Fist Of The North Star Revision Part 1 (P&A)

[Stefano4444]

For some reason Raoh has a High 6-A Key bu scaling from Pre-Seals Kenshiro, despire the fact that its Post-Seals Kenshiro who reach High 6-A.

Raoh never fought Post-Seals Kenshiro in the story, he has only fought Pre-Seals Kenshiro as the profile itself conferm, meaning there is no reason of him be High 6-A.

Beside that, i also notice that he still had Existence Erasure and Nonexistent Physiology in his profile, even when it was debunked a while ago, they also need to be deleted.

This no longer matter.

 

[Stefano4444]

Bump

 

[Stefano4444]

bump

 

[Confluctor]

Tier change seems fine. Haven't read through the linked thread yet so not 100% sure.

Since the thread was made by @SamanPatou I wonder if he knows

 

[SamanPatou]

EE should totally be removed, but I'm not up to date when it comes to the current HnK scaling.

 

[Stefano4444]

EE should totally be removed

I also notice that Kenshiro still had Nonexistent Physiology in his profile too, that need to be delete too and switch with Intangibility.

 

[Stefano4444]

@Jasonsith What its your opinion on this matter?

 

[Stefano4444]

bump

 

[ItalianGuy1234]

I agree with the removal for the high 6-A, Raoh has no business scaling to EoS characters at all.

 

[ItalianGuy1234]

Honestly there needs to be a serious rework for the part 2 characters, because the power creep is pretty significant.

 

[ItalianGuy1234]

looking at the profiles, some profiles need some updating too. Juza is listed as "Low 6-B/Small Country level" when his technique could have one shot killed Raoh, who is 6-B+/Country level+ even at 30%. Same thing for Han, Falco etc. who are Low 6-B+ despite scaling to High 6-B characters: Han fights and scales to 100% Kenshiro and Falco is comparable to Raoh who is 6-B+/High 6-B.

 

[Twellas]

I also notice that Kenshiro still had Nonexistent Physiology in his profile too, that need to be delete too and switch with Intangibility.

NEP shouldn't be deleted, it was never properly debunked, EE was the one debunked.

The state of the FotNS profiles is pretty laughable, just look at Jagi being scaled to Garuda when there's literally no evidence of that; for some reason almost no thought was put into the scaling after the recent revisions, I wanted to make a general scale CRT, but I genuinely have a billion things to do and can't sit down and make a 20 page long CRT, what I can do is give advices for whoever is crazy enough to start this endevor.

No, Raoh should not scale to post seals Ken

 

[ItalianGuy1234]

NEP shouldn't be deleted, it was never properly debunked, EE was the one debunked.

The state of the FotNS profiles is pretty laughable, just look at Jagi being scaled to Garuda when there's literally no evidence of that; for some reason almost no thought was put into the scaling after the recent revisions, I wanted to make a general scale CRT, but I genuinely have a billion things to do and can't sit down and make a 20 page long CRT, what I can do is give advices for whoever is crazy enough to start this endevor.

No, Raoh should not scale to post seals Ken

the statistics for the asura arc characters are all ****** up, plus we need to make profiles for the other characters like Kaiser and the nameless asura who fought Falco.

 

[FoxySonicMaster108]

I agree with the removal of High 6-A Raoh, He doesn't scale to EOS Ken at all. And most of the profiles are very outdated as of currently and should be updated at some point.

 

[Stefano4444]

Bump

 

[ItalianGuy1234]

Has anyone contacted the fist of the north star experts ?

 

[ItalianGuy1234]

NEP shouldn't be deleted, it was never properly debunked, EE was the one debunked.

The state of the FotNS profiles is pretty laughable, just look at Jagi being scaled to Garuda when there's literally no evidence of that; for some reason almost no thought was put into the scaling after the recent revisions, I wanted to make a general scale CRT, but I genuinely have a billion things to do and can't sit down and make a 20 page long CRT, what I can do is give advices for whoever is crazy enough to start this endevor.

No, Raoh should not scale to post seals Ken

Yo, contact me on the 'cord and just tell me what there's to do.

 

[Silvervigilant]

Yo, contact me on the 'cord and just tell me what there's to do.

I'm working on it

 

[Stefano4444]

By the way, can anyone explain where the Country level+ come from?

Because if we go with this feat, a full power Pre-Seals Kenshiro its only Small Country level+ at peak, not Large Country level.

 

[ItalianGuy1234]

By the way, can anyone explain where the Country level+ come from?

Because if we go with this feat, a full power Pre-Seals Kenshiro its only Small Country level+ at peak, not Large Country level.

Raoh's goten sho is that powerful.

 

[ItalianGuy1234]

and tbh Ken scales so much higher than Jagi in part 1 he should be country level. pre seals 30% Ken in part 2 is stronger than Falco who is equal to Raoh who bodied the base Kenshiro who in turn was far superior to Shin who one shot flashback Ken who beat down Jagi.

 

[Eseseso]

Raoh is a High 6-A due to fighting Post Musou Tensei Kenshiro, who tanked a blast from a heavily restrained Kaioh who was still stated to be above the 849.677 petaton vaporization of the oceans.

