About Undertale

[Azathoth_the_Abyssal_Idiot]

No. No you didn't you said "It would if your whole deal is gaining control over every aspect of the existence you reside in and "becoming God"." You also said that "Timeline. Asriel only affects a single timeline during the fight, iirc." , so I don't know where this omniprescence over existence is coming from. Furthermore, even if he is composed of multiple timelines, nothing suggests he is composed of all timelines.
Again. Tell me how it is different, thats all I'm asking, you say that I'm acting like it is, when honestly I don't know.

"Stated in Sans fight" what? Sans doesn't even know Asriel, much less what hes composed of.

"Shown in Flowey fight" Theres a difference between destroying and controlling, not even including the fact all we see is a void in the background, so if its not a statement then I don't know where thats coming from.

Yes, I did. Explaining things over multiple comments does not mean a single comment is literally everything I've said. I also immediately pointed out the difference to you, if you bothered to read if.

You asked for proof of multiple timelines. This has nothing to do with Asriel.

 

[SomebodyData]

During the entire time I was argueing over the reasoning of that statement alone, you cannot expect me to argue for all of them at the same time.

No I didn't I asked, "Except he said timeline, also when was it stated that his existence is composed of multiple timelines?" where did this proof of multiple timelines stuff come from???

 

[Azathoth_the_Abyssal_Idiot]

During the entire time I was argueing over the reasoning of that statement alone, you cannot expect me to argue for all of them at the same time.
No I didn't I asked, "Except he said timeline, also when was it stated that his existence is composed of multiple timelines?" where did this proof of multiple timelines stuff come from???

Then we are clearly arguing for different things.

You asked for proof of Asriel being composed of multiple timelines. I gave you proof by answering with two weaker characters who fulfil that criteria, one of whom is actually Asriel.

 

[SomebodyData]

Alright, then. So what validity does the statement that I was argueing against have?

Did you not just... "You asked for proof of multiple timelines. This has nothing to do with Asriel."

And now: "You asked for proof of Asriel being composed of multiple timelines. I gave you proof by answering with two weaker characters who fulfil that criteria, one of whom is actually Asriel."

Not only that, you still haven't shown me even a screenshot of them being composed of multiple timelines, you just stated that "Stated in Sans fight" and "Shown in Flowey fight"

 

[Cohobast]

Not a screenshot but here's the quote from the sans fight proving multiple timelines at least "our reports showed a massive anomaly in the spacetime continuum. timelines jumping left and right, stopping and starting ..."

As for the example with omega flowey, his use of save states shows that he was able to jump at will between more than one timeline as it suited him. Since Asriel is Omega Flowey with an extra composite soul It's not too much to assume Asriel has comperable abilities

 

[SomebodyData]

@Cohobast, I never asked for evidence of multiple timelines, rather if Asriel and etc were beings that consisted of multiple timelines.

Jumping through timelines doesn't mean a being is composed of a (or multilpe) timelines

 

[Cohobast]

Made an edit to address it

 

[ThemoonprinceN]

Yes but he's in IFITNTE timelines though

 

[Matthew_Schroeder]

@SomebodyData

I am sorry, but your examples ultilizing Saitama and Beerus aren't even close to being the same thing as Azzy's explanation of Asriel.

In fact, they are cartoonish exaggerations that ultilize Out-of-Universe ideas and a character's mere role in the story as argument, rather than Lore and plot.

 

[SomebodyData]

Jumping =/= being made of timelines again.

 

[Matthew_Schroeder]

Not a screenshot but here's the quote from the sans fight proving multiple timelines at least "our reports showed a massive anomaly in the spacetime continuum. timelines jumping left and right, stopping and starting ..."
As for the example with omega flowey, his use of save states shows that he was able to jump at will between more than one timeline as it suited him. Since Asriel is Omega Flowey with an extra composite soul It's not too much to assume Asriel has comperable abilities

Yup, basically this.

God Flowey proves Immeasurable speeds.

 

[SomebodyData]

@Matthew did you even read the statement I made the examples for?

 

[Cohobast]

I'm only saying that he has been shown able to control multiple timelines.

 

[SomebodyData]

@Matt jumping through timelines is immeasureable?

Welp, time to upgrade Tamura for doing tha everyday

(Also BTW thats not how you become immeasureable)

 

[SomebodyData]

@Cohobast where do you get jumping = control?

 

[Matthew_Schroeder]

Okay, how is Flowey capable of moving through timelines themselves them, in your opinion?

Does he simply teleport and his regular speed is much more limited?

