Dragon Ball Super Discussion Thread 100

[TheGodOfICE777]

Ah my fault
But considering some of the staff also saw his regen getting messed up because of being held by Black's body, and luckily LordGriffin gave us the only way for that thread.

I'll probably take a look at this and watch it, if anyone wants to fix that rating with the justification thread for the previous thread, but I thought it might be quite a pain to wrap up. But yes, provided that Future Trunks has long been accepted as having negation of regeneration.

Well I’m planning on making a crt to remove the possibly characters get for upscaling Buu and Gotenks and making it look better formatted on profiles so I could include that trunks stuff in my crt briefly but I would probably suggest doing Mid High & Mid Godly Negation since the spirit bomb also nullified Buu’s regen which is where mid high comes from

 

[SwordLegendz01]

Well it should be outright Mid-Godly because that's what Fusion Zamasu's regen is rated as

It's in the justification for the sentence about neg regen for Future Trunks, and yes his immortality is being held by Black's body although we don't know to what extent, and even his immortality being withheld is Atsushi Kido still considers him a "cheat" character by Dragon Ball world standards coinciding with the release of episode 66 it would be hard to change the animation again in less than 3 days. So it's hard to ignore the facts.

 

[Sir_Marvulous]

It's in the justification for the sentence about neg regen for Future Trunks

That's also acknowledged in Fusion Zamasu's regen justification, yet its still an outright rating

 

[SwordLegendz01]

Well I’m planning on making a crt to remove the possibly characters get for upscaling Buu and Gotenks and making it look better formatted on profiles so I could include that trunks stuff in my crt briefly but I would probably suggest doing Mid High & Mid Godly Negation since the spirit bomb also nullified Buu’s regen which is where mid high comes from

However it says all of Buu's cells were completely wiped out, but it's a bit difficult for this considering it's an argument that Golden Void and Damage in that thread argue for.

 

[TheGodOfICE777]

However it says all of Buu's cells were completely wiped out, but it's a bit difficult for this considering it's an argument that Golden Void and Damage in that thread argue for.

Wdym

 

[SwordLegendz01]

Wdym

Well, pretty neutral on this. Can't ignore the implied fact that all of Kid Buu's cells were wiped out. However, it's either the neg regen or just the infinite destruction effect of the Super Spirit Bomb. But yeah, the Mid-High neg comes from Atsushi Kido's statement about the "Cheat" character coinciding with Future Trunks' SoH debut.

 

[SwordLegendz01]

That's also acknowledged in Fusion Zamasu's regen justification, yet its still an outright rating

Kinda doubtful on this, as it's very hard to defend against it except with a possibly rating.

 

[Sir_Marvulous]

Kinda doubtful on this, as it's very hard to defend against it except with a possibly rating.

I think the fact that he returns as his disembodied will blatantly says that its outright Mid-Godly regen

 

[TheGodOfICE777]

Well, pretty neutral on this. Can't ignore the implied fact that all of Kid Buu's cells were wiped out. However, it's either the neg regen or just the infinite destruction effect of the Super Spirit Bomb. But yeah, the Mid-High neg comes from Atsushi Kido's statement about the "Cheat" character coinciding with Future Trunks' SoH debut.

I don’t see the argument here and I don’t see why being a cheat character would give you mid high

 

[Sir_Marvulous]

I think the fact that he returns as his disembodied will blatantly says that its outright Mid-Godly regen

Hell, they say its because of his immortal essence

Clearly Black's mortality didn't make it less than Mid-Godly

All that really did was hamper the physical regen

 

[SwordLegendz01]

I don’t see the argument here and I don’t see why being a cheat character would give you mid high

By the standards of the Dragon Ball world on characters that have even regeneration like Majin Buu and Cell, Fusion Zamasu is touted as a "cheat" character.

 

[SwordLegendz01]

Hell, they say its because of his immortal essence

Clearly Black's mortality didn't make it less than Mid-Godly

All that really did was hamper the physical regen

That's the point, because of Black's mortal body. His physical regeneration was disturbed but to what extent it is unknown.

 

[TheGodOfICE777]

By the standards of the Dragon Ball world on characters that have even regeneration like Majin Buu and Cell, Fusion Zamasu is touted as a "cheat" character.

