Heaven Ascension DIO and Jotaro: Major Downgrade and Revisions

[DMB_1]

>Part 3 statement.
Yeah no, that doesn't justify indefinite time-stop.

 

[The_Smashor]

Well, since every time DIO stops time in Part 3 the time stop lasts longer (Unlike Jotaro) and he probably stopped time several times inbetween actually killing his universe's Jotaro and the events of EOH. His time stop probably isn't indefinate or even as long as his other non-canon versio, but it's probably longer then eleven seconds.

 

[DMB_1]

Yes, but you get my point.

 

[BlackDarkness679]

You are against that only cuz "lol statement" why would Dio words about his time stop be wrong, not indefinite, but say no just cuz its been said isnt a good reason

 

[Eficiente]

DIO wasn't wrong, his time stop would eventually be indefinite. Thing is this doesn't matter at all as he never reached that.

 

[DMB_1]

Dio's time-stop can never be infinite as it just lasts longer the more Dio uses it.

It will always last a finite amount of time.

 

[Eficiente]

It could also be said that its limit could just be eventually removed, not that the time stop would be infinte via literally slowly increasing its duration.

Not that it matters here.

 

[Monarch_Laciel]

Looks fine to me. Agreed

 

[DMB_1]

Since "post-soul absorption" Dio has no feats that are more impressive than his pre-absorption self, and he mentioned only to have been "re-charged", I guess making another key for him isn't really necessary.

But from what I can understand, the general consensus on what to downgrade HA Dio to would be this:

"At least 8-C physically, at least 8-C with The World Over Heaven. From 4-A to High 3-A with Reality Overwrite"

"Attack Potency: At least Building level+ (Should be superior to his canon self), at least Building level+ with The World Over Heaven (Harmed Star Platinum; should be superior to its previous form). From Multi-Solar System level (created a dimension with a Giant Black Sun in it, and that seems to have countless stars in the sky. When fully charged, he was able to warp the entire area to make it looks similar to the previously mentioned over Heaven Arena) to High Universe level with Reality Overwrite (able to erase Funny Valentine from each and every one of the infinite world parallel to the main universe. Valentine himself said that he would have not been able to stop him even if he had had the full Holy Corpse)"

 

[Ogbunabali]

I honestly think just High 3-A is fine.

 

[DMB_1]

I am still iffy about erasing someone from infinite world being High 3-A (especially in this case since Dio makes warping the world around him seem like a more impressive feat), but if people want this, I guess it's fine.

I might make a CRT about it later.

 

[Ogbunabali]

Well if we're trying to judge potency, RO erasing infinite Valentines across infinite universes is the best thing he has displayed. And maybe shaping the world around him is more impressive because it's AoE and on a bigger scale technically than just a concentrated on a single person, even if it's across infinite universes.

Or the most likely explanation is that the author doesn't actually realize which feat is actually more impressive, like how in fiction a guy can create a storm across the planet and somehow destroying a giant rock would be more impressive.

 

[Black_knight_of_the_darkness]

Why does dio have type 1 immortality despite his age being unknown

 

[DMB_1]

Because the events from part 1 to 3 (where he was 120 years old) still played out in the timeline where he came from, we just don't know how old he is now.

Besides, Kars makes it specifically clear that the Stone Masks give you Type 1 Immortality.

 

[Black_knight_of_the_darkness]

Oh

 

[KaizukaZekrom]

I agree with this.

 

[DMB_1]

So basically, those will be the changes:

"At least 8-C physically, at least 8-C with The World Over Heaven. High 3-A with Reality Overwrite"

"Powers and Abilities: Superhuman Physical Characteristics, Enhanced Senses, Has all of his abilities from his canon counterpart, Can cast Lightning Bolts, Teleportation, Enhanced Regenerationn (High-Mid, should be at least the same as his canon counterpart) Can heal any injuries instantly with TWOH, albeit this has to be done manually by hand), Time Stop (Can stop time indefinitely Via The World Over Heaven), Immortality (Types 1 and 3), Corruption (Type 2), Power Bestowal (grants the ability to travel through Parallel Universes and through Time to anyone he corrupts), Time Travel , Soul Manipulation (Can steal souls and make them his slaves as well as absorb them to further increase his power), Reality Overwrite, Power Nullification (Allows Heaven DIO to overwrite/warp people and things out of existence in any timeline by touching them, as well as nullifying any attacks, like GER and Tusk Act 4. Valentine himself said that he would have not been able to stop him even if he had had the full Holy Corpse), Can resurrect the dead, Dimensional Travel, BFR (Through Teleportation and Time Travel), Creation (He created the Over Heaven Area), Summoning (Can summon some sort of Purple Aura to attack his enemies. Able to summons his minions, like Enya the Hag). The Corpse Parts grant him the following abilities: Holy Manipulation, Purification, Resistance to Transmutation and to Corruption"

