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It really doesn’t matter. DB has (somewhat) valid examples of this. SMT does not.
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Dragonball specific powers>hax symposium attempt 2
- Thread starter ArmBill
- Start date
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- dragon ball
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It’s a win win anyways, either the thread goes through, or that rules gets changed
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Disagree with this strength = resistance nonsense. If we’re going to seriously buy this, we have to ignore the following:
*boss rabbit being a threat to goku via his carrot touch despite being weaker
*Chiaotzu being able to paralyze goku despite being weaker than goku
*Devilman being able to affect anyone stronger than him with his “blowing up their heart” move
*The Mafuba working on anyone stronger than the person who uses it
*Ginyu being able to swap bodies with Goku, potentially vegeta, and frieza's men
*Guldo's timefreeze working on people stronger than him
*Guldo's paralysis working on gohan and krillin
*Android 19 and 20 being able to absorb ki from someone stronger than them
*Poison affecting Goku in the Universe 6 tournament
*literally anytime Buu absorbs characters far stronger than them.
*boss rabbit being a threat to goku via his carrot touch despite being weaker
*Chiaotzu being able to paralyze goku despite being weaker than goku
*Devilman being able to affect anyone stronger than him with his “blowing up their heart” move
*The Mafuba working on anyone stronger than the person who uses it
*Ginyu being able to swap bodies with Goku, potentially vegeta, and frieza's men
*Guldo's timefreeze working on people stronger than him
*Guldo's paralysis working on gohan and krillin
*Android 19 and 20 being able to absorb ki from someone stronger than them
*Poison affecting Goku in the Universe 6 tournament
*literally anytime Buu absorbs characters far stronger than them.
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Yeah.
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This Power>Hax thing got already accepted recently to be case by case, if there is explicit context or statement in which the Hax is resisted by power.
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As said before, we won't give people resistance to the haxes that clearly ignore the strength stuff.
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This turned into a staff thread the moment ant got the squad in so this isn’t gonna work dawg
Stefano4444
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I overall agree with the CRT.
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We aren't doing "If a person Has a hax, but weaker than goku, it won't work"
We are doing "This specific hax was resisted via having high Ki, thus everyone who has higher ki than the person who resists it, will get it."
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Wait what
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The word "dwag"?
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wtf so most MT character's resistances are gone?
Nullflowerblush
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Magic and Ki are completely unrelated.
i... don't know what to say about this one.
Typical Vegeta boast.
Nothing suggests that the Hakai is based on the user's strength. The Power of Destruction and Ki are two different powers. It is destruction, and it can be resisted so long as you have plot armor. Beerus erased Zamasu without any resistance, but Sidra's Energy of Destruction was dominated by Golden Frieza who then attacked a base form Goku with it who then also proceeded to resist it.
He saw through it, but he did not negate it.
Which he was.
'Cause Jiren.
what?
Because he was not eaten by Buu. He was protected by a barrier, so his goop never absorbed him.
The sword broke.
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responding to some of your posts
the point is that higher pl = resistance to your enemy's hax, it doesn't have to rely on the same power system at all
yeah really doubting that bud
jiren is in db, ergo everyone else gets it
thetechmaster36
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In all fairness, Vegeta was able to just punch through one of Toppo's Hakai spheres by coating his fist in the same aura as his SSBE aura, where as Golden Frieza couldn't hold back a Hakai sphere from Toppo in an earlier episode, but generally I'm in agreement with all that you said.
Manga only lol
yeah really doubting that bud
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So where does it remotely say Vegito kept his form because of power? The scan literally says even after being turned into a candy ball his power remained the same. At best this is a limited resistance since he still turned into a candy ball. If he had flat out resistance he wouldn’t turn period.
also Shenron isn’t exactly the best example to use when it’s a limit to his power that he cannot kill people or make them weaker, but anytime they grant wishes for people far stronger than the dragon it still works. So I don’t see reality warping resistance there. Especially given how inconsistent it is to argue shenron cannot affect those stronger than him in general.
Last time I checked Vegeta’s attacks were all being erased by Toppo’s power, and needed a suicide attack to take him out, unless there’s some missing context I don’t see EE resistance here.
Goku’s timeskip is a limited resistance at best given he only flat out resisted it in KKX10 SSB. And hit ended up adapting his timeskip to affect him harder.
you need to prove that Beerus would resist toonforce with sheer power alone, if that’s not stated then you’re making assumptions here.
Do you have scans of bergamo’s stuff? Also Vegito still got taken inside of Buu, he wasn’t completely absorbed just because he had the barrier to not let Buu’s body part touch his body like it did with every character that did get absorbed, so at best this would be a resistance via ki barrier.
I’m pretty sure he deflected all the spit away with his ki blasts and it didn’t touch his body, if it touched his body and it was turning to stone and he broke out of it then I can see that, otherwise no I don’t see resistance here.
they don’t adapt to it with sheer power, they literally train in the gravity to become used to the gravity. That’s the main reason Goku Vegeta and anyone else who trained in the time chamber is unaffected by 10X gravity because they got used to the gravitational pull.
also Shenron isn’t exactly the best example to use when it’s a limit to his power that he cannot kill people or make them weaker, but anytime they grant wishes for people far stronger than the dragon it still works. So I don’t see reality warping resistance there. Especially given how inconsistent it is to argue shenron cannot affect those stronger than him in general.
Last time I checked Vegeta’s attacks were all being erased by Toppo’s power, and needed a suicide attack to take him out, unless there’s some missing context I don’t see EE resistance here.