And there's nothing to say that Post Musou Tensei Kenshiro got any stronger between his last fight with Raoh and his first fight with Kaioh, since he'd just spent those 10 years living with Yuria.

 

[Eseseso]

By the way, can anyone explain where the Country level+ come from?

Because if we go with this feat, a full power Pre-Seals Kenshiro its only Small Country level+ at peak, not Large Country level.

Raoh's Goten Sho is 54.6 teratons, and his pre-Musou Tensei 100% is AT LEAST 333% of that since he did that with basically no energy since he was near death, so his pre-musou Tensei is >= 182 teratons.

Basically:

54.6 teratons = Near Death Raoh with Zero Energy <<< 30% Pre-Musou Tensei Raoh

100% Raoh = 54.6 teratons * 10/3 = 182 teratons.

Honestly he probably scales in 30% to far above 54.6 teratons but all we can do is just upscale.

 

[Eseseso]

I agree with the removal of High 6-A Raoh, He doesn't scale to EOS Ken at all. And most of the profiles are very outdated as of currently and should be updated at some point.

Post Musou Tensei Raoh scales to Post-Musou Tensei Ken, who scales to a heavily restrained and armored Kaioh who even while restrained was above the 849.677 petaton disaster that vaporized the oceans.

 

[Eseseso]

In short, I think post-Musou Tensei Raoh should remain a High 6-A for the reasons I stated above.

Also, look here and here for why Post Musou Tensei but Pre Seals Ken (who post musou Tensei raoh scales to) scales to Kaioh's High 6-A feat.

 

[Jibz]

Not familiar with the verse, but the tier changes themselves seem fine. Neutral on removing non-existent physiology as apparently it wasn't debunked.

 

[Eseseso]

I still oppose the tier change for Raoh for my above reasons.

Calling @Twellas

 

[ItalianGuy1234]

Nameless Asura scales to post Falco 30% Kenshiro, he reacts to Ken and he draws blood from him, then he reacts to and pierces through one of Falco's most powerful gento koken techniques after Kenshiro restores Falco's power. Nameless asura < Alf < Elite asuras who can match 1000 asuras < Kaiser < Han < Ken 100% < Kaioh who stomped Ken in the first fight. Ken gets massively more powerful throughout the Asura arc and it's confirmed by Shachi and Linn's commentary of Ken getting stronger the stronger the enemy he faces. Raoh has no business scaling to Kaioh or any of the demon kings / asura generals because Ken got plenty of fights that made him stronger in HnK2.

 

[Eseseso]

Nameless Asura scales to post Falco 30% Kenshiro, he reacts to Ken and he draws blood from him, then he reacts to and pierces through one of Falco's most powerful gento koken techniques after Kenshiro restores Falco's power. Nameless asura < Alf < Elite asuras who can match 1000 asuras < Kaiser < Han < Ken 100% < Kaioh who stomped Ken in the first fight. Ken gets massively more powerful throughout the Asura arc and it's confirmed by Shachi and Linn's commentary of Ken getting stronger the stronger the enemy he faces. Raoh has no business scaling to Kaioh or any of the demon kings / asura generals because Ken got plenty of fights that made him stronger in HnK2.

That's why he only scales to Ken at the start of the 2nd series before he unlocked his seals

 

[Silvervigilant]

I made a doc regarding the scaling, you guys can take a look, and tell me what you guys think. Feel free to disagree and ask me whatever you want about the scaling

 

[Eseseso]

I made a doc regarding the scaling, you guys can take a look, and tell me what you guys think. Feel free to disagree and ask me whatever you want about the scaling

Nice job, just one question:

Raoh near death with basically zero energy left split the clouds, which was accepted at 54.6 teratons.

Where does this fit in with the scaling?

Also, since in your scaling chart in the end 100% Raoh = the Kenshiro that scales to the High 6-A calc, does this mean that 30% Raoh is 30% of that calc?

If so, that'd put 30% Raoh at 254.9 petatons (High 6-A).

Also, since Kenshiro seems to get 4 multipliers of 3.33x each compared to when he scaled to the High 6-A calc, that'd actually put his End of Series self at 104.898 exatons.

 

[Silvervigilant]

Nice job, just one question:

Raoh near death with basically zero energy left split the clouds, which was accepted at 54.6 teratons.

Where does this fit in with the scaling?

Well Raoh was with literally 0 energy when he punched that clouds apart, he even says that all his energy was concentraded in the last punch he threw to hit Kenshiro (too bad he missed) after that punch Raoh no longer had any strength left in his fist, that means that at that point Raoh was way below his usual operating 30% capacity, so it should be safe to assume that even Pre-Shu's call, Pre-Timeskip, Pre-Awakening, Pre-Seals 30% Kenshiro (aka BoS Kenshiro) can easily match Raoh's half-dead self.

So yeah BoS 30% Kenshiro definitely scales above half-dead Raoh who peformed the 54.6 teratons feat.

