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Characters scaled from Katana and Spider-Man need to have their statistics revised
- Thread starter Antvasima
- Start date
- Status
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- Thread starter
- #322
So, here is what we need to do at the moment:
- Change all of the Marvel Comics profiles scaled from Spider-Man (Marvel Comics) to "At least 8-A".
- Get the feat of Venom (Edward Brock) withstanding a nuclear explosion calculated.
- Figure out which characters that should scale from the Luke Cage (Marvel Comics) Small Town level+ feat.
- Find calculations or comicbook scans of Batman feats to replace the DC Comics scaling from Katana (Post-Crisis).
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What if the nuke feat does become Low 7-C though, and what about guys like Carnage who are stronger than both Spiderman and Venom combined. Wouldn't that still make Spiderman Low 7-C via backscaling with both potentially Venom and Luke Cage. And does At Least 8-A Possibly/Likely Low 7-C work since he's not really hundreds of times weaker than Luke Cage.
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He regularly spars and defeats said characters though, but it's more on the skill side of things. But he still does good damage againts them.
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Spider-Man is well above Captain American, but significantly weaker than Venom. And I recall statements bout Spider-Man being roughly half the strength of Venom with Carnage being stronger than the combined strength of Spider-Man and Venom by not overwhelmingly so.
ShakeResounding
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Not arguing for AP here, but Spidey's durability should still scale to Venom's AP. There's been several moments where Venom wanted to kill Spidey with no holds barred, even going to strangulation and trying to bash his head in, and that's probably most situations between them as well.
Whatever the gap is between Venom and Spidey, it isn't too significant and makes sense, since Spidey always does display great durability and resilience.
Whatever the gap is between Venom and Spidey, it isn't too significant and makes sense, since Spidey always does display great durability and resilience.
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To be fair I'm pretty sure Venom gets all his powers including his AP specifically from the time the two were bonded together for such a long time, otherwise Venom would be much weaker at normal levels (I think anyway, I have no idea what a Klyntar's regular strength level is)
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Newly bonded klyntar's strength levels are essentially fodder for regular Venom, from what I remember. Then again, they're fodder for Spidey too, so shouldn't be comparable IMO
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A lot of people forget that Spider-Man isn't a stale character in terms of power. He is a lot stronger now than he was when he first encountered Venom. He went from needing the FF to take him on to holding his own pretty well. There are scans of him punching Venom hard enough to cause shock waves. Plus depending on the host he's been shown he can be as strong as venom for example when Mac Gargan (scorpion) was venom for a while. More recently he's been shown to be able to draw blood from him. I'm not saying him and Venom are equally strong but Spider-Man isn't that much below him. The main reason Venom wins is mostly because he has a far better Regenerationn and the only way Peter can effectively take him down is using fore and sound(which hardly works depending on plot). Keep in mind Peter trained before this. With characters like Captain America Shang-Chi not to mention he got older and such.
This reminds me of lid buu and Goku. They were both on equal terms when it came to power but kid buu had better Regenerationn and more stamina.
Another thing to consider is the context. Spider-Man 80% of the time is fighting while battle weary either because he just finished fighting another villain or because he's sleep deprived. He's basically pulling a Batman every other week.
Plus Peter has taken on iron man 2020. I know a lot of people will say it's an outlier but Iron Man 2020 isn't all that powerful. In fact there's scans of Peter beating characters relative to early day iron man. Like Crimson Dinamo and there's at least 2 instances where Peter has broken or at least dented Iron Man'a armor. Im definitely not saying he's Iron Man level but what I'm getting at is maybe research the context of those feats. Maybe somewhere in that issue those characters have a durability feat. I think it's safer if let's say earlier in the issue Iron Man, Hulk or whoever he fights has a specific durability feat. It's better to say Spider-Man is town level because he hurt the hulk who earlier in that hypothetical issue took a town level attack than Peter is solar system level because he hurt hulk who in an earlier unrelated issue in his own series took attacks from thor or something like that. Another thing is maybe if Peter hurt another hero like namor or something maybe we should look at the background of the writer of that issue. See if they written any stories with namor or blank character and see if they have any experience or at least get an idea of how strong or durable they think that specific character is.
Lastly I wanna thank you all for really looking into this. I still think it's a great idea using his villains' feats as a starting point. Either way our favorite wall crawler is still heavily underrated and movies and games don't do his great power justice.
This reminds me of lid buu and Goku. They were both on equal terms when it came to power but kid buu had better Regenerationn and more stamina.
Another thing to consider is the context. Spider-Man 80% of the time is fighting while battle weary either because he just finished fighting another villain or because he's sleep deprived. He's basically pulling a Batman every other week.