Goku’s timeskip is a limited resistance at best given he only flat out resisted it in KKX10 SSB. And hit ended up adapting his timeskip to affect him harder.
you need to prove that Beerus would resist toonforce with sheer power alone, if that’s not stated then you’re making assumptions here.
Do you have scans of bergamo’s stuff? Also Vegito still got taken inside of Buu, he wasn’t completely absorbed just because he had the barrier to not let Buu’s body part touch his body like it did with every character that did get absorbed, so at best this would be a resistance via ki barrier.
I’m pretty sure he deflected all the spit away with his ki blasts and it didn’t touch his body, if it touched his body and it was turning to stone and he broke out of it then I can see that, otherwise no I don’t see resistance here.
they don’t adapt to it with sheer power, they literally train in the gravity to become used to the gravity. That’s the main reason Goku Vegeta and anyone else who trained in the time chamber is unaffected by 10X gravity because they got used to the gravitational pull.
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Same mechanics as anime and is canon
arale's toonforce wouldn't work on beerus, how else could he resist it when the most consistent form of resisting hax in db is "He's too strong to be affected" (Chioatzu v Nappa)
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It isn't for all hax, he listed certain specific hax and cited evidence why resisting it is directly related to strength. Its fair.
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@Meganova_Stella where does it say strength? You need to prove they flat out refer to strength, all that’s said there is it won’t work on Beerus, no how or why, just that it won’t work.
@LeSupremeKing1 did you read my next post afterwards? Because I addressed the specific hax’s he’s arguing to be resisted.
@LeSupremeKing1 did you read my next post afterwards? Because I addressed the specific hax’s he’s arguing to be resisted.
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It was implied, especially with what I said before. There's no need to explicitly call it out when you have this many examples of power > hax.
Nullflowerblush
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Firstly, manga-only.
Secondly, that is a weakness of Time-Skip—the ability becomes less effective against opponents comparable to Hit.
Oh, yeah.
But, on that note, Frieza was weaker than Toppo by a vast margin and survived his Hakai in base.
not even close...
Power was never mentioned as a factor. Whis just stated that it would not work on Beerus, and that he would erase Arale. That just appears to be more of a side-effect of being a God of Destruction than a result of him being more powerful than Arale.
Telekinesis and Toon Force are incomparable.
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Doesn't count for anything. Still canon.
Is close. Unless you're implying that DBS Manga has totally different mechanics from the anime.
Which is simpler:
Beerus is immune to Arale's toonforce because he is a God of Destruction, and this property isn't mentioned ever again
Or:
Beerus is immune to Arale's toonforce because he is stronger, a fact backed up by the rest of the series
thetechmaster36
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Was it in base? It's hard to tell the colors because all I can see is p u r p l e, so either I'm colorblind or I'm stupid.
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Read this:
This Power>Hax thing got already accepted recently to be case by case, if there is explicit context or statement in which the Hax is resisted by power.
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Oh for *****' sake, Manga=/=Anime, this has been the rule for ages now with DBS.
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Yeah and i agree with all of the abilities you addressed except the existence erasure one and the time manip one. Didn't read it until later.
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1- Shenron literally states he can't do shit to anyone thats stronger than him or his curator. Strength is measured with ki. Guess who uses ki? 99%of db characters.
3- "vegeta's typical boast" Meanwhile: vegeta causally giving toppo a ki attack/punch coated WIth ki strong enough to resist Hakai.
lliterary using his energy [god ki] and raising it soo high that can't be erased. It literally screams "My ki si soo strong that you can't erase it".
'Cause jiren' most bland character, with bland Movest, normal ki and was able to resist it because he was strong. even angles said "time means shit against jiren, jiren is that strong". Yeah, so anyone who's stronger in jiren in db will get time resistance.
Stone spit was resisted by just coating your body with ki [Trunks]. You literally just need basic ki control and be as strong as trunks to resist it.
So yes, having high enough ki resist these specific abilities. You hear me?
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Well, things like Time Skip, have been stated to be time stop in both. Also, they are shown to be negated by power alone in both too.
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You can't use examples to make a general rule, thats fallacious, and gets negged the moment even a single piece of counter-evidence appears.
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There’s a blatant statement that hit’s time skip doesn’t work on people stronger than him, sorry but all the arguments against it are absolutely pathetic. That’s not resistance, that’s power. Also the manga isn’t the anime, this has been established for years now
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Manga and anime are completely separate, also goku resisted Hit after going Kk10, guess what does that do? raises your ki.
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the rule about resistance through force should really be changed
If there is statement that the hax can be beaten through sheer force and it’s a weakness of the attack and not being resisted directly, then there should be no resistance added for beating it
If there is statement that the hax can be beaten through sheer force and it’s a weakness of the attack and not being resisted directly, then there should be no resistance added for beating it
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But the thing is, in both anime and manga, Hit's time skip is literally sated to be Time stop.
And, did you really insult me with that word?
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And? Also what wordBut the thing is, in both anime and manga, Hit's time skip is literally sated to be Time stop.
And, did you really insult me with that word?
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Yes, but my point is, in the manga, Hit's time skip was also stated to be Time stop, and in both instances, the Hax is negated by sheer power.
thetechmaster36
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That doesn't mean anything, though, it's literally just describing what the ability does. Manga =/= Anime, meaning what works in the Manga doesn't work in the Anime, which includes the Time Skip example.
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