Goku vs. Garou (Martial Arts Battle)

[azontr]

Okay.. you got it. RoR Sasaki

Actually wait don't make the match I'm scared Garou may just lol evolve him to death even though that's also what Kojiro does.

 

[Greatsage13th]

Actually wait don't make the match I'm scared Garou may just lol evolve him to death even though that's also what Kojiro does.

That'd be pretty based.

 

[GilverTheProtoAngelo]

First I have to see if it was already done or not recently

 

[azontr]

That'd be pretty based.

 

[DaReaperMan]

Heyyyyy you are already making ton of Garou vs Warhammer dudes.. first that Grimgor guy then Chakax....

Because that was a versus thread, which meant I had to adapt to Garou's own ridiculous adaptation

 

[Jibz]

Naw deadass how many talking points do they gotta be to justify 13 pages

 

[Greatsage13th]

Naw deadass how many talking points do they gotta be to justify 13 pages

No idea

 

[GilverTheProtoAngelo]

https://vsbattles.com/threads/garou-vs-sasaki-skillz-series.138709/post-4881437

 

[BOEGVELD]

It's not And Garou used it back before he ever had energy manipulation.

Neither of these two are Durability Negation though. The latter's not even implied to be Fa Jin iirc. GFJ is in a category on its own.

Roaring Aura Sky Ripping Fist is a martial art that Bang and Bomb use in tandem to send shockwaves and destroy the opponent from the inside as well which is something Garou is shown to use.

I assumed we were already talking about this lmfao But yeah, this one is done via Shockwave Generation. That's restricted here.

But they're hax regardless of how they're achieved. This battle is purely about h2h combat.

 

[BOEGVELD]

Regular FJ isn't energy based. It's pure Martial Arts

When was this implied to be Fa Jin? I must've missed it. Though this isn't Durability Negation rgeardless. Unless coughing up blood from a stomach punch qualifies for Durability Negation, but then even Goku has Durability Negation from MA.

"A wicked style that brings total devastation"

It being a style doesn't negate the fact that it's achieved via an ability; Shockwave Generation.

 

[Scython]

Once again, stat equalized.

resistances still count.

Hitting pressure points and hitting someone's organs directly are two different things lol. IRL martial artists target pressure points but that doesn't suddenly mean they can crush your kidneys or some shit by hitting a pressure point.

Granola targets your vitals. Organs are considered to be vitals. Goku didn't get killed instantly by that attack and later on that same attack no longer worked. And that was before goku had ui. And I think before the hakai resistance feat.
Also after that goku tanked multiple attacks to his vitals by a stronger person. The shockwave wouldn't be a problem because goku cancelled out a stronger shockwave that had more range than garou's shockwave.
The insta kill thing wouldn't work because goku endured the potent toxin and resisted hakai. And on top of that goku can keep incoming attacks from hitting his vitals and shift his vitals. There was also that feat of goku resisting then breaking out of gas's spell. Something that was crushing goku with his own energy. So all aspects of what garou's dura neg can do are covered.

 

[JustANormalPerson01]

resistances still count.

Granola targets your vitals. Organs are considered to be vitals. Goku didn't get killed instantly by that attack and later on that same attack no longer worked.

Because he understood how to counter it: he shifted his body so the attacks don't instantly hit his vitals. It's not like Goku became resistant or immune to such attacks, he just learnt how to counter it

And that was before goku had ui.

Iirc Goku was able to counter pressure points because UI allowed him to instinctively switch his body before the attack hits

And I think before the hakai resistance feat.

I think enough people told you hakai has nothing to do with Garou's Dura Neg

Also after that goku tanked multiple attacks to his vitals by a stronger person. The shockwave wouldn't be a problem because goku cancelled out a stronger shockwave that had more range than garou's shockwave.

Goku cancelled a shockwave by hitting with the same force and angle, he's not resistant to it, and there is no proof such shockwave crossed and tried to destroy his inside, otherwise all people of Earth would be either die because their insides were crushed, or have durability big enough to endure a shockwave of such magnitude.

Both interpretations are wrong, it's just that Beerus'&Goku's universal shockwave don't damage insides

The insta kill thing wouldn't work because goku endured the potent toxin and resisted hakai.