"Attack Potency: At least Building level+ (Should be superior to his canon self), at least Building level+ with The World Over Heaven (Harmed Star Platinum; should be superior to its previous form). High Universe level with Reality Overwrite (able to erase Funny Valentine from each and every one of the infinite world parallel to the main universe. Valentine himself said that he would have not been able to stop him even if he had had the full Holy Corpse)"

 

[Sir_Ovens]

I'm fine with this.

 

[Qliphoth_Bacikal]

Fine enough.

 

[The_Smashor]

Remove the indifinate time stop part. Just say he can likely stop time for longer than eleven seconds.

 

[DMB_1]

I'll just write something like:

"While the duration of his time-stop should be superior to his Part 3 counterpart, it's unknown how much time it fully lasts".

 

[The_Smashor]

Yes.

 

[Antvasima]

I suppose that this seems to make sense, but you should preferably ask the staff members listed in the JoJo's Bizarre Adventure page to comment here.

 

[TriforcePower1]

I agree with DMB1's changes

 

[DMB_1]

Oh yeah, add Fate Manipulation to Dio as Jotaro has it too (though rather than just having it straightly, change for both of them to have a "possibly/likely", as it's never really stated, and what Jotaro did is more open to interpretations).

 

[The_New_God]

Isn't HA DIO above Pucci? Is Pucci's Low 2-C gonna be affected?

 

[DMB_1]

Pucci is Low 2-C via accelerating the entire Universe's time to the point of reset, which has nothing to do with AP or Reality Warping like Dio.

Dio never really got all of the 36 sinners' souls, which are the thing that would have allowed him to overwrite all of the main worlds.

And lastly, Heaven is a very unexplored concept, we can't really just scale one Stand to another like that.

 

[The_New_God]

Also is TWOH's speed getting downgraded or it's still infinite?

 

[DMB_1]

If GER's speed gets downgraded, TWOH gets downgraded too.

But to be fair, neither of them is ever portrayed as having infinite speed. In fact, when Dio mops the floor with them, the characters are perfectly aware of what's going on, and they even describe the situation.

 

[Genericstickman]

Shouldn't Jotaro have Acausality 1

also would a key for HAD with the 36 souls be allowed???

 

[Qliphoth_Bacikal]

Pretty sure I said my thoughts simple and straight to the point but I'll try again lol.

The new changes to the page is good. Time Stop should definitely be written off to something not viewed as indefinite as we don't truly know how much he's managed to stop time by the events of EoH's storyline.

The "Heaven stands", as I just made up to call Pucci's and Heaven DIO's stands, work differently from one another despite deriving from the same ritual/idea more or less. And as DMB 1 said, Heaven's an unexplored concept that we never got to really know more about in both canon and in this game AFAIK.

If GER's speed is getting downgraded and TWOH's does as well, so should EoH Jotaro's Star Platinum.

 

[Antvasima]

I suppose that this seems to make sense, but you should preferably ask the staff members listed in the JoJo's Bizarre Adventure page to comment here.

Has anybody done this yet?

 

[Antvasima]

@Qliphoth

Okay. That seems to make sense.

 

[GojiBoyForever]

@Antvasima

I will do that right now.

 

[Eficiente]

@Ant I believe there is enough acceptation here to generate the changes.

 

[Shubham_Sonsurkar]

Farmer with the Rifle solos

 

[DMB_1]

Shouldn't Jotaro have Acausality 1
also would a key for HAD with the 36 souls be allowed???

No, because Jotaro never killed himself from the past, at best he just changed his own fate.

No, because he never got all souls.

 

[Antvasima]

@Ant I believe there is enough acceptation here to generate the changes.

Maybe, but I would prefer a bit more staff input first.

 

[The_New_God]

Now that GER doesn't have a High 3-A key anymore, what tier should Reality Overwrite be now?

 

[DMB_1]

Still High 3-A since RO's rating wasn't related to GER.