Dragon Ball Super Discussion Thread 100

[Nullflowerblush]

Either Cell has been a Super Saiyan from as far back as the fight with Goku (37.2162956067 Foe) and the increase received by Third Grade is unquantifiable, thus making Super Saiyan Gohan stronger than Cell but not by fifty-times; or Cell was in normal form against Gohan, then entered Third Grade, thus granting a fifty-fold boost (938.25893 Foe), thus making Gohan half as strong as Cell in base form.

I don't think either is going to go over well.

 

[Phsccarvalho]

Either Cell has been a Super Saiyan from as far back as the fight with Goku (37.2162956067 Foe) and the increase received by Third Grade is unquantifiable, thus making Super Saiyan Gohan stronger than Cell but not by fifty-times; or Cell was in normal form against Gohan, then entered Third Grade, thus granting a fifty-fold boost (938.25893 Foe), thus making Gohan half as strong as Cell in base form.

I don't think either is going to go over well.

How is Gohan's kamehameha considered?

Because it's late at night and I'm in a hurry to read the manga again, but I saw that the loss of his arm made him lose half of his power, right? He defeated cell with half the power or at that moment he recovered 100% (the justification in the profile doesn't detail it very well and I'm too eager to read the manga at the moment to see this half power thing I read)

If he defeated Super Perfect Cell with half the power in SSJ2, by mathematics, half of SSJ2 would be equal to the full power of SSJ, right? So it would end up that PCell < SPCell < Gohan SSJ/SSJ2 half the power

But that's probably not it.

 

[RanHover60]

Epic, actually. This year, before the Anni, I legitimately didn’t care about it and so put my CC into the bait Ultra Summons (Ultra SSB Vegito and Ultra SSR Goku Black) and got both. Then the Anni came around and they revealed Mid-Fight Fusion Duos, and while I was impressed given the game has came a long way, I really didn’t care outside of the fact I have this goal to get at least 6 Goku-Vegeta Duos so I can have a full team of them, so I summoned for both. And I got both. Vegito on First Rotation of Step 3 and Gogeta on First Rotation of Step 4.

Didn’t get Shin or Broly, but those were optional anyway. Outside of that my Summons are going as well as can be expected, really. Mostly copies of Heroes and Extremes, but a decent amount of Sparking copies and the occasional chance new (old) unit.

I’ve also had some really good luck lately. Before the anniversary I caved in and did two rotas of the pick up banner but I managed to pull two copies of MUI and three of Super 17 and still had 7k left.

For the new banners, I got Gogeta on the last step of the first rota along with the tag gammas and two copies of broly. For Vegito though it took four or five rotas I managed to pull two copies of him. I was also able to get transcendent Kamehama Goku and Vegeta and Get old Vegito to 8 stars and Legends Limited Buu saga Vegeta to 7 so now I can zenkai awaken them at least.

Overall, my luck has been really good. Got both headliners for part one along with a lot of legends limited characters

 

[FrolzeurX]

Bosse

 

[StrymULTRA]

Plan on doing that later

HUH.

No more Tier 1?

 

[Shadyboi0]

 

[Stefano4444]

Yeah I really hate to admit it but if the visuals of u6 and 7 were accepted as being accurate, we need to take the 2c ratings into questioning too.

That visuals imply that each universe is either 3-C or they have just one single universal size galaxy, both which are just factually wrong since the existence of multiple galaxies are mention in the Manga and show in Anime.

As well the fact that it also means each respective Otherworld and Kaioshin World are know considered as be outside dimensions no longer part of the universes like Zeno's palace, which is also factually wrong based on the fact that those realms are still considered/show part of the same universe along with the Living World in both Anime and Manga.

Seriously the visuals arguments its just so full of holes in any angle that anyone who had enough common sense would see that it can't work.

 

[Hasty12345]

canon depictions of cosmology are wrong because they contradict secondary canon guide material.

 

[RanHover60]

it was pointed at that some of small bits of light were likely galaxies.

 

[Omegabronic]

HUH.

No more Tier 1?

No idea, all i'm trying is to make us have consistency here, if we accepted the super model model as disproof for infinite universe, then we must also for tier 2 and the likes, altho that would be very later down the line and not in my priority list at all

 

[Killerdrone123]

canon depictions of cosmology are wrong because they contradict secondary canon guide material.

Meanwhile the main manga and the author showing the macrocosm globe

 

[Omegabronic]

it was pointed at that some of small bits of light were likely galaxies.

Yeah, that i can't negate, like, a star doesn't look like a disk like hundreds of lights there look lol

 

[Omegabronic]

Meanwhile the main manga and the author showing the macrocosm globe

Pherhaps the dbs manga does have different cosmologies after all

also the map is wrong either way

 

[StrymULTRA]

Yeah, that i can't negate, like, a star doesn't look like a disk like hundreds of lights there look lol

I mean, the "galaxies" in DB are quadrants containing many others in the universe, so maybe it's a reference to that.

