Alucard(Hellsing) Immortality and Vulnerability

[JackWhite-01]

Alright. this needs to be put out. Alucard does not use souls to regenerate. It was a fan theory. And I'll debunk this.
If Alucard did use souls to regenerate:
1. How did Vlad regenerate his head off-screen when he had no souls at the time after he was decapitated?
2. Why did Dracula not use souls to regenerate when he was on the verge of death after being staked by Abraham Van Helsing?
3. Why did Alucard drink Integra's spilled blood to rejuvenate when he could have used one of his souls to rejuvenate?
4. How was Alucard able to regenerate after being decapitated, stabbed in the head, staked to the point where it nearly destroyed his heart, and burned by holy fire(which can one-shot demons) and still regenerate even when he had no souls?

Since Bram Stoker Dracula is a canon prequel to the franchise; I'll use it to debunk the theory.
Since you can barter souls by drinking their blood, the novel states that "Dracula requires no other sustenance but fresh human blood, which has the effect of rejuvenating him and allowing him to grow younger. His power is drawn from the blood of others, and he cannot survive without it. Although drinking blood can rejuvenate his youth and strength, it does not give him the ability to regenerate; months after being struck on the head by a shovel, he still bears a scar from the impact."

The real way to kill Alucard is to destroy his heart with a holy weapon. You don't have to do this multiple times if he has souls; you just have to do it once. The reason why I inferred that is his weakness is that after his loss against Abraham Van Helsing, he was taken in and experimented on to be an ultimate weapon for an organization that aims to kill demonic and satanic threats. Abraham Van Helsing experimented on him to be immune to traditional vampiric weaknesses like Garlic, and silver, and even methods to kill him like Decapitation, burned to a crisp, or even staking to the heart and is made so powerful to the point he is able to shrug off holy artifacts like crosses, holy water, and wafer and this is affirmed as Integra stated that he is 100 years of Hellsing's perfection and experimentation. And also, Alucard did say to Anderson "Pierce my heart with your bayonet" affirming the entire weakness of Alucard being to destroy his heart with a holy weapon.

 

[Crabwhale]

@Random-Helper323 @LordGinSama Can either of you comment here? I'm a bit busy for today.

 

[Random-Helper323]

Alright. this needs to be put out. Alucard does not use souls to regenerate. It was a fan theory.

It wasn't a fan theory so much as stated by Anderson, and in turn stated by the Major and Alucard himself.

And I'll debunk this.
If Alucard did use souls to regenerate:
1. How did Vlad regenerate his head off-screen when he had no souls at the time after he was decapitated?

When did this happen? Are you talking about when Monster Anderson slashed his head off, which happened before the holy fire destroyed Alucard's soul stock?

2. Why did Dracula not use souls to regenerate when he was on the verge of death after being staked by Abraham Van Helsing?

He survived it in Hellsing's continuity. So saying he didn't recover or regenerate from it is contrary to the fact he's still here.

3. Why did Alucard drink Integra's spilled blood to rejuvenate when he could have used one of his souls to rejuvenate?

It's more like it woke him up. There's no proof he actually needed it to recover. We also know he can still get hungry and has a particular taste for Integra's blood.

4. How was Alucard able to regenerate after being decapitated, stabbed in the head, staked to the point where it nearly destroyed his heart, and burned by holy fire(which can one-shot demons) and still regenerate even when he had no souls?

He was never staked or decapitated while having no souls. The holy fire was what destroyed his soul army, and the stab to the head and to the gut didn't take his head off or pierce his heart, and they both happened before the holy fire torched him and his soul stock. Even Anderson demonstrated an ability to recover from a bullet through his forehead right at the start, and the priest didn't care about Seras shooting him in the face either, so stabs to the head are clearly not a big issue for vampires.

Since Bram Stoker Dracula is a canon prequel to the franchise; I'll use it to debunk the theory.
Since you can barter souls by drinking their blood, the novel states that "Dracula requires no other sustenance but fresh human blood, which has the effect of rejuvenating him and allowing him to grow younger. His power is drawn from the blood of others, and he cannot survive without it. Although drinking blood can rejuvenate his youth and strength, it does not give him the ability to regenerate; months after being struck on the head by a shovel, he still bears a scar from the impact."

This entire quote runs directly contrary to even the most basic facts about Alucard. Still having a scar months later from a shovel strike and yet no scars or issues at all seconds after being turned into a pincushion for Anderson's blades and decapitated, or sliced clean in half vertically complete with slicing his brain and spine in half. Bit of a contradiction. The part about not surviving without blood is also contrary, given that Alucard went for decades without blood right before the start of the manga.

The real way to kill Alucard is to destroy his heart with a holy weapon. You don't have to do this multiple times if he has souls; you just have to do it once. The reason why I inferred that is his weakness is that after his loss against Abraham Van Helsing, he was taken in and experimented on to be an ultimate weapon for an organization that aims to kill demonic and satanic threats. Abraham Van Helsing experimented on him to be immune to traditional vampiric weaknesses like Garlic, and silver, and even methods to kill him like Decapitation, burned to a crisp, or even staking to the heart and is made so powerful to the point he is able to shrug off holy artifacts like crosses, holy water, and wafer and this is affirmed as Integra stated that he is 100 years of Hellsing's perfection and experimentation. And also, Alucard did say to Anderson "Pierce my heart with your bayonet" affirming the entire weakness of Alucard being to destroy his heart with a holy weapon.

Problem is Anderson pierced his heart with a blessed bayonet in the very first fight they had, and Integra stated that wouldn't kill Alucard.

 

[LordGinSama]

Unfortunately I'm headed into work and won't be able to comment for a few hours.

 

[Random-Helper323]

Unfortunately I'm headed into work and won't be able to comment for a few hours.

It's okay, I just edited my comment to have more detail. I first wrote it in a hurry. The fact that the interpretation put forth in this thread is contrary not only to solid statements but to even the most basic facts about Alucard means it doesn't hold up in Hellsing. However it does raise some issue about whether Bram Stoker's novel is a direct canon connection or merely a public domain reference.

 

[JackWhite-01]

It wasn't a fan theory so much as stated by Anderson, and in turn stated by the Major and Alucard himself.

The Major or Anderson never stated it explicitly but Anderson did indeed have an indirect suggestion of it which is the strongest evidence of Alucard's regeneration being based on souls.

When did this happen? Are you talking about when Monster Anderson slashed his head off, which happened before the holy fire destroyed Alucard's soul stock?

No, After he renounces God by drinking blood in defiance to him.

He survived it in Hellsing's continuity. So saying he didn't recover or regenerate from it is contrary to the fact he's still here.

You do realize that Abraham Van Helsing chose not to kill him right so that he can be used as an asset to an organization he will create? That's how the manga deviates from the novel.

It's more like it woke him up. There's no proof he actually needed it to recover. We also know he can still get hungry and has a particular taste for Integra's blood.

Well, he look shriveled before drinking blood and was rejuvenated after drinking it.

He was never staked or decapitated while having no souls. The holy fire was what destroyed his soul army, and the stab to the head and to the gut didn't take his head off or pierce his heart, and they both happened before the holy fire torched him and his soul stock. Even Anderson demonstrated an ability to recover from a bullet through his forehead right at the start, and the priest didn't care about Seras shooting him in the face either, so stabs to the head are clearly not a big issue for vampires.

Once, all the souls are released, he is vulnerable; that is the entire soul count theory. And the holy fire spread as a chain reaction due to the souls being in close proximity. It's not because once the blade nearly staked his heart, all the souls spontaneously combusted. Also, thinking about it now; The entire principle of the soul count theory is that you have to kill him or stake his heart X number of times where X is the no souls he has at his disposal. If we are using your interpretation of the soul count theory, why did all the souls start to burn in one stab to the heart?
and being stabbed in the head with a holy weapon would deal severe damage to Alucard as he collapsed and technically lost consciousness.
Anderson shrugged it off because he is not vulnerable to conventional weaponry whereas Alucard is vulnerable to holy weapons in this case.

This entire quote runs directly contrary to even the most basic facts about Alucard. Still having a scar months later from a shovel strike and yet no scars or issues at all seconds after being turned into a pincushion for Anderson's blades and decapitated, or sliced clean in half vertically complete with slicing his brain and spine in half. Bit of a contradiction. The part about not surviving without blood is also contrary, given that Alucard went for decades without blood right before the start of the manga.

Do you know that Abraham Van Helsing made him more powerful via experimentation using Alchemy or the occult? That's why he is stated to be 100 years of Hellsing's perfection.

Problem is Anderson pierced his heart with a blessed bayonet in the very first fight they had, and Integra stated that wouldn't kill Alucard.