 

[ThemoonprinceN]

Find it funny were all auguring about a super powered goat god XD

 

[SomebodyData]

Probably an ability like pretty much all time travelers, not to mention thats still not Immeasureable

 

[Cohobast]

We like to argue, that's what we're here for. and I got control from him being able to save and load to change the timeline as he sees fit.

 

[SomebodyData]

@Cohobast, thats not whats being argued?

 

[Cohobast]

You're asking how he has control over timelines, that's how he has control over timelines,

 

[SomebodyData]

You're asking how he has control over timelines, that's how he has control over timelines,

...

"Except he said timeline, also when was it stated that his existence is composed of multiple timelines?"

 

[Cohobast]

I've never used the wording composed at any point. Going back to the omega flowey fight we see him load different save states that have different stuff happening in them which is the main argument for asriel also having comperable abilities.

 

[SomebodyData]

Ok? The quote is the question that I asked, the one that everyone seems to be misreading for whatever reason.

 

[Cohobast]

As far as I've been able to find there is nothing specifically saying he is made of timelines, just that he has power over them. and with this reply I'm off for now.

 

[Fllflourine]

How is being able to completely stop Frisk while your not doing anything omniprescence? I mean, it could just be hax.

 

[Fllflourine]

I also have another question about Flowey being Immeasurable, considering that when he does load a new file, his attacks seem to revert to where they were when the file was saved. Then again, that only seems to apply to his attacks, as Omega Flowey himself doesn't seem to be affected by it. (Go to 2:13 in the video)


Undertale Omega Flowey Damageless

 

[Squid_peanut]

that's actually due to the nature of timetravel via determination. it doesn't move you back in time, it reverts all of time to a preset point. this is what it means to "save and load". since Flowey has multiple human souls he has multiple save files

 

[Fllflourine]

that's actually due to the nature of timetravel via determination. it doesn't move you back in time, it reverts all of time to a preset point. this is what it means to "save and load". since Flowey has multiple human souls he has multiple save files

So he's still moving in a higher unit of time? Still don't get it, though.

I also still need this question answered:

How is being able to completely stop Frisk while your not doing anything omniprescence? I mean, it could just be hax.

 

[Thebluedash]

I agree with most of SD's point. Jumping into time lines or moving through time lines themselves aren't really a good reason to use 'immeasureable". It's more of a hax ; an ability not an actual stat rating for the profile...

 

[Squid_peanut]

when you time travel with determination, you set a point, then any point after that, you pull all of reality back in time, with only those with determination able to keep any memory of that happening.

 

[Azathoth_the_Abyssal_Idiot]

The lengths people will go to for "this might not be immeasurable" are astounding.

During the fight, Flowey literally creates multiple space-time continuums, consciously swapping them and altering them to mess with Frisk. Even before that, he smashes the timeline which previously existed and was unaffected in the slightest. He's clearly not bound by basic time, in that state.

 

[Matthew_Schroeder]

Azzy said it all.

 

[SomebodyData]

@Everyone I'm not saying he(Omega Flowey) isn't immeasureable, I trust the undertale fans to have made the correct ratings

However, while I do believe his ratings are correct, the reasoning I've seen for them is very poor in quality (With an exception coming from Azzy)

@Azzy, are you sure thats the reasoning? Because you have placed feats that would produce infinite speed rather than immeasureable with the exception of creating space-time continuums, I'm not quite sure if thats immeasureable but I think it is.

@Matthew I'm sure you don't even truly understand whats going on here, so please, re-read everything

 

[Ryukama]

Yeah I see SD's point. It seems often times people mistake questioning the reason behind a stat to be the same as questioning a stat itself, when that is simply not the case.

 

[Azathoth_the_Abyssal_Idiot]

@Ryu

The thread itself is questioning the reasoning for Asriel's omnipresence as opposed to that and the immeasurable speed itself. The same cannot be said for Omega Flowey, in this case.

@SD

Being beyond the time and causality of a traditional space-time continuum while being able to freely manipulate those things on a lower level is, by definition, immeasurable speed as opposed to infinite.

 

[Matthew_Schroeder]

@SD

No, I understand what's going on here.

I simply agree with Azathoth, rather than you.

 

[Cropfist]

I agree with SomebodyData about the issue of immesurable speed.

 

[TheMightyRegulator]

This has been discussed before and I agree that they should retain their Immeasurable status. I'll alter the reasoning because I honestly hate it as well.

 

[Azathoth_the_Abyssal_Idiot]

This has been discussed before and I agree that they should retain their Immeasurable status. I'll alter the reasoning because I honestly hate it as well.

This is a good idea.

You can mention how Flowey busted the current timeline and was entirely unaffected by it while still being able to fight in the void where it once was.

Since that's immeasurable by definition.