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Galactic Gizoid, Master Core: ABIS + Eggman Shuffle Leftovers

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3-C Ultimate Emerl:
Ultimate Emerl currently scales to the value of the 4-A Final Egg Blaster (465.36463094381646829516462257912 ExaFoe), due to having absorbed its power. One thing we failed to account for, however, is that Emerl also had all 7 Chaos Emeralds on him at this time, which means that thier accepted multipliers would amplify his power, and by extension, the power he absorbed from the FEB, accordingly. Keep in mind that Emerl didn't JUST copy the FEB's power. He assimilated the entire weapon into himself. This is how Emerl's copy abillity is described to work:
"Computer: Technique to acquire all forms of weaponry is based on super-science technology... This process has no apparent limitations and will continue to loop indefinitely."
Supported by the fact that Emerl can copy every other fighter's weapon in Sonic Battle to perfection.
So all 7 Emeralds together would amount to a 128x multiplier to the weapon and its power flowing through him, resulting in an attack potency of 59.567 zettafoe. Around 5 times greater than baseline 3-C. Made more consistant by the feat that happens just a few games later, this being...

3-B Master Core: ABIS (Supplementary):
(Credit to MysticMania for this section)
In Sonic Riders: Zero Gravity, the final boss merges with both the powers of the 5 Arks Of The Cosmos, and the core unit of Astral Babylon; and in this merging, they create a black hole.
There is more to this black hole, though, as multiple stars and galaxies can be seen inside of it. If you look towards the top of the screen, during the starting countdown, they can be spotted swirling, flying around. I do greatly believe that the final boss, Master Core: ABIS, created these stars and galaxies right alongside the black hole.
This is instead currently accepted as a speed feat of Team Sonic and the Babylon Rogues travelling to those distant galaxies, but here's why I think it should be removed and replaced with a 3-B creation feat for Master Core: ABIS instead.

The stars and galaxies very much seem to be inside of the black hole. Considering how they move, even when the player/characters are standing still, and that there is no color tinting on them, they must be depicted as inside the black hole. If they were outside, they would move in relation to the characters, and not unsynced as they are, and they would likely be tinted either black or purple, due to (in this scenario) being seen outside of the black hole. Furthermore we can faintly see Earth outside of the black hole, and it exactly matches this exact description for what celestial objects outside of this black hole would look like. If you look left, here, and look right at this point, you can see the Earth steadily move into view as the player races forth the track with Sonic. (Looking through the blue paneling on the track itself may help in spotting Earth.)
I also do not think there was enough time for the black hole to pull in these stars and galaxies from outside (which would be inconsistent with Earth not yet being pulled inside and presumably the moon, too). The characters do get to Astral Babylon very quickly, and on top of this being an urgent situation in-universe, the game gives you a time limit of only five minutes to shut down the black hole. So, I think ABIS created the stars and galaxies at the same time as the black hole.

As for the exact potency of this creation feat. It is hard to tell just by looking at the background. We know the black hole has more than one galaxy just by looking at the background, but I don't think the exact amount and therefore the exact potency can be figured out just by sending this to a calc member. In this context, I would be fine with a low-ball of baseline 3-B, but I'm open to suggestions.

Edit: Mephistus has accepted to calculate this feat if its premise is accepted!

Now here's the stuff Ieft out from my last CRT:
Eggman Shuffle Leftovers
-Ice Manipulation and Status Effect Inducement (1 layer): (Can fire ice beams to trap foes in blocks of ice that not even Sonic and Tails can break out of, despite normally being able to do so easily)

-Electricity Manipulation: (Shown here)

-Heat Manipulation and Creation: (Has a large floating orb capable of creating rings and blasting heat to push back Team Sonic)

-Size manipulation and Statistics Amplification: (Can enlarge other characters and amplify them to the point that they can one-shot and flatten fighters who were previously comparable to them)

-Hammerspace Manipulation and possibly Body Puppetry: (Can drain the rings of 3 heroes at once using a beam. All 3 of them will then chase after the remaining character instead of attacking the Egg Mobile to make it stop, and one of them will only be able to escape the beam's effect after they succesfully attack the remaining hero, subjecting them to the beam's effects in thier stead)

More Forcejewel Abillities:
-(Additional) Body Puppetry: (The Curse Opal can "annoy" an opponent by forcing them to stay still for a certain number of turns (5 at most)

-Dimensional Storage Manipulation: Deletite can destroy items stored inside other characters' hammerspaces while Thief's Eye can steal them)

-Inventory Duplication: (Duplichaos transforms into a copy of a Forcejewel already in the player's inventory)


With Blockite:
-Resistance to all the effects listed above (It should also be noted on profiles that Blockite is a one-time use item. Once it succesfully shields thier user from a negative effect once, it can't be used again)

-Also, if anyone can find evidence that Eggman's hammerspace manipulation works on characters who hold Blockite (which I suspect it does), that would give this abillity of his 1 layer (since Blockite does in fact also prevent the user's cards from being meddled with by other means. Good luck proving that with the limited footage we have of Sonic Shuffle though.

