Arceus: The Jewel of Inconsistency

[Inverted_Tempest]

I think you mean as the Original Spirit since Arceus is the Original One. However, does that really affect the profile is what I'm asking?

 

[Kepekley23]

Just something random I'm pointing out.

Once we rewrite the Beyond Dimensional Existence page, he's likely gonna get some basic level of that.

 

[Inverted_Tempest]

Ah, I see. Well, good luck with the rewrite ig.

 

[Zeifyl]

Okay, and what does this do for the verse?
Also, 2-C sounds the best way to go about it because Dialga and Palkia still have their own feat for it to be supported. They should be "At Least Low 2-C" at worse considering even Primal Dialga still has Low 2-C feats and that's a very weakened and corrupted version of Dialga IIRC, meaning normal Dialga would be massively above that and the others would scale like the Lunar Duo, other CT Members, the Lake Trio, and that one Lucario from the Manga as well.

IIRC even Darkrai has a 2-C (though at its lowest possible extreme) feat, standalone, in one of the spinoff games.

 

[Inverted_Tempest]

Yeah, it was in Pokepark 2: Wonders Beyond and that was already brought up.

 

[Zeifyl]

Then, shouldn't the avatars upscale from that?

 

[Overlord775]

Avatar Arceus is able to create brand new Palkia and Dialgas without even needing it's plates tho

 

[Inverted_Tempest]

Yes.

 

[Ionliosite]

So 2-C everyone and the extremely casual Low 2-C will serve as support.

 

[Overlord775]

Avatar Arceus is able to create brand new Palkia and Dialgas without even needing it's plates tho

^^^^

BTW, Arceus did a 2-C feat in the movie, that being shaking his, the regular world, the distortion world and Palkia and Dialga's dimensions just by waking up

 

[Zeifyl]

Arceus is already upscaling far enough from Darkrai's 2-C feat that this is basically irrelevant.

The only thing stopping it from being truly irrelevant is that it was so casual that it's hard to gauge if the feat was accidental or intentional.

 

[Overlord775]

Darkway's feat is only 2 universes, the feat Arceus does in the movie is 5 universes, so it's not irrelevant

 

[Ionliosite]

Is shaking 5 universes a 2-C feat? Because shaking an universe isn't 3-A.

 

[Overlord775]

iirc yes

 

[Kepekley23]

I believe Arceus's true form should be rated a lot higher than 2-B, though I'll reserve that thread for the future.

 

[Inverted_Tempest]

Honestly, if this goes through, Arceus legit would probably need like three keys with one for an avatar, one for Arceus, and one for the Original Spirit iself.

 

[Lavcore]

isn't the original spirit arceus's true form or am i getting that wrong?

 

[Inverted_Tempest]

Yes.

 

[Overlord775]

Honestly, if this goes through, Arceus legit would probably need like three keys with one for an avatar, one for Arceus, and one for the Original Spirit iself.

Arceus is canonically the avatar of the Original Spirit, nothing really points at Arceus itself having also avatars of his own

 

[Zeifyl]

Agreed. We just need two keys: One for Avatar Arceus and one for the Original Spirit.

 

[Kepekley23]

Original Spirit Arceus is Low 1-C (in the new system). However, my thread on that will come later due to backlog and all that.

 

[NeoZex6399]

What

 

[Overlord775]

Original Spirit Arceus is Low 1-C (in the new system).
Not joking.

However, my thread on that will come later due to backlog and all that.

hot damn, that's some good shit there

 

[Zeifyl]

Original Spirit Arceus is Low 1-C (in the new system). However, my thread on that will come later due to backlog and all that.

Wouldn't it be one of the weakest Low 1-C's? No feats of affecting 5D+'s and all that?

 

[Kepekley23]

It'd transcend the verse's concept of dimensions, so...no. Dimensionality is irrelevant in the new tiering system.

It'd be a relatively powerful Low 1-C, considering it is a conceptual and formless void where all abstract forms shown to exist in the verse are one with it, ontop of every other ability its 2-B avatar possesses.

 

[Ionliosite]

Would Arceus' avatar be 2-B tho? What 2-B feat does it have?

 

[Kepekley23]

It scales from 2-B entities.

 

[Ionliosite]

Why would Avatar Arceus scale to the True Forms of the CT?

 

[Overlord775]

Because Avatar Arceus re-created Dialga and a Palkia without even needing his plates

 

[Ionliosite]

How we are sure those are their True Forms and not just Avatars? Aren't those True Forms omnipresent across all of space and time to begin with?

 

[The_Axiom_of_Virgo]

So with the current resolutions from this and future threads, I'm going to guess the Pokémon god tiers would look something like this? (assuming the upgrades/revisions are accepted):

CT Avatars: At least low 2-C

LS Avatars: At least low 2-C

LS true forms: 2-B

CT true forms: 2-B

Arceus: 2-B

Original Spirit: low 1-C

 

[Lavcore]

LS?

 

[The_Axiom_of_Virgo]

Lake Spirits.

 

[Kepekley23]

Lake Spirits.

 

[Ionliosite]

The CT Avatars wouldn't be Low 2-C, they would be 2-C via scaling above Darkrai.

And you still hasn't answered why is Avatar Arceus 2-B.

 

[Kepekley23]

Well, Avatar Dialga is capable of stabilizing all of space and time with its heartbeat, a feat we currently accept as 2-B, so...

 

[Ionliosite]

So basically we're back at square 1. If Avatars would be 2-B, what tier will the True Forms be?

 

[Lavcore]

ok but is avatar dialga doing that within that specific time-space or throughout the multiverse? the distinction is important.

 

[Kepekley23]

@Ionliosite

Still 2-B.

 

[Ionliosite]

@Ionliosite

Still 2-B.

Wait, how come the Avatars and the True Forms are the same?