.......

And on top of that goku can keep incoming attacks from hitting his vitals and shift his vitals.

There is no point of shifting your vitals if even a glaze of an attack covers your entire body

There was also that feat of goku resisting then breaking out of gas's spell. Something that was crushing goku with his own energy.

From what you've described, that's not dura neg

So all aspects of what garou's dura neg can do are covered.

No.

 

[Scython]

Because he understood how to counter it: he shifted his body so the attacks don't instantly hit his vitals. It's not like Goku became resistant or immune to such attacks, he just learnt how to counter it

Iirc Goku was able to counter pressure points because UI allowed him to instinctively switch his body before the attack hits

I think enough people told you hakai has nothing to do with Garou's Dura Neg

Goku cancelled a shockwave by hitting with the same force and angle, he's not resistant to it, and there is no proof such shockwave crossed and tried to destroy his inside, otherwise all people of Earth would be either die because their insides were crushed, or have durability big enough to endure a shockwave of such magnitude.

Both interpretations are wrong, it's just that Beerus'&Goku's universal shockwave don't damage insides

.......

There is no point of shifting your vitals if even a glaze of an attack covers your entire body

From what you've described, that's not dura neg

No.

Exactly goku countered an attack that targeted his vitals. He can shift his vitals and protect them from incoming attacks. Garou's dura neg targets the organs which is a vital. And he's never used his dura neg on someone who can do what goku can. So that aspect is covered.
Hakai effects the body, surrounds the body and erases the body in its entirety. And gas used a spell on goku that vegeta said could've crushed them if they didn't keep it together and goku resisted it then broke free of it. The shockwave around the body aspect is covered so is the effect garou's dura neg has on the bones. Yes.

 

[JustANormalPerson01]

Exactly goku countered an attack that targeted his vitals.

He just moved his body a bit, and still was heavily affected by the attack, it was just he didn't immediatly knock out.

He can shift his vitals and protect them from incoming attacks. Garou's dura neg targets the organs which is a vital.

Here, a way less perfectionated attack, from just a glance damaged the entire torso of Bang, shifting a bit vitals to not hit pressure points does not compare.

And he's never used his dura neg who can do what goku can. So that aspect is covered.
Hakai effects the body, surrounds the body and erases the body in its entirety.

Bro... many people has already told you that resisting hakai does not cover all kinds of durability negation. Goku resists being erased from existence, all here know that. But does he resist a shockwave breaking his entire inside? No.

They've even shown you examples of Goku being dura-negged by Hit despite being resistent to Hakai.

And gas used a spell on goku that vegeta said could've crushed them if they didn't keep it together and goku resisted it then broke free of it.

That's a lifting strength feat, not a dura-neg resistance feat

The shockwave around the body aspect is covered so is the effect garou's dura neg has on the bones. Yes.

No, it isn't

 

[Scython]

He just moved his body a bit, and still was heavily affected by the attack, it was just he didn't immediatly knock out.

Here, a way less perfectionated attack, from just a glance damaged the entire torso of Bang, shifting a bit vitals to not hit pressure points does not compare.

Bro... many people has already told you that resisting hakai does not cover all kinds of durability negation. Goku resists being erased from existence, all here know that. But does he resist a shockwave breaking his entire inside? No.

They've even shown you examples of Goku being dura-negged by Hit despite being resistent to Hakai.

That's a lifting strength feat, not a dura-neg resistance feat

No, it isn't

Hits dura neg no longer worked the 2nd time. And that was also before goku had ui. Granola targets the vitals. And goku wasn't effected at all by it. Goku tells granola that his vital attacks will no longer work and they didn't. Goku also being able to protect his vitals from incoming attacks is different from being able to shift his vitals too. Which is something he can also do. Goku resisted and broke out of a force that enveloped his body and could've crushed him. Hakai envelops your body and erases it from existence. Goku can also cancel out shockwaves. And goku will be using ui. He's going to be avoiding all of garou's attacks. Garou's never fought against someone like ui goku. Whereas goku has fought against angel moro.

