Beyonders Attack Potency Justification

[Elizio33]

Maybe there should be more justifications for Beyonders Attack Potency. As for example: With their powers, Doctor Doom had controlled the will of Multi Eternity and easily defeated Cyclop with the power of the Pheonix Force which will eventually become High 1-B. And they killed the Abstracts, The Celestials and the Living Tribunal on a whim, according to Hank Pym. With their powers, Molecule Man can end Lifebringner Galactus with a thought that will eventually become High 1-B. (MM can probably do it without their powers)

 

[Elizio33]

Bump!

 

[Antvasima]

For the moment we can only scale them from the Living Tribunal.

 

[Niarobi_(Formerly_Hadou)]

It was more like Doctor Doom controlling Multi-Eternity with his will, not him controlling the will of Multi-Eternity.

 

[Elizio33]

I guess you're right.

 

[Shivansh_Garg]

Molecule Man was also described as the Demiurge of new cosmos https://imgur.com/a/n7LWCdD

 

[The_Tetromino_King]

Molecule Man was also described as the Demiurge of new cosmos https://imgur.com/a/n7LWCdD

Beyonders should scale to this ofcourse.

So Molecule Man would have concept manipulation and plently of other stuff.

This would make him 1-A for creating a high 1-B reality and a space that is beyond the omniverse and superflow

 

[Elizio33]

So the justifications for thir Attack Potency should be:

• Three of them have killed The Living Tribunal.

• Exist in the Neutral Zone which is beyond the Superflow.

• With their powers, Molecule Ma has becomes the Demiurge of new cosmos.

• With their powers, God Emperor Doom has controlled the true Eternity with his will, easily defeated Cyclop with the power of the Phoenix Force and has overpowered Black Panter with the The Infinity Gauntlet.

• Mister Fantastic helped to create a new cosmos with their powers.

Are you agree?

 

[ΚΟΜΙΞ]

Well I agree.

I read somewhere that Hickman if he didn't leave, he would use Cyclops and teen Jean with Phoenix Force to create/recreate the cosmos back to normal.

 

[Shivansh_Garg]

I am pretty sure Beyonders were almost accepted to be rated as 1-A (along with the Living Tribunal). In that case the justification would be only them slaying the Living Tribunal

 

[Elizio33]

I am pretty sure Beyonders were almost accepted to be rated as 1-A (along with the Living Tribunal). In that case the justification would be only them slaying the Living Tribunal

Also, the Beyonders exist in the Neutral Zone a place beyond the highest level of existence: the Superflow and i think the Neutral Zone is the farthest edge of science.

 

[Shivansh_Garg]

@Elizio From what I recall they exist beyond Marvel totality and beyond even Neutral Zone (which is still a part of totality or Eternity per se)

 

[Antvasima]

Yes, The Beyonders exist outside of and beyond Multi-Eternity.

Anyway, I have no problems with rating The Living Tribunal, The Beyonders, and Molecule Man as 1-A. It is the regular multiversal abstracts that I am uncertain about.

The problem is that we preferably need input from Matthew Schroeder, Sera EX, Sandman31, or maybe Azathoth or Ryukama, as they are the only staff members who know Marvel sufficiently well, and Sera is faking a break, Sandman31 has no Internet at the moment, and Matthew is busy with The Elder Scrolls revisions and not very interested in Marvel anymore.

I suppose that you could ask Matthew, Azathoth, and Ryukama to comment here regarding if it is fine to go ahead and upgrade the mentioned characters though.

 

[Elizio33]

Even if they exist outside of the true Eternity, they should also have this justification.

 

[Ryukama]

I've been wanting 1-A for those characters for a while now

 

[Antvasima]

Okay, we just have to wait for Matthew and Azathoth then.

 

[Elizio33]

According to this scan, the Beyonders and many others beings like them embodies the beyond/outside. Is this necessary to add this on the Beyonders profile?

 

[Antvasima]

It might be useful as extra proof for their tier in any case.

