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Dio versus Diavolo
- Thread starter The_King_of_Prudence
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One more time, that result would be already shown by his precog during the first time erase (if not before). So he attacks DIO and quickly erases time again to not die by his second time stop, he just needs to do that before DIO's cooldown. Cooldown which, again, Diavolo doesn't have.
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After seeing all this I would still have to go with DIO FRAs above, but at this time this is just waiting for the left over points of debate to clear up.
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King Crimson scales from an OHKO to both Silver Chariot and Polnareff. From there we can connect the 8-C scaling from Part 3 to Part 5.
In terms of strength, The World > King Crimson by a small amount. That's because we have statements saying Star Platinum is the strongest and the two are equal.
In terms of strength, The World > King Crimson by a small amount. That's because we have statements saying Star Platinum is the strongest and the two are equal.
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How? King Crimson can one shot beings who can tank hits from star platinum. The World had to go for Kakyoin to one shot him, and I don't think he has successfully delt damage like that to any stand themselves except maybe Hermit Purple
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I believe KC is faster; The World only initially blizted SP with a kick, then they were evenly exchanging blows with The World surpassing SP, except that SP was able to put something on DIO without him noting it. Afterwards The World only shows being inferior to SP. Not that any of this matter here tho.
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@lapitus you're ignoring context. King Crimson could one-shot Silver Chariot because he wanted to kill Polnareff. Star Platinum couldn't because he didn't want to kill Polnareff.
There's literally no scaling that puts KC above Star Platinum, who already has a statement for being the strongest.
In terms of speed... honestly KC is vaguely MFTL for hitting Silver Chariot. I think Star Platinum has a statement for his speed too, but not sure.
There's literally no scaling that puts KC above Star Platinum, who already has a statement for being the strongest.
In terms of speed... honestly KC is vaguely MFTL for hitting Silver Chariot. I think Star Platinum has a statement for his speed too, but not sure.
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You can one shot someone without killing them. He could have at the very least broken the sword hand of his stand or something.HierophantDeluxe said:
Well, Star Platinum probably has higher DPS, King Crimson is more about focussed blows instead. While Star Platinum or The World usually need to Ora or Muda, King Crimson just goes for single punches.
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I'm going to have to agree still that Pixel and Sixo's reasons for DIO winning are of better quality and make far more sense than the stuff Eficiente is arguing.
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Based on what reasoning? Voting for the sake of voting is not valid.Dziga said:
@lapitus
Yes we are aware of the different attack styles. Star Platinum is still the stronger of the two.
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Also I believe Grace is nearly done if not done.
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A response to this comment in particular would be nice.
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I think this was already asked, how is Diavolo going to see Time Stop coming again? He sees the action, but he doesn't see the method which inherently doesn't give him an idea of how it's done. Diavolo's first Time Erase won't effectively kill him on the primary occasion as explained above, Dio time stops after the time erase, regardless of the cooldown of KC because he will pull it off and proceeds to absolutely to claim his W from there.
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I'm not saying the World doesn't have a cooldown but if we're assuming Time Erasure goes first then it's irrelevant.
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Then you quite literally don't get the simple facts. Let's just say Time Erasure happens first. Diavolo sees he got ****** up really badly but he doesn't know about the Regenerationn nor The World's Time Stop. So he uses his first Time Erasure, doesn't effectively kill DIO with that one as you've already seemed to go along with in several of your comments, then DIO Time Stops in response. DIO Time Stops in response to feeling pain, that was already proven above with Star Platinum and with Silver Chariot. DIO legitimately proceeds to beat him in that Time Stop, it's a very simple thing that's been explained repetitively on this thread.
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Eficiente, Diavolo quite literally does not have any means of knowing how Dio stops time. You always say he knows it's going to happen, but this does not make him invicible. You are ignoring the fight with Bruno, where he assumed what Bruno was doing purely off of precog and thought that Bruno was doing one thing in his prediction when he was actually doing another, and that ended up costing him a lot. Diavolo can precog, yes, but his future visions are based off of his interpretation and do not make him absolute.
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It literally doesn't matter at all, he doen't need to know that, just erase it, which he can, and it will take the shortest amount of time.Sixo Bullets said:
I said way above in this thread, the fight with Bruno had Diavolo with a sh*t ton of PIS. Diavolo's precog going as I said is the entire plot point of GER in the sense of "this is supposed to happen, but it didn't".Sixo Bullets said:
I don't even know why the first thing even matters, the second is true but answers me nothing.Sixo Bullets said:
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He does need to know how it works. If he doesn't know how he doesn't know when to erase, he only knows that he takes damage.
And how is it PIS? Bruno just overwhelmed his ability and thought past it. Bruno still died later, so it's not like he won against KC, he just showed that you can exploit it's ability.
What are you referring to? If it is the interpretation of Diavolo, and as stated above consistently, he does not know Dio stops time. He thinks he only takes damage. He isn't aware of regen nor aware of the enhanced senses you outright refuse to acknowledge and claim that it's inconsistent. Dio always time stops upon damage like that, regen lets him survive Diavolo's hit + time stop. Diavolo can't do shit in time stop and dies.
And how is it PIS? Bruno just overwhelmed his ability and thought past it. Bruno still died later, so it's not like he won against KC, he just showed that you can exploit it's ability.
What are you referring to? If it is the interpretation of Diavolo, and as stated above consistently, he does not know Dio stops time. He thinks he only takes damage. He isn't aware of regen nor aware of the enhanced senses you outright refuse to acknowledge and claim that it's inconsistent. Dio always time stops upon damage like that, regen lets him survive Diavolo's hit + time stop. Diavolo can't do shit in time stop and dies.