 

[JustANormalPerson01]

Hits dura neg no longer worked the 2nd time.

Show proof Goku was hit directly on his pressure points and it didn't work. Because at least now profiles does not supoort you

And that was also before goku had ui.
Granola targets the vitals. And goku wasn't effected at all by it. Goku tells granola that his vital attacks will no longer work and they didn't.

because he's able to shift his vitals.

Goku also being able to protect his vitals from incoming attacks is different from being able to shift his vitals too.

Goku has never protected his vitals in a different way than shifting it so Granolah doesn't hit them.

Which is something he can also do. Goku resisted and broke out of a force that enveloped his body and could've crushed him.

Which, again, is just a lifting strength feat

Hakai envelops your body and erases it from existence.

Doesn't matter

Goku can also cancel out shockwaves.

Which don't have durability negation, so it doesn't matter. And again, he did it by punching with the same force and angle, he also didn't do it at first, but when he knew that there were strong shockwaves he should take care of, so he won't do it at first on this battle.

And, again, Garou does not even need to touch Garou's body to incapacitate him, just a glaze of his attacks are enough.

And goku will be using ui. He's going to be avoiding all of garou's attacks.

Again, even if Garou don't directly hit Goku, which I doubt because Garou has also a kinda good IR, just a graze is enough.

Garou's never fought against someone like ui goku. Whereas goku has fought against angel moro.

And?

 

[Scython]

Show proof Goku was hit directly on his pressure points and it didn't work. Because at least now profiles does not supoort you

because he's able to shift his vitals.

Goku has never protected his vitals in a different way than shifting it so Granolah doesn't hit them.

Which, again, is just a lifting strength feat

Doesn't matter

Which don't have durability negation, so it doesn't matter. And again, he did it by punching with the same force and angle, he also didn't do it at first, but when he knew that there were strong shockwaves he should take care of, so he won't do it at first on this battle.

And, again, Garou does not even need to touch Garou's body to incapacitate him, just a glaze of his attacks are enough.

Again, even if Garou don't directly hit Goku, which I doubt because Garou has also a kinda good IR, just a graze is enough.

And?

Goku was hit in his neck and in the abdomen. Before that granola hit his neck prior, shoulders, and chest. He also punches him in the same chest area where he hit goku with his vital point attack. Goku's able to shift his vitals and before that during the Top whis commented that goku was able to protect his vitals from incoming attacks. Gas's spell was a force that enveloped goku's body and tried to crush him. Hakai is another force that envelops your entire body and erases it from existence. Saying goku didn't do it at first is a moot point. He's developed past that point. So he's going to have no problems canceling out garou's shockwaves the 1st time. Goku's ir is better and so is his analytical prediction. And garou's ir isn't as good as ui and goku fought against someone who also had ui and beat him.

 

[JustANormalPerson01]

Goku was hit in his neck and in the abdomen. Before that granola hit his neck prior, shoulders, and chest. He also punches him in the same chest area where he hit goku with his vital point attack. Goku's able to shift his vitals and before that during the Top whis commented that goku was able to protect his vitals from incoming attacks.

Show scan

Gas's spell was a force that enveloped goku's body and tried to crush him.

Not Durability Negation

Hakai another force envelops your entire body and erases it from existence.

Not related to Garou's durability negation

Saying goku didn't do it at first is a moot point. He's developed past that point.

And? Goku does not know Garou'll use shockwaves to cross and break his entire body from the inside. How many times did he cancel shockwaves after his fight against Beerus? None. So, assuming he'll punch Garou with the same force and angle to counter shockwaves he doesn't know Garou has is wrong

So he's going to have no problems canceling out garou's shockwaves the 1st time.

He's no problem doing it. But he won't do it.

Goku's ir is better

Debatable

and so is his analytical prediction.

The only "better feat" was predicting time stop, which as @Phoenks said, is not a good as you think it is

 

[GilverTheProtoAngelo]

Hakai is another force that envelops your entire body and erases it from existence.

Persistence won't net you any results here lad.... save your efforts. EE=/=Vibrations.

