All of Dragon Ball Cosmology revision (STAFF ONLY)

[Matthew_Schroeder]

A multiverse containing 12 to 18 universes is 2-C.

You might as well upgrade Marvel universe busting to 1-C because it has realms adjacent to it, but I'm sure given the state of this wiki people will just reply with "Sure, let's do that too."

 

[sanicspood]

dont see a problem with that

 

[Alphaapexnep00]

A multiverse containing 12 to 18 universes is 2-C.

You might as well upgrade Marvel universe busting to 1-C because it has realms adjacent to it, but I'm sure given the state of this wiki people will just reply with "Sure, let's do that too."

I would be happy too.

 

[Arcker123]

A multiverse containing 12 to 18 universes is 2-C.

You might as well upgrade Marvel universe busting to 1-C because it has realms adjacent to it, but I'm sure given the state of this wiki people will just reply with "Sure, let's do that too."

We are talking about the fact these space times are contained in a hyper timeline.

 

[Matthew_Schroeder]

We are talking about the fact these space times are contained in a hyper timeline.

This doens't exist. Y'all just made the word up to sound more impressive.

 

[Alphaapexnep00]

This doens't exist. Y'all just made the word up to sound more impressive.

Yeah we obviously made hypertime up the definition is literally in wikipedia.

 

[Alphaapexnep00]

Correct me if im wrong but it's the timeline version of hypertime correct?
Wiktionary. hypertime(Noun) Any of various fictional or theoretical time-like constructs that extend beyond normal time, usually by encompassing or spanning many distinct timelines (sometimes infinitely many).

It was first introduced in dc it is basically vast interconnected web of parallel time-lines which comprise all reality

 

[GilverTheProtoAngelo]

This doens't exist. Y'all just made the word up to sound more impressive.

Made up or not is Irrelevant.
The idea it represents is important here....especially when the concept is backed up by Tiering System and even the consultants themselves agree to it's existance.

 

[sanicspood]

This doens't exist. Y'all just made the word up to sound more impressive.

it does exist.

 

[Matthew_Schroeder]

The idea it represents is important here....especially when the concept is backed up by Tiering System and even the consultants themselves agree to it's existance.

There is one flow of time across all 12 universes. You have to make up a word to hide the more obvious realization going on here. That even giving it a 2-C rating is super generous.

 

[SSJRyu1]

Basically the argument here is that the DB "timeline" holds 12 4D Space Time's (Low 2-C/2-C structures, they are accepted as such on the wiki now btw individually) in a larger hypertime, as they are all held in the timeline, explicitly separate space times by themselves, and all effected when it multiplies. The issue with DontTalk's example is he is modeling the Universes as 3 dimensional in the case where they are encompassed by a single time dimension, but in reality the Universes by themselves already have a temporal dimension, the additional one that overarches all of them would be an additional, fifth dimension, and in this case a temporal one, which is treated as uncountably infinite. So I still agree with the OP, unless you wanna argue that each Universe is a 3-A structure, which is not the current standard and honestly given the current evidence, wrong.

 

[DivineAura44]

We are asking for proof. They're are many statements backing up that it is seperate, so we would need direct contradiction that hasn't been debunked.
(Talking to Matthew in this case.)

 

[Migue79]

I thought this was supposed to be Staff Only. Did all of these users actually get permission to speak here? Why are so many Non-Staff messaging here?

 

[InfiniteDay]

There is one flow of time across all 12 universes. You have to make up a word to hide the more obvious realization going on here. That even giving it a 2-C rating is super generous.

Have you.. perhaps understood the arguments incorrectly? It is the argument that all the universes flow through a sort of hypertime, this this larger timescale trivializing the common spacetime. Of course, this is a extremely basic interpretation, but you should have seen the argument that goes more into depth. It's not just 12 universes with one time flow as you claim.

 

[DastardlyDangerousDracoga]

I thought this was supposed to be Staff Only. Did all of these users actually get permission to speak here? Why are so many Non-Staff messaging here?

Funnily enough, it kinda just became too chaotic from then.

 

[Thedoctor]

the Daizenshuu guide books written by Akira Toriyama himself state the universe is a macrocosm with several different infinite universal dimensions, it consists of the living world, otherworld itself, heaven, hell, the demon realm (which is a parallel universe of the living world) and the kaioshin realm, that by itself makes one universe 2-C, time in those dimensions is stated to flow differently and inaccessible by normal means, the other universes are the same way except you have to be a kai or angel to travel to other macrocosms, there is no proof what happens in one universe effects another so you can't say they share the same time space with each other because that would be headcanon, everyone who scales to bog goku should be at least 2-C and Massively FTL+ and up

 

[AKUTO123]

Isn't that supposed to be just staff? Almost all comments are non-staff. only staff can comment like that in a crt? i just want to learn.