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- It still doesn't matter, but apparently even under those conditions he's going to just stop using precog, which is what the DIO voters were aiming for.
- The whole fight. Diavolo not aiming for the kill initially, making past Bruno meat future Bruno, explaining in detail his ability, and then, stop using precog. Which you are ignoring he does not do in his most memorable fight, showing his ultime capabilities.
- As I said many times by now, he's going to know the regen after his first attack. Diavolo erases that second time stop before the cooldown of the first one ends.
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Nobody said he would stop using Precog, you quite literally do not seem to understand the fundamental concept that it wouldn't matter if he did continue. You argued there is a cooldown for King Crimson. What happens is Time Erasure goes off first, Diavolo doesn't kill him with the first strike, then DIO immediately time stops in response to feeling that when he hasn't used it up to that point, meaning it happens and the cooldown screws over KC.
If that's what he did in the initial encounter, why would we not assume such when it comes to this fight? Heck, it just depends where he targets in general. If it's not the head to do enough significant trauma to bypass DIO's Mid Regen, he literally loses, it's as simple as that.
The second time erasure doesn't happen, that's already been over. DIO in character prevents Diavolo from remotely doing anything past the first time erasure and this has already been told to you over and over, I have no idea why that is so difficult to understand.
It's not really your decision on if it gets removed or not, the original thread was one-sided really with little to no actual explanation for DIO's defense. To put it like this, no offense, but you lost your cool over a fictional character losing to another. I think it's best we all just conclude from here though and not continue the debate, DIO has more than enough votes at this point to conclude him as the victor.
If that's what he did in the initial encounter, why would we not assume such when it comes to this fight? Heck, it just depends where he targets in general. If it's not the head to do enough significant trauma to bypass DIO's Mid Regen, he literally loses, it's as simple as that.
The second time erasure doesn't happen, that's already been over. DIO in character prevents Diavolo from remotely doing anything past the first time erasure and this has already been told to you over and over, I have no idea why that is so difficult to understand.
It's not really your decision on if it gets removed or not, the original thread was one-sided really with little to no actual explanation for DIO's defense. To put it like this, no offense, but you lost your cool over a fictional character losing to another. I think it's best we all just conclude from here though and not continue the debate, DIO has more than enough votes at this point to conclude him as the victor.
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Araki has stated many times that Time Stop is the most powerful stand ability. (Post King Crimson and Pre Made in Heaven)
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But it is logically inferior to time erase, but eh. It all depends on timing and circumstance really.
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Laughs in Emerald Splash
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DIO starts with time stop to do literally anything (i.e. messing with Polnareff by making him take steps down the stairs, switching out with Nukesaku, anytime someone tries to attack him if he can't deflect it) The only time he doesn't start out with it is if he's screwing around (i.e. comparing our attack rushes)
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@Anttron224
Cool and all but these are the facts.
1 Dio still lost against Jotaro even after the power up form draining the blood from Joseph
2 Jotaro in part 4 was losing against Rat even with Star Platium The World
3 It took 2 requiem stands Silver Chariot Requiem and Experience Requiem GER Bucciarati gang to defeat Diavolo.
4 In part 6 Jotato was defeat twice by Pucci: the first time and the second time.
I know MIH is far more powerfull than Star Platium The World but at the end of the day it took 2 requiem stands to defeat Diavolo and that shows us how strong King Crimson ability really is compared to Za wurdo or Star Platium Za Wurdo.
Cool and all but these are the facts.
1 Dio still lost against Jotaro even after the power up form draining the blood from Joseph
2 Jotaro in part 4 was losing against Rat even with Star Platium The World
3 It took 2 requiem stands Silver Chariot Requiem and Experience Requiem GER Bucciarati gang to defeat Diavolo.
4 In part 6 Jotato was defeat twice by Pucci: the first time and the second time.
I know MIH is far more powerfull than Star Platium The World but at the end of the day it took 2 requiem stands to defeat Diavolo and that shows us how strong King Crimson ability really is compared to Za wurdo or Star Platium Za Wurdo.
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1. Jotaro literally plot armored through that fight there is no way around that
2. Jotaro's time stop around that time was like 3 seconds
3. It really only took ger to be fair silver chariot kinda hurt the group a bit but that's besides the point also requiem stands were exclusive to that part because that's the only place the requiem arrow could be found
4. Jotaro's time stop was even worse I'm pretty sure and also Emiya alter is broken
2. Jotaro's time stop around that time was like 3 seconds
3. It really only took ger to be fair silver chariot kinda hurt the group a bit but that's besides the point also requiem stands were exclusive to that part because that's the only place the requiem arrow could be found
4. Jotaro's time stop was even worse I'm pretty sure and also Emiya alter is broken
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JoJo is a Rock-Paper-Scissors verse, so there's plenty of counters, even to supposedly invincible abilities (I have a theory that Vanilla Ice will oneshot GER). So most powerful ability or not doesn't matter.
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To quote myself; "Canonically DIO's time stop has a cooldown, Diavolo's time erase doesn't. What we saw him do with Trish and Narancia is a lapse of time of him using his power twice faster than DIO's cooldowns." Diavolo using time erase first would not change anything, he just has to use it again before DIO's response, which he will know about due to precog.Inverted Tempest said:
This communicates nothing.Inverted Tempest said:
Never said it was, your're just misinterpreting me again, in both cases I said "ask to", as in "propose to others and then they do something if theywant to". I lose my cool over the attitude of the people here, to be specific.Inverted Tempest said:
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