 

[Scython]

Show scan

Not Durability Negation

Not related to Garou's durability negation

And? Goku does not know Garou'll use shockwaves to cross and break his entire body from the inside. How many times did he cancel shockwaves after his fight against Beerus? None. So, assuming he'll punch Garou with the same force and angle to counter shockwaves he doesn't know Garou has is wrong

He's no problem doing it. But he won't do it.

Debatable

The only "better feat" was predicting time stop, which as @Phoenks said, is not a good as you think it is

Ui leaves no openings. Goku has better er and analytical prediction than garou. Goku couldn't see, sense or read hit. Hit was also stronger, faster and was skipping in time. Hit is also a trained assassin. Goku can shift his vitals and protect them from incoming attacks. Goku fought against someone with the same ir as him and beat him. Garou lost against his own fighting style. Goku's resisted 2 instances of enveloping forces one could've crushed him and the other is erasure. And goku can cancel out shockwaves.

 

[JustANormalPerson01]

Ui leaves no openings.

There is no need of opening the graze of a punch to connect your body

Goku has better er and analytical prediction than garou.

Debatable again

Goku couldn't see, sense or read hit. Hit was also stronger, faster and was skipping in time. Hit is also a trained assassin.

It doesn't seem he can't see Hit here.

Goku can shift his vitals and protect them from incoming attacks.

already answered several times

Goku fought against someone with the same ir as him and beat him.

Beat him with help + Moro losing control over his strength as well as becoming crazy for the amount of energy.

And, what about that? Garou also fought against people as skilled as him

Garou lost against his own fighting style.

Talking about a way weaker version of Garou

Goku's resisted 2 instances of enveloping forces one could've crushed him and the other is erasure. And goku can cancel out shockwaves.

Already answered several times.

You are just repeating yourself right now

 

[Scython]

There is no need of opening the graze of a punch to connect your body

Debatable again

It doesn't seem he can't see Hit here.

already answered several times

Beat him with help + Moro losing control over his strength as well as becoming crazy for the amount of energy.

And, what about that? Garou also fought against people as skilled as him

Talking about a way weaker version of Garou

Already answered several times.

You are just repeating yourself right now

Garou's not touching him. You saying it's debatable doesn't make it true. Okay he could see him. Everything else still applies. And the time skip feat was performed by goku without ui. I'm talking about angel moro not planet moro. Garou lost against his own fighting style being used against him. Goku beat angel moro. Someone on a similar level and who had ui.
Point being garou lost against someone using his own fighting style against him. Goku beat someone with the same ir as him. That's just one instance of the difference in skills between goku and garou. I'm not the only one repeating myself. And I'm not going to stop doing that. I don't see any good arguments being made against what I'm saying and have said.

 

[JustANormalPerson01]

Garou's not touching him. You saying it's debatable doesn't make it true.

It is debatable lmao

Okay he could see him. Everything else still applies. And the time skip feat was performed by goku without ui.

Which, as already argued here, is not as good as people wants it to be

I'm talking about angel moro not planet moro.

Angel Moro was just beaten because his body couldn't withstand the power of an Angel

Garou lost against his own fighting style being used against him.

Again: a way weaker and less skilled version of Garou

Goku beat angel moro. Someone on a similar level and who had ui.

Another time repeating yourself

Point being garou lost against someone using his own fighting style against him. Goku beat someone with the same ir as him.

And another time

That's just one instance of the difference in skills between goku and garou. I'm not the only one repeating myself.

Yes, you are. If I'm repeating myself is because I'm endlessly trying to convience you resisting poison and hakai is not resistance to Garou's shockwaves, neither is counter a shockwave which doesn't negate durability

And I'm not going to stop doing that. I don't see any good arguments being made against what I'm saying and have said.

Bro... literally everyone on this thread explained you that resisting hakai is not resisting Garou's dura neg. And Beerus & Goku shockwaves don't have dura neg, Goku won't start with that since he knows Garou could create shockwaves, it's not even necessary to touch Garou for dura negging him, etc.