Just watched first OVA and Anderson said that he just decapitated him

 

[Crabwhale]

The Major or Anderson never stated it explicitly but Anderson did indeed have an indirect suggestion of it which is the strongest evidence of Alucard's regeneration being based on souls.

Fam I don't think you can get more explicit than this.

No, After he renounces God by drinking blood in defiance to him.

The blood was calling to him, so it already had weird soul pocus shit going on with it. By drinking it, he probably ate his first souls as well.

You do realize that Abraham Van Helsing chose not to kill him right so that he can be used as an asset to an organization he will create? That's how the manga deviates from the novel.

There are many difference from the novel actually. Hellsing is a continuation of sorts, but it's definitely a continuation set in a different universe. For starters, Mina Harker never got fully cured of her vampirism in this version. One of the protagonists of the original novel (might've been Dr. Seward) doesn't even get mentioned when they namedrop the other protagonists. Lucy Westenra and Dracula's three vampire ladies are nowhere to be seen or heard, either.

Once, all the souls are released, he is vulnerable; that is the entire soul count theory. And the holy fire spread as a chain reaction due to the souls being in close proximity. It's not because once the blade nearly staked his heart, all the souls spontaneously combusted. Also, thinking about it now; The entire principle of the soul count theory is that you have to kill him or stake his heart X number of times where X is the no souls he has at his disposal. If we are using your interpretation of the soul count theory, why did all the souls start to burn in one stab to the heart?

Because that's the power of Helena's Nail and the Monster of God it turns Anderson into.

and being stabbed in the head with a holy weapon would deal severe damage to Alucard as he collapsed and technically lost consciousness.
Anderson shrugged it off because he is not vulnerable to conventional weaponry whereas Alucard is vulnerable to holy weapons in this case.

He might not be. We've already seen he doesn't give a shit about sunlight. Traditional vampire weaknesses don't seem to affect him much. He's just that old and strong.

Just watched first OVA and Anderson said that he just decapitated him

The OVA takes some liberties with the source material.

 

[JackWhite-01]

Fam I don't think you can get more explicit than this.

The translation is off. Check it out in manga reader . to chapter 88
Also, the statement "All of them being sacrificed" are referring to The Last Battalion, the Crusaders, The Captain and Anderson. Not the souls he absorbed. Also, Even the major knew that Walter could never kill Alucard.

The blood was calling to him, so it already had weird soul pocus shit going on with it. By drinking it, he probably ate his first souls as well.

Actually, In the Hellsing guide; Hirano stated that Alucard became a vampire of his own and not because of an external force. Also, If he did absorb souls in one lick. how is it that he had to repeatedly drink the blood of Rip Van Winkle to absorb her?

There are many difference from the novel actually. Hellsing is a continuation of sorts, but it's definitely a continuation set in a different universe. For starters, Mina Harker never got fully cured of her vampirism in this version. One of the protagonists of the original novel (might've been Dr. Seward) doesn't even get mentioned when they namedrop the other protagonists. Lucy Westenra and Dracula's three vampire ladies are nowhere to be seen or heard, either.

It was stated in the novel that the curse would be lifted if Dracula died, but he doesn't die in the Hellsing franchise as a result the curse was still alive in Mina Harker but dormant. This was all explained in the manga also. And John Seward being omitted was most likely not to be intentional. As some of the translators add him in the line as well to rectify Hirano's error. Dracula's 3 brides were referred to as his 'servants' in the manga

Because that's the power of Helena's Nail and the Monster of God it turns Anderson into.

does not refute the reasoning for it being burned due to being in close proximity.

He might not be. We've already seen he doesn't give a shit about sunlight. Traditional vampire weaknesses don't seem to affect him much. He's just that old and strong.

In the novel, he wasn't affected by it to a lethal extent

The OVA takes some liberties with the source material.

https://***********.to/read/hellsing-230/en/chapter-6

it even says in the manga that he only decapitated him.

 

[Crabwhale]

The translation is off. Check it out in manga reader . to chapter 88

Brother, it's the OFFICIAL Viz translation. I have the physical Hellsing Deluxe Edition to confirm it, even.

Actually, In the Hellsing guide; Hirano stated that Alucard became a vampire of his own and not because of an external force. Also, If he did absorb souls in one lick. how is it that he had to repeatedly drink the blood of Rip Van Winkle to absorb her?

Scans for the said guide? Also I don't know if you read this, but the manga literally has the Major in the same predicament as Alucard, with the blood calling to him. He just refused to drink it.

It was stated in the novel that the curse would be lifted if Dracula died, but he doesn't die in the Hellsing franchise as a result the curse was still alive in Mina Harker but dormant. This was all explained in the manga also. And John Seward being omitted was most likely not to be intentional. As some of the translators add him in the line as well to rectify Hirano's error. Dracula's 3 brides were referred to as his 'servants' in the manga

I'd like to see the scan for the servants. And also, those differences aren't the only ones. They're just the most prominent. There's no way Hellsing and the Dracula novel are one-to-one continuations of each-other. I've read both, and own physical copies of both, and I can tell you that with good backing.

does not refute the reasoning for it being burned due to being in close proximity.

In the novel, he wasn't affected by it to a lethal extent

That's because the novel was written at a time when vampires did not have an overwhelming weakness to sunlight. In Hellsing, they clearly do. Every vampire operation or movement we see is done at night, and there's numerous references to sunlight and vampires being incompatible.

 

[Random-Helper323]

The Major or Anderson never stated it explicitly but Anderson did indeed have an indirect suggestion of it which is the strongest evidence of Alucard's regeneration being based on souls.

Right after Alucard absorbed lots and lots of blood, the Major said he was rebuilding his fortress and Alucard specifically told Walter that he'd now have to kill him thousands of times.

No, After he renounces God by drinking blood in defiance to him.

So right after he absorbed his first soul.

You do realize that Abraham Van Helsing chose not to kill him right so that he can be used as an asset to an organization he will create? That's how the manga deviates from the novel.

You do realise that is irrelevant to the point I made, wherein we still see him get staked in the heart, and it is factually true he's still alive afterwards. Don't be condescending when what you're saying is irrelevant to what I said. It's literally like all those people who dismissed Ichigo's feat of blocking all of Byakuya's petal blades because he still only managed to reach a draw with Byakuya, which is completely irrelevant to the previous feat. Same is true of dismissing Alucard not dying from a stake in the heart because he was used later.

Well, he look shriveled before drinking blood and was rejuvenated after drinking it.

He looked pretty dead after Anderson hacked his head off too. This guy looking shrivelled doesn't prove he was dead or even unable to function. It just proves he sat still for ages and let himself shrivel, or even that he made himself look like that by choice, given his form shifting tendencies.

Once, all the souls are released, he is vulnerable; that is the entire soul count theory

And he was still able to summon more of his army after the first few waves went out. Level 0 obviously accesses his ability to release them but doesn't instantly fire all of them out. So he still had souls in him when Anderson attacked him.

And the holy fire spread as a chain reaction due to the souls being in close proximity. It's not because once the blade nearly staked his heart, all the souls spontaneously combusted.

And that's why it spread through the entire army across London while not burning anything else?

Also, thinking about it now; The entire principle of the soul count theory is that you have to kill him or stake his heart X number of times where X is the no souls he has at his disposal. If we are using your interpretation of the soul count theory, why did all the souls start to burn in one stab to the heart?

You've misworded this, whether deliberately or by mistake. Monster Anderson never stabbed Alucard's heart because Seras stopped him. He stabbed his head. And it obviously did greater damage because the holy nature of Anderson's fire obviously represents a unique threat.

and being stabbed in the head with a holy weapon would deal severe damage to Alucard as he collapsed and technically lost consciousness.
Anderson shrugged it off because he is not vulnerable to conventional weaponry whereas Alucard is vulnerable to holy weapons in this case.

This is kind of nonsensical. Alucard is very vulnerable to extremely holy materials, yes. He proved that blessed bayonets and blessed silver didn't have any solid effect at other times. The Nail of Helena is literally coated in the blood of Jesus Christ. That is an extremely holy weapon. And why would Anderson have any weakness to conventional weapons?

Do you know that Abraham Van Helsing made him more powerful via experimentation using Alchemy or the occult? That's why he is stated to be 100 years of Hellsing's perfection.

Yeah, although what exactly was done is unknown. It also has no relevance to how exactly his regeneration works outside of speculation which is irrelevant to what we've seen him survive.

Just watched first OVA and Anderson said that he just decapitated him

Did you see the pincushion he made out of him with bayonets before that? His heart would have been pierced there.

 

[LordGinSama]

I'd like to see the scan for the servants. And also, those differences aren't the only ones. They're just the most prominent. There's no way Hellsing and the Dracula novel are one-to-one continuations of each-other. I've read both, and own physical copies of both, and I can tell you that with good backing.