Ah okay fair enough

 

[SwordLegendz01]

By the way, can we give immortality type 4 negation to hakai users? maybe immortality 7 too

 

[TheGodOfICE777]

By the way, can we give immortality type 4 negation to hakai users? maybe immortality 7 too

Luffy was gonna make a crt about that i had been waiting for him to do it for a while

 

[SwordLegendz01]

Luffy was gonna make a crt about that i had been waiting for him to do it for a while

Alright

 

[Sir_Marvulous]

2-C = Buuhan < Kid Buu ~ Post-Vegito Division Super Saiyan 3 Goku <<< Post-Revitalization Super Saiyan Goku <<<<<< Post-Buu Saga Super Saiyan 3 Goku <<< Hirudegarn <<< Janemba <<< Super Gogeta < Super Vegito

Ultimate Gohan is at least 1/2 of Buuhan as a lowball. He matched Buutenks (who only overpowered him after he got tired in Toei DBZ), so Buutenks should be at least 1/2 of Buuhan. Gotenks should be at least 1/2 of Buutenks since he had the advantage over Super Buu, whom added the former's power to his own by absorbing him. Super Buu held his own against Gotenks. Super Buu should be about 4 times weaker than Buuhan as a lowball.

The real headache is making the Post-Vegito Division bullshit work

 

[TheGodOfICE777]

Time for madness to ensue

 

[LuffyRuffy46307]

Luffy was gonna make a crt about that i had been waiting for him to do it for a while

I think if someone tries it maybe it can come out better than mine

Alright

You can do it bro! But I don't know if it will be accepted, I'll send you the topic that was trying to do this and then you address all the arguments.

here is the topic that was discussed, you would have to address the counterarguments before anyone mentions it, in order for it to be accepted.

Use that mention of Sidra, where no being goes to the afterlife when he is hit by the hakai and ending his resurrection through the afterlife that purifies your entire soul and sends you back for a new body (being another being)

 

[SirAlex09]

Only in Vsbattlewiki I read nonsense like Broly having lost power gained via adaptation

Part 2: Jiren and Zeno don't resist Hakai XDDD. I wonder why Beerus and Co are still listening to the little midget

 

[TheGodOfICE777]

I think if someone tries it maybe it can come out better than mine

You can do it bro! But I don't know if it will be accepted, I'll send you the topic that was trying to do this and then you address all the arguments.

here is the topic that was discussed, you would have to address the counterarguments before anyone mentions it, in order for it to be accepted.

Use that mention of Sidra, where no being goes to the afterlife when he is hit by the hakai and ending his resurrection through the afterlife that purifies your entire soul and sends you back for a new body (being another being)

The arguments were that it was redundant which is a bad argument since accuracy is all that matters

Part 2: Jiren and Zeno don't resist Hakai XDDD. I wonder why Beerus and Co are still listening to the little midget

Changing that

 

[LuffyRuffy46307]

Part 2: Jiren and Zeno don't resist Hakai XDDD. I wonder why Beerus and Co are still listening to the little midget

Beerus can't kill him with hakai (if that were the case, all Gods of Destruction would try to kill him and Beerus already explained this during the anime) Zeno'oh doesn't fight, but he has the ability to erase anything in moments.

 

[SirAlex09]

Beerus can't kill him with hakai (if that were the case, all Gods of Destruction would try to kill him and Beerus already explained this during the anime) Zeno'oh doesn't fight, but he has the ability to erase anything in moments.

I know. I am just making fun of it

 

[LuffyRuffy46307]

I know. I am just making fun of it

I understand

 

[LuffyRuffy46307]

Guys, I was reviewing the manga and it seems that the Daishinkan may have abilities to manipulate the laws of angels, shall we discuss this?

 

[CryoTheMayo]

Guys, I was reviewing the manga and it seems that the Daishinkan may have abilities to manipulate the laws of angels, shall we discuss this?

I assume you mean this? To me it sounds like the Grand Priest just destroyed Merus before he was erased by the laws and then remade him as a mortal so he wouldn't be subject to them anymore. It's less the Grand Priest manipulating the laws of Angels and more him just exploiting a loophole. Put another way, are we going to give every lawyer 'law manipulation' for finding loopholes for clients? Just doesn't work.