 

[Killerdrone123]

Pherhaps the dbs manga does have different cosmologies after all

also the map is wrong either way

Dude you have one map which literally lacks part of cosmology and other which is given in canon manga and also supported by author and guides plus shows all realms of the cosmology

It literally is no brainer which one is correct and which one is wrong

 

[RanHover60]

Well now that the thread decompositing the cosmology is likely going to pass, how U7 appears in the manga will no longer matter to the anime.

 

[Stefano4444]

canon depictions of cosmology are wrong because they contradict secondary canon guide material.

Its Jaco commenting about there are countless galaxies, that they actually show to be the case in the Anime or the original U7 structure appearing in the Manga secondary guide material?

it was pointed at that some of small bits of light were likely galaxies.

That its just an mere assumption and nothing else suggest those lights are galaxies, those could had been just very distant/rogue stars or star clusters.

Beside it doesn't change the fact that there is no statements within the series, from interviews or guide material that say that those visuals are mean to be fully accurate.

Like the way the Manga show the universes are also inconsistent with how they are show in the Anime, its clear that they shouldn't be taken at face value.

 

[ArcaneAbyss]

So where exactly is the afterlife and kaioshin realm supposed to be in those anime depictions?

 

[Ottavio_Merluzzo]

Snip

You know what's funny? If we do take these seriously, but assume that galaxy is a just an artistic representation of the other countless galaxies and celestial bodies as someone else said, this literally shows the 12 universes being space-time bubbles that are clearly separated from each other.

In any case, there's no argument for below tier 2 / tier 3.

 

[Omegabronic]

So where exactly is the afterlife and kaioshin realm supposed to be in those anime depictions?

That is assuming they would be visible in the first place

 

[ArcaneAbyss]

That is assuming they would be visible in the first place

Why would it not be visible? Are you saying the anime visualization is only showing e mortal universe?

 

[Omegabronic]

Why would it not be visible?

Better question, why would it?

 

[ArcaneAbyss]

Better question, why would it?

Why would a part of the universe be visible in what is to be a complete representation of the universe? Are you trolling?

 

[Omegabronic]

Why would a part of the universe be visible in what is to be a complete representation of the universe? Are you trolling?

Zoom out enough and you can't see any galaxy or star at all in the universe, being a part of it doesn't mean it is visible

 

[RedReaper616]

Zoom out enough and you can't see any galaxy or star at all in the universe, being a part of it doesn't mean it is visible

But…what…no?

The various realms have sizes relative to/based on the universe, so it should be visible regardless. Like, ignoring Heaven, the World of the Kais is ONE TENTH the size of the Macrocosm/Universe and is yet part OF it (revolving around it, specifically). It should DEFINITELY be visible from a mere Zoom Out.

 

[LuffyRuffy46307]

Well, you can do the crt to return to the normal map, where all the kingdoms are shown, because the anime's map really isn't to scale and people are wanting to make Universe 3-C

 

[Omegabronic]

But…what…no?

The various realms have sizes relative to/based on the universe, so it should be visible regardless. Like, ignoring Heaven

oH yeah, currently we accept it as that big, but soon that will change and it will go back to being unquantifiable in size

, the World of the Kais is ONE TENTH the size of the Macrocosm/Universe and is yet part OF it (revolving around it, specifically). It should DEFINITELY be visible from a mere Zoom Out.

Which contradicts it not beinf visible in the DBS anime, showing that that information is no longer valid to it at least

 

[Omegabronic]

Well, you can do the crt to return to the normal map, where all the kingdoms are shown because the anime's map really isn't to scale

The map is not to scale, snake way is not half the universe in size

and people are wanting to make Universe 3-C

WHat? No one ever said that lol

 

[RedReaper616]

Also, the concept of a Dimension moving in circles around other Dimensions is kinda hilarious, since the area is considered a “separate realm,” also of a different “space-time,” that can only be entered through the space-time transportation methods used by Kai-Kai, teleportation, and Angels. But still moves around dimensions somehow.

 

[LuffyRuffy46307]

Also, the concept of a Dimension moving in circles around other Dimensions is kinda hilarious, since the area is considered a “separate realm,” also of a different “space-time,” that can only be entered through the space-time transportation methods used by Kai-Kai, teleportation, and Angels. But still moves around dimensions somehow.

This is what is expected for someone who does not know cosmology

 

[RedReaper616]

oH yeah, currently we accept it as that big, but soon that will change and it will go back to being unquantifiable in size

Hence why I ignored it, because it’s in contention currently.

Which contradicts it not beinf visible in the DBS anime, showing that that information is no longer valid to it at least

Wha-Noooo? You do realize the Kaioshin Realm model is still used in all but like one example I posted on the Macrocosm Model argument posts I made earlier, right? Such as the DBS Manga? Besides, this is moving the goalpost of proof from “oh why would they be seen, it’s just too small,” to “well the canon size is clearly contradicted,” (by the literal point in contention, thus you need to prove why it’s value ranks over the rest of the evidence, not just say it is), “sooooo that information doesn’t count.”