Literally this.

 

[JackWhite-01]

Brother, it's the OFFICIAL Viz translation. I have the physical Hellsing Deluxe Edition to confirm it, even.

Really? Is it? I just went to Viz's website and I found no results on Hellsing. Also, Hellsing has gained a small reputation for having poor translation.

Scans for the said guide? Also I don't know if you read this, but the manga literally has the Major in the same predicament as Alucard, with the blood calling to him. He

Not a guide but it was an interview. Also, I need you to educate me on how to forward the pic because I can't drop a link due to it being censored.

just refused to drink it.

I'd like to see the scan for the servants. And also, those differences aren't the only ones. They're just the most prominent. There's no way Hellsing and the Dracula novel are one-to-one continuations of each-other. I've read both, and own physical copies of both, and I can tell you that with good backing.

I don't know the chapter no but if you know the chapter where Alucard reminiscences his loss against Abraham Van Helsing, his servants get mentioned. And it's obvious the novel and manga are not 1:1 considering the fact that the manga deviates from the novel when Abraham Van Helsing chose not to kill him which was the only part it deviated.

That's because the novel was written at a time when vampires did not have an overwhelming weakness to sunlight. In Hellsing, they clearly do. Every vampire operation or movement we see is done at night, and there's numerous references to sunlight and vampires being incompatible.

Well, I was referring to Count Dracula the whole time and he wasn't affected by sunlight in a lethal sense in the novel either.

 

[JackWhite-01]

Right after Alucard absorbed lots and lots of blood, the Major said he was rebuilding his fortress and Alucard specifically told Walter that he'd now have to kill him thousands of times.

Well, I couldn't find that line but when Alucard was referred to as a 'Fortress', it was a metaphor for the army of souls he has at disposal.

So right after he absorbed his first soul.

No, he most likely didn't absorb a soul in one lick considering the fact he repeatedly had to drink rip van winkle's blood to absorb her slowly.

You do realise that is irrelevant to the point I made, wherein we still see him get staked in the heart, and it is factually true he's still alive afterwards. Don't be condescending when what you're saying is irrelevant to what I said. It's literally like all those people who dismissed Ichigo's feat of blocking all of Byakuya's petal blades because he still only managed to reach a draw with Byakuya, which is completely irrelevant to the previous feat. Same is true of dismissing Alucard not dying from a stake in the heart because he was used later.

Mate did you not read the part when I said "He was on the verge of death"? Why didn't he use a soul to regenerate to retaliate back against Abraham Van Helsing? Why did he fall down and was bested by Abraham Van Helsing when he had an army of souls he could use to regenerate and tire out Van Helsing by repeatedly regenerating? Also, to finish Dracula off for good, you need to stake his heart followed by decapitation or slitting his throat and burn his corpse for good measure.

He looked pretty dead after Anderson hacked his head off too. This guy looking shrivelled doesn't prove he was dead or even unable to function. It just proves he sat still for ages and let himself shrivel, or even that he made himself look like that by choice, given his form shifting tendencies.

No, he didn't. I don't know which fight you are referring to but in both fights where Anderson decapitates him, Alucard didn't look dead; His head reformed into shadows in the final battle and he regenerated back in both the first and final battle. And no doesn't make himself look like that(which is an ability can perform but not in this case and I'll tell why) because this correlates to the point in the novel where he requires blood to rejuvenate his youth and strength. If he doesn't need blood(or souls) to rejuvenate, why did he not protect Integra unscathed?

And he was still able to summon more of his army after the first few waves went out. Level 0 obviously accesses his ability to release them but doesn't instantly fire all of them out. So he still had souls in him when Anderson attacked him.

No, headcanon. He releases all of his souls at once.

And that's why it spread through the entire army across London while not burning anything else?

You can see flames and pyro on buildings in the manga and ova

You've misworded this, whether deliberately or by mistake. Monster Anderson never stabbed Alucard's heart because Seras stopped him. He stabbed his head. And it obviously did greater damage because the holy nature of Anderson's fire obviously represents a unique threat.

Oops, Fire spread when he was stabbed in the head and Alucard's life flashes before his eyes and then he was incompletely stabbed in the heart.

This is kind of nonsensical. Alucard is very vulnerable to extremely holy materials, yes. He proved that blessed bayonets and blessed silver didn't have any solid effect at other times. The Nail of Helena is literally coated in the blood of Jesus Christ. That is an extremely holy weapon. And why would Anderson have any weakness to conventional weapons?

Mate, I said he is not vulnerable to conventional weaponry.

Yeah, although what exactly was done is unknown. It also has no relevance to how exactly his regeneration works outside of speculation which is irrelevant to what we've seen him survive.

Compare Alucard's regen between the Novel and Manga, you can tell that his regeneration is seemingly more powerful and augmented.

Did you see the pincushion he made out of him with bayonets before that? His heart would have been pierced there.

The best it did was moderately damage by grazing his heart. It didn't really destroy it.

 

[Random-Helper323]

Well, I couldn't find that line but when Alucard was referred to as a 'Fortress', it was a metaphor for the army of souls he has at disposal.

Alucard still specifically told Walter that he had to kill him thousands of times.

No, he most likely didn't absorb a soul in one lick considering the fact he repeatedly had to drink rip van winkle's blood to absorb her slowly.

Rip wasn't already dead, and besides, Alucard chose to kill her slowly.

Mate did you not read the part when I said "He was on the verge of death"? Why didn't he use a soul to regenerate to retaliate back against Abraham Van Helsing? Why did he fall down and was bested by Abraham Van Helsing when he had an army of souls he could use to regenerate and tire out Van Helsing by repeatedly regenerating? Also, to finish Dracula off for good, you need to stake his heart followed by decapitation or slitting his throat and burn his corpse for good measure.

That was always an inconsistency in the story. Maybe Alucard didn't have that ability yet at that point. There are clear differences between the two stories, and I don't know why everyone keeps saying Bram Stoker's novel is canon to Hellsing when it is clearly a loose reference.

No, he didn't. I don't know which fight you are referring to but in both fights where Anderson decapitates him, Alucard didn't look dead; His head reformed into shadows in the final battle and he regenerated back in both the first and final battle.

He looked dead right after being decapitated in their first fight.

And no doesn't make himself look like that(which is an ability can perform but not in this case and I'll tell why) because this correlates to the point in the novel where he requires blood to rejuvenate his youth and strength.

Again, the novel and manga aren't one to one here.

If he doesn't need blood(or souls) to rejuvenate, why did he not protect Integra unscathed?

Probably because he was asleep and sleeps like a lazy log.

No, headcanon. He releases all of his souls at once.

Then why is he shown releasing seperate groups of souls, at separate times?

You can see flames and pyro on buildings in the manga and ova

Probably because his army were all over them. The fire burns down that huge soul army but doesn't harm the Iscariot agents or Integra or even burn the blood Alucard drinks later, is resisted by Seras who is literally holding the source of the fire, and doesn't leave any noticeable fire damage anywhere.

Oops, Fire spread when he was stabbed in the head and Alucard's life flashes before his eyes and then he was incompletely stabbed in the heart.

Seras stopped the bayonet from reaching his heart.

Mate, I said he is not vulnerable to conventional weaponry.

Read your earlier post. You said that your assertion that Alucard will always die if stabbed in the heart with a holy weapon must be true because Alucard was affected far more by the Nail of Helena's holy effects than Anderson was by conventional weapons. In short, you stretched a weakness to extremely holy weapons up to the idea that it's an instant kill in all circumstances.

Compare Alucard's regen between the Novel and Manga, you can tell that his regeneration is seemingly more powerful and augmented.

Because they aren't the same story, character and verse. I don't know why people keep saying that just because events are referenced from Alucard's past that must mean Hellsing is a sequel to the book itself. It just means the manga is using the general information from the original appearance of Dracula, it doesn't mean it's treating all of it as canon. The mere fact that Bram Stoker's novel exists in Hellsing basically means that in the Hellsing verse, the novel is a record of Alucard's past life events, and evidently not an entirely accurate one given that Alucard is still alive.

The best it did was moderately damage by grazing his heart. It didn't really destroy it.

You said it only needed to be pierced, not destroyed. Alucard's entire chest cavity looked like a pincushion, and the heart isn't a particularly small object.

 

[JackWhite-01]

Alucard still specifically told Walter that he had to kill him thousands of times.

I don't know which translation or manga site you used but the one I use is completely different. Here Alucard says that "he somehow thought he couldn't even win. Even when I gave him tens of thousands of chances". Both lines have different intentions and meanings.

