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Dragon Ball Super Discussion Thread 100

Just opened Jiren´s profile and saw this note:
  1. Due to the vast amount of inconsistencies between various feats, statements, and information given about Time Skip, such as the mechanics explained by Vados and Whis, (that it is merely limited Time Travel that stores time) being directly contradicted on multiple occasions, including feats like freezing Goku in time (twice), Hit's own words, and Word of God, or what even qualifies as Time Skip, as Tides of Time (Hit's Dimension-Shift) was initially stated not to be, but this was contradicted later in the Tournament of Power, or regarding how Time Skip has a reliant Dimension connected to it for Time Storage contradicts Hit's testimony regarding how he never made Time Skip do more than its initial basic function before, (and the basic mechanics, as he needs to skip time first to then store it, contradicting even that description), etc. has created a patchwork of incoherence. Due to this, and how the Time Freezing and Travelling related parts of the ability must both be simultaneously true for the plot of the Dragon Ball Super Anime to make sense (as Vados/Whis explanation is the sole reason he has his greater Time Dimension abilities thoughout the Assassination Arc and the Tournament of Power, and he needs the abilities to also specifically be Time Stop for certain major plot sequences, like Time Cage, {a Time Stop ability which is explicitly described as "Time Skip in Reverse"} to affect Jiren), as well as the fact they are used interchangeably at several points, our community has decided to index the ability as both Time Travel and Time Stop, and to simply reconcile the best we can by ignoring these glaring contradictions to get the most accurate listing of Hit's ability. As such, Jiren's ability to get around these abilities will be indexed as they would be if this inconsistency did not exist. This includes resisting both time travel and stop.
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Reminds me of this:
GAViF7ZXYAAIbcy.jpg
 
Fezzih_007 said:
Is simple.
If someone time travels to the future, and you go with them, you're resistancing the ffect of staying in the past.
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no, if you time travel alongside them you either have time travel of your own to intercept them or Immearuable speed for the same effect......also Hit only travels to the future, not the past, and even then that would be Acausality type 1, event THEN it wouldn't apply to DB since traveling to the past doesn't change the future
 
Oh wait he thinks it's supposed to be resisting Hit traveling through time. No, it's resisting Time Cage, which is "Time Skip in reverse." Time Skip being currently indexed as time travel and time stop. So in this case he's legit just resisting someone trying to force him through time.
 
omegabronic said:
no, if you time travel alongside them you either have time travel of your own to intercept them or Immearuable speed for the same effect
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Not really, If someone time travels, and you can follow them or intercepts then, that means you can resist the effects of someone sending you to the future.

Like, someone go to the future, that means leaving the past behind, and you can tag them while they going to the future. That means you're resisting the effects of the time travel.
 
Fezzih_007 said:
Not really, If someone time travels, and you can follow them or intercepts then, that means you can resist the effects of someone sending you to the future.

Like, someone go to the future, that means leaving the past behind, and you can tag them while they going to the future. That means you're resisting the effects of the time travel.
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Er, no, that means you're just time traveling to follow them. Or you're punching to the future, which isn't resisting time travel, but range-
 
although in this case hit does not send you to the future, and only hit is the one that travels to the future.

well it doesn't matter and Idk
Fezzih_007 said:
Not really, If someone time travels, and you can follow them or intercepts then, that means you can resist the effects of someone sending you to the future.
Click to expand...
 
Fezzih_007 said:
Not really, If someone time travels, and you can follow them or intercepts then, that means you can resist the effects of someone sending you to the future.
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.........that would be resistance to BFR, even then that doesn't apply here as Hit goes alone to the future

Fezzih_007 said:
Like, someone go to the future, that means leaving the past behind, and you can tag them while they going to the future. That means you're resisting the effects of the time travel.
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no, that means you yourself is Time Traveling to follow them, you are not resisting anything as there is absolutely nothing to resist in the first place

RedReaper616 said:
I imagine it's much like resisting BFR. Someone tries to force teleport you, doesn't work. Except in this case temporally.
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that would be resisting BFR, not Hit time traveling

RedReaper616 said:
No, it's resisting Time Cage, which is "Time Skip in reverse." Time Skip being currently indexed as time travel and time stop. So in this case he's legit just resisting someone trying to force him through time.
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"in reverse" aka the oposite of advancing time is to make it not move at all also scan for such statement please?, regardless the effects of the time cage are said to simply stop one in time, with Hit affirming that all he is doing is making Jiren be stopped
 
omegabronic said:
i don't think you understand, in the scenarion you describe, one would have the ability to Time Travel, without that the scenario you described makes no sense
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That's what i said, one character have a time travel ability, and the other don't.

