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Avatar Discussion Thread

Well, I tried. Unless there's a feat or scene in the series that I'm forgetting, I don't think there's any scenes in Korra which blatantly shows off mh+ speeds. I wonder if the bomb scene would be usable, since Mako and Bolin did duck during the explosion, but I don't think that would be regarded as "official". These standards are pedantic.
 
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In my neverending quest to find a way to buff the verse's speed, I realized that harmonic convergence leaves Earth faster then it covers it.


​

I also found evidence that the energy should scale to spirit Korra's speed. The energy spreads the spirit lights over the planet, and the spirit lights (aka the northern and southern lights) are actual spirits. Korra traveled through the spirit lights in the season 2 finale.

UCGGwof.png

​
So the energy leaving Earth should also be calc'd, since the spirit lights are leaving the atmosphere.
​
 
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Upon further inspection, the spirit lights didn't leave the Earth during the book 2 finale, only the purple energy did.
pDzfypH.png


Combined with Unalaq's claim proving true when the spirits move into the sky after the Southern portal is opened, this seems to confirm that the purple energy=Vaatu's influence; spirit lights=Raava's influence. More proof of this is when Unavaatu beams himself up into the portal's energy, he leaves a purple shockwave behind. Reminder that both of theme created the portals and scale to the energy that comes from them.

And in the season 2 artbook, when Korra is zooming through the atmosphere, the creators straight-up call the lights the aurora. They seem to behave just like rl auroras do, despite them also being spirits. Kind of like how the ocean and moon spirits are the literal ocean and moon but are also supernatural entities. Therefore, full-power Raava's passive influence/attacks should scale to the speed of the spirit lights, and since they're literal light that emit photons... Or would there have to be quantifiable proof that they move as fast as the rl auroras?
 
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In this thread, people have begun sorting layers into the profiles of their respective verses. Avatar has some layered abilities, but we should sort out how many there are before they are included.

First up is obviously bloodbending (blood manipulation and body puppetry). Katara is 1 layer above baseline via being above Hama, with her declaring that Hama's bending is useless against her. Tarlokk is 2 layers via being able to bloodbend without a full moon and being able to effect multiple people, something that Katara was never capable of. Amon is 3 via no-selling Tarlokk's bloodbending, combined with Tarlokk calling him the strongest bender he knows.
 
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No I mean what are the proposed layers for this verse?
 
I see, the Bloodbending stuff does look good. Unsure about the fog stuff as I haven't read the novel, but it does seem backed up
 
Propellus said:
Hmm, maybe just leave it at 3, do we actually know if there's over 100 avatars?
Click to expand...
Well, the Avatars started 10000 years before Korra. For the average age of an avatar, let's pick 50 cause a number of them probably died young (Kyoshi lived to be over 200 when she died, Aang was around 70, and Kuruk died at only 33). So that would be 200 avatars.
 
I know, right. Pretty wild that Avatars could potentially withstand Bleach Soul crush, at least on the spiritual level. Not post-season 2 Korra tho, cause she lost her past lives.
 
BrackishBrineBroth said:
In my neverending quest to find a way to buff the verse's speed, I realized that harmonic convergence leaves Earth faster then it covers it.


​

I also found evidence that the energy should scale to spirit Korra's speed. The energy spreads the spirit lights over the planet, and the spirit lights (aka the northern and southern lights) are actual spirits. Korra traveled through the spirit lights in the season 2 finale.

UCGGwof.png

​
So the energy leaving Earth should also be calc'd, since the spirit lights are leaving the atmosphere.
​
Click to expand...

With this I can get you sub-rel

Give me a bit
 
Getting a 100s for past Avatars is pretty easy if we just look at the statues in the Southern Air Temple. The vault was full of them.

That said, if 3 past Avatars is all that can be proven or even theorised to have it, 3 it is. This stuff also wouldn’t cross scale to the Spiritbending (I don’t think it does anyway) since the Fog is specifically Madness manip while Unalaq’s shenanigans were corruption or smth. From what’s been posted for the soul stuff, it’s not a blanket resistance to soul hax but just specific applications.
 
AnonymousBlank said:
That said, if 3 past Avatars is all that can be proven or even theorised to have it, 3 it is. This stuff also wouldn’t cross scale to the Spiritbending (I don’t think it does anyway) since the Fog is specifically Madness manip while Unalaq’s shenanigans were corruption or smth. From what’s been posted for the soul stuff, it’s not a blanket resistance to soul hax but just specific applications.
Click to expand...
I'm not sure if it should be limited or not. I just rechecked the book, and how it works is that the mist digs into your body/spirit before it assaults your mind. If it can't sink into you, it can't affect you. But on the wiki, if a hax operates on a deeper level, whether it be the soul or conceptual, then that should be noted on the profile.
 