Rip wasn't already dead, and besides, Alucard chose to kill her slowly.

That was before Alucard attempted to absorb her soul. She begins to die after her soul was detached from her slowly. the fastest way for Alucard to absorb a soul is to use hemokinesis where he drains the blood of anyone in an instant.

That was always an inconsistency in the story. Maybe Alucard didn't have that ability yet at that point. There are clear differences between the two stories, and I don't know why everyone keeps saying Bram Stoker's novel is canon to Hellsing when it is clearly a loose reference.

How the hell can you say that? the soul count theory is the entire point of his immortality(regeneration also). He does not gain that ability, he already has it. If we go by this logic then that means that true vampires like Seras did not have the ability to regenerate using souls but still regenerated like how Alucard does or even when Alucard does not even instructs her to use souls to regenerate contradicts the line 'didn't have that ability yet at that point'.
Also, Hirano did say that from manga perspective, the novel is a prequel to it. It's not a loose reference considering the fact that the only deviation being the ending of the novel where Dracula was left alive to be used as an asset.

He looked dead right after being decapitated in their first fight.

It may have seen like it but it was all like that for Seras to drink his blood which she didn't. If Alucard didn't have the intention to make seras drink his blood; he would have regenerated far more quickly.

Again, the novel and manga aren't one to one here.

The Novel's content is about 95/96% accurate to the manga with only Dracula's fate being the deviation. This however does not change how Dracula's powers, immortality, or weakness work.

Probably because he was asleep and sleeps like a lazy log.

He is obligated to work, serve and protect the Helsing family. That's not an excuse something Alucard would use or any servant would. And vampires only get tired during daytime not under the moonlight. Alucard being shriveled and seemingly a rotten corpse was because he was deprived of blood which again refers to the novel that he needs it to use rejuvenate his youth and strength.

Then why is he shown releasing seperate groups of souls, at separate times?

That was different scenes/panels at the same time.

Probably because his army were all over them. The fire burns down that huge soul army but doesn't harm the Iscariot agents or Integra or even burn the blood Alucard drinks later, is resisted by Seras who is literally holding the source of the fire, and doesn't leave any noticeable fire damage anywhere.

That substantiates the point that the holy fire is being spread in close proximity. Integra or the Iscariots not being harmed by the fire was because there were no souls around them for the fire to spread like a chain reaction around. Also, The Holy Fire did harm her but like what Alucard did, she regenerated.

Seras stopped the bayonet from reaching his heart.

yes

Read your earlier post. You said that your assertion that Alucard will always die if stabbed in the heart with a holy weapon must be true because Alucard was affected far more by the Nail of Helena's holy effects than Anderson was by conventional weapons. In short, you stretched a weakness to extremely holy weapons up to the idea that it's an instant kill in all circumstances.

Me bringing up Anderson was just a comparison of similarity that's all. Shouldn't be looked into a lot. I didn't stretch a weakness when it is true considering the fact that Anderson used a nail that was used to crucify God himself to fight Alucard. Obviously, a demon like Alucard would be very vulnerable to it and is susceptible to dying from it.

Because they aren't the same story, character and verse. I don't know why people keep saying that just because events are referenced from Alucard's past that must mean Hellsing is a sequel to the book itself. It just means the manga is using the general information from the original appearance of Dracula, it doesn't mean it's treating all of it as canon. The mere fact that Bram Stoker's novel exists in Hellsing basically means that in the Hellsing verse, the novel is a record of Alucard's past life events, and evidently not an entirely accurate one given that Alucard is still alive.

From the novel perspective, the manga is an unofficial sequel. From the manga perspective, the Bram Stoker novel is canon with all the contents of the book(except Dracula's fate) being canon to it. Hirano has confirmed that events from the novel did indeed take place in the manga and now that's undisputable. Bram Stoker's novel existing you could say was diversion assisted by the Royal Army and Hellsing organization to keep undisclosed the existence of supernatural threats.

You said it only needed to be pierced, not destroyed. Alucard's entire chest cavity looked like a pincushion, and the heart isn't a particularly small object.

Read the first comment that started the thread. Tell me if I said something like that again.

 

[Random-Helper323]

I don't know which translation or manga site you used but the one I use is completely different. Here Alucard says that "he somehow thought he couldn't even win. Even when I gave him tens of thousands of chances". Both lines have different intentions and meanings.

I have the official Viz translations, and sure, I can go into that again and read it, although I'm sure you'll say those are wrong too. You said it to Crabwhale earlier.

How the hell can you say that? the soul count theory is the entire point of his immortality(regeneration also). He does not gain that ability, he already has it. If we go by this logic then that means that true vampires like Seras did not have the ability to regenerate using souls but still regenerated like how Alucard does or even when Alucard does not even instructs her to use souls to regenerate contradicts the line 'didn't have that ability yet at that point'.

I'll check what you're responding to before I dig up the scans.

Also, Hirano did say that from manga perspective, the novel is a prequel to it. It's not a loose reference considering the fact that the only deviation being the ending of the novel where Dracula was left alive to be used as an asset.

Don't suppose you could provide that statement?

It may have seen like it but it was all like that for Seras to drink his blood which she didn't. If Alucard didn't have the intention to make seras drink his blood; he would have regenerated far more quickly.

Doesn't change the fact that he looked dead when his head was flying off his body.

The Novel's content is about 95/96% accurate to the manga with only Dracula's fate being the deviation.

Dracula's fate, Mina's fate, vampires being harmed by sunlight, Dracula's size, the nature of Dracula's abilities, the spelling of the name Hellsing...

This however does not change how Dracula's powers, immortality, or weakness work.

The thing is that the evidence of the soul count being the regeneration's basis is found in statements in the manga itself.

He is obligated to work, serve and protect the Helsing family. That's not an excuse something Alucard would use or any servant would.

He was ordered to kill Millennium in WWII, and yet he ditched Walter to let him fight the Captain. It's also irrelevant if he was asleep.

And vampires only get tired during daytime not under the moonlight. Alucard being shriveled and seemingly a rotten corpse was because he was deprived of blood which again refers to the novel that he needs it to use rejuvenate his youth and strength.

Or he was just asleep for decades.

That was different scenes/panels at the same time.

I'll look up the manga again.

I didn't stretch a weakness when it is true considering the fact that Anderson used a nail that was used to crucify God himself to fight Alucard. Obviously, a demon like Alucard would be very vulnerable to it and is susceptible to dying from it.

It is a weakness. The Nail damages him a lot. Prove that it would be fatal even if he had all his souls. Also prove that less holy weapons will do that too.

From the novel perspective, the manga is an unofficial sequel. From the manga perspective, the Bram Stoker novel is canon with all the contents of the book(except Dracula's fate) being canon to it. Hirano has confirmed that events from the novel did indeed take place in the manga and now that's undisputable. Bram Stoker's novel existing you could say was diversion assisted by the Royal Army and Hellsing organization to keep undisclosed the existence of supernatural threats.

Scans? If Alucard is a weak piece of shit, provide the scans to prove it.

Anyway, I'll look into the manga yet again.

 

[JackWhite-01]

I have the official Viz translations, and sure, I can go into that again and read it, although I'm sure you'll say those are wrong too. You said it to Crabwhale earlier.

Viz does not have translations for Hellsing. I looked into their website and got no results and their wiki page does not have mention Hellsing at the bare minimum.

Don't suppose you could provide that statement?

It's from an interview and it's gonna take some time because I have another interview of his which required the Wayback machine and it's confirmed in Hellsing's fandom wiki so I could ask the mod's bibliography. Also, how do you forward scans, I can't paste the link because it will be censored here.

Doesn't change the fact that he looked dead when his head was flying off his body.

But considering the fact that he was talking to Seras via Telepathy proves that he was still alive before regenerating back.

Dracula's fate, vampires being harmed by sunlight, Dracula's size, the nature of Dracula's abilities, the spelling of the name Hellsing...

Dracula's fate deviation was the sake of the creation of the manga, what about Dracula's size and the nature of his abilities?
As for the name Hellsing, It's modified probably because of copyright. I also read off from the wiki and I'm not sure but it seems plausible as it states that Integra changed the family name from 'Helsing' to 'Hellsing' due to conversion from Catholicism to Protestantism. As a result, a reformation took place considering she is currently the head of the family.

The thing is that the evidence of the soul count being the regeneration's basis is found in statements in the manga itself.

That is indeed the strongest evidence of the soul count but it's debunked as a character statement when Dracula did not regenerate against Abraham Van Helsing despite having over 10s of thousands of souls to use or when he was able to regenerate off-screen after being decapitated when he renounced God and when he regenerated when he had no souls against Walter and Anderson.