Les't me explain better.

Person A can go to the future. Person B can't do that. If Person A goes to the future, and Person B is able to follows then even without the ability to time travel, they either have Immerasuble speed, or can powernull the ability of time travel of the other character. And no, you would't need speed to do that.
 
Fezzih_007 said:
That's what i said, one character have a time travel ability, and the other don't.
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as i said, in the situation you are describing, the other must also be able to time travel, else the situation you described makes no sense

Fezzih_007 said:
Les't me explain better.

Person A can go to the future. Person B can't do that. If Person A goes to the future, and Person B is able to follows then even without the ability to time travel, they either have Immerasuble speed
Click to expand...
which would mean that they do have the ability to Time Travel as that is the most standard thing about Immeasurable speed, meaning that they would be able to time travel

Fezzih_007 said:
, or can powernull the ability of time travel of the other character. And no, you would't need speed to do that.
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no because person A is still time traveling in the scenarion you described, that wasn't nulled, person B simply followed them
 
Fezzih_007 said:
No i mean, nulled the effects for themselfs.
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there is no effect on themselves, the things isn't even being used on them in the first place, unless you mean they aren't affect by the attack in the future? which would be Acausality and not power null

Fezzih_007 said:
Like, Person A time travels to the future, and Person B is unnafected by that.
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acausality you mean? also that isn't what Goku did, he followed Hit, he wasn't unnafected by his skip, he followed him to stop his from attacking in the first place
 
Oh i see the problem.
I not talking about Goku and Hit. You said "you can't resist someone time traveling" which i disagree, since you totally can.

What Goku did is another discussion. Which is more easy to explain.
omegabronic said:
also that isn't what Goku did, he followed Hit, he wasn't unnafected by his skip, he followed him to stop his from attacking in the first place
Click to expand...
 
omegabronic said:
.........that would be resistance to BFR, even then that doesn't apply here as Hit goes alone to the future


no, that means you yourself is Time Traveling to follow them, you are not resisting anything as there is absolutely nothing to resist in the first place


that would be resisting BFR, not Hit time traveling


"in reverse" aka the oposite of advancing time is to make it not move at all also scan for such statement please?, regardless the effects of the time cage are said to simply stop one in time, with Hit affirming that all he is doing is making Jiren be stopped
Click to expand...
So I found it, but apparently it's a mistranslation of what Vados actually said.

She said Hit "is using Time Skip continually only on Jiren" (episode 111, 12:51, Sub) and the version I saw worded this as "Time Skip in reverse," (referring to the range of Time Skip, since Hit has inverted it from affecting everyone but himself to affecting a singular person not himself.)

Edit: The point remains regardless, though. All Time Prison is, is normal Time Skip, but locked onto a singular person in such a way that instead of reality being affected, they are. As Time Skip is indexed as both Time Stop and Travel, (and ignoring the narrative contradictions as accepted by thread), this means he's simply resisting both. Also, temporal BFR (forced time travel) is a thing. Check out Thor punching the World Serpent across time in GoW, or Aku throwing Jack through time in Samurai Jack. In this case, Jiren is resisting that.
 
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You know, it occurs to me. Both (Manga) Merged Zamasu and Anilaza warp space time and create portals through punching really ******* hard. Like, identically to Vice Shout, it's just raw force being outputted in a punch that on paper anyone can do, (since it's just a matter of strength). Why don't we index that for profiles like we do for Vice Shout?
 
RedReaper616 said:
So I found it, but apparently it's a mistranslation of what Vados actually said.

She said Hit "is using Time Skip continually only on Jiren" (episode 111, 12:51, Sub) and the version I saw worded this as "Time Skip in reverse," (referring to the range of Time Skip, since Hit has inverted it from affecting everyone but himself to affecting a singular person not himself.)

Edit: The point remains regardless, though. All Time Prison is, is normal Time Skip, but locked onto a singular person in such a way that instead of reality being affected, they are. As Time Skip is indexed as both Time Stop and Travel, (and ignoring the narrative contradictions as accepted by thread), this means he's simply resisting both. Also, temporal BFR (forced time travel) is a thing. Check out Thor punching the World Serpent across time in GoW, or Aku throwing Jack through time in Samurai Jack. In this case, Jiren is resisting that.
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I know it is a thing, i mentioned in the post you are answering
 
RedReaper616 said:
Both (Manga) Merged Zamasu and Anilaza warp space time and create portals through punching really ******* hard.
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Firstly, Zamasu creates portals using supernatural powers.

