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Fate Servant Tiering CRT

They are sentient mountains who can already contend with Gods. When scaling the stats of beings size is one of the most basic and clear cut ways, and since mount Ebih was one of the mightiest of the mountains, that would mean it would be at least on the level of their size alone, regardless of what size it is.
 
that would mean it would be at least on the level of their size alone, regardless of what size it is.

That doesn't make much sense. I really doubt that it a valid feat, go ahead and ask a calc member but I doubt this would get passed since it relies on a massive assumption and wonky methods.
 
Calaca Vs said:
That seems like an unreasonable assumption. I find it baseless at least.
Click to expand...
How so? If at the very lowest, you take the power of a character by their size which is a common and valid practice for determining a character's power. Now, by this method, what level would most powerful sentient mountains be, if we are using size alone? Large mountain level. Now, since we know that Mount Ebih is on par with the strongest of mountains, what level would they scale to? Large mountain.

What "unreasonable" and "baseless" assumptions have I made in that line of reasoning?
 
Rin The Dragon Empress said:
that would mean it would be at least on the level of their size alone, regardless of what size it is.
That doesn't make much sense. I really doubt that it a valid feat, go ahead and ask a calc member but I doubt this would get passed since it relies on a massive assumption and wonky methods.
Click to expand...
Why the **** would I talk to a calc group member for advise on this lore when we aren't calculating anything? Look at my reply to calaca. What "wonky" or "massive" assumptions have I made? I have literally taken the low ball, with the high ball scaling it to the gods who were impressed with its power
 
They need to reach a certain height if you want that argument working. I remember a blog with such a thing being calced a couple of months ago but I don't know if it was ever finished.

"Strongest of mountains" is an hilarious statement, tbh. "Largest mountains" is something which I could agree with but the mountains aren't strong by themselves at least IRL.

Plus you could try to calc the PE needed for being a mountain-sized humanoid using rock density. But with such statement I wouldn't accept any rating. Especially knowing what happened to the "mountain" statements this very same verse used to have as a regular basis for its scaling which, the way it is right now, is far from Mountain level.
 
@Iapitus

Even IF we took the "mightiest of mountains" thing as Large Mountain level, it would only scale to living Ishtar. So that already takes the wind out of this argument. That said...

Mount Ebih was a sentient mountain with control over nature. Defeating it meant climbing it, not destroying it. Roman even specified this when it was brought up in Babylonia; that Ishtar "defeated" Mount Ebih by reaching the top despite its resistance. It's only after defeating it that she promptly destroyed it for pissing her off, which serves as the basis of her NP.

Defeating it isn't High 7-A. Destroying it, is.
 
not sure if it will help in the long run but we do have this feat performed by a half dead Shirou with an inperfect Excalibur. sure we do need to redo it but at least it's something.
 
So currently for scaling we have mountain level statements, that feat from Shirou, Siegfried fighting Fafnir, and Tawara Touta fighting a centipede the size of a mountain right.

I would also like to add that we could scale off of Roa or Arcuied as well
 
Donttalk said a half cylinder should be used and in the calc it does look like a half cylinder was used. I just glanced over it so maybe I missed something but from what I saw the math looked fine and most people agreed. All donttalk said was a half cylinder should be used as a full cylinder doubles the result and the calc used a half cylinder to get the value so I'm not seeing the problem.
 
Solacis said:
@Iapitus
Even IF we took the "mightiest of mountains" thing as Large Mountain level, it would only scale to living Ishtar. So that already takes the wind out of this argument. That said...

Mount Ebih was a sentient mountain with control over nature. Defeating it meant climbing it, not destroying it. Roman even specified this when it was brought up in Babylonia; that Ishtar "defeated" Mount Ebih by reaching the top despite its resistance. It's only after defeating it that she promptly destroyed it for pissing her off, which serves as the basis of her NP.

Defeating it isn't High 7-A. Destroying it, is.
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Nah, because I'm pretty sure her Servant NP is also capable of busting it as well.

ah, so AP wise durability would be the only thing that matters. Iirc there is a specific spirit embodying it too, which could scale to embodying the land mass. Either way, we can still use it for scaling since Servant Ishtar's NP should still be capable of the same
 
Calaca Vs said:
They need to reach a certain height if you want that argument working. I remember a blog with such a thing being calced a couple of months ago but I don't know if it was ever finished.
"Strongest of mountains" is an hilarious statement, tbh. "Largest mountains" is something which I could agree with but the mountains aren't strong by themselves at least IRL.

