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Ben 10: High 6-A, possibly Low 5-B? upgrade.

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Reiner04

Reiner04

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So currently everyone scales to Armodrillo feat which was calc'd to 6-C. I re-calc'd this and goop feat which gave me high 6-A as a result and there are several other calcs which are high 6-A anyway.
  1. Armodrillo feat (2.599386266666667e+28 Joules), 3.868388 times that of Goop pulling back Piscciss feat.
  2. Goop pulling back planet feat (6.719559515962323e+27 J)
  3. Galvan B pullback feat (i recalc'd it and it gave me Low 5-B result but no one evaluating it so meh)
  4. Sub energy calc (Upchuck was able to counter sub energy powered attacks with his attacks so should scale ig).
  5. Canonbolt survived Big ticks internal explosion which broke his shell.
Edit: Re-Calc of galvanic Mechamorph pulling back Galvan B has been accepted to be Low 5-B now. Results are 293 times of Armodrillo feat (it's not far stretched result since Malware did said that he has become 100 times stronger than before)
vsbattles.fandom.com

Galvanic Mechamorph pulling back Galvan B and Malware surviving Galvan B destruction

vsbattles.fandom.com vsbattles.fandom.com

The scaling chain:
  • Teen era characters scale 10x above OS characters due to Vilgax being stated to be 10x stronger in AF and him absorbing the power of 10 heroes.
  • Echo Echo is 1/3rd this value, as 3 Echo Echos is currently accepted as equal to Diamondhead.
  • Omniverse Kevin 11 is at least 17x OS characters for his AP, as he visually has the powers of at least seven combat-applicable Aliens. However he should also have at least 19x Durability based on him having Ball Weevil and The Worst’s DNA.
  • Full-size Humungousaur and D’Void are 50x OS characters, due to the former being 5x the size and the latter fighting him.
  • Ultimate Greg is 70x in AP and at least 70x in Durability consists of himself, his staff and the Andromeda Five, while his Durability consists of himself, the Andromeda Five and P’andor’s containment suit. While base Aggregor’s AP is currently Unknown, he should be upgraded to 5-C due to being comparable to Kevin and having 5-C Durability feats.
  • Ultimate Humungousaur is 10x Humungausaur due to a statement [insert image here] and him downscaling from Ultimate Kevin. However we haven’t decided if he’s 10x base size or 10x full-size (the former would make him 100x OS characters while the latter would make him 500x OS characters).
  • Ultimate Kevin, Ultimate Echo Echo and Michael Morningstar’s peak would all be either over 140x or over 500x OS characters, depending on where Ultimate Humungousaur scales.
@Ghengiroo115's opinion on scaling chain: Of course there is still the question of whether Ben’s revival should be considered a 10x boost or if Vilgax defeating full-size Humungousaur is an outlier. Like I said I would personally argue the latter as full-size Hugh tanks Vilgax’s eye beam, Jetray’s blasts seemed to threaten Vilgax and Jetray survived multiple attacks from Vilgax despite being physically much weaker than full-size Hugh. Vilgax seemingly on-shotting full-size Hugh also implies that Highbreed arc Ben is comparable to (if not weaker than) OS Ben, which makes no sense.

Agree: @Propellus, @LordGriffin1000, @Maverick_Zero_X (Agree on High 6-A but iffy on scaling it to OS)
 
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Wonder who did the pixel scaling for these 😳

charmcaster.gif
 
If we’re just gonna use Zamasu’s calc then would that make lower tiers scale to Mechamorphs while higher tiers scale to Talpaedans?

And then of course Teen era characters scale to 10x the values thanks to the Vilgax statement and general common sense.
 
Reiner04 said:
So currently everyone scales to Armodrillo feat which was calc'd to 6-C. I re-calc'd this and goop feat which gave me high 6-A as a result and there are several other calcs which are high 6-A anyway.
  1. Armodrillo feat
  2. Goop pulling back planet feat
  3. Galvan B pullback feat (i recalc'd it and it gave me Low 5-B result but no one evaluating it so meh)
Click to expand...
High 6-A seems fine based on this.
Reiner04 said:
  1. Sub energy calc (Upchuck was able to counter sub energy powered attacks with his attacks so should scale ig).
Click to expand...
Though this one seems iffy to use for scaling. Upchuck only scales to this via Energy Absorption, and Low 7-C to High 6-A seems like a big leap for Original Series aliens.
 
Maverick_Zero_X said:
Though this one seems iffy. Upchuck only scales to this via Energy Absorption, and Low 7-C to High 6-A seems like a big leap for Original Series aliens.
Click to expand...
Okaish. But I'm not really upto scaling original series to Alien force or Omniverse but my issue is that they in those latter series (whenever time travel stuff was involved) has been consistently scaling to Present versions of ben and others and also that OV regular non ben Aliens had been comparable to ben Aliens. While it can be ignored for circular scaling issues, it's kind of known that we will be dealing with 10 years old OS scaling back to AF or OV. I wonder if giving their OV and AF past self separate keys or smth like "Low 7-C usually, upto high 6-A because of being shown to be comparable to OV and AF Ben Aliens in altered Universe" would solve the issue, similar to how marvel and dC characters are scaled. I'm not so sure about this but just a suggestion.
 
