Dio versus Diavolo

[CrackerVolley]

Hey, I think people forgot to add my vote for Diavolo...

 

[Anttron224]

@Tincan123

Jotaro was trying to teach Josuke to follow through because he wanted him to take out Ratt and learn how to shoot for later fights. Using that as an example of Jotaro's faults is demonstrably misleading.

 

[Inverted_Tempest]

You are actively acting like there is absolutely no timeframe DIO is going to be able to do anything when that simply isn't the case. You realize Time Stop for DIO is thought-based, right? Literally shown when he's toying with Polnareff and when Polnareff tried jumping him. I do not know why you keep insisting DIO has no frame of reaction whatsoever. We give Diavolo the benefit of the doubt by getting off the first Time Erase and when it ends, DIO's Time Stop naturally goes off afterward. Knowing what even happens won't help from the activation in response to what Diavolo did in the Time Erasure. And with what Sixo's said based on Diavolo doing things based on interpretation since he doesn't flat out know the method and doesn't remotely do the limited supplement you've been providing, DIO still should have the ability to Time Stop afterward.

"This communicates nothing."

No, it communicates the very simple fact that Diavolo isn't going to accomplish remotely anything past the very first Time Erasure. Several people have explained this to you and your response was "Bad argument" or "Lol" in a mocking tone. Now, either address what's actually being said or flat out do not reply to it all, it's that simple.

Ummmm, quote from you, "If no one's going to argue the real problem here I will just ask the match up to be remove if it's added by commenting the surprising thing I said 4 times already. In fact, f*ck it, I can't convince this much users who doesn't read the arguments, I will unfollow this and see what was going on here later." You were insinuating you were going to have this thread removed by the proposition of asking, the difference doesn't matter. And just because the users "do not read arguments," is simply not true, they just do not agree with your view. You're still losing your cool over a fictional topic of discussion, remember this is all for fun at the end of the day, not something for you to aggressively mock people on.

 

[TriforcePower1]

If Dio's going to time stop right after the time erasure ends, Diavolo just timeskips again. He can see what's going to happen after he finishes to time erase during time erasure, so if he sees himself dying he'd skip the time that happens. Yes, he'd need to skip nearly the entire battle, but King Crimson DOESN'T have cooldown. He only gets out of time erasure because he cannot interact with people during it. He can just time skip till he's 100% sure Dio won't timestop immediately after and just attack him once, twice and so on till Dio's regen stops working.

 

[Paul_Frank]

Diavolo does not have infinite stamina so no he couldnt spam king crimsom the whole fight until dio dies and again diavolo wouldn't aim for the head

 

[Moritzva]

Maybe we should get this thread closed. Grace is already over and it was one hell of a close fight.

 

[JohnConquest1]

People are still debating it though personally don't feel okay with this being added regardless.

 

[Genericstickman]

Congrats DIO, after two loses you finally beat Diavolo

 

[Moritzva]

People are still debating it though personally don't feel okay with this being added regardless.

That would be true is new information is being brought to the table. It's just the same DIO arguments vs the same Diavolo arguments. If someone dropped an information bomb like "Acktually Dio could move in erased time" (he can't, but example), then this should be kept up.

 

[Sixo_Bullets]

 

[BlastX]

...Is there a reason why Awakened DIO wasn't used? Does he turn this match into a stomp

 

[JohnConquest1]

His better regen and how he could possibly have access to Part 1 abilities.

 

[Eficiente]

You are actively acting like there is absolutely no timeframe DIO is going to be able to do anything when that simply isn't the case. You realize Time Stop for DIO is thought-based, right? Literally shown when he's toying with Polnareff and when Polnareff tried jumping him. I do not know why you keep insisting DIO has no frame of reaction whatsoever.

You are once again ignoring what I said. I know DIO's timestop can be thought-based, and that it will be thought-based in that moment, this still doesn't mean that Diavolo's suddenly not erasing that timestop which he will see coming due to his precog, as you're not communicating how that doesn't happen you are not saying anything useful. Just stuff everyone already knows.

We give Diavolo the benefit of the doubt by getting off the first Time Erase and when it ends, DIO's Time Stop naturally goes off afterward. Knowing what even happens won't help from the activation in response to what Diavolo did in the Time Erasure.

That's no "benefit of the doubt" as it doesn't matter, as I said before. Diavolo erases that timestop which he sees coming via precog, then DIO has a cooldown and Diavolo can attack and erase time before it ends.

"This communicates nothing."

