Aang content revision

[Alakabamm]

@SaitamaBro, am I sure I watched the show? Yes I am and I don't believe I mentioned in this thread whether or not I did. I also made that Raava point a while ago.

@Slaphappyjoy, because you measure natural disasters that way. You don't measure it via the fact that it destroyed a city or not, because the phrase "destroyed a city" has a wide variety of connotations that don't necessarily measure up to an energy total in the megaton range. If a bunch of lava hits a city and makes its unliveable yet only does that, then can you truly say it has more energy than a nuclear bomb which obliterates parts of the city?

Anyways, I guess you could do KE of the erupted rock as well but it's gonna be hard to get a timeframe of how it was moving if you are referring to the feat shown in the opening by Roku.

 

[The_Living_Tribunal1]

what is to be calculated?

http://atla.avatarspirit.net/screenshots.php?quality=dvd&num=201&page=37

This, i think.

if those are average volcanoes, then definitely looks like at least city level, but i will see if i can have the time to go more in depth in it by today

 

[Gwynbleiddd]

@Slaphappyjoy just because there were 4 volcanos doesn't mean they are the ones portrayed on the map.Also if you really take this map seriously then these volcanos would be 100+ km tall which is absurd.

 

[Slaphappyjoy]

@Slaphappyjoy, because you measure natural disasters that way. You don't measure it via the fact that it destroyed a city or not, because the phrase "destroyed a city" has a wide variety of connotations that don't necessarily measure up to an energy total in the megaton range. If a bunch of lava hits a city and makes its unliveable yet only does that, then can you truly say it has more energy than a nuclear bomb which obliterates parts of the city?

No, land disasters are measured in seismic activity. Then there are various other scales for measuring volcano activity. The most notable for this might be the VEI. Considering most of the eruptions from the four volcanoes in the Volcano feat was lava, the VEI magnitude would be well beyond Mega-Colossal and probably unable to be reasonably measured on a real world scale.

 

[Slaphappyjoy]

@Slaphappyjoy just because there were 4 volcanos doesn't mean they are the ones portrayed on the map.Also if you really take this map seriously then these volcanos would be 100+ km tall which is absurd.

That's the official map. You can't say there are other volcanoes somewhere else. If those volcanoes are calculated to be that tall then that's how it is, regardless of how absurd it seems.

 

[Slaphappyjoy]

if those are average volcanoes, then definitely looks like at least city level, but i will see if i can have the time to go more in depth in it by today

Those volcanoes are some of the tallest mountains in the verse.

 

[Gwynbleiddd]

You do realize that the map is drawn in a very old fashion ,it's meant to be interesting to look at ,not a realistic representation of their world

 

[The_Living_Tribunal1]

just to give some examples for rough comparison:


Krakatoa eruption of 1883 was 200 Mgatons worth of tnt

it's effects were seen around the world to some extent, ships 20 km away reported 4 inch object landing on their boats, the largest part of the eruption was heard 3110 km away in australia and was heard as canon fire 4800 km away


another example of a massive eruption is the mount tambora eruption with a yield of 800 megatons of TNT. The volcano lost nearly 1.5 km of its height due to it, and there was pitch darkness for up to 600 km away for 2 days. There were reports of debris being shot as far as calcutta (so it started from south of indonesia and landed near east india)


maybe these clues can help us roughly and qualitatively place a guess to where the explosion may have stood

otherwise, one would have to calculate the volume of moleten rock released, find the max height, and using that calculate the energy needed to push the moleten rocks that high

 

[The_Living_Tribunal1]

You do realize that the map is drawn in a very old fashion ,it's meant to be interesting to look at ,not a realistic representation of their world

true

 

[Slaphappyjoy]

You do realize that the map is drawn in a very old fashion ,it's meant to be interesting to look at ,not a realistic representation of their world

That's the official map. In ATLOK, Kuvira uses a map with the same dimensions and she is from the most technologically advanced city in the verse. What you see on the maps is correct.

 

[Slaphappyjoy]

You do realize that the map is drawn in a very old fashion ,it's meant to be interesting to look at ,not a realistic representation of their world

true

See my previous post.

 

[Gwynbleiddd]

For god's sake , i don't mean the shape of the land but the way mountains appear.

