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Fate Servant Tiering CRT

"!" We barely had the edge in the confrontation of the Noble Phantasms. Bellerophon had ninety percent of its light offset by Saber's holy sword."


It says that 90% of Bellerophon > Excalibur. Am I reading that right?
 
Yeah more or less but before this Shirou traced a 4 layer Rho Ais to slightly weaken Excalibur. Even so I still say we back scale it, since it rediculouse to think that, assuming Bellepheron tier don't change that a High 7-A attack overpowered a 6-B attack even if it was done with help.
 
"The second projection. Magic that shaves my existence away. But we can't beat Saber without it. We can't match Saber's Noble Phantasm, even with Bellerophon.

We knew that already. So I'm going to make her win. If Rider's Noble Phantasm is inferior in force, I'll make up for the difference…!!!!"

Not sure if Bellepheron should scale considering evidently the only reason it managed to win was because of Shirou and even then it still almost lost
 
Paul Frank said:
"The second projection. Magic that shaves my existence away. But we can't beat Saber without it. We can't match Saber's Noble Phantasm, even with Bellerophon.

We knew that already. So I'm going to make her win. If Rider's Noble Phantasm is inferior in force, I'll make up for the difference…!!!!"
Click to expand...
Not sure if Bellepheron should scale considering evidently the only reason it managed to win was because of Shirou and even then it still almost lost
True but again the problem here is that this implies that a High 7-A attack overpowered a 6-B attack. Keep in mind that EMIYA 7 layered Rho Ais barely manage to Gae Bolg which we rate as 7-A possibly higher. And the one that Shirou project is only 4 layers. So a slightly weaker version of a 7-A shield and and High 7-A combine manage to overpowered a 6-B attack.
 
Large Mountain level with Bellerophon (Was able to match and eventually overpower Excalibur Morgan with help from Shirou's Rho Aias at the cost of losing ninety percent of its own light, but ultimately stands no chance against it otherwise. As an A+ rank Anti-Army Noble Phantasm, it should be comparable to Balmung, which can hold back Brahmastra when used over and over).
 
DragonEmperor23 said:
Wait, Xeno's 6-B Bennu calc was accepted.
https://vsbattles.fandom.com/wiki/User_blog:XenoBreaker2803/Evil-man's_Dynamic_of_A_Meteor!!!

I guess we start finding out who scales?
Click to expand...
Considering Da Vinci says that the meteorite was 'teleported' into the skies of Shinjuku, bypassing Chaldea's monitoring, and the fact that it was visible in the skies of Shinjuku, I am not sure why the distance used was from Bennu's orbit.
~ Regis​
IDK if that changes things.
 
XenoBreaker2803 said:
The Meteor is not visible in the skies of Shinjuku. All Da Vinci says is that there a meteor above the skies of Shinjuku and that said sky was being monitored by Sheba. Also Bennu can't have teleported because the effect of the 7th bullet set Bennu course toward Gudoa. Also in the translation in the video it wasn't Bennu that was stated to teleport it was us that was stated to 'move' toward a completely different area.
Click to expand...
^
 
Regis had more to say on Bennu.

Relevant parts
"Da Vinci: This----! The meteorite has appeared in the skies above Shinjuku! That's… this composition… it's "Bennu"...! But the Shinjuku airspace was constantly being monitored, so why!? This is as if it teleported…!

Mashu: ...!! It couldn't be… that meteorite is the… seventh…!

Artoria Alter: When you were killed, that was the time it activated!? That is why it transported to such a near…!

Da Vinci: When Moriarty's death was confirmed, the meteorite was transported, prepared to be fired…!"

Outside, the power of the magic bullet has faded from the meteorite. It is just a really big rock now. Emiya Alter says that he will break it into pieces, but that is about all that he can do. Artoria will have to sweep up the pieces. She asks if his magecraft can really shatter the meteorite. Emiya is confident that he can. As a mage he isn't much, but this is something he's good at.

"Emiya Alter: Reality marble. To send something that can originally overturn the world into the opponent's body. Even if it is a meteorite that will destroy the world… if it's just to rupture it, something can be done.

Artoria Alter: Don't mess it up, okay?

Emiya Alter: I took on this job. Seeing it through to the end is a mercenary's fate. ---I am the bone of my sword. Back in Chaldea, they are still unable to shift you out of Shinjuku. There is but 10 seconds before Bennu falls.