More Eggman Empire Additions
-Duplication: (With one beam attack, Eggman can create a near perfect duplicate of someone, down to the same abillities, the same weapons, and comparable combat skills and fighting style)

-Damage Transferal/Limited Durabillity Negation: (Eggman has a laser which can one-shot Sonic without even needing to make him drop his rings, the same is true for the Egg Robo's black hole according to its profile)

-Modern Egg Pawns can keep up with Team Dark's speed immediately prior to the events of Sonic Generations. They can even dodge Omega's gunfire, only being unable to land a hit due to the skill gap. This should grant them "Likely Infinite" speed

-Eggman should have Power Cores and Chaos Drives in his standard equipment since he has used them to power his machines in the past and is still explicitely shown to use Chaos Drives in the Modern Era, while Power Cores are still of relevance in his empire

Extra
-Minor Attack Reflection: (Spin Dash users can reflect weak projectiles with the start-up of thier technique)
-Bean and Espio can both teleport after activating Hyper Mode


Agree (7): Eseseso, TheUser789, (both neutral on 3-B feat), MysticMania, ShakeResounding, ShionAH, Maverick_Zero_X, LordGriffin1000
Disagree:
Neutral:
 
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I think it's more that it's space travel then making galaxies.
So despite the evidence presented, you still think those galaxies are outside the black hole and that said black hole is a threat to the planet despite being lightyears away from it. Am I getting this right?
Power absorption and body puppetry?
Seems like the most likely interpretation. We can always attach a "possibly" to it if necessary.
 
Didn't Emeral already have the 128× boost from the emeralds because if so I don't know why he would get another 128× amp after already having the first one.
 
What standards. Emeral isn't picking up another 7 chaos emeralds to get a multiplier.
And no one is saying he is. The Emerald multiplier just multiplies all of Emerl's power, including the power he absorbed from the FEB
 
And no one is saying he is. The Emerald multiplier just multiplies all of Emerl's power, including the power he absorbed from the FEB
For that to be true it would mean that the emeralds give Emeral a 128× multiplier every time he increases in power for any reason which isn't reasonable and I can show what I mean with math.

Let's say Emeral is a 1 on a scale while the FEB is 1000. These are random numbers for the sake of example.

In this case what I'm saying is.

(Emeral + 7 emeralds) = 128 because his base stats get multiplied. + (FEB) = 1128 because the FEB is unrelated to the boost Emeral got from the emeralds.

Meanwhile you are saying.

(Emeral + 7 emeralds) = 128 + (FEB) = 1,128 × 128 = 144,384. And that can only be the case if Emeral got two separate multipliers from the same set of emeralds.
 
For that to be true it would mean that the emeralds give Emeral a 128× multiplier every time he increases in power for any reason which isn't reasonable and I can show what I mean with math.

Let's say Emeral is a 1 on a scale while the FEB is 1000. These are random numbers for the sake of example.

In this case what I'm saying is.

(Emeral + 7 emeralds) = 128 because his base stats get multiplied. + (FEB) = 1128 because the FEB is unrelated to the boost Emeral got from the emeralds.

Meanwhile you are saying.

(Emeral + 7 emeralds) = 128 + (FEB) = 1,128 × 128 = 144,384. And that can only be the case if Emeral got two separate multipliers from the same set of emeralds.
That is not what I'm saying. You're the only one here who's confused by this, so please re-read the OP and read the power-scalling blog I linked in it if necessary. The AP value Emerl currently has does not account for the Emerald multipliers at all. All I'm doing is fixing that by adding ONE 128× multiplier. Not 2 like you're saying I am.

In other words, what I'm saying is:
FEB × 128 = Ultimate Emerl AP


What we currently have is:
FEB = Ultimate Emerl AP

It's that straightforward
 
The AP value Emerl currently has does not account for the Emerald multipliers at all. All I'm doing is fixing that by adding ONE 128× multiplier. Not 2 like you're saying I am.