 

[Elizio33]

And they should have a type 9 of immortality since they embodies the outside and they can form physical manifestations.

 

[Antvasima]

Maybe. Hickman apparently treated them as truly killed when the Molecule Men exploded and destroyed their manifestation forms.

 

[The_Tetromino_King]

The Outside in that comic refers to the neutral zone. If you read that story you would know.

 

[The_Tetromino_King]

@Elizio From what I recall they exist beyond Marvel totality and beyond even Neutral Zone (which is still a part of totality or Eternity per se)

They aren't

Read Captain America and the Mighty Avengers

 

[The_Tetromino_King]

However the Beyonders are still freely able to move outside eternity which has been shown when they tried to fight abstracts and in older comics there are in a realm beyond the multiverse totality

 

[The_Tetromino_King]

However it was still stated they existed in a realm outside the multiverse. but this was before the neutral zone existed.

 

[Elizio33]

The Neutral Zone is also known as the Beyond and the White Space. I think The Tetromino King is right, the outside/beyond in this scan https://imgur.com/yiA0dhu is the Neutral Zone not the real outside.

 

[Antvasima]

@Tetromino

Can you supply the specific scans that state that The Beyonders are from the Neutral Zone and not outside of the Marvel multiverse? Because from what I remember they have been referred to as originating outside of all of it.

 

[The_Tetromino_King]

The place where kevin got lost They Open a door outside (they called it neutral zone) kevin came back to the normal reality to bfr Jason back to what is meant to be outside' ' (Which refers to the neutral zone.

And basically what @Eli said.

 

[The_Tetromino_King]

for more information what the neutral zone is:

the Neutral Zone also known as the ExoSpace a place outside/beyond the highest level of existence also known as The Superflow and The Omniverse

 

[Antvasima]

I see no proof of the Beyonders originating in the Neutral Zone from the above scans. It also would make no sense with them killing the Living Tribunal and nearly destroying Multi-Eternity if they originated from within the multiverse.

 

[The_Tetromino_King]

The Neutral zone is beyond the omniverse and the superflow (the realm of abstract.)

 

[The_Tetromino_King]

They basically open a '''DOOR TO THE OUTSIDE '''and calls it the neutral zone they even capped the word Outside SMFH

 

[The_Tetromino_King]

Nor the fact that the outside was stated to contain no space in it. and in that scan it basically said ''outside the wild spaces beyond reality''

 

[The_Tetromino_King]

I see no proof of the Beyonders originating in the Neutral Zone from the above scans. It also would make no sense with them killing the Living Tribunal and nearly destroying Multi-Eternity if they originated from within the multiverse.

The Neutral zone is a existence beyond TLT and existing within a realm doesn't mean they can't kill Multi eternity?????

 

[The_Tetromino_King]

I don't see any proof from you that it doesn't suggest the neutral zone.

 

[Antvasima]

I see no proof from you that explicitly states that they came from the Neutral Zone, and it still does not make any sense that a tiny part of Multi-Eternity would be able to destroy him and the Tribunal.

Your suggestion is not going to get accepted unless you find explicit proof, and drop the attitude while you visit this wiki.

 

[The_Tetromino_King]

Anyway just believe what you want.

 

[Antvasima]

Can you be more explicit regarding what sentences that explicitly refer to the Beyonders as originating in the Neutral Zone?

If the Neutral Zone is a part of Multi-Eternity, this would make the beings that populate it a tiny part of him.

As you know, I am extremely overworked and distracted from constantly trying to help everybody in this wiki with different tasks. I do not have the time available to reread the entire Jonathan Hickman Avengers run, along with all other Beyonders appearances, to find explicit references, and regrettably have to go by memory.

 

[The_Tetromino_King]

It's alright you should rest more.

 

[The_Tetromino_King]

So your suggestion beyond completely beyond multi eternity? Well that is still possible if we go with older comicssuch as these.

 

[The_Tetromino_King]

I will just ignore the captain america and the mighty avengers story. Since I'm also a supporter of 1-A beyonders.