Maverick_Zero_X said:
Though this one seems iffy to use for scaling. Upchuck only scales to this via Energy Absorption, and Low 7-C to High 6-A seems like a big leap for Original Series aliens.
Click to expand...
Upchuck countered it with regular rocks, which functionally is his “base” power level. Driscoll is also shown to survive Upchuck spitting the Sub-Energy back at him, so both participants of the fight scale naturally to the Sub-Energy.

The Mechamorph feat (if allowed) and the Talpaedan feat also should scale to OS characters. Mechamorph scaling comes from Malware, while Talpaedan scaling comes from the average members of races (or even some above average members like Malware or Tini) being consistently around OS Ben’s level.
 
As long as it's consistent with the other aliens showing, then I should be cool with this. Upchuck stuff should only scale to his Absorption though as it shouldn't spread to OS characters considering I recall a 16 year old Ben telling his 10 year old self that he got way stronger before.

But who am I to say what's actually consistent in this verse, considering the scaling is all over the place either way.
 
Propellus said:
But who am I to say what's actually consistent in this verse, considering the scaling is all over the place either way.
Click to expand...
That's true. As much as we do know Ben has gotten alot stronger with time, it hits hard when creators just put him again with 10 yrs old self or equal to non ben Aliens.
Propellus said:
Upchuck stuff should only scale to his Absorption though as it shouldn't spread to OS characters considering I recall a 16 year old Ben telling his 10 year old self that he got way stronger before.
Click to expand...
Actually re-watching the episode, Upchuck before eating the sub energy was shown to be able to counter energy attacks from Forever king with his rock blasts (or whatever his vomit/spit name is). Sub energy power (which as we know is E/t) scales to high 6-A. So he should be attacking Upchuck with that AP. This eat of Upchuck scales exactly 10 times lower than all Aliens of beginning of Aliens force, since Vilgax was stated to become 10 times stronger than before. Which will lead to more consistency than what we currently have. Considering OV ben don't go out normally then him being on par with his past self normally will makes sense, as well as him scaling to non ben Aliens.
 
Propellus said:
As long as it's consistent with the other aliens showing, then I should be cool with this. Upchuck stuff should only scale to his Absorption though as it shouldn't spread to OS characters considering I recall a 16 year old Ben telling his 10 year old self that he got way stronger before.
Click to expand...
Upchuck deflected Driscoll’s Sub-Energy attacks by eating regular rocks, which is treated as his “base” power level that characters can survive the attacks of. I got sniped lol

OS characters would also scale to the Galvanic Mechamorphs if that feat is useable, as Ben fought Malware who was stronger than a normal Mechamorph in his second form. They should also arguably scale to the Talpaedans as OS characters are consistently shown to be around as strong as average and above average aliens, plus the weakest Highbreed are stated to be almost as powerful as OS Vilgax by Dwayne McDuffie and they’re portrayed as more powerful than other aliens.

Like Reiner said Vilgax is stated to be 10 times stronger than before in promotional material (hopefully he can bring up the image if needed as I don’t know how to lol), which also makes sense narratively as Vilgax absorbed the powers of 10 heroes to defeat Ben. One of those heroes was Ultimos who scales to OS Ben.
 
Ghengiroo115 said:
Upchuck deflected Driscoll’s Sub-Energy attacks by eating regular rocks, which is treated as his “base” power level that characters can survive the attacks of. I got sniped lol
Click to expand...
Wouldn't the counter argument then be exactly what happened with multiple Reboot High 6-A feats where they were dismissed as "Gag feats" by Akm sama at thread #88 cause
Screenshot_20240221-2239252.jpg


Same can be said here when Upchuck was eating those rocks and firing/deflecting back at Forever King

"The surroundings did not show a multi-continental display of destruction" meaning the energy was at it's lowest cause no area damage.

Max did said Sub-Energy got enough energy to obliterate a Continent and we didn't even see that happen so no reason to assume that the energy is at it's a High 6-A or at it's peak
 
Wait, could I see some proof of Vilgax getting apparently 10x stronger than before?
 
DemonicDude said:
Wouldn't the counter argument then be exactly what happened with multiple Reboot High 6-A feats where they were dismissed as "Gag feats" by Akm sama at thread #88 cause
Screenshot_20240221-2239252.jpg


Same can be said here when Upchuck was eating those rocks and firing/deflecting back at Forever King

"The surroundings did not show a multi-continental display of destruction" meaning the energy was at it's lowest cause no area damage.

Max did said Sub-Energy got enough energy to obliterate a Continent and we didn't even see that happen so no reason to assume that the energy is at it's a High 6-A or at it's peak
Click to expand...
It's fine DD, calm down, I understand. AKM will not haunt reboot anymore.
 
DemonicDude said:
Wouldn't the counter argument then be exactly what happened with multiple Reboot High 6-A feats where they were dismissed as "Gag feats" by Akm sama at thread #88 cause
Screenshot_20240221-2239252.jpg


Same can be said here when Upchuck was eating those rocks and firing/deflecting back at Forever King

"The surroundings did not show a multi-continental display of destruction" meaning the energy was at it's lowest cause no area damage.

Max did said Sub-Energy got enough energy to obliterate a Continent and we didn't even see that happen so no reason to assume that the energy is at it's a High 6-A or at it's peak
Click to expand...
I mean this isn’t a gag feat so…
 
The one shot gap is being revised to possibly 14 times ig so we will be able to establish some consistency.
 
Agree on the first 2 feats, neutral on the small planet calc and disagree with upchuck’s calc scaling to stats. However didn’t cannonbolt destroy the big tick or smthn which is multi continental
 
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