speedster352
He/Him- 17,544
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Who else scale to buuhan feat?
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Dragon Ball Super Discussion Thread 100
- Thread starter Warren_Valion
- Start date
Eden_Warlock99
She/Her- 10,226
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Doesn't the "This space would cover the living world" contradict it also destroying the Afterlife?
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But the Afterlife is not part of the universe.
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Depends on the Buuhan vs Kid Buu argument, otherwise GT and Vegito
read the next line
Yes it is. The 'living world' refers to the Universe, while 'the Universe' refers to the macrocosm that holds Heaven, Hell, and the world of the Kais along with the living world
speedster352
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No offence but anime buu Han had to be beaten by fusion and they said they had zero chance whereas Goku and vegeta argued on who to fight kid buu
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According to Koyama he stated that Hell is infinite, just like the Universe.
The living world alone is infinite, and the universe (macrocosm) includes the afterlife (Heaven and Hell which are also stated to be universe sized). Why wouldn't it be Low-2C?
Really, a 2C argument could be made
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anime scaling is weiiiiird trust me, due to narrator statements and filler that had Goku beat a Mystic Gohan clone inside of Buuhan who was stated to have the same strength as him in SSJ, there's a good argument that Kid Buu's the strongest Buu (this only applies to anime canon of course)
Nullflowerblush
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The Living World encompasses the Universe and the Demon Realm.
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No, the living world and universe are synonymous and outside of Super which contradicted the cosmology in many ways (and even in Super it’s dubious), the universe was never used to describe anything but. The Afterlife and Kaioshin were clearly described as completely different places.
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I mean does it matter, living world by itself is universal.
Nullflowerblush
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Considering Koyama no longer works on the anime, is his word really worth anything?
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I hate twitter upgrades tbh but he is just confirming what exists already in guidebooks
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Yes, he is worth more than his word, he who made the Dragon Ball Z anime
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This here is the Dragonball universe (macrocosm)
The living world is 'the universe' and demon realm sections (i'm not sure about the demon realm part i'm taking Null's word on it here), while it and the rest of the remaining places are the DB Universe (macrocosm). It's very confusing, the reason being simply that words in japanese have multiple meanings and translation gets wonky
Since this upgrade doesn't concern DBS, i think his word holds value
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I take it to mean his space distortion covers the entire living world, and then all of the universe( afterlife/kaio realm) is destroyed because it’d make no gramatical sense to use two separate terms when referring to the same thing in that specific sentence.
Nullflowerblush
He/Him- 9,791
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He was a former writer. "Former", because he is no longer a writer for the already concluded series. His authority is null.
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He was a writer for the Z buu saga, was he not? DBS is irrelevant then, seeing as it's a different verse to what we're discussing here
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And how does that make any difference?
He was in charge of the DBZ anime which is a closed continuity, no series ever after utilizes the actual same setting to where his statements would be effectively retconned by whoever else would be in charge.
He was in charge of the DBZ anime which is a closed continuity, no series ever after utilizes the actual same setting to where his statements would be effectively retconned by whoever else would be in charge.
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his authority is null when he talks about Dragon Ball Super, I don't see anything contradicting himself here, it's just a fact that you have to accept, he made the anime and his words have weight, if he's not messing with Dragon Ball Super it's valid .
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GT does actually, but there is no retcons as far as i'm aware
Nullflowerblush
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Stop bringing up Super, for Pete's sake; Super is irrelevant. Koyama is no longer the Word of God.
Simple as that.
Simple as that.
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Why's that then, if it's not about Super?
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Just sit and watch, your word is God, is it now? for God's sake, Koyama's word is worth more than yours and anyone who disagrees about Dragon Ball Z
Nullflowerblush
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Koyama's word in the present day is about as substantial as Rumiko Takahashi's word on Yashahime. The TV ended little under thirty years ago, and Koyama is throwing quick-fire answers to followers on Twitter.
His comments are not Word of God statements, they are his personal views until Toei Animation steps in and co-signs him after all of these years.
Vietthai96
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This is absolutely unnecessary, just because others have different opinions on the matter which oppose to you doesn't mean they hate the verse
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For the record I disagree with this, but let's not go on a tangent
Koyama's statement here only serves to strengthen something that's already in the guidebooks, so this shouldn't be a problem
Nullflowerblush
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Publish a CRT.
Vietthai96
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Bruhhh
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Sure. This is my first time doing this though, can you give me a pointer to a successful CRT that i can take an example from?
?
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Not even buuhan himself
Vegito stopped the feat and thats about it
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Well you can clearly see in this diagram that the Living World is the universe (as shown in the anime or manga). The idea of a Macrocosm is only maybe possible for the DBS anime because of there are a few strange statements and retcons, but in any version of DBZ the Afterlife was always considered a conventionally different universe and not part of the main universe in any way.This here is the Dragonball universe (macrocosm)
The living world is 'the universe' and demon realm sections (i'm not sure about the demon realm part i'm taking Null's word on it here), while it and the rest of the remaining places are the DB Universe (macrocosm). It's very confusing, the reason being simply that words in japanese have multiple meanings and translation gets wonky
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How do you explain Kid Buu reaching Otherworld in the anime, then?
Daizenshuu 4 and Daizenshuu 7 both have the macrocosm though, so it does apply to DBZ
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Because he literally used the Kai-Kai teleportation.
And their descriptions of the Dragon World never place the Afterlife and Living World as the same universe, and clearly treat them as completely different. How can they be a macrocosm, if the Afterlife is a completely separate place from the entire universe.
Vietthai96
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DBS never actually retcon anything, in fact Chouzenshuu for DBS still retain the same information from Daizenshuu for DBZ
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One unarguable retcon is the nonsense of King Yemma apparently only handling the souls of beings that die on Earth, when in DBZ (anime and manga) they clearly showed and explained that all aliens went to him.
But I agree logically even in Super it shouldn’t be the case but it seems to be inconsistent in the anime.
Vietthai96
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So kind of inconsistency is almost everywhere in DB, it is the verse characteristics bruhhh, but those thing not really affect cosmology as a whole.
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I’d like to think so, but the anime wrote strange things that at face value make no sense with DBZ’s world like saying “Zamasu was in U10” while he was in the Kaioshin Realm, but besides those kind of instances even in the Super anime the cardinal universes encompassing the Afterlives isn’t really contextually consistent, which is why I said there is no macrocosm outside of maybe the Super anime but even there this isn’t consistent.
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I still believe that the universe in this case refers to the macrocosm, since the word 'the universe' was used both in DBS and DBGT where Beerus and Goku / Omega Shenron threatened to destroy the macrocosm
I agree with this
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