Plus Peter has taken on iron man 2020. I know a lot of people will say it's an outlier but Iron Man 2020 isn't all that powerful. In fact there's scans of Peter beating characters relative to early day iron man. Like Crimson Dinamo and there's at least 2 instances where Peter has broken or at least dented Iron Man'a armor. Im definitely not saying he's Iron Man level but what I'm getting at is maybe research the context of those feats. Maybe somewhere in that issue those characters have a durability feat. I think it's safer if let's say earlier in the issue Iron Man, Hulk or whoever he fights has a specific durability feat. It's better to say Spider-Man is town level because he hurt the hulk who earlier in that hypothetical issue took a town level attack than Peter is solar system level because he hurt hulk who in an earlier unrelated issue in his own series took attacks from thor or something like that. Another thing is maybe if Peter hurt another hero like namor or something maybe we should look at the background of the writer of that issue. See if they written any stories with namor or blank character and see if they have any experience or at least get an idea of how strong or durable they think that specific character is.
Lastly I wanna thank you all for really looking into this. I still think it's a great idea using his villains' feats as a starting point. Either way our favorite wall crawler is still heavily underrated and movies and games don't do his great power justice.
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Another idea I got is we can also compare Spider-Man to other Spider-Men seeing how he is definitely superior to like 90% of them with the exception of Cosmic Spider-Man, and Kaine to name a few. What I mean is that during the end of Spider-verse (the first one) Superior Spider-Man was able to take down most of the remaining spider people there pretty easily all by himself and later on Peter one shoted him. Keep in mind Peter was already weekend from fighting Morlun, getting exposed to radiation, and having a severe headache from the spider web weaver being killed and he still one shoted Superior Spider-Man. I'd even put him way above Miles seeing how Miles is more comparable and directly scales from Ultimate Peter who is no where near as strong as 616 Peter.
Just a thought sorry to bother again. Also how durable is Tombstone? I've seen scans of him no diffing Deadpool and even trading blows with Luke Cage and Spider-Man one shoted him on multiple occasions along with mo diffing Hammer head and mr negative.
Just a thought sorry to bother again. Also how durable is Tombstone? I've seen scans of him no diffing Deadpool and even trading blows with Luke Cage and Spider-Man one shoted him on multiple occasions along with mo diffing Hammer head and mr negative.
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- Thread starter
- #336
I am mostly fine with scaling Spider-Man from Venom's feats, but not from Iron Man's.
See here: Power-scaling Rules for Marvel and DC Comics
See here: Power-scaling Rules for Marvel and DC Comics
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Direct, calculated feats are the best for rating these characters since they are as inconsistent as hell.
Otherwise we have to use "common sense". I know it sounds very vague but we can't just scale everyone to anybody they fought, or we'll end up with universal 1-A Marvel and DC.
Otherwise we have to use "common sense". I know it sounds very vague but we can't just scale everyone to anybody they fought, or we'll end up with universal 1-A Marvel and DC.
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Can I update Black Knight's page to be under Cap, but still somewhat scale, his feat should be completely fine too? His ratio of fighting such characters is way way way too high. Besides what I listed above he otherwise fights sorcerers, stomping dozens upon dozens of knights, beating vampires, fighting his Ancestors now and then, fighting giant monsters, the occasional world ending threat alongside the avengers, and I think that's it.
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Alright time to get out my trusty ruler and do this quickly.Standuser081 said:
Average human leg is 35 inches = 0.889 meters long
Leg = 0.2 cm
Explosion = 5 cm
5/0.2 = 25 * 0.889
Diameter = 22.225 Meters
Radius = 11.1125 Meters
(11.1125)^3*((27136*1.37895 + 8649)^(1/2)/13568 - 93/13568)^2
0.1103 Tons of TNT (Batman's bomb)
Average car width is 6.5 feet = 0.4 Cm
Explosion = 4.5 cm
4.5/0.4 = 11.125 * 6.5
Diameter = 72.3125 Feet = 22.04085 Meters
Radius = 11.020425 Meters
(11.020425)^3*((27136*1.37895 + 8649)^(1/2)/13568 - 93/13568)^2
0.1075674 Tons of TNT
(I think this one was close enough to Batman to where inverse law doesn't need to apply)
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Actually how big is the Bat Cave? Because I recall a feat with an explosion so big it covered the Cave
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1. Done above
2. Explosion = 3.2 cm
Average train height = 9 feet and 2 inches (9.1667 feet)