He was ordered to kill Millennium in WWII, and yet he ditched Walter to let him fight the Captain. It's also irrelevant if he was asleep.

There are other figures in Millenium to kill not just the captain. Besides, Walter can actually defend himself, unlike Integra who was helpless as a child.

Or he was just asleep for decades.

which again correlates to the point of him being dependent on blood as his elixir for strength and rejuvenation. His immortality means nothing without strength. Regeneration is one thing but it's not dependent on any external source whereas his immortality is as stated it is dependent on blood and he requires no other sustenance.

It is a weakness. The Nail damages him a lot. Prove that it would be fatal even if he had all his souls. Also prove that less holy weapons will do that too.

Now, Hellsing as you know is a culmination of different concepts, ideas, folklore, myths, etc. Like how Alucard obtained Baskerville who is a demon dog from the Sherlock novel. The lore behind the Nail of Helena and other instruments of Passion is that they are weapons used to defeat Satan. Now If such a weapon like that Alucard just barely survived, most likely he is gonna survive getting shot in the heart with a blessed bullet or getting staked by a blessed bayonet and would enter a dormant state as he would in the novel when he is severely injured and rely on his coffin to sleep and heal.

Scans? If Alucard is a weak piece of shit, provide the scans to prove it.

I'll get you the scans. But, by reading the Novel one can interpret the entire story to be a dark and cruel fable(like any other old-fashioned one) where the villain is extremely powerful and has a wide array of abilities but has enough weaknesses to be exploited so that Abraham Van Helsing(The protagonist) can prevail against Dracula(the antagonist). So it's kind of a ****** up adult version of a storybook for children. Kind of an allegory.

 

[Crabwhale]

Viz does not have translations for Hellsing. I looked into their website and got no results and their wiki page does not have mention Hellsing at the bare minimum.

Actually on this one, he's sorta correct. I was erroneously attributing the Hellsing manga to Viz in the English release, when it is in fact published by Dark Horse Comics.

Anyway, here's a LITERAL picture of the official English release (courtesy of @WeeklyBattles cause I'm too lazy to photograph my own):

It's from an interview and it's gonna take some time because I have another interview of his which required the Wayback machine and it's confirmed in Hellsing's fandom wiki so I could ask the mod's bibliography. Also, how do you forward scans, I can't paste the link because it will be censored here.

Where exactly are you linking to.

But considering the fact that he was talking to Seras via Telepathy proves that he was still alive before regenerating back.

I find this point largely superfluous. What does it matter if he was dead or alive already? He still regenerated.

Dracula's fate deviation was the sake of the creation of the manga, what about Dracula's size and the nature of his abilities?
As for the name Hellsing, It's modified probably because of copyright. I also read off from the wiki and I'm not sure but it seems plausible as it states that Integra changed the family name from 'Helsing' to 'Hellsing' due to conversion from Catholicism to Protestantism. As a result, a reformation took place considering she is currently the head of the family.

That's diving into pure speculation. The name was probably changed just to be made up of two English words that sounded good together and had meaning. And it still doesn't help any of the other inconsistencies between the novel and the manga.

That is indeed the strongest evidence of the soul count but it's debunked as a character statement when Dracula did not regenerate against Abraham Van Helsing despite having over 10s of thousands of souls to use or when he was able to regenerate off-screen after being decapitated when he renounced God and when he regenerated when he had no souls against Walter and Anderson.

We don't know WHAT happened when Abraham beat Dracula. We just get a vague statement about him "dying", which he clearly didn't actually die. More likely, is that he was so thoroughly beaten he prostrated himself towards the Hellsing family since then. And even if that isn't enough to convince you, it's entirely plausible the soul stock regen got engineered into Alucard from the beefing up that the Hellsings did to him.

Now, Hellsing as you know is a culmination of different concepts, ideas, folklore, myths, etc. Like how Alucard obtained Baskerville who is a demon dog from the Sherlock novel. The lore behind the Nail of Helena and other instruments of Passion is that they are weapons used to defeat Satan. Now If such a weapon like that Alucard just barely survived, most likely he is gonna survive getting shot in the heart with a blessed bullet or getting staked by a blessed bayonet and would enter a dormant state as he would in the novel when he is severely injured and rely on his coffin to sleep and heal.

Actually the black dog is a very old concept from English folklore that far predates the Sherlock Holmes series.
Anyway, I really don't know what more proof you actually need that Alucard regens from his souls. It's constantly pointed to, alluded to and referenced, and at this point repeating it would just be going around in circles.

I'll get you the scans. But, by reading the Novel one can interpret the entire story to be a dark and cruel fable(like any other old-fashioned one) where the villain is extremely powerful and has a wide array of abilities but has enough weaknesses to be exploited so that Abraham Van Helsing(The protagonist) can prevail against Dracula(the antagonist).

Cool, doesn't change the fact that the novel is still the full canon continuity to the Hellsing manga.

 

[LuffyRuffy46307]

I disagree.

 

[WeeklyBattles]

Need scans of somethin?

 

[Crabwhale]

Aside from scans of existence? Nah, it's fine.

 

[JackWhite-01]

Actually on this one, he's sorta correct. I was erroneously attributing the Hellsing manga to Viz in the English release, when it is in fact published by Dark Horse Comics.

Anyway, here's a LITERAL picture of the official English release (courtesy of @WeeklyBattles cause I'm too lazy to photograph my own):

Then I have no idea why Deluxe and original have two different translations.

Where exactly are you linking to.

animetics file and wayback machine

I find this point largely superfluous. What does it matter if he was dead or alive already? He still regenerated.

If we go by this soul count theory. Alucard 'died' and used a soul to regenerate. But he telepathically communicated with Seras to drink the blood before actually regenerating.

That's diving into pure speculation. The name was probably changed just to be made up of two English words that sounded good together and had meaning. And it still doesn't help any of the other inconsistencies between the novel and the manga.

It's ironic and funny how you call my explanation a speculation but your reasoning on why Hirano modified the name 'Hellsing' sounded good together when it is the exact same phonetics as 'Helsing'(But I agree when you said it had meaning). Also, it is plausible considering how Abraham Van Helsing is catholic and Integra is a protestant(Or Arthur). But I'm more leaning toward the reasoning behind the change is because of copyright.

We don't know WHAT happened when Abraham beat Dracula. We just get a vague statement about him "dying", which he clearly didn't actually die. More likely, is that he was so thoroughly beaten he prostrated himself towards the Hellsing family since then. And even if that isn't enough to convince you, it's entirely plausible the soul stock regen got engineered into Alucard from the beefing up that the Hellsings did to him.

Dracula would never prostrate himself. Anyone who knows the character would know that. Dracula rather be dead and curse him while rotting in hell than serve his nemesis. The most convincing suggestion is that Abraham Van Helsing didn't fully finish him off and decided to use him as an asset to an organization against Supernatural threats and later rooted in the Royal monarch of the UK. And then experiment on him to lock limiters on him, invoke hidden powers(demonstrated new powers in Hellsing), and make him immune to traditional vampiric weaknesses.
Also, you refuted the one main point that defended the soul count theory. Saying that Dracula was experimented on to be engineered into using souls to regenerate contradicts what Anderson said because Anderson explained it in a manner that Alucard using souls to regenerate was a natural ability of being a vampire.

Actually the black dog is a very old concept from English folklore that far predates the Sherlock Holmes series.

Oh wow, didn't actually know that. Thanks for rectifying an error to my knowledge.

Anyway, I really don't know what more proof you actually need that Alucard regens from his souls. It's constantly pointed to, alluded to and referenced, and at this point repeating it would just be going around in circles.

you refuted the one and only point that advocates your point of Alucard using souls to regenerate with your speculation. And I have successfully defended each and every point on why Alucard doesn't use souls to regenerate.

Cool, doesn't change the fact that the novel is still the full canon continuity to the Hellsing manga.

I think you are trying to say "Cool, doesn't change the fact that the novel is still not the full canon continuity to the Hellsing manga." The deviation of Dracula's fate was necessary to kickstart the manga. everything other than that is exactly canon to the manga.

 

[JackWhite-01]

Here are the scans for the events of the novel being canon to the manga here.
and here's the scan for the evidence that Vlad became a vampire on his own and not because of an external source here.

 

[Crabwhale]

Then I have no idea why Deluxe and original have two different translations.

Define "original" here.

It's ironic and funny how you call my explanation a speculation but your reasoning on why Hirano modified the name 'Hellsing' sounded good together when it is the exact same phonetics as 'Helsing'(But I agree when you said it had meaning). Also, it is plausible considering how Abraham Van Helsing is catholic and Integra is a protestant(Or Arthur). But I'm more leaning toward the reasoning behind the change is because of copyright.

