Ainz Ooal Gown vs Strahd von Zarovich

[Mr. Bambu]

TBH, no one will care about DND unless they start threatening spots in the "Strongest for Every Tier Threads"

This implies anyone cares anyways. In the end it's just a game I play on sundays and sometimes saturdays. D&D has a couple of spots on the strongest tier thread (High 6-A, 6-B, they were slated to take 6-C now that Pit Fiend is up, and 2-C, probably take Low 7-B via Abstract).

Also, as Anton says, yeah, you guys really don't know much about tabletops like this if resisting literally everything is new. Pretty much all of them do this. I wouldn't be surprised if Anima, Pathfinder, Gamma World, etc were all hyper-haxy as well as D&D. Probably not to the same extent due to just having a shorter lifespan thus far but still.

 

[ABoogieYesSir]

What a match this is.

 

[Qawsedf234]

...inability to be death-haxed by 4-D people is an anti-feat?
Regardless Strahd still has his resistances but still, what?

The weird part is that even the Immortals can't death or fear hax undead things. They need a special ability to do so like with Thanatos

Mr. Bambu"] D&D unironically resists wish.

Of course it does.[/quote]
For Wish, it should be noted that it varies heavily from multiversal retcon to retcon. Like in 1e or 2e Wish is literally just "Do anything the spell" while in 3e/5e its far more limited. I forget if it was possible to resist wish in the early editions (but to my memory I don't think it was possible), but you can resist the newer weaker wish (although in 5e I think it went back to being unresistable).

 

[Qawsedf234]

Bambu could probably just say random shit about 7-D D&D and nobody would bat an eye.

The seventh dimension does exist in Mystara tbf. But no one would scale to that besides the Luminous Being or the Old Ones (and the Far Realm I guess).

 

[Saga89]

I mean Strahd's resistances still apply. In D&D you absolutely can't death manip an undead creature. [...] Not even a god could.

I'm not sold on that

TGOALID isn't 4-D, is it? If so then it isn't bypassing Strahd's immunity to all things tied to Fort Saves.

RAW: Immunity to any effect that requires a Fortitude save (unless the effect also works on objects or is harmless).

So TGOALID can technically work on him.

The weird part is that even the Immortals can't death or fear hax undead things. They need a special ability to do so like with Thanatos

again: any cleric and most 3e deities (which usually have 20 cleric levels)?

Yes and no.

The "chance" is purely game mechanics and not the only method of resisting. In theory, yes, a 9-B can lolnope 2-A mindhax because they got two twenties in a row.

Didn't we talked about that on your message wall? Double or Triple 20 isn't a core game mechanic, it is an houserule given as an example.

Lowering resistances to mindhax via Mind Fog and mindhaxing, or sealing him within a confined part of Barovia via Soul Anchor.

Mind Fog is a mind-affecting effect and if this is accurate Ainz is immune to that like any D&D undead. And what is soul anchor? did you mean soul bind? Soul bind only works on freshly dead bodies. Trap the soul however can possibly negate all of Ainz's resistence (RAW: If the creature's name is spoken as well, any spell resistance is ignored) if Strahd is somehow able to learn Ainz true name (which btw would be Momonga or the player's true name outside Yggdrasil?).

Still, how good would be Ainz at locating any vampire's coffin? Or severing Strahd link with Barovia? Or preventing Ravenloft Mists from bringing Strahd back? Also how quickly does Ainz mana regen? How many times is Ainz able to cast a "quickened" version of TGOALID (iirc he needs a one-use pay item in order to do this)?

I'd like to vote for Strahd too, but for now I'd say it's incon.

 

[Qawsedf234]

again: any cleric and most 3e deities (which usually have 20 cleric levels)?

Ah, you're right. I just mentally classified them as Holy Manipulation and thinking that those two things are mutually exclusive rather than accepting that its both. My mistake.

As for Gods its a bit weird. All Gods (in 3e) can cast spells relating to their domain, but unless they're full spell-casters (such as Boccob, Vecna, or Wee-Jas) they're limited to their domains. But in other editions they can just cast any spell.

And what is soul anchor?

Maybe he confused Soul Bind with Dimensional Anchor?

 

[Dargoo_Faust]

TGoALiD works on Stradh?