No, it communicates the very simple fact that Diavolo isn't going to accomplish remotely anything past the very first Time Erasure. Several people have explained this to you and your response was "Bad argument" or "Lol" in a mocking tone. Now, either address what's actually being said or flat out do not reply to it all, it's that simple.

This was aiming to you saying "this happens" and not elaborating, that's why it "communicates nothing". Here's what you said; "The second time erasure doesn't happen, that's already been over. DIO in character prevents Diavolo from remotely doing anything past the first time erasure and this has already been told to you over and over, I have no idea why that is so difficult to understand."

I'm the one unsatisfied with most of the arguments here, I politely going to say that I don't care about the subjective opinions you are having there.

Ummmm, quote from you, "If no one's going to argue the real problem here I will just ask the match up to be remove if it's added by commenting the surprising thing I said 4 times already. In fact, f*ck it, I can't convince this much users who doesn't read the arguments, I will unfollow this and see what was going on here later." You were insinuating you were going to have this thread removed by the proposition of asking, the difference doesn't matter. And just because the users "do not read arguments," is simply not true, they just do not agree with your view. You're still losing your cool over a fictional topic of discussion, remember this is all for fun at the end of the day, not something for you to aggressively mock people on.

That quote proves my point of me just asking for the matter to be handled. "they just do not agree with your view" is not at all what was going on there, the thing that "I said 4 times already" was something that never got an argument at the time, what's more, some guy after that proved my point by saying that TP's argument was answering mine when it didn't (again. after saying it 4 times), and DIO was still getting FRAs. Later someone called me on my wall and said that the argument was finally recognized, with now TP and that user voting Diavolo. You are misunderstanding various things here, so know that, again, I politely don't care about your subjective opinions, if you want to think that bad of me then that's fine.

 

[LordUrien935]

1. Jotaro literally plot armored through that fight there is no way around that
2. Jotaro's time stop around that time was like 3 seconds

3. It really only took ger to be fair silver chariot kinda hurt the group a bit but that's besides the point also requiem stands were exclusive to that part because that's the only place the requiem arrow could be found

4. Jotaro's time stop was even worse I'm pretty sure and also Emiya alter is broken

Chariot Requiem was crucial in defeating Diavolo. If it wasn't for the soul swapping ability then Diavolo would've received King Crimson Requiem. It was only thanks to Bruno exploiting Chariot Requiem's powers that Giorno was able to get the arrow. And Part 6 Jotaro was him at his strongest. He got his 5 second time stop again and Star Platinum's developmental potential went down to E.

The other 2 I agree that it's PIS. (Especially the Ratt fight, but Jotaro actually only had 0.5 seconds of time stop.)

 

[LordUrien935]

Also where was it ever stated that Time Skip takes up Diavolo's stamina?

 

[Eficiente]

Btw I vote Diavolo ftra.

 

[Moritzva]

...Is there a reason why Awakened DIO wasn't used? Does he turn this match into a stomp

Would of been a much more one-sided fight.

 

[LordUrien935]

Really makes you wonder how Diavolo has a victory against Awakened DIO on his profile.

 

[TriforcePower1]

Most Dio votes probably are just anime only fans that have only seen the PIS-filled fight between Bruno and Diavolo. Just look at how little was precognition brought up.

Again, Diavolo just sees everything coming with Precog to the point he can literally erase small amounts of time to make sure every single bullets gets blocked by natural occurrences, and he's always going to see Dio stopping time and he's always going to hit right after he thinks he has won by hitting Diavolo's afterimage.

 

[Moritzva]

Really makes you wonder how Diavolo has a victory against Awakened DIO on his profile.

This was basically the remake of that thread.

 

[Inverted_Tempest]

I'm not ignoring what you said whatsoever, I'm putting it very simply. Okay, it's pretty obvious that Diavolo uses it to sneak attack, which is why I agreed with. We're still on the same page at this point? Hope we are because this is getting redundant with you being willfully ignorant. First Time Erasure will not work at successfully putting down DIO, his method has already been explained and why that hardly matters when he can still actively use his Time Stop when traumatically suffering from far worse. Diavolo, in character, mostly uses Time Erasure as a defense. Examples here and here. That's what I've been trying to communicate with you. The surprise attack won't work, Enhanced Senses + Regenerationn which is not something I objectively claim I argued originally first, but you have failed to actually substantiate ways around it. Using it as a defense is mostly what it's used for because DIO will already know he's there. If he uses it defensively, that literally means Diavolo is far more likely to see what he will do in order to accomplish what is done through Epitaph. Nobody is denying what happens with Epitaph seeing the future either, just that Diavolo doesn't spam it in conjunction with Time Erasure offensively to the extent you're suggesting. Epitaph gives him an idea of what will happen as well, not the full picture. He will be going off of interpretation in which he actively tries to see what happens. Do you know why that goes incredibly poorly for Diavolo? Because DIO doesn't approach you like that, he uses Time Stop from a distance which means Diavolo has no reason to Time Erase and then Dio can MUDA him to oblivion and so on for other options.