Japanese copyright law according to a quick search protected the rights of an individual's works 30 years after their death, prior to 1970. Bram Stoker died in 1912, and thus the Dracula novel would've entered the public domain on 1942. Hellsing was published in 1997, exactly one century later than the novel.

Dracula would never prostrate himself. Anyone who knows the character would know that. Dracula rather be dead and curse him while rotting in hell than serve his nemesis. The most convincing suggestion is that Abraham Van Helsing didn't fully finish him off and decided to use him as an asset to an organization against Supernatural threats and later rooted in the Royal monarch of the UK. And then experiment on him to lock limiters on him, invoke hidden powers(demonstrated new powers in Hellsing), and make him immune to traditional vampiric weaknesses.

You missed the entire point of Alucard's character then. He constantly kneels and acts submissive towards Integra. He will literally not do anything without her go-ahead. He believes that humanity is special, that human willpower is the one thing to end him, and we can see from the brief flashback to his time as the Count that his arrogance was utterly broken by Van Helsing. That night literally gives him nightmares, meaning whatever Helsing did in this continuity humbled the king of vampires so thoroughly that it changed his entire worldview.

you refuted the one and only point that advocates your point of Alucard using souls to regenerate with your speculation. And I have successfully defended each and every point on why Alucard doesn't use souls to regenerate.

Apologies but you truly have not.

I think you are trying to say "Cool, doesn't change the fact that the novel is still not the full canon continuity to the Hellsing manga." The deviation of Dracula's fate was necessary to kickstart the manga. everything other than that is exactly canon to the manga.

Brother, the deviation in Dracula's fate isn't even the MAIN change in the novel.

No mention of Renfield, Lucy or the Sisters. No elaboration on how Dracula's and Alucard's powers are different. Hell, in the original Dracula novel, Dracula isn't even Vlad the Impaler. He's moreso implied to be a descendant. Dracula is a foundational work from which Hellsing springs, but that at no point means they are one-to-one in plot.

 

[Crabwhale]

Here are the scans for the events of the novel being canon to the manga here.
and here's the scan for the evidence that Vlad became a vampire on his own and not because of an external source here.

These are fascinating reads, but also they seem to be largely based on the OVA, rather than the manga.

Also, it would be helpful if you provided the actual page numbers.

 

[JackWhite-01]

Define "original" here.

translation on the non-deluxe version.

Japanese copyright law according to a quick search protects the rights of an individual's works 30 years after their death, prior to 1970. Bram Stoker died in 1912, and thus the Dracula novel would've entered the public domain on 1942. Hellsing was published in 1997, exactly one century later than the novel.

Then it's either like what you mentioned for the meaning or it's that conversion of the denomination. Either way or maybe both. But the change in the name doesn't really matter in such that it doesn't advocate that Bram Stoker's novel is not canon considering the fact that the name 'Hellsing' only applied to Hirano's OC descendants of Abraham Van Helsing.

You missed the entire point of Alucard's character then. He constantly kneels and acts submissive towards Integra. He will literally not do anything without her go-ahead. He believes that humanity is special, that human willpower is the one thing to end him, and we can see from the brief flashback to his time as the Count that his arrogance was utterly broken by Van Helsing. That night literally gives him nightmares, meaning whatever Helsing did in this continuity humbled the king of vampires so thoroughly that it changed his entire worldview.

No, I didn't. The reason why he does that was because he lost against Abraham Van Helsing and is alive due to his mercy and change of decision and became the lapdog of his organization by default. That's why he bows to Integra in submission out of obligation. It is not something he chose and it never will. Also, you can see in the manga that Abraham Van Helsing 'knocking' Dracula out and Alucard woke up. Not once do we see him prostrating or being insinuated that he did off-screen. In Hellsing, Count Dracula has a change of mentality towards humans and now loathes the one thing he used to unleash carnage for his gain and he hopes a human slays him.

Apologies but you truly have not.

Oh, I did. Have you actually used definitive reasoning proof other than saying that 'Dracula's content is not canon since its ending deviates according to Hellsing' and then saying backfiring speculations that contradict the concrete statement by Anderson that suggests Alucard uses souls to regenerate like 'he was possibly engineered to use souls to regenerate' or repeatedly use those misinterpreted lines of the major? All I have used is the lines from both the novel and manga to validate my points.

Brother, the deviation in Dracula's fate isn't even the MAIN change in the novel.

No mention of Renfield, Lucy or the Sisters. No elaboration on how Dracula's and Alucard's powers are different. Hell, in the original Dracula novel, Dracula isn't even Vlad the Impaler. He's moreso implied to be a descendant. Dracula is a foundational work from which Hellsing springs, but that at no point means they are one-to-one in plot.

Renfield, Lucy Westerna, and the 3 brides were referred to as servants by Abraham Van Helsing in that flashback in the manga. And in what manner Count Dracula's and Alucard's powers are different?
"According to his nemesis Abraham Van Helsing, "He must indeed have been that Voivode Dracula who won his name against the Turk, over the great river on the very frontier of Turkey-land. If it be so, then was he no common man: for in that time, and for centuries after, he was spoken of as the cleverest and the most cunning, as well as the bravest of the sons of the land beyond the forest.""
Count Dracula is implied to be Vlad 3 Dracula Tepes in the novel as noted by Abraham Van Helsing.

 

[JackWhite-01]

These are fascinating reads, but also they seem to be largely based on the OVA, rather than the manga.

No it ain't

Also, it would be helpful if you provided the actual page numbers.

pg7 and 3 respectively i think

 

[Crabwhale]

Count Dracula is implied to be Vlad 3 Dracula Tepes in the novel as noted by Abraham Van Helsing.

Many figures have been suggested as inspirations for Count Dracula, but there is no consensus. In his 1962 biography of Stoker, Harry Ludlam suggested that Ármin Vámbéry, a professor at the University of Budapest, supplied Stoker with information about Vlad Drăculea, commonly known as Vlad the Impaler.[10] Professors Raymond T. McNally and Radu Florescu popularised the idea in their 1972 book, In Search of Dracula.[11] Benjamin H. LeBlanc writes that there is a reference within the text to Vámbéry, an "Arminius, of Buda-Pesh University", who is familiar with the historical Vlad III and is a friend of Abraham Van Helsing,[12] but an investigation by McNally and Florescu found nothing about "Vlad, Dracula, or vampires" within Vámbéry's published papers,[13] nor in Stoker's notes about his meeting with Vámbéry.[12] Academic and Dracula scholar Elizabeth Miller calls the link to Vlad III "tenuous", indicating that Stoker incorporated a large amount of "insignificant detail" from his research, and rhetorically asking why he would omit Vlad III's infamous cruelty.

 

[JackWhite-01]

Many figures have been suggested as inspirations for Count Dracula, but there is no consensus. In his 1962 biography of Stoker, Harry Ludlam suggested that Ármin Vámbéry, a professor at the University of Budapest, supplied Stoker with information about Vlad Drăculea, commonly known as Vlad the Impaler.[10] Professors Raymond T. McNally and Radu Florescu popularised the idea in their 1972 book, In Search of Dracula.[11] Benjamin H. LeBlanc writes that there is a reference within the text to Vámbéry, an "Arminius, of Buda-Pesh University", who is familiar with the historical Vlad III and is a friend of Abraham Van Helsing,[12] but an investigation by McNally and Florescu found nothing about "Vlad, Dracula, or vampires" within Vámbéry's published papers,[13] nor in Stoker's notes about his meeting with Vámbéry.[12] Academic and Dracula scholar Elizabeth Miller calls the link to Vlad III "tenuous", indicating that Stoker incorporated a large amount of "insignificant detail" from his research, and rhetorically asking why he would omit Vlad III's infamous cruelty.

I wouldn't call that weak when they literally called him by his honorific( That is 'Voivode' and also mentioned the actual nation he was warring with) and I wouldn't take that seriously because they called it "tenuous" or weak because the rampage caused by Vlad 3 was not mentioned or even the namesake on the reasoning why he is known as the 'Impaler AKA Tepes'.

 

[Random-Helper323]

Okay, I'm reading the manga now. Translation by Duane Johnson, published by Mike Richardson, produced by Dark Horse Comics.

On page 201, Volume 9, the Major says "Alucard released Level Zero und emitted all his lives. Vhen he became "the only vone in his castle"... Vould Anderson the priest defeat him? Vould Valter the butler defeat him? I think "Nein". Even alone, he's a dreadful vampire."

On page 45, volume 10, the Major says "You can't vin against that, now. Your chances haf dropped infinitely close to zero. The once-in-a-lifetime ideal chance ist gone. There've only been two good chances to physically defeat Alucard. Only two opportunities since 1898..."