Ainz might just deathhax then with True Death or Cry of the Banshee.

 

[Saga89]

As I said, TGoALiD is not enough on its own. Ainz also needs to 1) destroy Strahd's coffin, and 2) severe Strahd link to Barovia, otherwise the vampire may just pop back 1 hour later.

 

[Antoniofer]

Welp, in 1 hour he will just recover 1 HP, so the minimal damage will "kill" him once more. Also, if he is unable to transform (can't transform if he is exposed to water or sunlight) or Ainz find a way to hold him for 2 hours he is ultimately destroyed; it can also put an stake in the coffin to stop his resurrection. That's it, not sure if Ainz have ways to hold him for that long.

 

[Mr. Bambu]

> Undeath to Death

That's a bit different, don'tcha think? It specifically targets that. It isn't the same as a death spell in a verse where undead aren't typically immune to that sort of thing.

The triple 20 thing is just an example, again, we use Take 10 for the canon resistance method.

Soul Anchor is a custom spell from Ravenloft, no I do not mean Soul Bind lol.

 

[EmperorRorepmeThree]

TGOALD kills the undead which "the concept of life doesn't apply to".

 

[Apeironaxim]

It killed a construct/golem thing actually, which isn't alive

Pretty sure it's not a concept thing, more just it works on inanimate objects

 

[Qawsedf234]

Soul Anchor is a custom spell from Ravenloft, no I do not mean Soul Bind lol.

Oh, yeah it checks out

 

[Yobo_Blue]

It killed a construct/golem thing actually, which isn't alive

Pretty sure it's not a concept thing, more just it works on inanimate objects

Nah, it's mentioned to be a concept thing in the original novel.

 

[Apeironaxim]

In that instant, the world died.

That was not a metaphor.

It died. All of it.

Einherjar, who'd been brandishing its lance before him, turned to white mist and began to collapse. It died instantly despite being a construct and having no life.

....

It brought death even to the lifeless air and made it impossible to breathe within a diameter of almost 250 yards. If there was anything trying to breathe and live in that area, its lungs would have been polluted by the dead air and it would have died from that. The soil also died. Everywhere within those 250 yards around Ainz instantly turned into a desert.

This is the description from the official translation

 

[Yobo_Blue]

The official translation has as much accuracy as 3-A Dante

 

[Apeironaxim]

Any examples of this?

 

[EmperorRorepmeThree]

A woman's wail echoed through the air. This cry carried with it an instant-death effect. Ainz had used various skills to augment this spell, so its potency was greater than normal and harder to resist. Still, it was useless against Shalltear and the Einherjar construct. Oddly enough, Shalltear's summoned minions — who had no resistance to instant death — did not fall. This situation was quite bizarre, but Ainz remained unmoved. Rather, one could say that things were going as planned. Tick. The clock face behind Ainz ticked, and its hands slowly moved as the spell took effect. Ainz glanced at Shalltear in the distance as his health dwindled under the onslaught of the Einherjar, and at the same time he felt quite disappointed. ...So I can't finish this cleanly, huh? Damn you, Peroroncino, did you build her specifically to counter me? To think you actually gave her a resurrection item! Dammit! Ainz cursed his guildmate within his heart.

Ainz frantically struggled to avoid the attacks of the Einherjar. After twelve seconds had passed, the hour hand had completed a full circuit, and it pointed to the heavens once more.

Then, Ainz's trump card took effect. In that moment — the world died. This was not metaphorical. Everything died. The Einherjar evaporated into white mist as it couched its lance, and dispersed before Ainz's eyes.

Even a homunculus with no concept of life died instantly. Shalltear's familiars shared the same fate, unable to resist the destruction which overtook them. That was not all. Even the air — which was not even alive to begin with — fell into death. For over one hundred meters in all directions, the air was no longer breathable. If any living creature tried to respire within that area, their lungs would be corrupted by the deadly air, and they would die. Neither did the land escape the embrace of death. The terrain in a hundred meter radius was instantly transmuted into sand.

Only Shalltear and Ainz could move in this world, where only death remained.

This is what is says for mine.

 

[Apeironaxim]

Is that from an official translation or an online fan translation?

 

[Qawsedf234]

Don't they say roughly the same thing?

 

[EmperorRorepmeThree]

Fan translated by Skythewood I think.