The rest of this stuff isn't really relevant to the thread at this point, but I'll address it. Anyways, it doesn't matter if "you do not care for subjective opinions," that's literally you admitting you are intentionally not being close-minded and accepting of possibilities. Look, I've been accepting of multiple things you've had to say on this thread along with literally everyone else. You've given everyone the short end of the stick by calling people's arguments bad, saying lol to them, saying people do not understand just because they do not agree with you, telling people they aren't contributing anything, etc. You are instigating people to actively get aggressive and therefore heating this thread, that part was entirely your fault alone for taking things personally. That lost part raises even bigger red flags, "Later someone called me on my wall and said that the argument was finally recognized, with now TP and that user voting Diavolo. You are misunderstanding various things here, so know that, again, I politely don't care about your subjective opinions, if you want to think that bad of me then that's fine." I'm not trying to be accusive or anything but you seem to be pissed people aren't voting Diavolo which is still blatant character bias. I won't say objectively are biased towards Diavolo, but the way you are wording your responses puts a lot of things you are saying dually in question as well.

 

[Eficiente]

Hope we are because this is getting redundant with you being willfully ignorant. First Time Erasure will not work at successfully putting down DIO, his method has already been explained and why that hardly matters when he can still actively use his Time Stop when traumatically suffering from far worse. Diavolo, in character, mostly uses Time Erasure as a defense. Examples here and here.

I said many, many times by now that the first attack would not kill DIO. I already know that Diavolo uses Time Erase as a defense, which is why he will put himself after DIO's timestop, in it's cooldown.

That's what I've been trying to communicate with you. The surprise attack won't work, Enhanced Senses + Regenerationn which is not something I objectively claim I argued originally first, but you have failed to actually substantiate ways around it. Using it as a defense is mostly what it's used for because DIO will already know he's there.

For the Regenerationn, again, I said many, many times that Diavolo's first attack would not kill DIO. For the Enhanced Senses, I said a couple of times that they aren't enough, time erase leaves unawareness on others, DIO can't timestop in its cooldown, and Diavolo has the positioning advantage.

If he uses it defensively, that literally means Diavolo is far more likely to see what he will do in order to accomplish what is done through Epitaph. Nobody is denying what happens with Epitaph seeing the future either, just that Diavolo doesn't spam it in conjunction with Time Erasure offensively to the extent you're suggesting.

I gave examples of him using time erases quickly, he's not going to see himself dead and just not erase that.

Epitaph gives him an idea of what will happen as well, not the full picture. He will be going off of interpretation in which he actively tries to see what happens. Do you know why that goes incredibly poorly for Diavolo? Because DIO doesn't approach you like that, he uses Time Stop from a distance which means Diavolo has no reason to Time Erase and then Dio can MUDA him to oblivion and so on for other options.

One more time, it doesn't matter, him seeing himself suddenly damaged is something he will erase. If DIO uses time stop from a distance Diavolo will erase that as he will see himself being suddenly damaged.

That lost part raises even bigger red flags, "Later someone called me on my wall and said that the argument was finally recognized, with now TP and that user voting Diavolo. You are misunderstanding various things here, so know that, again, I politely don't care about your subjective opinions, if you want to think that bad of me then that's fine." I'm not trying to be accusive or anything but you seem to be pissed people aren't voting Diavolo which is still blatant character bias. I won't say objectively are biased towards Diavolo, but the way you are wording your responses puts a lot of things you are saying dually in question as well.

The part before that ignores context all together, I'm not even going the answer it anyone can just read the whole thread. But in this part in particular you say that I "seem to be pissed people aren't voting Diavolo which is still blatant character bias" when the text legit says that an argument being ignored was the problem, the parts of text around that that you're not showing make that far more clear. This is why I don't care what you say on this, you keep ignoring all the context.

 

[HierophantDeluxe]

Thread is over, go home already.

 

[Anttron224]

You've had one too many, I'm cutting you off. Pub's closed, call a cab pal.