This statement is continued on page 46, volume 10, where the Major says "All of those (lives of the vampires and crusaders) vere sacrificed to create a single instant. The one instant in vich Alucard can be killed. Und even then, your filaments didn't reach him. How the hell many lives does Alucard haf now? A million? Two million? You can no longer beat him."

On page 47, volume 10, immediately after Walter slices him in half while he is in the process of absorbing lots of blood, Alucard says "Keep killing. You've only got thousands upon thousands more to go."

This all points to the soul number being key. It also directly contradicts the notion that a holy weapon to the heart is what kills him. Walter doesn't have a holy weapon, so if a holy weapon to the heart is what kills him, why has Walter got an opportunity? Anderson brought the Nail of Helena, so why was wiping out Alucard's soul army the only way to make that opportunity to kill him, the first since 1898? And finally, if the holy weapon is the trick, then why was Alucard talking total jibberish about Walter needing to kill him thousands upon thousands more times? Not only the statements, but the entire context of the scene, directly contradicts the idea that the holy weapon through the heart is the only way to kill him, and even more strongly contradicts the idea that such a method could have been used at any random time to kill him.

Edit: On a small side note, on page 41, Volume 8, Alucard, having already released a wave of his army, is shown summoning up a large seperate wave behind him, which is interesting since it means the entire army didn't just pour out in one move the instant he released Level Zero. It was visibly two seperate waves. However, a part that's really interesting is that the final clash between Alucard and Anderson in the manga, shown on pages 18-21, contains Alucard's familiars attacking Anderson as well, and even shows several of them charging while beingaattacked by Anderson's thorns, and as a result the familiars are on fire and surrounded by fire. Page 21 even shows a large wall of them being held back by Anderson's thorns, which page 20 already showed us causes the familiars to be burned. This means Alucard still had familiars until the final exchange between them destroyed all of them, except for one, the black dog.

 

[JackWhite-01]

Okay, I'm reading the manga now. Translation by Duane Johnson, published by Mike Richardson, produced by Dark Horse Comics.

On page 201, Volume 9, the Major says "Alucard released Level Zero und emitted all his lives. Vhen he became "the only vone in his castle"... Vould Anderson the priest defeat him? Vould Valter the butler defeat him? I think "Nein". Even alone, he's a dreadful vampire."

Yeah, this translation is very similar if not the exact same but with minor differences. But if you read the line here or in the non-deluxe version it says that Major even thinks that Walter or Anderson still wouldn't kill Alucard despite not having any souls.

On page 45, volume 10, the Major says "You can't vin against that, now. Your chances haf dropped infinitely close to zero. The once-in-a-lifetime ideal chance ist gone. There've only been two good chances to physically defeat Alucard. Only two opportunities since 1898..."

In the non-deluxe says, "No matter, you can't win now. Your last chance is forever lost. This truly will be the chance of a lifetime. There have only been two chances to overthrow Alucard. An opportunity not presented but twice since 1898..." Sort of similar but, With Major addressing that Walter still couldn't beat Alucard in level 0 state confirms that Walter has the chance to kill Alucard was never any one of the two chances to Kill Alucard since 1898.

This statement is continued on page 46, volume 10, where the Major says "All of those (lives) vere sacrificed to create a single instant. The one instant in vich Alucard can be killed. Und even then, your filaments didn't reach him. How the hell many lives does Alucard haf now? A million? Two million? You can no longer beat him."

Those 'lives' are referring to the Last Battalion, The 9th Crusaders, Captain, Anderson, Iscariots, and the lives that served with Walter. Those 'lives' were not referring to Alucard's souls.

On page 47, volume 10, immediately after Walter slices him in half while he is in the process of absorbing lots of blood, Alucard says "Keep killing. You've only got thousands upon thousands more to go."

In the Non-deluxe version, Alucard said "That spaced-out priest. He thought he couldn't win even though I gave him tens of thousands of chances." The line here was referring to Anderson. And, it's obvious that when he said thousands of chances was an exaggeration of giving a lot of chances to kill him even when he had souls at the time absorbed inside of him.

This all points to the soul number being key. It also directly contradicts the notion that a holy weapon to the heart is what kills him. Walter doesn't have a holy weapon, so if a holy weapon to the heart is what kills him, why has Walter got an opportunity? Anderson brought the Nail of Helena, so why was wiping out Alucard's soul army the only way to make that opportunity to kill him, the first since 1898? And finally, if the holy weapon is the trick, then why was Alucard talking total jibberish about Walter needing to kill him thousands upon thousands more times? Not only the statements, but the entire context of the scene, directly contradicts the idea that the holy weapon through the heart is the only way to kill him, and even more strongly contradicts the idea that such a method could have been used at any random time to kill him.

The Deluxe and non-deluxe translations had different interpretations in a few lines. Also, The two chances were Abraham Van Helsing having the chance to kill Alucard, and the second one being that Schrodinger to poison Alucard by absorbing his soul and very nature. Also, the 2 chances that one-each both Anderson and Walter have to kill Alucard is false as the Major said that they still couldn't beat Alucard even when he had no souls. One more thing, the Major said two chances since 1898, so why would you exclude Abraham Van Helsing's chance to kill Dracula?
Walter's wires are probably blessed considering the fact he worked in the Hellsing organization and he is fighting a demon.

Edit: On a small side note, on page 41, Volume 8, Alucard, having already released a wave of his army, is shown summoning up a large seperate wave behind him, which is interesting since it means the entire army didn't just pour out in one move the instant he released Level Zero. It was visibly two seperate waves. However, a part that's really interesting is that the final clash between Alucard and Anderson in the manga, shown on pages 18-21, contains Alucard's familiars attacking Anderson as well, and even shows several of them charging while beingaattacked by Anderson's thorns, and as a result the familiars are on fire and surrounded by fire. Page 21 even shows a large wall of them being held back by Anderson's thorns, which page 20 already showed us causes the familiars to be burned. This means Alucard still had familiars until the final exchange between them destroyed all of them, except for one, the black dog.

All of this relates to the fact that the souls being burned were a result of fire being spread due to proximity and all of the souls were not burning simultaneously. That's why we see souls charging alongside Alucard. The Major also addressed that Alucard released all of his souls and is the 'ONLY' man in his castle, so what you propose here is contradicting his word and it doesn't matter how many waves there were for all souls to be unleashed. And those familiars we see charging alongside Alucard were not absorbed, not even off-screen because after Walter stabbed Luke Valentine with the pipe and Alucard started to absorb the blood in London, the Major said that he is the 'Only' man in his castle meaning that Alucard never absorbed any familiars and the Major was watching. And when Baskerville was killed and used as a puppet to chomp on Alucard, he still regenerated. And let's not forget when Walter dismembered Alucard'arms and tossed him around into buildings repeatedly and dealt loads of damage and still regenerated however he did not use a familiar Baskerville to regenerate all that damage.

So all in all, all that debunks the soul count theory down to the ground.

 

[DaReaperMan]

Yeah I'm gonna have to drop a disagree, reading the arguments, the one against this are stronger then the ones for.

 

[Random-Helper323]

Yeah, this translation is very similar if not the exact same but with minor differences.

It's the official translation.

But if you read the line here or in the non-deluxe version it says that Major even thinks that Walter or Anderson still wouldn't kill Alucard despite not having any souls.

Yes, I think I said that.

In the non-deluxe says, "No matter, you can't win now. Your last chance is forever lost. This truly will be the chance of a lifetime. There have only been two chances to overthrow Alucard. An opportunity not presented but twice since 1898..." Sort of similar but, With Major addressing that Walter still couldn't beat Alucard in level 0 state confirms that Walter has the chance to kill Alucard was never any one of the two chances to Kill Alucard since 1898.

Even your own quote talks about Walter losing his chance. How did he get that chance when he doesn't have any holy weapons? Why did he lose it when Alucard drains all the blood?

Those 'lives' are referring to the Last Battalion, The 9th Crusaders, Captain, Anderson, Iscariots, and the lives that served with Walter. Those 'lives' were not referring to Alucard's souls.

I know. I never said otherwise. I just couldn't be ****** to list all that irrelevant B.S about the armies when I had to type those entire quotes out on a phone which was lagging and attempting to **** up my writing with autocorrect.

The Deluxe and non-deluxe translations had different interpretations in a few lines. Also, The two chances were Abraham Van Helsing having the chance to kill Alucard, and the second one being that Schrodinger to poison Alucard by absorbing his soul and very nature.

Then why did Walter "lose his chance" even in whatever you're quoting?

Also, the 2 chances that one-each both Anderson and Walter have to kill Alucard is false as the Major said that they still couldn't beat Alucard even when he had no souls.