 

[Apeironaxim]

Don't they say roughly the same thing?

Official translation says It died instantly despite being a construct and having no life.

Fan translation says Even a homunculus with no concept of life died instantly.

One mentions the "no concept of life" which has people debate on whether TGOALID works on a conceptual level

 

[EmperorRorepmeThree]

Do you have the officially translated book?

 

[Apeironaxim]

Yes, that's where I got the description I put in one of my above comments from

 

[Assaltwaffle]

Y'all may want to take this isn't a separate thread. Discussing TGOALID should probably be taken elsewhere.

 

[Apeironaxim]

Due to the difference between the two translations, TGOALID discussions never seem to go anywhere anyway

 

[Apeironaxim]

Back on track, I can't really see this being incon, as no matter how many times Ainz kills Strahd, I sincerely doubt Ainz will find this single room in an entire country in time before being wittled down

Ainz will also run out of MP eventually, though I guess he could pull out some Mana potions during the downtime of Strahd regening

 

[Antoniofer]

I don't think the castle is that far from the fight, and Strahd mist form do not instantly teleport, he needs to move to its castle, and can be followed by Ainz (I dount he just remain there seeing how it let go the mass of mist); after the mist return to the castle it will take 1 hour to recover 1 HP, one hour that Ainz have to plan something (assuming it reaches the coffin).

The GoALiD should work regardless (conceptual or not, it can still affect undeads and construct), but I do not guarantee a complete death once used.

 

[Apeironaxim]

True Death prevents resurrection, and low tier resurrection spells can regenerate souls in Overlord, so would that work?

Obviously he would have to use it with TGOALID in order to bypass the death manip resistance

 

[Dargoo_Faust]

Back on track, I can't really see this being incon, as no matter how many times Ainz kills Strahd, I sincerely doubt Ainz will find this single room in an entire country in time before being wittled down
Ainz will also run out of MP eventually, though I guess he could pull out some Mana potions during the downtime of Strahd regening

Doesn't Ainz have tracking spells/can use Wish to grant himself knowledge of it's location?

 

[Apeironaxim]

Bambu said Strahd's coffin has a bunch of anti-divination spells iirc

• Undead Blessing: Can sense other undead beings.

^ Would this count as divination? It's a skill granted to him by being an Overlord

 

[Dargoo_Faust]

Bambu said Strahd's coffin has a bunch of anti-divination spells iirc

I mean, to the point where something that warps reality wouldn't give Ainz knowledge of its location?

I get Strahd resisting, but gaining knowledge about his coffin is a no too?

 

[Apeironaxim]

Didn't Bambu also say Strahd resists Wish?

 

[Dargoo_Faust]

Didn't Bambu also say Strahd resists Wish?

Strahd resists wish, yes.

However I don't see why something like "I wish to learn how to defeat my opponent" or "I wish to understand the weaknesses of my opponent" wouldn't work outside of Strahd himself, as they only affect Ainz and his knowledge of Strahd.

Strahd's resistances would make Ainz assume he has some sort world-class item in possession, so he'd naturally avoid using wish directly on Strahd anyways.

 

[Antoniofer]

Few detections spells do not require a Saving Throw, Detect Undead for example. Don't known about the coffin indetection powers, but I do not think its impossible to detect the mist form.

 

[Apeironaxim]

I'm guessing hitting Strahd's mist form with Astral Smite won't do much?

 

[Apeironaxim]

Few detections spells do not require a Saving Throw, Detect Undead for example. Don't known about the coffin indetection powers, but I do not think its impossible to detect the mist form.

Is there a difference between skills and spells in DnD?

Because Ainz has an Overlord skill that lets him detect undead

 

[Qawsedf234]

Strahd can resist wish in some editions I guess. As for divination I would need to look more into the coffin. But some of those anti-detection receptacles can be resistant to all sorts of stuff.

 

[Antoniofer]

It depends more of the nature rather than the effect, I not that used to DnD, but skill could require a ST too. Naturally, if a power do not target a character then the character can't use a ST (nothing it affecting it).

 

[Apeironaxim]

Not sure if Undead Blessing targets undead for detection or just lets Ainz see where undead are in a certain range. Unless those are treated as the same thing

Assuming I didn't misunderstand what you meant