It does serve as a good intelligence feat though, it shows the GP is well aware of how to abuse and bypass the restrictions on his existence if needed.

Despite what I said though, it would be good if we could bring up the original Japanese scan and maybe get someone to translate it. For all we know the Viz translation is inaccurate.

 

[LuffyRuffy46307]

I assume you mean this? To me it sounds like the Grand Priest just destroyed Merus before he was erased by the laws and then remade him as a mortal so he wouldn't be subject to them anymore. It's less the Grand Priest manipulating the laws of Angels and more him just exploiting a loophole. Put another way, are we going to give every lawyer 'law manipulation' for finding loopholes for clients? Just doesn't work.

It does serve as a good intelligence feat though, it shows the GP is well aware of how to abuse and bypass the restrictions on his existence if needed.

Despite what I said though, it would be good if we could bring up the original Japanese scan and maybe get someone to translate it. For all we know the Viz translation is inaccurate.

It's not that quote, he has a quote mentioned before about the laws of angels and Whis asks him about it, his comment has nothing to do.

 

[CryoTheMayo]

It's not that quote, he has a quote mentioned before about the laws of angels and Whis asks him about it, his comment has nothing to do.

Okay, then it must be this right? I can't think of any other instances of him discussing the Angel law. In these pages it's stated that the GP enforces Angel law and seems to more or less serve as the judge for them, with him deciding when it's 'too far' and the Angel needs to be erased. However we are also shown that the GP found a loophole for Merus to save him so either he can't fully go against the law or he simply created the loophole to 'technically' follow his own law.

From there we're going to need to concretely argue that Angel law is integral to reality and isn't simply just akin to human law. Is the Grand Priest actually controlling the limits of a divine law? Or is it just a ruling made up by free will? Well it seems the erasure process is natural, given Beerus believes they would need to explain to the GP what happened, but the GP does allude to ending Merus himself prior to Whis making his case.

So:

• Angelic law is integral to existence, it's not just made-up like human law and Merus is erased automatically for violating it
• Yet the Grand Priest mentions 'ending Merus's tenure' himself, meaning either he would kill Merus himself or he chooses when the law takes effect (defining the law's limits)
• The only reason Merus isn't erased there is because Whis provided a convincing argument to give him more leeway (greater limits)

There's no reason for the Grand Priest to step in and end Merus's tenure himself if the law is integral to existence like it's shown. Not unless the implication is that the Grand Priest has some level of control over that law, a law shown to be part of their very existence and taking effect automatically.

In short it does seem like the Grand Priest is actively controlling the law, meaning there is some argument for GP having Law Manipulation.

 

[SwordLegendz01]

here is the topic that was discussed, you would have to address the counterarguments before anyone mentions it, in order for it to be accepted.

Maybe I'll try it another time if I have time for it, currently I'm a bit busy preparing for the college entrance test.

 

[LuffyRuffy46307]

Okay, then it must be this right? I can't think of any other instances of him discussing the Angel law. In these pages it's stated that the GP enforces Angel law and seems to more or less serve as the judge for them, with him deciding when it's 'too far' and the Angel needs to be erased. However we are also shown that the GP found a loophole for Merus to save him so either he can't fully go against the law or he simply created the loophole to 'technically' follow his own law.

From there we're going to need to concretely argue that Angel law is integral to reality and isn't simply just akin to human law. Is the Grand Priest actually controlling the limits of a divine law? Or is it just a ruling made up by free will? Well it seems the erasure process is natural, given Beerus believes they would need to explain to the GP what happened, but the GP does allude to ending Merus himself prior to Whis making his case.

So:

• Angelic law is integral to existence, it's not just made-up like human law and Merus is erased automatically for violating it
• Yet the Grand Priest mentions 'ending Merus's tenure' himself, meaning either he would kill Merus himself or he chooses when the law takes effect (defining the law's limits)
• The only reason Merus isn't erased there is because Whis provided a convincing argument to give him more leeway (greater limits)

There's no reason for the Grand Priest to step in and end Merus's tenure himself if the law is integral to existence like it's shown. Not unless the implication is that the Grand Priest has some level of control over that law, a law shown to be part of their very existence and taking effect automatically.