In other words, what I'm saying is:
FEB × 128 = Ultimate Emerl AP


What we currently have is:
FEB = Ultimate Emerl AP

It's that straightforward
That makes no sense though since Emeral got the emeralds before the FEB and therefore received the multiplier before the FEB. So what your proposing only makes sense if the emeralds not only grant a 128× multiplier apon acquiring them but also multiply every single power increase after that point by 128×
 
That makes no sense though since Emeral got the emeralds before the FEB and therefore received the multiplier before the FEB. So what your proposing only makes sense if the emeralds not only grant a 128× multiplier apon acquiring them but also multiply every single power increase after that point by 128×
Why would the moment he obtained the emeralds matter? By your logic, in order to use his power sources the most optimally, he would have to remove the Emeralds from his body after having aborbed the FEB's power and then immediately put them back in so the multiplier gets added after the FEB's power rather than before. Do you realize how ridiculous that is? The math equation isn't reliant on which amps came first chronologically. It's reliant on common sense. The emeralds amplify thier user's power. The FEB is part of the user's power in this case, therefore it is amplified. Simple as that
 
Why would the moment he obtained the emeralds matter? By your logic, in order to use his power sources the most optimally, he would have to remove the Emeralds from his body after having aborbed the FEB's power and then immediately put them back in so the multiplier gets added after the FEB's power rather than before. Do you realize how ridiculous that is?
Your missing the point. Because the emeralds are treated as multipliers they only multiply the users power at the moment they aquired them. And there is no reason for such multipliers to apply to amps received after that and saying otherwise is headcanon.
The math equation isn't reliant on which amps came first chronologically. It's reliant on common sense. The emeralds amplify thier user's power. The FEB is part of the user's power in this case, therefore it is amplified. Simple as that
Ok here I have a question for you. If Emeral added/absorbed 1 volt would the emeralds turn that volt into 128 volts because they amplify the user?
 
Your missing the point. Because the emeralds are treated as multipliers they only multiply the users power at the moment they aquired them. And there is no reason for such multipliers to apply to amps received after that and saying otherwise is headcanon.
So you are saying that Emerl would need to remove the emeralds only to immediately put them back in. Got it.
Ok here I have a question for you. If Emeral added/absorbed 1 volt would the emeralds turn that volt into 128 volts because they amplify the user?
Let's say each volt added grants him one foe of power. He would indeed upscale from 128 foe, yes.
 
So you are saying that Emerl would need to remove the emeralds only to immediately put them back in. Got it.

Let's say each volt added grants him one foe of power. He would indeed upscale from 128 foe, yes.
More or less because to be honest this would never fly in any other series and it shouldn't here. As an example let's use dragon ball I guess. Base gokus power level is 3 million and super saiyan is a 50 times multiplier putting him at 150 million. If goku were to absorb a spirit bomb after going Super saiyan with a 1 billion power level it would be reasonable to say he reaches 1.15 billion because it's just a + b. But by your logic despite super saiyan and the spirit bomb being 2 distinct sources of power the super saiyan multiplier would just randomly mullltiply this unrelated energy source to 50 billion even though the user has already received their multiplier.
 
If goku were to absorb a spirit bomb after going Super saiyan with a 1 billion power level it would be reasonable to say he reaches 1.15 billion because it's just a + b. But by your logic despite super saiyan and the spirit bomb being 2 distinct sources of power the super saiyan multiplier would just randomly mullltiply this unrelated energy source to 50 billion even though the user has already received their multiplier.
This is a good point, honestly. I think I disagree with the multiplier scaling here.
 
More or less because to be honest this would never fly in any other series and it shouldn't here. As an example let's use dragon ball I guess. Base gokus power level is 3 million and super saiyan is a 50 times multiplier putting him at 150 million. If goku were to absorb a spirit bomb after going Super saiyan with a 1 billion power level it would be reasonable to say he reaches 1.15 billion because it's just a + b. But by your logic despite super saiyan and the spirit bomb being 2 distinct sources of power the super saiyan multiplier would just randomly mullltiply this unrelated energy source to 50 billion even though the user has already received their multiplier.
Always Dragon Ball. Every time. I'm not entirely against that line of thinking for them either, but I'm by no means knowledgeable enough on the series to comment the legitimacy of this scaling. I could argue why it's still likely more reliable for Emerl because of the mechanics of Chaos energy and Emerl's copy abillity, but I want to be sure that this other-verse-whataboutism isn't a complete waste of time first.
 