Train height = 0.7 cm
3.2/0.7 = 4.57143 * 9.1667
Diameter Explosion = 41.90492 Feet = 12.77262 Meters
Radius = 6.38731 Meters
(6.38731)^3*((27136*1.37895 + 8649)^(1/2)/13568 - 93/13568)^2
0.020943 Tons of TNT
3. Did it above
4. Nothing to scale from and we didn't see the full explosion
5. Average Human head = 0.239 Meters
Batman head = 0.1 cm
Explosion length 11.7 cm
11.7/0.1 = 117 * 0.239
Explosion Diameter = 27.963 Meters
Explosion Radius = 13.9815 Meters
(13.9815)^3*((27136*1.37895 + 8649)^(1/2)/13568 - 93/13568)^2
0.2196579 Tons of TNT
6. Average width of a Submarine is 10 Meters. Now the tail I think is half the height of the width.
Tail = 5 Meters
Tail = 0.3 Cm
Explosion = 5.2 cm
5.2/0.3 = 17.33 * 5
Diameter of Explosion = 86.65 Meters
Radius of Explosion = 43.325 Meters
(43.325)^3*((27136*1.37895 + 8649)^(1/2)/13568 - 93/13568)^2
6.535837252818757769 Tons of TNT (I'm not too sure on the tail size and I'm doing this on the fly)
7. It's half cut and the car's width somewhat big compared to the explosion.
8. By the Flash....
9. Nothing to scale from
10. More panels are needed to calc the building size and then the explosion. Otherwise it could be low end building level to baseline Large Building level.
Goodnight everyone =)
2. Explosion = 3.2 cm
Average train height = 9 feet and 2 inches (9.1667 feet)
Train height = 0.7 cm
3.2/0.7 = 4.57143 * 9.1667
Diameter Explosion = 41.90492 Feet = 12.77262 Meters
Radius = 6.38731 Meters
(6.38731)^3*((27136*1.37895 + 8649)^(1/2)/13568 - 93/13568)^2
0.020943 Tons of TNT
3. Did it above
4. Nothing to scale from and we didn't see the full explosion
5. Average Human head = 0.239 Meters
Batman head = 0.1 cm
Explosion length 11.7 cm
11.7/0.1 = 117 * 0.239
Explosion Diameter = 27.963 Meters
Explosion Radius = 13.9815 Meters
(13.9815)^3*((27136*1.37895 + 8649)^(1/2)/13568 - 93/13568)^2
0.2196579 Tons of TNT
6. Average width of a Submarine is 10 Meters. Now the tail I think is half the height of the width.
Tail = 5 Meters
Tail = 0.3 Cm
Explosion = 5.2 cm
5.2/0.3 = 17.33 * 5
Diameter of Explosion = 86.65 Meters
Radius of Explosion = 43.325 Meters
(43.325)^3*((27136*1.37895 + 8649)^(1/2)/13568 - 93/13568)^2
6.535837252818757769 Tons of TNT (I'm not too sure on the tail size and I'm doing this on the fly)
7. It's half cut and the car's width somewhat big compared to the explosion.
8. By the Flash....
9. Nothing to scale from
10. More panels are needed to calc the building size and then the explosion. Otherwise it could be low end building level to baseline Large Building level.
Goodnight everyone =)
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So basically we have four 9-A feats and one High 8-C feat.
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I also remember Bambu doing some for me which include one 8-C and High 8-C
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Of course (I'm not sure where these calcs even are but I'll find them)
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6. Average width of a Submarine is 10 Meters. Now the tail I think is half the height of the width.
The problem with this one is that the torpedo hit the submarine underwater on one of its sides, so everyone would've been standing at least 5 meters (half the width) presuming the size is correct.
The problem with this one is that the torpedo hit the submarine underwater on one of its sides, so everyone would've been standing at least 5 meters (half the width) presuming the size is correct.
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Ah I see sorry
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Alright I'm back up
7. Nothing is wrong just comparing to the other explosion where I scaled to car width. The average car width is much bigger in comparison to the much smaller explosion. Would probably make it to barely Small Building Level.
8. Alrighty then assuming KE, since there's a big rubble cloud.
Flash stated he was going 10 times his previous speed, which was speed of sound.
Flash weights 88 Kg
0.5*88*3430*2
517655600 Joules or 0.123722657744 Tons of TNT
9. Deadshot is not standing outside of the explosion to where it can be scaled, he's inside.
7. Nothing is wrong just comparing to the other explosion where I scaled to car width. The average car width is much bigger in comparison to the much smaller explosion. Would probably make it to barely Small Building Level.
8. Alrighty then assuming KE, since there's a big rubble cloud.
Flash stated he was going 10 times his previous speed, which was speed of sound.
Flash weights 88 Kg
0.5*88*3430*2
517655600 Joules or 0.123722657744 Tons of TNT
9. Deadshot is not standing outside of the explosion to where it can be scaled, he's inside.
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