In short it does seem like the Grand Priest is actively controlling the law, meaning there is some argument for GP having Law Manipulation.

Dude, thank you so much! You are simply amazing at putting together such an argument, I'm almost speechless, that's what I'm talking about, it is possible to argue that he can govern the laws of angels and during pages 52 to 56 it is mentioned about the laws of the Universes, if angels interfere create imbalance to the Universe (as Merus stated)

Also during the tournament it is mentioned that the Daishinkan is manipulating the whole tournament and putting rules for the participants not to be able to fly, I believe that it is manipulation of the law instead of annulling some thing

 

[LuffyRuffy46307]

Maybe I'll try it another time if I have time for it, currently I'm a bit busy preparing for the college entrance test.

Good boy, he's busy like me with college and work, I only have time on Sundays.

 

[LuffyRuffy46307]

Okay, then it must be this right? I can't think of any other instances of him discussing the Angel law. In these pages it's stated that the GP enforces Angel law and seems to more or less serve as the judge for them, with him deciding when it's 'too far' and the Angel needs to be erased. However we are also shown that the GP found a loophole for Merus to save him so either he can't fully go against the law or he simply created the loophole to 'technically' follow his own law.

From there we're going to need to concretely argue that Angel law is integral to reality and isn't simply just akin to human law. Is the Grand Priest actually controlling the limits of a divine law? Or is it just a ruling made up by free will? Well it seems the erasure process is natural, given Beerus believes they would need to explain to the GP what happened, but the GP does allude to ending Merus himself prior to Whis making his case.

So:

• Angelic law is integral to existence, it's not just made-up like human law and Merus is erased automatically for violating it
• Yet the Grand Priest mentions 'ending Merus's tenure' himself, meaning either he would kill Merus himself or he chooses when the law takes effect (defining the law's limits)
• The only reason Merus isn't erased there is because Whis provided a convincing argument to give him more leeway (greater limits)

There's no reason for the Grand Priest to step in and end Merus's tenure himself if the law is integral to existence like it's shown. Not unless the implication is that the Grand Priest has some level of control over that law, a law shown to be part of their very existence and taking effect automatically.

In short it does seem like the Grand Priest is actively controlling the law, meaning there is some argument for GP having Law Manipulation.

I really think you can make it happen, you are just amazing with it :3

 

[SwordLegendz01]

Also during the tournament it is mentioned that the Daishinkan is manipulating the whole tournament and putting rules for the participants not to be able to fly, I believe that it is manipulation of the law instead of annulling some thing

I don't know why I think that occasionally Goku in ToP at the MUI level can break that rule even though at the beginning of the tournament he tried to fly and couldn't even, but I kinda forgot it was at what minute.

 

[SwordLegendz01]

Good boy, he's busy like me with college and work, I only have time on Sundays.

That's how it is, I haven't even had time to prepare arguments for the additional thread about the saiyans.

 

[Tyranno223]

I don't know why I think that occasionally Goku in ToP at the MUI level can break that rule even though at the beginning of the tournament he tried to fly and couldn't even, but I kinda forgot it was at what minute.

MUI Goku never flew in the ToP. Are you thinking of the time he used ki blasts to bounce between Jiren's beams?

 

[LuffyRuffy46307]

That's how it is, I haven't even had time to prepare arguments for the additional thread about the saiyans.

Hehehe, I like your arguments, they are very good, I believe there will be time soon.

 

[LuffyRuffy46307]

I don't know why I think that occasionally Goku in ToP at the MUI level can break that rule even though at the beginning of the tournament he tried to fly and couldn't even, but I kinda forgot it was at what minute.

He used Ki Balls to float during this scene.

 

[SwordLegendz01]

MUI Goku never flew in the ToP. Are you thinking of the time he used ki blasts to bounce between Jiren's beams?

Not that, but I kind of remember that Goku didn't fly but made a foothold from his ki ball against Jiren.

He used Ki Balls to float during this scene.

Well, this one.

 

[SwordLegendz01]

Hehehe, I like your arguments, they are very good, I believe there will be time soon.

Thanks!

 

[LuffyRuffy46307]

Thanks!

You're welcome, bro