 

[Scython]

It is debatable lmao

Which, as already argued here, is not as good as people wants it to be

Angel Moro was just beaten because his body couldn't withstand the power of an Angel

Again: a way weaker and less skilled version of Garou

Another time repeating yourself

And another time

Yes, you are. If I'm repeating myself is because I'm endlessly trying to convience you resisting poison and hakai is not resistance to Garou's shockwaves, neither is counter a shockwave which doesn't negate durability

Bro... literally everyone on this thread explained you that resisting hakai is not resisting Garou's dura neg. And Beerus & Goku shockwaves don't have dura neg, Goku won't start with that since he knows Garou could create shockwaves, it's not even necessary to touch Garou for dura negging him, etc.

It wasn't everyone. Just the same people repeating the same things. And they're not good rebuttals or arguments. Goku's shown a resistance to a stronger enveloping force higher than what garou's shockwave does. And the response to that is it's not the same. Yeah it's greater. And all you're saying is that their ap is debatable. That's not even a rebuttal or an argument. Angel moro was beaten because goku beat him down.

 

[Shubham_Sonsurkar]

Didn't UI dodged an AOE attack where there was no opening?

 

[JustANormalPerson01]

It wasn't everyone. Just the same people repeating the same things. And they're not good rebuttals or arguments. Goku's shown a resistance to a stronger enveloping force higher than what garou's shockwave does.

Bro... it's not a stronger, but a different one. Yeah, the consequences are stronger, but it does not make Goku immediatly immune to Garou's dura neg. That's like saying that since Goku resisted Hakai, which erases all aspects of you (talking in DB terms), he'll be unaffected by a common ki attack which only damages your body.

Which is wrong

And the response to that is it's not the same. Yeah it's greater. And all you're saying is that their ap is debatable.

Dura neg has no AP lmao

That's not even a rebuttal or an argument. Angel moro was beaten because goku beat him down.

Angel Moro was beaten because he lost control over the Angel power so he needed a bigger body to control it

 

[BOEGVELD]

Didn't UI dodged an AOE attack where there was no opening?

What?

 

[Scython]

Bro... it's not a stronger, but a different one. Yeah, the consequences are stronger, but it does not make Goku immediatly immune to Garou's dura neg. That's like saying that since Goku resisted Hakai, which erases all aspects of you (talking in DB terms), he'll be unaffected by a common ki attack which only damages your body.

Which is wrong

Dura neg has no AP lmao

Angel Moro was beaten because he lost control over the Angel power so he needed a bigger body to control it

I'm not talking about immunity. When it comes the effect of the shockwave goku has resisted a greater effect. He's also resisted a force that was trying to crush him. Coupled with goku being able to shift his vitals and protect them. And goku's able to cancel out shockwaves. So with all of that in mind I don't see garou's dura neg being a problem. Not to mention that with ui goku will have better ir and his analytical prediction which I shortened to ap is better than garou's. So garou's not going to be able to land anything. And angel moro merged with the planet after goku beat him.

 

[BOEGVELD]

Exactly goku countered an attack that targeted his vitals.

Garou's not targeting vital points though. His ability targets your internal organs. Goku can't shift those.

Garou's not touching him.

But I still agree with this. Active Instinctive Reactions combined with better Analytical Prediction, Enhanced Senses and Extrasensory Perception makes it hard for Garou to do anything.

 

[Shubham_Sonsurkar]

What?

if I remember correctly it was an AOE attack from Moro which Goku somehow dodged

 

[JustANormalPerson01]

I'm not talking about immunity. When it comes the effect of the shockwave goku has resisted a greater effect.

He hasn't resisted a shockwave damaging his insides, as I already told you

He's also resisted a force that was trying to crush him.

Just LS feat, as I already told you

Coupled with goku being able to shift his vitals and protect them.

Already answered several times, I'm not gonna copy-paste the same paragraph more

And goku's able to cancel out shockwaves

already ansered x2

. So with all of that in mind I don't see garou's dura neg being a problem.

Even if you can't see, it is

Not to mention that with ui goku will have better ir and his analytical prediction

Debatable

which I shortened to ap is better than garou's. So garou's not going to be able to land anything. And angel moro merged with the planet after goku beat him.

False

 

[Shubham_Sonsurkar]

if I remember correctly it was an AOE attack from Moro which Goku somehow dodged

^ok it was Moro's passive absorption which he somehow dodge for some reason....