Secondly, yes, Anilaza "パワーで空間をゆがめやがった" ("distorted space with his power"), but the Subspace Punch is described as "unbelievable" and "Quite a wonderful attack!" and is, appropriately, treated as a supernatural power by the Z-Fighters and the narrative, rather than merely a feat of strength any fighter can achieve. You'd think, if anybody could warp space via raw strength,—with nothing but punches,—you'd see that a lot more often from, say, Destruction Mode Toppo, Jiren, Blue Evolution Vegeta, Ultra Instinct Goku, etc.
 
vsbattles.com

Back to the beginning

The new DBS map is just the Observed Living Universe, that's all, it doesn't contain all the other realms, so it shouldn't be accepted as being absolute for the macrocosm, because this map only represents the Observed Living Universe. Ah but Luffy how can you know that this map is just the...
vsbattles.com vsbattles.com
 
Nullflowerblush said:
Firstly, Zamasu creates portals using supernatural powers.
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I suppose I misremembered this one. Fair enough.
Nullflowerblush said:
Secondly, yes, Anilaza "パワーで空間をゆがめやがった" ("distorted space with his power"), but the Subspace Punch is described as "unbelievable" and "Quite a wonderful attack!" and is, appropriately, treated as a supernatural power by the Z-Fighters and the narrative, rather than merely a feat of strength any fighter can achieve.
Click to expand...
Interesting. Makes sense to me.
Nullflowerblush said:
You'd think, if anybody could warp space via raw strength,—with nothing but punches,—you'd see that a lot more often from, say, Destruction Mode Toppo,
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This guy warps the WoV. This is literally considered space manip on his profile. On top of that, he should totally scale above the prior space manip feats in the series.
Nullflowerblush said:
Jiren,
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This guy transcends time. While it isn’t space, space and time are often connected and he should already upscale like Toppo.
Nullflowerblush said:
Blue Evolution Vegeta, Ultra Instinct Goku, etc.
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These guys beat the other guys, and have their own space manip feats. Should upscale.

So I dunno if these examples work all that well, really, when they mostly already qualify and by all logic on paper could totally pull it off if they just directed and controlled their spatial nonsense. It’s part of why I asked to begin with.
 
Nullflowerblush said:
Hurts my heart everyday knowing that the only known HD scan of Jiya and Sachie-chan Guu!! has 0 seeders and 7 leechers.
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I'm almost like this because the guy who does the Brazilian translation of Dragon Ball Super has several lost DB media (or at least very difficult to find) at home (physical) and doesn't scan it for the rest of the fandom.
 
Nullflowerblush said:
Firstly, Zamasu creates portals using supernatural powers.

Secondly, yes, Anilaza "パワーで空間をゆがめやがった" ("distorted space with his power"), but the Subspace Punch is described as "unbelievable" and "Quite a wonderful attack!" and is, appropriately, treated as a supernatural power by the Z-Fighters and the narrative, rather than merely a feat of strength any fighter can achieve. You'd think, if anybody could warp space via raw strength,—with nothing but punches,—you'd see that a lot more often from, say, Destruction Mode Toppo, Jiren, Blue Evolution Vegeta, Ultra Instinct Goku, etc.
Click to expand...
More exactly, Zamasu creates rifts in dimensions:

 
Although, what the article says about the manga's version of Jiren's Full Power is curious.
ジレンは、その圧倒的な力をオーラとして身に纏って、悟空たちと闘ったぞ！ 気功波の直撃にも耐える、強力な技だ!!

(ChatGPT's translation; I'm taking a drug test right now so...) "Jiren enveloped himself in an overwhelming aura of power and fought Goku and the others! It's a powerful technique that can withstand direct hits from energy blasts!"
Click to expand...
Apparently, he can wrap himself in his own power, and that grants him a boost? I'm not really sure what it's supposed to imply; if it's just an aura or if he's doing something unique (nothing really unique by releasing your Ki outward).
 
Nullflowerblush said:
Although, what the article says about the manga's version of Jiren's Full Power is curious.
Nullflowerblush said:
ジレンは、その圧倒的な力をオーラとして身に纏って、悟空たちと闘ったぞ！ 気功波の直撃にも耐える、強力な技だ!!


(ChatGPT's translation; I'm taking a drug test right now so...) "Jiren enveloped himself in an overwhelming aura of power and fought Goku and the others! It's a powerful technique that can withstand direct hits from energy blasts!"
Click to expand...

Apparently, he can wrap himself in his own power, and that grants him a boost? I'm not really sure what it's supposed to imply; if it's just an aura or if he's doing something unique (nothing really unique by releasing your Ki outward).
Click to expand...
What's that about?
 
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