interference with the real world. Looking back, it should have struck me as strange that Telepathy was possible, even. It wasn’t the sort of thing that would break down over time—but given that he could have any contact with the real world, and even exchange messages, perhaps it said more about Veldora. Neither of us noticed this at the time, though. |