 

[Dienomite22]

Neither of these two are Durability Negation though.

They are both durability negation. GFJ is just an advanced Fa Jin.

The latter's not even implied to be Fa Jin iirc. GFJ is in a category on its own.

We know the latter is a Fa Jin attack because the attack strikes the same with Garou shoving his palms on his opponent each time time he uses Fa Jin and the result is the same as they both reduced the surrounding infrastructure to dust.

I assumed we were already talking about this lmfao But yeah, this one is done via Shockwave Generation. That's restricted here.
But they're hax regardless of how they're achieved. This battle is purely about h2h combat.

It's impossible to restrict the Shockwave generation when the martial arts technique is made around producing it. The OP didn't restrict their techniques. It's still a hand-to-hand technique and doesn't fit the restrictions within the OP.

 

[Scython]

Garou's targeting vital points though. His ability targets your internal organs. Goku can't shift those.


But I still agree with this. Active Instinctive Reactions combined with better Analytical Prediction, Enhanced Senses and Extrasensory Perception makes it hard for Garou to do anything.

Granola's attacks was just said to target vitals. And from what was shown granola targeted, the neck, body, chest, shoulder and abdomen. Goku said he could shift his vitals. Goku can also protect his vitals from incoming attacks then there's goku resisting gas's spell and breaking out of. At least we agree on the latter part. With the active instinctive stuff etc.

He hasn't resisted a shockwave damaging his insides, as I already told you

Just LS feat, as I already told you

Already answered several times, I'm not gonna copy-paste the same paragraph more

already ansered x2

Even if you can't see, it is

Debatable

False

Goku can cancel out shockwaves, block/deflect intangible attacks, can shift his vitals and protect them from incoming attacks. He's resisted and broken out of a force that was trying to crush him. And he's fought multiple times with a hole in his chest. When goku beat angel moro and was about to finish him off it was then angel moro merged with the planet. Goku still beat him though.

 

[Shubham_Sonsurkar]

Honestly, I am not even gonna vote since I am gonna see how exactly Garou is gonna deal with Saitama's serious punches since he can only copy techniques, not AP.
Unless he now somehow goes intangible.

 

[Scython]

Goku can cancel out attacks. Block/deflect intangible attacks. Is able to shift his vitals/protect them from incoming attacks. And has resisted and broken out of a force that was trying to crush him. He can also fight with a hole in his chest. He beat angel moro someone who also had ui. While garou lost against his own technique being used against him. Goku has better ir, analytical prediction, enhanced senses, and extrasensory perception than garou. And that's why to me he'd beat garou. Don't think I'm going to reply anymore to this thread. I've said all I wanted to say. If there's voting mines will be for goku.

 

[Dienomite22]

Honestly, I am not even gonna vote since I am gonna see how exactly Garou is gonna deal with Saitama's serious punches since he can only copy techniques, not AP.
Unless he now somehow goes intangible.

Garou can actually copies AP as well according to the last chapter. Not applicable here since equal stats and he hasn't been shown to copy the strength of things on the level of unrestricted Goku but it's still crazy.

 

[BOEGVELD]

They are both durability negation. GFJ is just an advanced Fa Jin.

Neither his attack against Blackluster or EFJ are implied to be any form of Durability Negation. Also, if making some cough up blood with an attack qualifies for Durability Negation, then Goku has numerous DN attacks as well.

We know the latter is a Fa Jin attack because the attack strikes the same with Garou shoving his palms on his opponent each time time he uses Fa Jin and the result is the same as they both reduced the surrounding infrastructure to dust.

His attack against Blackluster were not with the palm of his hands. And EFJ is literally just Garou grabbing Saitama's torso and slamming him down.

It's impossible to restrict the Shockwave generation when the martial arts technique is made around producing it. The OP didn't restrict their techniques. It's still a hand-to-hand technique and doesn't fit the restrictions within the OP.

It's not purely a hand-to-hand combat technique, so of course it's possible to restrict it.

 

[DTG499]

Bro Schyton came straight from a 2012 screw attack YouTube comment section.

 

[MonkeyOfLife]

Wow.

Idk...