Emiya Alter: ---Unlimited Lost Works! Emiya fires his reality marble into Bennu, shattering it. The fragments of the asteroid are about to rain over Shinjuku, threatening to raze it to the ground. However, Artoria is already prepared. Da Vinci shouts excitedly that it's done, and asks if they can see.

Da Vinci: What pulverizes this magic bullet released from space shall be the Divine Construct that stands atop the peak of all Holy Swords. Even should the sword's wielder be swallowed by darkness---

Artoria Alter: ---Hammer of the Vile King. Invert the aurora. Mashu: As long as Master is here, this light shall surely---!

Artoria Alter: Swallow all light… Excalibur Morgan! Unleashing her Noble Phantasm, Artoria Alter wipes out all traces of Bennu from the sky. Not a single piece of it falls upon Shinjuku. With this, Chaldea can leyshift you back at any time.

Overall, the distance is assumed since all that is stated is that it was visible and detected in Shinjuku airspace, which doesn't imply interplanetary ranges
 
Also Emiya said he can break it into pieces but that's all he can do.

He doesn't fully scale

I'm inclined to say Baseline 7A seems best
 
What implies interplanertary range for Bennu is the fact that it a real life meteor that have never come close to impacting the Earth. It not some fictional meteor that we have absolutely no info about. No we actually have real life info from Nasa on where it maybe, and that somewhere is nowhere near Earth. The thing not getting any closer (Unless one of us here will be alive in about a hundred years from now).

Also Bennu being visible from Shinjuku air space, that does not tell us anything about it. Why? Because according to Holmes any Meteor 'visible' from Earth in 1999 could have been used as a bullet. Why is this important? Because according to this.

https://web.archive.org/web/20180319121233/https://ssd.jpl.nasa.gov/sbdb.cgi?sstr=101955;cad=1

the closest Bennu was to Earth in 1999 was

0.0146863884265115 Au

So the word visible is obviously being used very loosely here.

Also Emiya should at least get some scaling off of it since he still fractured the thing into like a hundred pieces
 
Real life meteor doesn't imply anything about distances when the work itself doesn't specify that it's still in space where it should be given the wording from Da Vinci. That is just twisting the evidence to try to support a conclusion that is not easily proven, which is hardly a decent standard for anything.
 
So for scaling, do we accept that the Fate Parameters are accurate? Because I don't think it's really that consistent, with characters like Raikou (D rank in Agility) being able to fight Ushi (A+ Agility), Fuuma (A+ Agility), Benkei (C Agility), Mash (D rank Agility), and Kintoki (B rank Agility) all at the same time and stalemate them.
 
The problem with Agility is that it encompasses both general running speed and reactions and gives a rating based on that. It should probably get its own CRT on why it shouldn't be used as scaling, along with some other parameters.
 
Okay, if we agreed on if we should accept Parameters, would it be for the specific Parameter that has shown to be inconsistent/consistent or would we apply that to all Parameters?
 
I feel like the Raikou case is special since it was technically Ushi-Gozen.

She is also supposed to be really skilled so there is that
 
Who knows? We still rely on a format based off equating Herc's A Rank Strength to an Excalibur blast for AP, which I personally feel is less accurate than a simple cataloguing and evaluation of feats and scaling.
 
Honestly we shouldn't even backscale NPs to servants unless that NP is Excalibur and that servant is Herc.
 
IMO All of the 7B+ characters should outright lose their + ratings as they backscale too far.

Even if D rank was like 4x weaker that's still strong enough to put up a fight, despite inconsistencies
 
I mean, if they backscale that far then we should look for their own feats instead of backscaling.
 
Paul Frank said:
Excalibur Morgan=Excalibur in strength
Click to expand...
Um, not always.

Depends on which master is commanding Saber. Considering Herc's feats were under Shirou!Saber Excalibur Morgan should be significantly stronger.
 
Morgan is only more spamable

It's the same strength as Excalibur execpt when Shirou is the master
 
"Now, it has been pointed out that the calc for Berserker knocking away a 7-A Excaliblast is now outdated and invalid by the current standards of the wiki. A search for 7-A feats to maintain the current tiers for Servants has resulted in the gathering moutain busting statements for Mordred and Heracles."

This sums it up. There was a recalc but it didn't result in Tier 7.
 
Well it did, for the high end

Either way there are plenty of other 7-A feats to replace it
 
People keep saying stuff that is ultimately meaningless when there is no specified feats or sources given.

I would like to recommend people who want to discuss feats to actually link to them, provide resources when necessary and show why the rating is accurate and who it scales to rather than repeating "What happens now?" over and over again like broken records.
 
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