 

[Eseseso]

Well Raoh was with literally 0 energy when he punched that clouds apart, he even says that all his energy was concentraded in the last punch he threw to hit Kenshiro (too bad he missed) after that punch Raoh no longer had any strength left in his fist, that means that at that point Raoh was way below his usual operating 30% capacity, so it should be safe to assume that even Pre-Shu's call, Pre-Timeskip, Pre-Awakening, Pre-Seals 30% Kenshiro (aka BoS Kenshiro) can easily match Raoh's half-dead self.

So yeah BoS 30% Kenshiro definitely scales above half-dead Raoh who peformed the 54.6 teratons feat.

Good, that fits with the scaling since he stomped the Low 6-B Jagi.

Honestly, considering Raoh had basically zero energy when he did this, it wouldn't be unreasonable for 30% Raoh to upscale to baseline High 6-B (100 teratons).

But my other questions still stand:

Also, since in your scaling chart in the end 100% Raoh = the Kenshiro that scales to the High 6-A calc, does this mean that 30% Raoh is 30% of that calc?

If so, that'd put 30% Raoh at 254.9 petatons (High 6-A).

Also, since Kenshiro seems to get 4 multipliers of 3.33x each compared to when he scaled to the High 6-A calc, that'd actually put his End of Series self at 104.898 exatons.

 

[Silvervigilant]

Also, since in your scaling chart in the end 100% Raoh = the Kenshiro that scales to the High 6-A calc, does this mean that 30% Raoh is 30% of that calc

That's Correct

If so, that'd put 30% Raoh at 254.9 petatons (High 6-A).

I mean that's definitely plausible given the fact that a 30% Raoh could easily punch through to 30% BoS Kenshiro's body, with a casual punch
not to mention that some versions of Raoh's Goten sho calc put the feat at Continent level

 

[Silvervigilant]

Also, since Kenshiro seems to get 4 multipliers of 3.33x each compared to when he scaled to the High 6-A calc, that'd actually put his End of Series self at 104.898 exatons.

Apparently yes

 

[Eseseso]

That's Correct

I mean that's definitely plausible given the fact that a 30% Raoh could easily punch through to 30% BoS Kenshiro's body, with a casual punch
not to mention that some versions of Raoh's Goten sho calc put the feat at Continent level

So we can just have Raoh's entire tier (which will be just 1 key) be ranked at "High 6-A, higher in 100% mode".

And not to mention, some versions of the accepted Goten Sho calc but with higher speeds put the feat at levels as high as 3 or even 78 petatons

 

[Silvervigilant]

@Eseseso Could you answer me this ? if 30% Raoh is 254.9 petatons, how strong is BoS 30% Kenshiro ?

 

[Eseseso]

@Eseseso Could you answer me this ? if 30% Raoh is 254.9 petatons, how strong is BoS 30% Kenshiro ?

Well, from what your scaling page said, 100% BoS Ken matched 30% Raoh, so 30% BoS Ken would be 76.47 petatons (which is still High 6-A).

 

[Silvervigilant]

Well, from what your scaling page said, 100% BoS Ken matched 30% Raoh, so 30% BoS Ken would be 76.47 petatons (which is still High 6-A).

Thanks, i'm asking this because after re-reading Kenshiro and Raoh's first fight, i actually think that Kenshiro had a power boost during that fight too.

As we know, 30% Raoh could instantly kill 30% Kenshiro with a casual punch, but the thing is that even Toki said that Ken didn't even had 1% chance of winning against a 30% Raoh, and Toki definitely was taking Tenryu Kokyu Ho into consideration, Raoh himself said that no matter what Kenshiro could do he would never stand a chance, (So at that time even if Kenshiro used 100% of his power he wouldn't compare to a 30% Raoh), Then Toki immobilized Kenshiro by pressing a vital point, but Kenshiro powered himself and broke Toki's bind, and right after that Toki stated that Kenshiro had surpassed his expectations, and seemed curious to see their fight, and Toki himself was unable to know who would win between the 2, and Raoh himself admitted that Ken became very strong, even though he called Kenshiro a weakling minutes prior, which means that Ken did infact became stronger after he broke Toki's Bind.

Do you agree ?

 

[Eseseso]

Thanks, i'm asking this because after re-reading Kenshiro and Raoh's first fight, i actually think that Kenshiro had a power boost during that fight too.

As we know, 30% Raoh could instantly kill 30% Kenshiro with a casual punch, but the thing is that even Toki said that Ken didn't even had 1% chance of winning against a 30% Raoh, and Toki definitely was taking Tenryu Kokyu Ho into consideration, Raoh himself said that no matter what Kenshiro could do he would never stand a chance, (So at that time even if Kenshiro used 100% of his power he wouldn't compare to a 30% Raoh), Then Toki immobilized Kenshiro by pressing a vital point, but Kenshiro powered himself and broke Toki's bind, and right after that Toki stated that Kenshiro had surpassed his expectations, and seemed curious to see their fight, and Toki himself was unable to know who would win between the 2, and Raoh himself admitted that Ken became very strong, even though he called Kenshiro a weakling minutes prior, which means that Ken did infact became stronger after he broke Toki's Bind.

Do you agree ?

I mean I guess, but if so then I'm not sure that we could scale BoS Ken to anything but the Goten Sho feat.