It was one chance. The Major said it was the once in a lifetime chance to kill him, but neither person would get him. It doesn't mean they couldn't have possibly killed him; the Major anticipated Alucard would win even when vulnerable. Obviously the other chance referred to Abraham beating him.

Walter's wires are probably blessed considering the fact he worked in the Hellsing organization and he is fighting a demon.

Cool. Good chance they are. Prove they could have killed him when he had souls, even though it's expressly stated they can't.

All of this relates to the fact that the souls being burned were a result of fire being spread due to proximity and all of the souls were not burning simultaneously. That's why we see souls charging alongside Alucard.

Unless he summoned them anew.

The Major also addressed that Alucard released all of his souls and is the 'ONLY' man in his castle, so what you propose here is contradicting his word and it doesn't matter how many waves there were for all souls to be unleashed.

He said that after the fight with Anderson.

And those familiars we see charging alongside Alucard were not absorbed, not even off-screen because after Walter stabbed Luke Valentine with the pipe and Alucard started to absorb the blood in London, the Major said that he is the 'Only' man in his castle meaning that Alucard never absorbed any familiars and the Major was watching.

Cool. Because Anderson burned the last of them in their final clash. What are you even talking about here?

And when Baskerville was killed and used as a puppet to chomp on Alucard, he still regenerated.

Which means nothing, we know he still has regeneration without souls. It's just that his heightened regeneration which can recover from fatal blows even by vampire standards involves the souls. I say that as someone who would love for that regeneration to be unlimited, but still can't lie about the statements and events.

And let's not forget when Walter dismembered Alucard'arms and tossed him around into buildings repeatedly and dealt loads of damage and still regenerated however he did not use a familiar Baskerville to regenerate all that damage.

Sigh... See above...

So all in all, all that debunks the soul count theory down to the ground.

Big shocker... Another nothing. I read this part first, and was wondering what you'd introduced, and naturally, it's nothing but old ground which is self-evident in the manga itself. We all know vampires without souls can still regenerate.

Look, we know Alucard is stated to be vulnerable after his souls are gone. We also know that when he absorbs lots of blood that vulnerability is treated as vanishing. We also know multiple statements in the official translation say he has those lives.

Even without that, ironically without the soul numbers, it would actually suggest Alucard just had that regeneration regardless. We have not received any statements suggesting that piercing his heart with holy weapons will kill him, and the fact that Anderson rammed three seperate blessed bayonets into the area where Alucard's heart would be (I'm counting them in the manga itself right now, and referring to the ones over the heart area, not in his whole chest, so don't bother trying to nitpick that to try to discredit me), and the fact that when Walter attempted to spear Alucard's heart he used a random length of metal he ripped out of some rubble, the story doesn't exactly point to that either.

I also have no clue what you're talking about with seperate translations, which you're constantly bringing up against the official ones we all have, and arbitrarily deciding that your translation (which none of us have been shown) is accurate while the Dark Horse comics version is not. You're also pushing your interpretation as more accurate than either the soul count or the simple "we don't ******* know" version which would be the reality if the soul count was discredited. Where does holy weapons insta-killing him no matter what even come from?


In short, the burdon of proof is firmly on you to specifically prove that a holy weapon in the heart will kill him. Even if we decided there was insufficient proof of the soul count regeneration boost, that would actually make Alucard stronger, not weaker, since it would mean he regenerates like that regardless. Even then, you'd still have to prove that specifically a holy weapon in the heart will kill him. Otherwise the only provable way to kill him would be to damage him beyond his regeneration's limits or nullify it.

 

[JackWhite-01]

Yeah I'm gonna have to drop a disagree, reading the arguments, the one against this are stronger then the ones for.

really? refute them in your words or copy and paste some of the things that advocate the soul count and I'll refute it for ya.

 

[JackWhite-01]

I'll respond later in some time cuz I have exams coming up

 

[DaReaperMan]

really? refute them in your words or copy and paste some of the things that advocate the soul count and I'll refute it for ya.

Read the thread, that should give you a clue

No idea why you're even contesting a blue name vote anyway, shit is thinner then water

 

[Crabwhale]

really? refute them in your words or copy and paste some of the things that advocate the soul count and I'll refute it for ya.

You're new here, so FYI members can indeed back up an argument by simply saying "agreed/disagreed/neutral for reasons above", also known as FRA.

Not everybody is expected to just type up text walls every time they have an opinion if somebody else has done it for them.

 

[Phsccarvalho]

In the non-deluxe says, "No matter, you can't win now. Your last chance is forever lost. This truly will be the chance of a lifetime. There have only been two chances to overthrow Alucard. An opportunity not presented but twice since 1898..." Sort of similar but, With Major addressing that Walter still couldn't beat Alucard in level 0 state confirms that Walter has the chance to kill Alucard was never any one of the two chances to Kill Alucard since 1898.

Wrong, that was one of the chances.

Official translation from my country:

"It's already too late for anything. You are no longer able to defeat him, you missed your last chance

I gave you a unique opportunity. You had the chance to physically finish off Alucard. Something that hasn't happened since 1898.

* part talking about the characters who participated in this massacre in England *

A unique chance that was created thanks to all this. The only instant in which it would be possible to kill Alucard.

How many lives do you think he has now? One million, two million. You are no longer a match for him."

Right after that, Alucard brags about telling Walter to try to kill him a thousands more times.

Again, official translation, not one made by an internet scan.

Those 'lives' are referring to the Last Battalion, The 9th Crusaders, Captain, Anderson, Iscariots, and the lives that served with Walter. Those 'lives' were not referring to Alucard's souls.

Of course, totally ignoring the part of Major saying "How the hell many lives does Alucard haf now? A million? Two million? You can no longer beat him."

In the Non-deluxe version, Alucard said "That spaced-out priest. He thought he couldn't win even though I gave him tens of thousands of chances." The line here was referring to Anderson. And, it's obvious that when he said thousands of chances was an exaggeration of giving a lot of chances to kill him even when he had souls at the time absorbed inside of him.

Wrong translation, I have an official hellsing box that is not the deluxe one but one that is the 10 volumes and the translation aligns with Random-Helper's.

----------------------------------------

Seriously, we have Alexander talking about Alucard and his many lives, and that this is why he doesn't die.

Right after Alexander burns all of Alucard's souls and leaves him empty, we are shown that this is Walter's chance to kill Alucard.

When Walter fails to do so in time and Alucard ends up absorbing the blood, the Major comments that Walter missed his chance to kill Alucard and even wonders how many lives he has now.

And right after Walter cuts Alucard in half, Alucard brags telling Walter to keep killing him thousands more times.

I disagree with the topic.

 

[Phsccarvalho]

And for those who doubt about my box, here is the image.

 

[Random-Helper323]

DaReaperMan is fully allowed to read your arguments, mine and Crabwhale's, and draw a conclusion. He doesn't have to be staff or make long arguments of his own to do so. Just as you're fully allowed to make these arguments against an admin, and that admin will rightly be called out if he bans you for disagreeing with him or otherwise silences you, not that Crabwhale would ever do something that pathetic; he's a bigger man than that. In short, be glad we're not like all the communities which silence everyone they don't want to hear. You should probably thank Antvasima for that, because the Wiki was a lot more like that before he came along.

By the same token, many people simply lazily side with whatever verse they support or go against whatever verse they oppose, including staff, and these staff votes often are called out as not being worth much at all, certainly not as much as the vote of a staff member who is actively involved and knowledgeable. There have been cases of such input being ignored entirely due to the person's vote on that subject being utterly biased and useless, in fact. If they're someone who'll support any downgrade for a verse they hate, for example, even if the downgrade goes against basic rules and requires an extreme double standard, then no-one's really going to care when they inevitably support every downgrade thread for that verse.

---

Anyway, ramble over. Back on topic, we can narrow this down, since even if you were able to debunk the soul count stuff (which you haven't) you still have to prove that this guy who can regenerate from a puddle will die if stabbed in the heart specifically with a holy weapon. You're talking about that with no proof, and meanwhile you talk about some other translation which you can't seem to provide or authenticate, but have regardless decided is more accurate than the official Dark Horse translation. And this other translation is basically your entire basis for discrediting the soul number regeneration.

So for bare minimum, you need to prove that translation even exists, and then you need to prove it is more accurate than the official ones we have. Phsccarvalho has now very kindly provided a mention of another language's translation which also lines up with the official ones we have. And even then the soul count being irrelevant contradicts what we clearly see happening and the context. Even if this somehow amounted to throwing the soul count out, that would actually just mean his regeneration was always like that, and you would then have to prove that a holy weapon in the heart would kill him. Not to mention explaining why Walter peed his pants when Alucard started absorbing all the blood.