Like, at that point you might as well just say any canon information given to us by the guy who made the series is irrelevant. Toriyama literally drew up the model and said “This is the Macrocosm.” Toei then copied it verbatim and said “This is the Macrocosm.” Bandai copied it verbatim for various games and said “This is the Macrocosm.” It was used as a Title Screen for DBKai, with the intent of showing you the Macrocosm. It’s used in the Super Manga. It’s in the Guides. The only outlier is the Super Anime, dude, (and even then the Super Anime Guide literally contradicts this).

EDIT: This contradiction was also created by the super magic reality warping Dragon with Galaxies inside it that can make the impossible possible, like being viewed in all Macrocosms at once DESPITE THE FACT they are totally separate space-times and realities as a golden light in the sky, regardless of your position in said incomprehensible expanse. You could pretty easily write it off as a one off inconsistency or outlier caused by reality warping BS and call it a day, really.

 

[Omegabronic]

Hence why I ignored it, because it’s in contention currently.

I see

Wha-Noooo? You do realize the Kaioshin Realm model is still used in all but like one example I posted on the Macrocosm Model argument posts I made earlier, right? Such as the DBS Manga?

hence why i specified the DBS anime's version

Besides, this is moving the goalpost of proof from “oh why would they be seen, it’s just too small,” to “well the canon size is clearly contradicted,” (by the literal point in contention, thus you need to prove why it’s value ranks over the rest of the evidence, not just say it is), “sooooo that information doesn’t count.”

i am not moving the post, both can be true, and the source material itself would rank higher than suplementary material......that is how suplementary/secondary cannon material works

Like, at that point you might as well just say any canon information given to us by the guy who made the series is irrelevant.

If what he says doesn't contradict the said series then no

Toriyama literally drew up the model and said “This is the Macrocosm.” Toei then copied it verbatim and said “This is the Macrocosm.” Bandai copied it verbatim for various games and said “This is the Macrocosm.” It was used as a Title Screen for DBKai, with the intent of showing you the Macrocosm. It’s used in the Super Manga. It’s in the Guides. The only outlier is the Super Anime, dude, (and even then the Super Anime Guide literally contradicts this).

hence why i specified the DBS anime and not all continuities, and as i said, if a guide contradicts the main material, then said main material gets priority

EDIT: This contradiction was also created by the super magic reality warping Dragon with Galaxies inside it that can make the impossible possible, like being viewed in all Macrocosms at once DESPITE THE FACT they are totally separate space-times and realities as a golden light in the sky, regardless of your position in said incomprehensible expanse. You could pretty easily write it off as a one off inconsistency or outlier caused by reality warping BS and call it a day, really.

1 That is assuming that the dragon is reality warping like that for.....some reason? Which is also never said
2 the ToP scene is clearlt him traveling through the universes, so....

 

[TheGreatBanana]

Dragon ball: Showes the map of the macrocosm with all of the realms being present and visbil, such map and depiction [that is drawn by Akira, the literal author] being used in z anime, Super anime, Super manga.
Omega: no, we gotta use the inconsistent visual one that goes against all statements and literal Canon depictions of the macrocosm...for some reason.

 

[LuffyRuffy46307]

Dragon ball: Showes the map of the macrocosm with all of the realms being present and visbil, such map and depiction [that is drawn by Akira, the literal author] being used in z anime, Super anime, Super manga.
Omega: no, we gotta use the inconsistent visual one that goes against all statements and literal Canon depictions of the macrocosm...for some reason.

I really like seeing these things

 

[Omegabronic]

Dragon ball: Showes the map of the macrocosm with all of the realms being present and visbil, such map and depiction [that is drawn by Akira, the literal author] being used in z anime, Super anime, Super manga.
Omega: no, we gotta use the inconsistent visual one that goes against all statements and literal Canon depictions of the macrocosm...for some reason.

the super anime doesn't use the macrocosm map tho

 

[Nullflowerblush]

You know there's an entire Content Revision Thread you guys could be discussing this in in a somewhat meaningful way, right?

 

[LuffyRuffy46307]

Leave the fire on, i like to watch this while eating popcorn

 

[Nullflowerblush]

man they aren't sending their best

 

[Tipper17]

 

[BestMGQScalerEver]

You know what's funny? If we do take these seriously, but assume that galaxy is a just an artistic representation of the other countless galaxies and celestial bodies as someone else said, this literally shows the 12 universes being space-time bubbles that are clearly separated from each other.

In any case, there's no argument for below tier 2 / tier 3.

Doesn't need to be a space-time bubble just a spatial bubble. Anyways can we please keep atleast low 2-C macrocosms