 

[KingTempest]

Isn't that supposed to be just staff? Almost all comments are non-staff. only staff can comment like that in a crt? i just want to learn.

It's staff only, people just don't feel like listening.
It's supposed to be the OP and the staff only.

 

[Matthew_Schroeder]

Have you.. perhaps understood the arguments incorrectly? It is the argument that all the universes flow through a sort of hypertime, this this larger timescale trivializing the common spacetime. Of course, this is a extremely basic interpretation, but you should have seen the argument that goes more into depth. It's not just 12 universes with one time flow as you claim.

or it's just one spacetime and you invented the word to justify a headcanon.

It's just one time flow.

 

[sanicspood]

or it's just one spacetime and you invented the word to justify a headcanon.

It's just one time flow.

how is it head canon?

 

[Alphaapexnep00]

or it's just one spacetime and you invented the word to justify a headcanon.

It's just one time flow.

Still doesn't provide evidence that it's a made up word or a one time flow.

 

[Abstractions]

Still doesn't provide evidence that it's a made up word or a one time flow.

It has been a few minutes, try to relax.

 

[GilverTheProtoAngelo]

or it's just one spacetime and you invented the word to justify a headcanon.

It's just one time flow.

No need to be mean.
As of now wiki accepts each universe as space-time.
And there are many users here who explain so again.
While you are fair to question it's validity since OP decided to bring it in to upgrade the macrocosm to 2C as an extra instead of just focusing on low1C by taking universes as established low2C construct on the wiki.

As for debunking low2C universes the burden of proof is on you if it is desired by you to have it as 3A. Which to be honest you have done a very poor job on such an endeavor.
Merely just handwaving it away or calling it head canon isn't going to fly.

 

[Arcker123]

It has been a few minutes, try to relax.

He is just asking him to prove a claim.

 

[Alphaapexnep00]

It has been a few minutes, try to relax.

Am clearly asking him to prove his claim and I don't think anything is wrong with that.

 

[Abstractions]

He is just asking him to prove a claim.

He had posted multiple times within a few minutes, I had commented at that time.

Am clearly asking him to prove his claim and I don't anything wrong with that.

Note how I never said there was anything wrong with what you asked!

 

[Vietthai96]

Well this chaotic is expected, it is Dragon Ball after all. Everyone should relax and take a break for a while before going back to the discussion. This is just unhealthy for everyone

 

[Axxtentacle]

Normal users: let the actual debate play out, please. This is a Staff Thread for the purpose of preventing the megafuckton of spam that this thread is currently receiving. Stop commenting without permission to post, and if you wish to comment, get permission.

I was given permission to comment this by Abstractions here.

 

[AKM sama]

This is a staff thread, so I'd appreciate if all non-staff comments that are just back and forth, are contributing little to nothing or just repeating what someone else has already said, stop entirely.

The arguments have been made, and from the looks of it, this isn't going to result in any upgrade. Ultima, the reason for this thread's creation, also agrees with DT that this is just 2-C, not Low 1-C. I'd just leave it open for some time in case any other staff member wants to give any input.

 

[Antvasima]

I agree with AKM, and apologise for causing trouble for him when he is already sick.

 

[Planck69]

I'm fairly sure Ultima just elaborated more on what's necessary for Low 1-C rather than outright rejecting it but I already lost the energy needed to argue this. I think this should be left open, if only for him to give any final opinion before closing.

 

[Antvasima]

I think that Ultima also made some statements via Discord regarding that he does not agree with this.

 

[Planck69]

Did he? The last Discord post I saw here was him agreeing with the concept. But if he actually disagrees then oh well, I won't make a fuss.

 

[Antvasima]

 

[Antvasima]

I was strictly shown these screencaptures though. I do not take part in any common Discord chat rooms.

 

[Antvasima]

A multiverse containing 12 to 18 universes is 2-C.

You might as well upgrade Marvel universe busting to 1-C because it has realms adjacent to it, but I'm sure given the state of this wiki people will just reply with "Sure, let's do that too."

Anyway, I strongly agree with Matthew here.

 

[Planck69]

I'd be more comfortable with a concrete answer on the thread (whether yes or no) but if most staff agree on closing then that's fine.

 

[Antvasima]

Let me be blunt, Ultima sound like he being pressured into disagree

No, it seems like he was originally misunderstood and possibly a bit careless with how he expressed himself.

 

[AKM sama]

People should really stop with the discord screenshots and learn to not speak for other people. People can say anything off-site, those screenshots are null and the person in question whose screenshots are being shared around is free to speak on his own here.

 

[Antvasima]

Okay. My apologies.