I make a terrible but possibly fair match

[Sir_Ovens]

Kars to open with The World Ultimate if he so wished. He is intelligent enough to know when something is far beyond what he can tank.

 

[Standuser081]

Couldn't D4CU just ressurect Kars even if he dies?

 

[Sir_Ovens]

D4CU can't resurrect Kars because he'd be dead in every universe.

 

[Standuser081]

D4CU creates another universe.

 

[Iapitus_The_Impaler]

I thought we decided not to use that interpritation on this site because it was considered to just be speculation on a character's part

 

[Sir_Ovens]

Yes. In the novel, Joji was just saying that it could be possible that D4C created universes instead of just going to them. There's no solid proof that D4C can in fact create parallel timelines.

 

[Standuser081]

Then make a CRT because that's what's written in his profile.

 

[Iapitus_The_Impaler]

A CRT was made about it a while ago and went through, so idk why its still on there

 

[Sir_Ovens]

Yeah, the tiers were fixed but the powers and abilities remained the same.

 

[Yobo_Blue]

D4CU can't resurrect Kars because he'd be dead in every universe.

Actually, the bullet just destroys timelines where Kars survives the bullet. It doesn't destroy other timelines where he never encountered it

 

[Sir_Ovens]

...

Then you do realize Ashen would have to destroy every single version of Kars from a literal infinite multiverse in order to put him down right?

The scales have now tipped in Kars' favour.

 

[Monarch_Laciel]

What is the proof that D4CU will survive past Kars's death and search out a new Kars on its own? I'm pretty sure Valentine always needed to transfer it while still alive.

 

[Sir_Ovens]

Novel D4C works differently. Kars' Stands work independent from Kars by virtue of not being his in he first place.

 

[Monarch_Laciel]

Did he steal it from Valentine or make his own copy?

 

[Yobo_Blue]

He made a stronger version, hence the U

 

[Monarch_Laciel]

That's what I thought. In which case it is his own stand in the first place.

 

[Sir_Ovens]

Still won't stop BtD from rewinding time and giving Kars the chance he needs to send D4C out.

Unlike D4C, Killer Queen actually belongs to Kira. Kars T posed on him and KQ chose the alpha male. Killing Kars won't stop BtD.

 

[Monarch_Laciel]

If the bullet has been fired, then the future where BTD does that no longer exists.

And even if it does go back, any future that is different to "Kars dies to the Bullet" has been destroyed, so the outcome can't change anyway.

 

[Sir_Ovens]

You misunderstand. Kars of the past can send out D4CU before his untimely demise. BtD can go back 1 hour, the bullet deletes Kars' future at the point of firing. This gives Kars 1 hour of prep time. More than enough for someone of his calibur.

 

[Iapitus_The_Impaler]

Actually, the bullet just destroys timelines where Kars survives the bullet. It doesn't destroy other timelines where he never encountered it

technically speaking, we don't know that. The wording of the gunsmith just says all the "wrong" futures where the given target "survives"

 

[Iapitus_The_Impaler]

You misunderstand. Kars of the past can send out D4CU before his untimely demise. BtD can go back 1 hour, the bullet deletes Kars' future at the point of firing. This gives Kars 1 hour of prep time. More than enough for someone of his calibur.

Monarch is right. Don't forget, due to Ashen being a perennial this fight must take place in The House. The note on her profile says as much. One of the things about The House, is that fate exists there and time is cyclical. Even if he stops Ashen from pulling the trigger, the fact that she pulls the trigger at all means that he is still fated to die, and that is unavoidable. Even if the bullet doesn't do him in, something else will

Also, another reminder. Ashen has several months of prep at least, since that's about how long it would have taken for The Captain and Ashen to reach the orchard and cause Low 2-C destruction

 

[Sir_Ovens]

When you say time is cyclical, does that mean that other timeline exist? Because if Kars has even a moment to send out D4CU, it can make a completely unrelated Kars into the main Kars with prior knowledge and all that. New Kars doesn't share the same fate as the Kars that got shot.

 

[Sir_Ovens]

Also, this Kars doesn't have MiHU restricted. Which means that if another Kars survives, he can reset the world and make it so Ashen never became what she is today.

 

[Iapitus_The_Impaler]

Other universes exist, but they are not part of The House (which contains many higher dimensional objects and beings). I don't think D4CU could leave The House anyway, so I'm not sure how that would work. Ashen has plenty of prep, so I'm sure she will make many back up bullets (which would still work on the alternate Kars, since they share the same name). They will probably go head to head like this until Ashen goes into the mirror wise and tricks Kars to follow, at which point he will likely be shallowed by an infinite pillar of body parts or sucked into a higher dimensional vortex

 

[Iapitus_The_Impaler]

Also, this Kars doesn't have MiHU restricted. Which means that if another Kars survives, he can reset the world and make it so Ashen never became what she is today.

Ashen moves into one of the reflected worlds of the mirror wise or just shoots him while he is attempting to reset the universe

Tho now that i think about it, Kars's D4CU could still probably work by calling Alternate Kars from the alternate reflected worlds that exist throughout the mirror wise

 

[Walking_Strawman]

Ashen FRA

 

[Standuser081]

It still doesn't change the fact that D4CU can just create another universe where he can call upon another Kars.

 

[Walking_Strawman]

It was already established that it was just a theory, and that it is unknown if he can actually do it, so we don't count it

 

[Standuser081]

It's in his profile, so unless you make CRT, you'll have to count it.

 

[Walking_Strawman]

A CRT was made and the revisions went through, that's what we said. The stats were changed, its an error that its still there

 

[Sir_Ovens]

I concede. Ashen for the reasons above.

 

[Iapitus_The_Impaler]

What's the current vote counter anyway?

 

[Iapitus_The_Impaler]

bump

 

[LephyrTheRevanchist]

What is the proof that D4CU will survive past Kars's death and search out a new Kars on its own? I'm pretty sure Valentine always needed to transfer it while still alive.

In the Novel, an alternate Kars killed the Funny that had D4C. The stand simply flew to the Funny that was with Joji.

 

[LephyrTheRevanchist]

or just shoots him while he is attempting to reset the universe

How? MiH in the Novel can go into a couple thousand years in seconds, as demonstrated when Pucci activated it and in the time it took him to finish a sentence, the room they were in was crumbling to dust. With Speed Equal, this gives Kars an enormous boost.

 

[Standuser081]

Huh, speaking of, is there some way I can read JORGE JOESTAR online?

 

[LephyrTheRevanchist]

There is a translation you can easily download. Just search "jorge joestar pdf".

 

[Standuser081]

Ok, thanks.

 

[LephyrTheRevanchist]

Ashen doesn't know how to make them, so he can't get them from copying her, and he wouldn't know about the gunsmith who she has make them for her. Seeing the bullets themselves would only give him a fraction of the process needed, and wouldn't know about the chanting or singing that goes into it. He can't understand the effects either, because the second he is given a chance, he is already dead
-
He didn't saw D4C at any point in the Novel. He simply experienced it's effects. Yet manifested the physical form of the stand anyway.
He gets killed the first time. D4C brings a new Kars. Now he understands.

 

[Iapitus_The_Impaler]

Assuming seeing the writing is even enough, he probably wouldn't anyway. He would need to take the bullets out of the guns, which is unlikely. Also, Kars has no way to experience the full on future killing effects either. He isn't Medaka, so simply figuring out that it kills the futures won't be enough. You can't "experience" it in the way that he needs to.