Eh, screw it. I'll entertain it since my rebuttal is very simple. Emerl didn't just copy the FEB's power, he copied the FEB itself.
"Computer: Technique to acquire all forms of weaponry is based on super-science technology... This process has no apparent limitations and will continue to loop indefinitely."
That's how Emerl's copy abillity is described. It's supported by the fact that Emerl can replicate every weapon used by other fighters in the game to perfection. It means that the FEB's physiology, so to speak, is now part of Emerl's base state, which the emeralds would obviously amplify.
 
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Eh, screw it. I'll entertain it. Emerl didn't just copy the FEB's power, he copied the FEB itself.

That's how Emerl's copy abillity is described. It's supported by the fact that Emerl can replicate every weapon used by other fighters in the game to perfection. It means that the FEB's physiology, so to speak, is now part of Emerl's base state, which the emeralds would obviously amplify.
This is also true. I agree with the multipliers again.
 
Hammerspace Manipulation (Removing the Rings) & Induced (Status Effect) Berserk Mode for making them attack one another? The latter I'm unsure of because it could simply be the mechanic of the minigame, the former is more clear-cut.
 
Worst case scenario Emerl’s power would be that of the 7 emeralds continent moving feat+Egg Blaster.
That's really the absolute worst case scenario. One that almost changes nothing to the rating we currently have and doesn't account for the Emeralds being accepted to multiply each other's power as well.
I disagree with the multipliers.
Any reason for it that wasn't already adressed?
Hammerspace Manipulation (Removing the Rings) & Induced (Status Effect) Berserk Mode for making them attack one another? The latter I'm unsure of because it could simply be the mechanic of the minigame, the former is more clear-cut.
Agree with the former, but I think body puppetry makes more sense than Berserk Mode. The thing that settles it for me is the fact that the characters under Eggman's beam don't bother to just jump and attack the Egg Mobile directly to make it stop, instead chasing the remaining character. So yeah. "Hammerspace Manipulation and possibly Body Puppetry" is what I'll go with.
 
Anyways put me down as disagree with 3C emerl. Also I'm going through the entire story of Sonic battle again to make a response so see you tomorrow I guess.
 
Eh, screw it. I'll entertain it since my rebuttal is very simple. Emerl didn't just copy the FEB's power, he copied the FEB itself.

That's how Emerl's copy abillity is described. It's supported by the fact that Emerl can replicate every weapon used by other fighters in the game to perfection. It means that the FEB's physiology, so to speak, is now part of Emerl's base state, which the emeralds would obviously amplify.
Also, you should edit some of this into the OP to make it clear you're arguing the FLOOR of Emerl's power is now the FEB; thus the multiplier would be applied to that. Seems to be the strongest argument supported by the narrative of Battle.

However, where's the 128x figure coming from? Is this due to upscaling from Power Core multipliers for all 7 Emeralds? I just don't remember that number at all
 
Also, you should edit some of this into the OP to make it clear you're arguing the FLOOR of Emerl's power is now the FEB; thus the multiplier would be applied to that. Seems to be the strongest argument supported by the narrative of Battle.
If it makes that much of a difference, then sure. Pretty straightforward.

I also have other stuff to add to the OP. For instance, I changed my mind about the Curse Opal's layered paralysis inducement. The description of the item and its effect in-game are more likely to imply body puppetry that forces the target to stay still, especially since we already have a precedant for other Forejewels having that exact abillity. If it actually was layered paralysis, that would result in a hax-scaling paradox where:
-Two Forcejewels can resist Medusa's light
-Two Forcejewels cannot resist the Curse Opal, which would make the latter layered (if it was actually paralysis inducement)
-The Curse Opal can still be resisted by Blockite
-Blockite can't fully resist Medusa's light without the assistance of another Forcejewel.
See what I mean? Just thought I would explain my reasoning for that change since 3 people agreed with it.
However, where's the 128x figure coming from? Is this due to upscaling from Power Core multipliers for all 7 Emeralds? I just don't remember that number at all
Yep. They get the upscaled 2x multiplier 7 times.
 
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Firstly, wrong timestamp in the 2nd link. Secondly, she & several other of the Fighters cast already got that in their pages(albeit a few still missing it). Only Metal, Bark & Eggman don't have the Weapon Steal move.
 
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