Plus you could try to calc the PE needed for being a mountain-sized humanoid using rock density. But with such statement I wouldn't accept any rating. Especially knowing what happened to the "mountain" statements this very same verse used to have as a regular basis for its scaling which, the way it is right now, is far from Mountain level.
Click to expand...
Not really, because I do not claim Ebih's size. I say that it scales from mountains of the strongest of mountains. No calculations are happening here, so we do not need a specific height

Not really, because Ebih > The tallest mountains. Not necesarilly in size, but in strength, which for thr other mountains would just be size.

Why would we need to calc it? And why would it not be accepted? Ishtar busting the mountain range is a major part of her myth, and the foundation for her noble phantasm. i have no idea what you refer to for this later point, care to explain yourself?
 
Bring a calc group member and we'll see if any of your claims make any sense. I don't find it myself, and you don't want a no as an answer so go bring a calc member to see if he/she agrees with your point.

Calcs are a need. We can't give random tiers just from statements and let alone guesstimations which is the case here with Ebih being "the strongest mountain".
 
We aren't calculating anything, so why do we need a calc group members approval?

What the **** would we be calculating? Lol. They are not needed, especially when the feats are not something that can be properly calculated. Have you not worked with non-visual works before?
 
@Rin Yes you ******* can. We work tier based off of size all the ******* time, and this is no different. Someone dwarfs mountains? perfectly viable tier justification. So why would a mountain being the size of a large mountain not be a viable way to justify a tier?
 
Because you're not justifying it via size but via power which is a pretty vague way to justify it.
 
Calaca Vs said:
What Rin said. It makes literally zero sense. It's a very unquantifiable feat.
Click to expand...
Why would determining the power of a mountain, and scaling to it, be any different from justifying a tier for a characer which is the size of a mountain?
 
Calaca Vs said:
Because you're not justifying it via size but via power which is a pretty vague way to justify it.
Click to expand...
I am tho. Mount Ebih >= Large Mountains in power. Large Mountains are large mountain level in durability obviously, so why is it such an issue to say that Mount Ebih is above that?
 
You seriously need to calm down, nobody is cursing at you so please remain respectful and civil.


Not to mention you keep changing your argument. At first you said it wasn't via size but power but now you wanna say it's via size and not power? Pick one, and I doubt Mount Ebih is the size the of a large mountain, especially if there's to support that.
 
If you're going to use that, mountains don't have AP to begin with.

I disagree with your basis, and so does a few other people. I have no power here tho, I'm just giving my thoughts as why your basis for this is unreliable and vague. I can't argue much about the verse at all.
 
Rin The Dragon Empress said:
You seriously need to calm down, nobody is cursing at you so please remain respectful and civil.

Not to mention you keep changing your argument. At first you said it wasn't via size but power but now you wanna say it's via size and not power? Pick one, and I doubt Mount Ebih is the size the of a large mountain, especially if there's to support that.
Click to expand...
Cursing and cursing at you are two different things. This is a difference you need to learn. I can drop as many F-bombs as I want, and it will in no way tie into how much I respect or do not respect you.


I have not changed my argument. Scaling just generally high end mountains has always been about size, and that has not changed. Scaling Mount Ebih to be superior to these mountains in general power makes no claims about how this power manifests other than that the stats are indeed superior, but what i am focussing on is the durability. I made no claims on the size of mount Ebih, only that it was superior in power to the mountains, and mount Ebih can manifest its powers in various ways
 
Calaca Vs said:
If you're going to use that, mountains don't have AP to begin with.
I disagree with your basis, and so does a few other people. I have no power here tho, I'm just giving my thoughts as why your basis for this is unreliable and vague. I can't argue much about the verse at all.
Click to expand...
They can when they are supernatural and sentient, but that is beside the point. Servants scale from busting it, so durability is what really matters

yet you have not proven how it is either of these, unreliable or vague. They spend a good few missions hyping up mount Ebih, so it is not unfounded anyway.

Anyway, its fine if you are new to the verse. If you wanna talk about anything to do with it let me know
 
Looks like you missed the part when I said that I won't argue anymore about this. I still find the scaling iffy, but if there's a real solid argument I'd concede. But it doesn't matter, I barely started Fate apocrypha and forgotten to keep watching it.
 
Not the best place to start imo, but I hope you enjoy it. Jump to zero next

fair choice (although fgo has poisoned my view of him kek). My personal favorite from Apoc is probably Achilles
 
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