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Huge MCU revision

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Imo, the Guardians of the Galaxy, Scarlet Witch, Ant-Man, Hawkeye, Black Widow, etc, being High Hypersonic are outliers. They mostly rely on circular scaling and are heavily contradicted by multiple depictions of inverse speed.

Sorry if this counts as derailing.
 
I wouldn't call it derailing. The issue with the MCU is that the vast majority of the cast fight each other and are mostly even speed wise. You can't downgrade Hawkeye without downgrading BP, and it goes from there.
 
Yeah I was talking about the Ragnarok Arena fight. He just stands there for like 20 seconds and gives a smile when he could've just dropped the hammer and moved back.
 
At this point, no. He had given up trying to calm Hulk down was trying to beat him into unconscious
 
Qawsedf234 said:
Yeah I was talking about the Ragnarok Arena fight. He just stands there for like 20 seconds and gives a smile when he could've just dropped the hammer and moved back.
Click to expand...
What are you even talking about? He stood there for like 20 seconds with a smile? Did you ignore all Thor's dialogue during the fight? Sun's getting real low? He could've just dropped the hammer and moved back? The random Sakaarian hammer Hulk threw at him after kicking him into the wall?
 
> He stood there for like 20 seconds with a smile?

After Hulk grabbed the hammer he just stood there doing nothing for over ten seconds

> Did you ignore all Thor's dialogue during the fight? Sun's getting real low?

Rigjt after that moment he says "Screw it" and takes the fight more seriously. Even so he still made a easily correctable mistake

> He could've just dropped the hammer and moved back?

Yes?

> The random Sakaarian hammer Hulk threw at him after kicking him into the wall?

The one he also avoided and could avoid because he's faster than Hulk
 
ByAsura said:
Imo, the Guardians of the Galaxy, Scarlet Witch, Ant-Man, Hawkeye, Black Widow, etc, being High Hypersonic are outliers. They mostly rely on circular scaling and are heavily contradicted by multiple depictions of inverse speed.
Sorry if this counts as derailing.
Click to expand...
No, this is absolutely true and due to the same shoddy scaling that wants 8-A Cap.

Only Iron Man, Thor and Hulk should be this fast.
 
Also there is literally only one MHS+ for Mjolnir and no MHS+ Flight Feat. High Hypersonic based on Iron Man is pushing it but as far as it goes. If anything the MCU deserves some heavy downgrades due to the frankly wrong scaling it goes through.
 
I think Captain America is the best example of that last sentence, not for the 8-A stuff, but in general.

"Held his own against a held-back Thanos, and managed to stagger him. Briefly fought Corvus Glaive, but he was easily defeated after Glaive started fighting more seriously. Held his own against Ultro."

"Caught an attack from Thanos with the Infinity Gauntlet. Was the only Avenger who managed to get back up against Thanos after Thanos blasted him with the Power Stone."

These are most certainly outliers, especially getting up from the Power Stone. The people included were Black Panther, Winter Soldier, Black Widow, and Wakanda fodder btw, people who are portrayed as equal or much weaker than Cap.
 
No, this is absolutely true and due to the same shoddy scaling that wants 8-A Cap.

Only Iron Man, Thor and Hulk should be this fast.

The issue with the MCU is that you'll have to upgrade everyone, because they can all keep up with each other in combat.
 
ByAsura said:
These are most certainly outliers, especially getting up from the Power Stone. The people included were Black Panther, Winter Soldier, Black Widow, and Wakanda fodder btw, people who are portrayed as equal or much weaker than Cap.
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I think these are fine examples of how he's "possibly higher". Getting up from the Power Stone blast should probably be removed though.
 
The scaling thing does have a point though. I think we should probably cut the long chain of scaling somewhere. Probably downgrade Scarlet Witch, Hawkeye, Black Widow and those who scale to Supersonic? Because Scarlet Witch somehow scales to Black Panther for blocking his attack on the Winter Soldier, but I find this scaling unreliable.

However, I disagree with removing the "likely higher" stuff except the Power Stone thing. Thanos wasn't even trying hard against Cap, and he tends to hold back. I calculated that punch against Cap to be only Street level (though I did not take into account the scene was in slow-motion, so the actual result would actually probably be around Wall level). Captain America also got quickly stomped by Corvus Glaive.

These "feats" are just shown to say that Cap is capable of holding his own against stronger characters.
 
He scales to Spider-Man, who's already possibly Higher, so I wasn't suggesting that.

Ultron (Vibranium Ultron in this case), Corvus, etc, are all beings who scale far above others who stomped him when he was clearly trying. That's a massive outlier. Harming Thanos in the slighest is also an outlier and it's unknown how much he's actually even holding back.

I'll put this in perspective. Star-Lord scales to Spider-Man just for keeping up with him once, Gamora scales to Star-Lord and Groot, who scales to the Outriders, fodder who everyone could keep up with, and Rocket scales to Gamora.

I won't get into Cap's speed, as that has something behind it but Ant-Man scales to Black Widow, who scales to Hawkeye, who is stated to be faster than Scarlet Witch, something that makes no sense as she "stopped Black Panther's attack on the Winter Soldier at the last second."

The scaling is mostly circular and contradictory. Their speed ratings mostly consists of Supersonic feats as well.
 
I think scaling everyone to a throwaway AoS atatement is still weird. Why not use Iron Man's tank stuff?
 
Yeah. The bulldozer thing seems like a textbook case of something making no sense. It's better than literally everything else Cap has done lifting wise. If we want to keep the rating why not switch to Iron Man lifting a tank in the spin-off comics or scale from War Machine.
 
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