 

[Slaphappyjoy]

For god's sake , i don't mean the shape of the land but the way mountains appear.

Cherry picking, why wouldn't the mountains be to scale too?

 

[Alakabamm]

and seismic activity is apparently destruction these days? It's not. My point stands.

VEI is basically richter for volcanoes, except that unlike richter, it is very hard to convert VEI to energy realistically.

Those are very clearly not mega colossal volcanoes. The lava is for show.

 

[Slaphappyjoy]

just to give some examples for rough comparison:

Krakatoa eruption of 1883 was 200 Mgatons worth of tnt

it's effects were seen around the world to some extent, ships 20 km away reported 4 inch object landing on their boats, the largest part of the eruption was heard 3110 km away in australia and was heard as canon fire 4800 km away


another example of a massive eruption is the mount tambora eruption with a yield of 800 megatons of TNT. The volcano lost nearly 1.5 km of its height due to it, and there was pitch darkness for up to 600 km away for 2 days. There were reports of debris being shot as far as calcutta (so it started from south of indonesia and landed near east india)


maybe these clues can help us roughly and qualitatively place a guess to where the explosion may have stood

otherwise, one would have to calculate the volume of moleten rock released, find the max height, and using that calculate the energy needed to push the moleten rocks that high

- Note that an overwhelming amount of discharge in those eruptions in your reference is tephra, which is extremely less massive than the coincidental lava.

- In this Volcano feat, the amount of force required to discharge that much lava, at that speed, to at least the height shown is by far more than any real measured instance.

 

[Alakabamm]

and the lava is for show, so that is inconsequential. If you want to maintain the illusion that the lava matters, then you will also have to admit that it isn't actually a volcanic eruption because the eruption would only last as long as Roku/whatever avatar that was can keep it up. Why? Because there wasn't a buildup of gas to maintain it.

 

[Slaphappyjoy]

and seismic activity is apparently destruction these days? It's not. My point stands.
VEI is basically richter for volcanoes, except that unlike richter, it is very hard to convert VEI to energy realistically.

Those are very clearly not mega colossal volcanoes. The lava is for show.

Thermal energy can't be measured here, so we can't go off that point. Are you implying that the feat is just for show? Because we clearly see him discharging the lava.

 

[Alakabamm]

You don't know the speed. You don't see the full duration of the eruption and you don't see the full height either. Please don't act like you know those values.

Honestly the best way to calc this is find out the size of one volcano via angsizing, compare that to known volcanoes, figure out how much stuff was ejected and use kinetic energy on that (after finding out a speed, which will be difficult) to find the energy. Then multiply it by 4.

 

[Alakabamm]

and seismic activity is apparently destruction these days? It's not. My point stands.
VEI is basically richter for volcanoes, except that unlike richter, it is very hard to convert VEI to energy realistically.

Those are very clearly not mega colossal volcanoes. The lava is for show.

Thermal energy can't be measured here, so we can't go off that point. Are you implying that the feat is just for show? Because we clearly see him discharging the lava.

I'm implying the lava is for show.

 

[Slaphappyjoy]

what is to be calculated?

This video better depicts the action of the eruptions. 19:08 - 19:13. The video is slightly sped up.

 

[Slaphappyjoy]

You don't know the speed. You don't see the full duration of the eruption and you don't see the full height either. Please don't act like you know those values.
Honestly the best way to calc this is find out the size of one volcano via angsizing, compare that to known volcanoes, figure out how much stuff was ejected and use kinetic energy on that (after finding out a speed, which will be difficult) to find the energy. Then multiply it by 4.

- See my previous post for the rate of discharge. You can't compare the size of our world's volcanoes to this verse by speculation. A better option is to scale with a warship, Appa, or any other sizeable character.

- You can imply the lava is for show all you want. The lava is still there.

 

[Alakabamm]

That's a time interval not a rate.

You have a character right there to scale the actual volcano. I don't know what you thought angsizing meant.

The amount of volume ejected, however, cannot be speculated on via scaling unless you'd like to lowball it.

 

[Slaphappyjoy]

For god's sake , i don't mean the shape of the land but the way mountains appear.