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Actually wait a second, 8893796.802 m/s isn't Sub-Rel+, it's just regular Sub-Rel, as Sub-Rel+ starts at 14 million m/s
 
Been thinking.

The spirit world is sometimes called a plane. We have seen that distance in the world is malleable to an unknown degree. The size of the world is unknown, but it's shown to overlap with the physical world, especially when Aang was a soul and was halfway into the spirit world when he was dealing with Hei Bei. The world should also extend into space, as celestial objects like moons and stars in the avatar world have spiritual properties/are spirits. So that means that the plane stretches on infinitely, like the universe. Combined with the fact that the energy of HC sent a wave throughout the spirit world, and that the world can theoretically stretch on to infinity...

Wouldn't that teeeeecchnically make the god-tiers universal at their full power?
 
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BrackishBrineBroth said:
Been thinking.

The spirit world is sometimes called a plane. We have seen that distance in the world is malleable to an unknown degree. The size of the world is unknown, but it's shown to overlap with the physical world, especially when Aang was a soul and was halfway into the spirit world when he was dealing with Hei Bei. The world should also extend into space, as celestial objects like moons and stars in the avatar world have spiritual properties/are spirits. So that means that the plane stretches on infinitely, like the universe. Combined with the fact that the energy of HC sent a wave throughout the spirit world, and that the world can theoretically stretch on to infinity...

Wouldn't that teeeeecchnically make the god-tiers universal at their full power?
Click to expand...
Vaatu at its full power would destroy everything; The wave you are referring to would only be range.
 
I noticed that Azula has forcefield creation on her profile. Weird that only she has it, as plenty of other characters can also create shields. Will have to add those in a crt.


On a different note, would Raava and Vaatu being able to passively strengthen their respective force of peace/chaos be considered conceptual manipulation? I saw an argument that they're only able to influence spirits, but there is this exchange that proves otherwise.
0ltRLXY.png
 
BrackishBrineBroth said:
On a different note, would Raava and Vaatu being able to passively strengthen their respective force of peace/chaos be considered conceptual manipulation? I saw an argument that they're only able to influence spirits, but there is this exchange that proves otherwise.
Click to expand...
I don't think this is enough.

Their type 8 immortality should also be conceptual[They will continue to exist as long as the concepts of good and evil exist]
 
Lynieryz said:
I don't think this is enough.

Their type 8 immortality should also be conceptual[They will continue to exist as long as the concepts of good and evil exist]
Click to expand...
How about this?
MJzxTEm.png


From the way it's phrased (He cannot destroy light anymore than I can destroy darkness) it sounds like they're talking about the totality of light/darkness. As in, "all light will disappear if I'm somehow destroyed".
 
BrackishBrineBroth said:
How about this?
MJzxTEm.png


From the way it's phrased (He cannot destroy light anymore than I can destroy darkness) it sounds like they're talking about the totality of light/darkness. As in, "all light will disappear if I'm somehow destroyed".
Click to expand...
I think it's valid for type 8 to be conceptual but I don't think it helps with conceptual manipulation, what they're saying is that until the other is reborn the given concept won't exist and to be conceptual manipulation they have to be shown actively manipulating concepts and not a consequence of them being destroyed.
 
Lynieryz said:
I think it's valid for type 8 to be conceptual but I don't think it helps with conceptual manipulation, what they're saying is that until the other is reborn the given concept won't exist and to be conceptual manipulation they have to be shown actively manipulating concepts and not a consequence of them being destroyed.
Click to expand...
I don't think they've been shown to directly manipulate their respective facet over nature, but both spirits have existed since time itself began, and they seem to embody their respective concepts. I feel like they should get abstract existence type 2 from that, but the AE page says this:
8xz7cZB.png


They do have immortality, but it's never explicitly said it's because of the concept they embody.
 
BrackishBrineBroth said:
I don't think they've been shown to directly manipulate their respective facet over nature, but both spirits have existed since time itself began, and they seem to embody their respective concepts. I feel like they should get abstract existence type 2 from that, but the AE page says this:
8xz7cZB.png


They do have immortality, but it's never explicitly said it's because of the concept they embody.
Click to expand...
I think AE works, the immortality of both comes from the concept of light/good and darkness/evil, the previous text you sent and everything about rebirth is about that.
 
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