Here is the Earth generals' map used in their war strategy room. The mountains shown in the Fire Nation are the same scale as in the other maps.

 

[Gwynbleiddd]

https://vsbattles.fandom.com/wiki/User_blog:Kkapoios/Avatar_Kyoshi_creates_an_Island_(calc) the first calc

 

[Slaphappyjoy]

That's a time interval not a rate.
You have a character right there to scale the actual volcano. I don't know what you thought angsizing meant.

The amount of volume ejected, however, cannot be speculated on via scaling unless you'd like to lowball it.

Through that time interval you have lava displacement, thus a rate--or did you not watch the video? Sure I'll lowball it--it was enough to destroy at least a large island to a country.

 

[Alakabamm]

You can't see the amount ejected in that interval...

 

[Slaphappyjoy]

You can't see the amount ejected in that interval...

That means the feat is likely to cause more damage than what can be calculated from observing the scene. Good thing I asked for the specifics of the scene e.g. the speed, at least the height shown, at least the amount shown. Then there's also the displacement of the lava onto the viewer i.e. the feat shows him moving the lava laterally as well as vertically.

 

[Alakabamm]

I don't think you understand physics at all. Like at all.

Consider the gravitational constant 9.8 m/s^2 and the fact that the time interval for the whole feat is 5 seconds. Do you understand that for the lava to have come back down in that time interval after exploding upwards, that the volcano would have to be building sized?

For the last time, you don't have the freaking speed. Without the speed, you don't have the amount.

 

[Faisal_Shourov]

Through that time interval you have lava displacement, thus a rate--or did you not watch the video? Sure I'll lowball it--it was enough to destroy at least a large island to a country.

You got a calc to support this? Because the calc by Kkapoios doesn't match your statement

 

[Alakabamm]

The Khapoios calc was for something else entirely. He was referring to the Volcano feat which is uncalc'ed

 

[Faisal_Shourov]

The Khapoios calc was for something else entirely. He was referring to the Volcano feat which is uncalc'ed

Oh I see. The volcano feat is by Avatar Roku right? My bad

 

[Slaphappyjoy]

- @Ala I don't think you watched the show at all, hence you mentioned Roku as the one performing the feat, which is wrong. Some of these characters can manipulate lava, meaning they can control its speed, mass, volume, temperature, phase change, movement, you name it. It's probably best that people who are actually informed, on this topic and its content, reply.

- The speed is in the video previously posted.

 

[Alakabamm]

You know what? Because you're annoying me, I'm going to do a joke calc right here.

Average size of a volcano = 3000m tall; g = 9.8m/s^2; timespan = 5 seconds

d=vi(t) +1/2at^2

vi=(d-1/2at^2)/(t) = (-3000m - (1/2)(-9.8m/s^2))/(5s)^2 = -119.8m/s

So to answer your question about the speed, the lava was traveling 119 m/s...downwards

 

[Alakabamm]

1. There is no speed.

2. No, benders do not have complete control over their elements, they have a set level of manipulation that varies based on skill and power. Just for you knowledge, since you convienently don't mention it, Roku DIED FIGHTING A SINGLE VOLCANO.

3. "It's probably best that people who are actually informed, on this topic and its content, reply." This one is blatant disrespect and if it continues I will lock this thread.

 

[Slaphappyjoy]

You know what? Because you're annoying me, I'm going to do a joke calc right here.

Average size of a volcano = 3000m tall; g = 9.8m/s^2; timespan = 5 seconds

d=vi(t) +1/2at^2

vi=(d-1/2at^2)/(t) = (-3000m - (1/2)(-9.8m/s^2))/(5s)^2 = -119.8m/s

So to answer your question about the speed, the lava was traveling 119 m/s...downwards

Your calc is wrong for this thread, since you don't know the size of any of the volcanoes in the feat, nor did you measure the speed of the lava in the video.

 

[Alakabamm]

Correction, I'm locking this thread right now.

If you would like to get the volcano feat calc'ed, ask a member of the calc team by posting the relevant details on their message wall. Please don't start a new thread on the following:

-making the volcano calc (unless you post in the calculation request thread)

-the Kyoshi feat (you may add the calc result to the pages, if you like)

Thank you.